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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Posted: 09/09/19 7:23 pm ::: |
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7) The Liberty relocate to Boston and immediately win a championship
_________________ You can always do something else.
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6828
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Posted: 09/10/19 2:16 am ::: |
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I think Boyd and Hartley are both perfectly fine as 4th or 5th guards.
IMO Boyd gets more negative reaction ATM because for a few seasons she was touted as the future franchise PG and she gave signs of turning into that but injuries and never developing a consistent 3 point shot has turned her into a greater disappointment. Also while she is pretty high up in the league in Assists she also has a lot of turn overs so while her assist to turnover ratio isn't bad it is hard to get those moments where she throws the ball into the stands out of your head.
Hartley at least from the fan base had lower expectations the only one who kept thinking she was a starter was Katie Smith. Also Hartley walks the thin line between being a player who can play two positions PG and SG and being that player that has no position (too lose a handle and not a good enough creator to be a PG, too small to guard bigger guards and too inconsistent for the "shooting" part of shooting guard). IMO Hartley has as many good games as she does bad, but the bad ones piss people off too much for them to give her credit for the good ones.
But the truth is next year if we get Ionescu either one could play 10 minutes a night in a rotation with Ionescu and Durr getting 30 minutes a night and Nurse eating up another 10 minutes at the guard spot sliding to the two when have a legit SF on the floor.
I am not saying that I want both of them to stay, I am simply saying the harsh criticism is routed in inflated expectations for Boyd and too large and crucial of a role this season for Hartley.
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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Posted: 09/10/19 5:21 am ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
I think Boyd and Hartley are both perfectly fine as 4th or 5th guards.
IMO Boyd gets more negative reaction ATM because for a few seasons she was touted as the future franchise PG and she gave signs of turning into that but injuries and never developing a consistent 3 point shot has turned her into a greater disappointment. Also while she is pretty high up in the league in Assists she also has a lot of turn overs so while her assist to turnover ratio isn't bad it is hard to get those moments where she throws the ball into the stands out of your head.
Hartley at least from the fan base had lower expectations the only one who kept thinking she was a starter was Katie Smith. Also Hartley walks the thin line between being a player who can play two positions PG and SG and being that player that has no position (too lose a handle and not a good enough creator to be a PG, too small to guard bigger guards and too inconsistent for the "shooting" part of shooting guard). IMO Hartley has as many good games as she does bad, but the bad ones piss people off too much for them to give her credit for the good ones.
But the truth is next year if we get Ionescu either one could play 10 minutes a night in a rotation with Ionescu and Durr getting 30 minutes a night and Nurse eating up another 10 minutes at the guard spot sliding to the two when have a legit SF on the floor.
I am not saying that I want both of them to stay, I am simply saying the harsh criticism is routed in inflated expectations for Boyd and too large and crucial of a role this season for Hartley. |
Thank you. Terrific analysis. I agree with all of this.
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63947
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Posted: 09/10/19 8:30 am ::: |
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Katie Smith does herself no favors by insisting that she tried to win that last game against Indiana. Never mind the endless excuses for the rest of the season. Let that fourth quarter against Indiana be her defining moment. Scored only 7 pts in a game she says she was trying to win. Had her hottest player sitting on the bench way too much. If she wasn’t trying to lose that game, she’s just a very poor game manager and I’m doubting that will suddenly improve and things will suddenly click for her next season.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Posted: 09/10/19 8:34 am ::: |
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Shades wrote: |
Katie Smith does herself no favors by insisting that she tried to win that last game against Indiana. Never mind the endless excuses for the rest of the season. Let that fourth quarter against Indiana be her defining moment. Scored only 7 pts in a game she says she was trying to win. Had her hottest player sitting on the bench way too much. If she wasn’t trying to lose that game, she’s just a very poor game manager and I’m doubting that will suddenly improve and things will suddenly click for her next season. |
There were other examples too...one other thing 7/10 of those wins the optimistic 7-7 start....came with charmin on bench when she left it was day and night...very big factor
_________________ "Leave it to the NCAA women's basketball committee to turn a glass slipper into glass ceiling" Graham Hays
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
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Posted: 09/10/19 9:32 am ::: |
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And, adding insult to irony, the coach of the team that won the Lottery Bowl game got fired.
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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Posted: 09/10/19 10:30 am ::: |
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Imagine if someone did a study of head coaches and managers in all professional sports to determine how many coached for two seasons, had a winning percentage of .250, and were brought back for a third season.
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Posted: 09/10/19 11:02 am ::: |
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Bob Lamm wrote: |
Imagine if someone did a study of head coaches and managers in all professional sports to determine how many coached for two seasons, had a winning percentage of .250, and were brought back for a third season. |
Can count em on your hand
_________________ "Leave it to the NCAA women's basketball committee to turn a glass slipper into glass ceiling" Graham Hays
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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Posted: 09/10/19 11:42 am ::: |
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Happycappie25 wrote: |
Bob Lamm wrote: |
Imagine if someone did a study of head coaches and managers in all professional sports to determine how many coached for two seasons, had a winning percentage of .250, and were brought back for a third season. |
Can count em on your hand |
Yes. In his 50,000 words (it felt like that!) about how Katie Smith should return for another season, her personal publicist (am I getting his job description wrong?) neglected to mention that.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32341
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Posted: 09/10/19 11:45 am ::: |
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It's great when you don't have to make up excuses for yourself. Just hire someone to do it for you.
_________________ For there is always light,
if only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
- Amanda Gorman
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Posted: 09/10/19 11:57 am ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
Hartley at least from the fan base had lower expectations the only one who kept thinking she was a starter was Katie Smith. Also Hartley walks the thin line between being a player who can play two positions PG and SG and being that player that has no position (too lose a handle and not a good enough creator to be a PG, too small to guard bigger guards and too inconsistent for the "shooting" part of shooting guard). IMO Hartley has as many good games as she does bad, but the bad ones piss people off too much for them to give her credit for the good ones. |
Great observation. I think that's why Hartley is so hard to assess. She appears really useful on paper, but Bria can look totally useless on the court. The other problem is that Bria has only OK one-on-one skills, but she uses them too much either by choice or at the urging of her coach. Hartley is decent at beating people off the dribble, but like so many of the Liberty players she is below average at finishing.
The obstacle to Hartley's return is that she's a UFA. I doubt anyone is going to offer her $102k again. Whether it's the Liberty or another team, Bria will have to take a pay-cut -- maybe a big one. Meanwhile, Boyd is signed for a reasonable $80k (unless the new CBA really shakes things up). It's not guaranteed money, and many fans would rather see someone younger get a shot, but most coaches prefer to go with experience.
Moving on to Magliocchetti:
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Through two seasons, the Liberty have gone 17-51 under Smith’s watch. A .250 average might be tolerable on the Yankees or Mets, but not so much for New York basketball coaches. |
_________________ You can always do something else.
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 22478 Location: NJ
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Posted: 09/10/19 12:28 pm ::: |
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Geoff was predominantly the only reporter to cover the Liberty recently. With them owned by Tsai and having the Nets connection, there are more reporters popping up now to cover them. Let's see how he does next season with them at Barclays.
_________________ LET'S GO LIBERTY!!!!!!
Twitter: @TBRBWAY
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Posted: 09/10/19 12:39 pm ::: |
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Reading that article, Mags mostly talks about attitude, effort, and togetherness -- touchy, feely stuff related to the players. He never discusses the basketball aspect of coaching -- Xs and Os, systems, strategy, game management, player deployment, etc. Getting along with the players is certainly important, but so is the actual coaching.
_________________ You can always do something else.
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Posted: 09/10/19 2:17 pm ::: |
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root_thing wrote: |
Reading that article, Mags mostly talks about attitude, effort, and togetherness -- touchy, feely stuff related to the players. He never discusses the basketball aspect of coaching -- Xs and Os, systems, strategy, game management, player deployment, etc. Getting along with the players is certainly important, but so is the actual coaching. |
That's the problem the players dont need a friend they need a driver and developer...someone to push them especially the young ones to a.higher level
Thats not Katie
_________________ "Leave it to the NCAA women's basketball committee to turn a glass slipper into glass ceiling" Graham Hays
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67139 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 09/10/19 2:36 pm ::: |
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Happycappie25 wrote: |
root_thing wrote: |
Reading that article, Mags mostly talks about attitude, effort, and togetherness -- touchy, feely stuff related to the players. He never discusses the basketball aspect of coaching -- Xs and Os, systems, strategy, game management, player deployment, etc. Getting along with the players is certainly important, but so is the actual coaching. |
That's the problem the players dont need a friend they need a driver and developer...someone to push them especially the young ones to a.higher level
Thats not Katie |
The head coach doesn't have to be the bad cop.
_________________ I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a threat to mankind
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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NYSports56
Joined: 03 Jul 2018 Posts: 1137 Location: New Jersey, USA
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Posted: 09/11/19 3:26 am ::: |
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They can't be seriously thinking about bringing Katie back.
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