View previous topic :: View next topic |
Author |
Message |
Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63960
Back to top |
Posted: 09/15/20 10:36 pm ::: Washington Mystics 2021 |
Reply |
|
There’s a bunch new contracts that will needed. Somebody’s gotta go.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
|
|
Luuuc #NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005 Posts: 21987
Back to top |
Posted: 09/15/20 10:39 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Too many good players. Nice problem to have.
_________________ Thanks for calling. I wait all night for calls like these.
|
|
Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4703
Back to top |
Posted: 09/15/20 10:52 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
2021 should be a lot easier to navigate for the Mystics personnel- and cap space-wise if Meesseman takes the season off for the Olympics like it seems like she will(?) She did her part this year anyway by being one of the few to show up and help keep the Mystics' playoff streak alive lol.
|
|
J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6831
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 12:07 am ::: |
Reply |
|
Cloud/Mitchell
Atkins/Lesliey
EDD/Powers
MHA/Meeseman
Charles/Sanders
go with 11 finish out with Sutton, Agnew or someone off the waiver wire on low money
can they afford this?
Is Hawkins a free agent? If Meeseman is out for the Olympics keep Hawkins/
If Hawkins isn't a free agent could she get them a late first round pick in 21 I am sure LV, Conn or Chicago could use her
|
|
xkqqpjc
Joined: 23 May 2006 Posts: 24
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 12:24 am ::: |
Reply |
|
I think Kang (korean shooter) is make a roster
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 8:49 am ::: |
Reply |
|
J-Spoon wrote: |
can they afford this? |
If everyone demands the most they can get on the open market, probably not. Too many high-end vets. I thought this was a reasonably conservative bunch of estimates, for example:
EDD 220k (known)
LMitch 123k (known)
Charles 190k
Cloud 170k
Meesse 220k
Powers 180k
Sanders 150k
That would be 1.253m for seven players, when the cap is 1.339m. You can't fit the remaining four players (minimum) in the 86k of space that's left. |
|
Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 3:26 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Richyyy wrote: |
J-Spoon wrote: |
can they afford this? |
If everyone demands the most they can get on the open market, probably not. Too many high-end vets. I thought this was a reasonably conservative bunch of estimates, for example:
EDD 220k (known)
LMitch 123k (known)
Charles 190k
Cloud 170k
Meesse 220k
Powers 180k
Sanders 150k
That would be 1.253m for seven players, when the cap is 1.339m. You can't fit the remaining four players (minimum) in the 86k of space that's left. |
Is Charles under contract? If it comes down to it, Meese is the one I would keep.
|
|
mavcarter #NATC
Joined: 02 Sep 2010 Posts: 5935 Location: Chicago
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 3:45 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Randy wrote: |
Is Charles under contract? |
Nope._________________
wrote: |
Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree? |
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 4:05 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Yeah, apart from the two listed as 'known', those are all just guesses as to what they might sign for. Theoretically, they could all take anything from 70k to 221k. |
|
root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 4:37 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
That list already excludes Hawkins. Would the Mystics prefer to keep Tianna over Sanders? Using those estimates, even dropping Charles wouldn't give them enough money to pay 11 players. Management needs to squeeze out something like $15k more.
_________________ You can always do something else.
|
|
J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6831
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 5:08 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
So basically Meeseman has to take the season off for the Olympics or the Mystics have to make some tough choices
|
|
root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 5:21 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Since contracts stretch over multiple years, they really need to start planning now for 2022 when Atkins and Hines-Allen are due. Make tough decisions today or it will bite you in the ass later.
_________________ You can always do something else.
|
|
J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6831
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 5:25 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
crazy idea
trade Charles back to NY for one or two of our cheap wings/posts
Charles for Walker and Shook
For Washington this isn't about talent it is about saving money to pay other talent
If Charles can pull a McCoughtry and support the young new face of the franchise it could actually make NY decent pretty quickly (and be some good insurance if Zahui B decides to sign somewhere else)
Ionescu, Durr, Nurse, Charles, Zahui B
Clarendon, Johannes (or Kea) Jones, Willoughby, Odom, Stokes, lottery pick
Cloud, Atkins, EDD, MHA, Sander
Mitchell, Leslie, Powers, Walker, Meesdman, Shook
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 5:45 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Charles is a UFA who, outside of forcing a sign-and-trade to get the supermax like Bonner did, can go wherever she likes for nothing.
As I understand it, this year counts for her core total, and therefore she also can't be cored any more. But that's not 100%. |
|
J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6831
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 6:28 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Richyyy wrote: |
Charles is a UFA who, outside of forcing a sign-and-trade to get the supermax like Bonner did, can go wherever she likes for nothing.
As I understand it, this year counts for her core total, and therefore she also can't be cored any more. But that's not 100%. |
I was only joking (mostly) but
Washington traded for her cored rights but because she never signed her core designation gets used up and Washington gets nothing?
OTOH she intended to play for Washington and like Mike T but not signing Charles solves some of their money problem
Any chance Charles re-signs with NY that would be crazy.
In reality in what seems like a post starved league and draft I would think Charles would have a lot of suitors
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 7:17 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Washington must've known when they were making the deal that it might ultimately be for nothing. If they didn't at least consider the possibility it was a screw up, but I doubt that was the case. Probably figured the price was worth taking the shot. |
|
Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4703
Back to top |
Posted: 09/16/20 7:57 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
The Mystics also didn't give up anything particularly substantial. Yes, they gave up 5 different assets, but three of them were draft picks in a weak draft (2021), one was Walker-Kimbrough who wasn't really used a whole lot in Washington anyway, and the other was their #12 pick - really nothing to write home about. It was quantity over quality. And Charles who was willing to sign on for less than max insists she'll re-sign with the Mystics anyway, so it's much ado about nothing imo.
The question is how long and how much she'll sign for. She could sign top dollar for one year if Thibault knows Meesseman will fully sit out. Mystics could win it all in 2021 and the original Charles trade could somewhat serve its purpose, where Charles herself could sign back with New York in 2022 and Meesseman would be free to re-sign with the Mystics for top dollar in 2022. A multi-year deal for Charles might not be as lucrative for her as a single-year deal, but I think we'll see her re-sign for two or three years rather than one.
|
|
pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67146 Location: Where the action is
Back to top |
Posted: 10/12/20 10:23 am ::: |
Reply |
|
Growth of Young Players Will Force Mystics to Make Tough Financial Decisions
https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/sports/nbcsports/growth-of-young-players-will-force-mystics-to-make-tough-financial-decisions/2442168/
Quote: |
Right now, with five players signed for 2021 as well as Natasha Cloud and LaToya Sanders having to come back after opting out in 2020, the team has accounted for roughly 57% of their salary cap. Between that, the team has to make room for some high-priority free agents. Tina Charles, who has not played a single second in a Mystics jersey, has verbally committed to Thibault for the next season. Emma Meesseman and Aerial Powers are also priorities for him and his staff to re-up. |
_________________ I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a threat to mankind
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 10/12/20 10:42 am ::: |
Reply |
|
What he's doing there is assuming they bring Cloud and Sanders back for something very similar to what they were on last year (which in both cases was around the old max, meaning they'd actually be underpaid on the new scale). Thibault suggested in a press thing a week or two ago that there was some kind of rule about that, but I can't find one (and people I asked couldn't come up with one either).
So I think that 57% number is already questionable even before they get to the rest of the roster. |
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
|
pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67146 Location: Where the action is
Back to top |
Posted: 11/03/20 4:23 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Natasha Cloud bailed a Florida woman out of jail after she was arrested for destroying Trump campaign signs
https://www.insider.com/wnba-natasha-cloud-bails-out-woman-arrested-destroying-trump-signs-2020-11
Quote: |
"While I don't condone destruction of things... I know exactly where she's coming from," Cloud told Insider. "I've too wanted to rip signs and flags down." |
_________________ I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a threat to mankind
|
|
CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18371 Location: Phoenix
Back to top |
|
Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63960
Back to top |
Posted: 01/12/21 8:30 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Quote: |
Thibault will likely spend another $234,000 on Cloud and Sanders, as the Mystics have exclusive negotiating rights with each player and limited ability, according to WNBA rules, to deviate from the $117,000 that each was slated to earn in 2020 before opting out. That would leave about $561,000 for four or five players. |
What? Teams have exclusive negotiating rights to the players that opted out, and they’re obligated to play at last year’s rate? This helps the Mystics too much.
Does that mean Minnesota has exclusive negotiating rights (whatever that means... how do you negotiate if it’s exclusive) to Maya without coring her, and she’ll be expected to play at 2019 rates?
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
|
|
Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24412 Location: London
Back to top |
Posted: 01/12/21 8:44 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Thibault suggested that "have to pay them something close to what they were on before" thing in a press conference several months ago, around the end of last season. I have found no corroborating evidence or source that agrees that a rule like that exists. Maybe he meant 'in order to avoid pissing off the players involved and the Players Association', but as far as I can find the rules for 'suspended-contract expired' players are that they can't negotiate with anyone else and that's it.
Exclusive negotiating rights means exactly what those three words mean. |
|
Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4703
Back to top |
Posted: 01/17/21 10:19 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
It’s an interesting concept, though, if unsigned players coming off expired/suspended contracts have to re-sign for something close to (or not above/too far above) their previous contract value. If that’s really the case, that the rule probably doesn’t take into account the salary structure of the new CBA is a complete oversight. The Lynx theoretically bringing Maya Moore back for ~$120k or thereabouts (anything below regular max, really) would be truly staggering.
Maybe Thibault was just working out the numbers in his head when he was talking about bringing back Cloud & Sanders? Idk. Doesn’t sound like it based on the wording of that article though.
|
|
|
|