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NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007 Posts: 14097
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Posted: 09/16/17 6:24 pm ::: |
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toad455 wrote: |
I definitely think Tina needs to say to "player x", "Come to New York and we'll win a title together." Angel? Loyd? Bonner? Cambage? Vandersloot? |
I don't see Angel wanting to play for Laimbeer or vice versa. Plus the teams are a poor fit trading-wise. Bonner is exactly what the Libs need and she might just be attainable. She has length, she defends, she's a SF and she has a good floor game.
_________________ The poster formerly known as LibWNBAFan.
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tfan
Joined: 31 May 2010 Posts: 9776
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24408 Location: London
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Posted: 09/16/17 7:35 pm ::: |
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NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
toad455 wrote: |
I definitely think Tina needs to say to "player x", "Come to New York and we'll win a title together." Angel? Loyd? Bonner? Cambage? Vandersloot? |
I don't see Angel wanting to play for Laimbeer or vice versa. Plus the teams are a poor fit trading-wise. Bonner is exactly what the Libs need and she might just be attainable. She has length, she defends, she's a SF and she has a good floor game. |
I remember suggesting Bonner could fill that hole at the 3 years ago, and it hasn't really changed. Except she's since gotten older and had twins.
Didn't one of Bill's teams back in the day have two or three couples on it? Maybe you could get Bonner for, say, Rodgers, and Dupree for Stokes, and everyone lives happily ever after . |
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63934
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Posted: 09/16/17 8:53 pm ::: |
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Bonner shouldn't be a topic for the Liberty because it's not going to happen.
But has anybody been keeping track of Bonner's progress after giving birth? A 130 lb woman going full term with twins takes a lot bigger toll than say a 170 lb woman going half term with twins. Is she rebounding quickly or is that not a factor in any of this brainstorming? Seems like there are cheaper options that are less risky out there. Christmas, Currie... Nared as a draft pick.... maybe bring Alex Montgomery back, bring Carson back.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6827
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Posted: 09/16/17 9:31 pm ::: |
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There is one player out there I think could be a viable force her way to NY kind of player (no matter how much she claims to love her team). Her management just needs to convince her she needs to be in the biggest market/fashion Capitol of America. TBH she isn't one of my favorites but she would be a good fit and a game changer for NY.
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6827
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Posted: 09/16/17 9:40 pm ::: |
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My problem with trading Rodgers (besides her being one of my favorite players on the Liberty) is market value.
I did consider Rodgers for Bonner with a second move for Dupree mostly for camp value, but in the short term it could work considering the window of opportunity for NY as is, is short term.
None of this is meant to insult Rodgers (she has the greatest value among our guards IMO) but realistic trade would be like
Rodgers for Boyette (actually I doubt Atl does that with Hayes and Sykes all ready there). Now if Atl regrets losing there draft pick, is in love with Sykes and see potential in Boyette maybe Rodgers and #10 for Hayes could happen. Syjes becomes the Starter, Rodgers does her 6 woman thing in Atl and the Dream can get a first rounder to develop, wishful thinking I know, but I would do that trade.
Rodgers and #10 for Sims (Maybe if LA wants to go twelve deep and needs two rookie contracts to pull that off, but Sims is coming into her own in LA so who knows).
Rodgers for Alexander and #13, (maybe but SA still has Plum and McBride eating up a lot of those SG minutes if Jefferson returns).
If everyone comes back healthy Dallas, Indy, Chicago, Was, Conn are all very heavy in the 2 spot.
Rodgers for Currie? Rodgers for the rights to Bone (do we really need another Braxton)?
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24408 Location: London
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Posted: 09/16/17 9:47 pm ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
There is one player out there I think could be a viable force her way to NY kind of player (no matter how much she claims to love her team). Her management just needs to convince her she needs to be in the biggest market/fashion Capitol of America. TBH she isn't one of my favorites but she would be a good fit and a game changer for NY. |
Nah man, they probably don't want Cappie back.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63934
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Posted: 09/16/17 9:53 pm ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
There is one player out there I think could be a viable force her way to NY kind of player (no matter how much she claims to love her team). Her management just needs to convince her she needs to be in the biggest market/fashion Capitol of America. TBH she isn't one of my favorites but she would be a good fit and a game changer for NY. |
You must be talking about fashionista Powers. I'm not sure why Dallas would give her up. She's instant energy. Just consider Christmas a present.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6827
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Posted: 09/16/17 9:56 pm ::: |
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Shades wrote: |
J-Spoon wrote: |
There is one player out there I think could be a viable force her way to NY kind of player (no matter how much she claims to love her team). Her management just needs to convince her she needs to be in the biggest market/fashion Capitol of America. TBH she isn't one of my favorites but she would be a good fit and a game changer for NY. |
You must be talking about fashionista Powers. I'm not sure why Dallas would give her up. She's instant energy. Just consider Christmas a present. |
Right team but someone more fashionable with management ties in NYC.
If Christmas comes as an UFA I'd be cool with that. If R, Montgomery decides to move to NY as an UFA I'd be cool with that as well. If were going for right now adding Montgomery, Christmas and Swords to replace Zahui B, B and L Allen could work, but I doubt we could afford it.
You're the Zahui B fan, how about Zahui B and #22 for #12?
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18066 Location: Queens
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63934
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Posted: 09/16/17 10:32 pm ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
Right team but someone more fashionable with management ties in NYC. |
More fashionable than Powers? Are you trying to get Powers to throw down with you, because she'll do it.
J-Spoon wrote: |
If Christmas comes as an UFA I'd be cool with that. |
For Dallas, I'd recommend a core and trade of Christmas... unless they have somebody else they need to core.
J-Spoon wrote: |
If RMontgomery decides to move to NY as an UFA I'd be cool with that as well. |
She already turned you down prior to the 2016 season. I don't Laimbeer is a glutton for rejection.
J-Spoon wrote: |
If were going for right now adding Montgomery, Christmas and Swords to replace Zahui B, B & L Allen could work, but I doubt we could afford it. |
Does a team that ended the season on a ten game win streak really need wholesale changes? I can almost guarantee all those players will be better next year.
J-Spoon wrote: |
You're the Zahui B fan, how about Zahui B and #22 for #12? |
It's not all that unfair a deal, but ask me before the draft. Kinda like to see what might be available at #12. Right now I'm kinda feeling Nurse or Vadeeva.
I think Zahui would be a great fit for SEA. She's friends with Loyd, and I think she'd get enough minutes to get into a rhythm since SEA doesn't really have a player like her. How about #17 for Zahui, and you keep #22?
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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LibFan25
Joined: 01 Sep 2012 Posts: 895 Location: NY
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Posted: 09/16/17 11:01 pm ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
Shades wrote: |
J-Spoon wrote: |
There is one player out there I think could be a viable force her way to NY kind of player (no matter how much she claims to love her team). Her management just needs to convince her she needs to be in the biggest market/fashion Capitol of America. TBH she isn't one of my favorites but she would be a good fit and a game changer for NY. |
You must be talking about fashionista Powers. I'm not sure why Dallas would give her up. She's instant energy. Just consider Christmas a present. |
Right team but someone more fashionable with management ties in NYC.
If Christmas comes as an UFA I'd be cool with that. If R, Montgomery decides to move to NY as an UFA I'd be cool with that as well. If were going for right now adding Montgomery, Christmas and Swords to replace Zahui B, B and L Allen could work, but I doubt we could afford it.
You're the Zahui B fan, how about Zahui B and #22 for #12? |
Nope. Miss Diggins-Smith coming here that aint happenin lol you gonna have to trade STAR for STAR. and the only star we got is Miss Tina Charles.
now if she forces a trade that's different story, but i believe she really does love her team and Dallas
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LibFan25
Joined: 01 Sep 2012 Posts: 895 Location: NY
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Posted: 09/16/17 11:08 pm ::: |
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Delete.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11219
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Posted: 09/17/17 9:04 am ::: |
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Like so many teams in so many sports on the cusp of contending for a championship, the Liberty need some luck.
The Warriors were never as good as the Libs are, but were never bad enough to get a high pick. Then they tanked, picked Curry (who took two years to find himself) and got very, very lucky with Draymond Green.
Of course, the same could be said for Washington and Connecticut -- have that second rounder develop into an all-star to join the existing starters and all of a sudden you're a true contender.
Or Susie McConnell-Serio says "It's me or Katie Smith" and you get an Olympian for Chandi Jones.
Or a star gets hurt and you're back in the lottery.
The role of luck in sports, especially injury luck, cannot be underrated.
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007 Posts: 14097
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Posted: 09/17/17 10:14 am ::: |
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Klay Thompson 11th overall didn't hurt either. It's not commonplace to not have a top 5 draftee spearhead championship teams in the NBA. Durant was but the GSW won a title without him too.
The Libs haven't had the greatest injury luck with season-ending or just about season-ending major injuries to ball-handling guards each of the last two years. Toss in Carson in 2013 and that's 3 major injuries in 5 seasons. I can't think of a team that's had a parallel in the W. Injuries happen but it's hard to fault the team-building process for them, when you're talking freak, non-impact injuries. One of which happened in Russia.
Entering the season the plan was to use speed and depth while attaining improvement from within. With the injury to Boyd, all of those areas were adversely affected.
I'd think next season there isn't going to be the expectation of internal improvement. They'll hope for it, sure. But unlike this year I'd bet they aren't going to bank on it. As such, it would not surprise me to see significant changes with vets being added next year. Even if it means trading draft picks or young players. The availability of vets being the caveat. Can you get any? I don't see much availability but Laimbeer has pulled off the unexpected before.
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Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 4174 Location: QUEENS!!!!
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Posted: 09/17/17 10:22 am ::: |
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the biggest thing was thinking Prince could be everyday PG and while Boyd getting hurt magnified that it was an idea since day 1 IMHO the way the team was built with Rodgers.
Instead we got when ones good the other's bad syndrome and when Prince did start at PG...we were flat out BAD 3-8 if I remember right.
The incredible run without Prince and Vaughn was an omen that Prince and Rodgers together just didn't work.
So well you could say it was as much failing to sign and trade Rodgers to me...I think she has value...my goal would be a 3 but moving up from 10 would suffice as well and give Z one more year to hold down the 3 and moving Hartley back to 2 playing some 1
My rough rough draft for the roster would be (secondary position) [Or TC/Pick depending on preseason performance] Will not make trade FA proposals as I don't know the market yet and this is a one or the other situation so Rodgers OR prince can go but I'd rather keep prince:
1: FA
Boyd
L. Allen
(Hartley)
2: Prince
Hartley
(Zellous)
3: Trade (Rodgers and likely pick note I'd take a rookie below Z if we use Rodgers to move up in the draft)
Zellous
[R. Allen]
4: Charles
[Raincock]
5: Stokes
Vaughn (Note order)
Ill have a wishlist when FAs come out but this is where I think the problems lie
_________________ "Leave it to the NCAA women's basketball committee to turn a glass slipper into glass ceiling" Graham Hays
Last edited by Happycappie25 on 09/17/17 10:34 am; edited 1 time in total |
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67121 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 09/17/17 10:22 am ::: |
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ClayK wrote: |
The Warriors were never as good as the Libs are, but were never bad enough to get a high pick. Then they tanked, picked Curry (who took two years to find himself) and got very, very lucky with Draymond Green. |
How much tanking does it take to get the #7 pick? And it wasn't a fluke, there were six teams with worse records. They could just as easily wound up with Jonny Flynn.
_________________ I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a threat to mankind
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010 Posts: 5065 Location: New York City
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Posted: 09/17/17 10:44 am ::: |
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NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
Klay Thompson 11th overall didn't hurt either. It's not commonplace to not have a top 5 draftee spearhead championship teams in the NBA. Durant was but the GSW won a title without him too.
The Libs haven't had the greatest injury luck with season-ending or just about season-ending major injuries to ball-handling guards each of the last two years. Toss in Carson in 2013 and that's 3 major injuries in 5 seasons. I can't think of a team that's had a parallel in the W. Injuries happen but it's hard to fault the team-building process for them, when you're talking freak, non-impact injuries. One of which happened in Russia.
Entering the season the plan was to use speed and depth while attaining improvement from within. With the injury to Boyd, all of those areas were adversely affected.
I'd think next season there isn't going to be the expectation of internal improvement. They'll hope for it, sure. But unlike this year I'd bet they aren't going to bank on it. As such, it would not surprise me to see significant changes with vets being added next year. Even if it means trading draft picks or young players. The availability of vets being the caveat. Can you get any? I don't see much availability but Laimbeer has pulled off the unexpected before. |
For me, internal improvement was a crucial hope for 2017. Boyd was injured right away and we'll never know what she'd have given the team in 2017. But I'd hoped for significant internal improvement from at least two of our third year players. And we didn't get that from Stokes, Rebecca Allen, or Zahui B. That really hurt. And I'd say it contributed to Charles having to play so many minutes and wearing down.
For 2018, the most significant internal improvement could come from Lindsay Allen and Nayo Raincock-Ekunwe. Two big ifs. My hope for Allen is much higher than most fans who are posting here, but without question everyone could be right and I could be wrong. And having Boyd might prove to be a big plus... or might not. As for the rest of the current roster, I'd say they are what they are.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11219
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Posted: 09/17/17 11:35 am ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
ClayK wrote: |
The Warriors were never as good as the Libs are, but were never bad enough to get a high pick. Then they tanked, picked Curry (who took two years to find himself) and got very, very lucky with Draymond Green. |
How much tanking does it take to get the #7 pick? And it wasn't a fluke, there were six teams with worse records. They could just as easily wound up with Jonny Flynn. |
They had to lose a bunch of games to get in the lottery ... it was pretty blatant (and of course I'm a fan).
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24408 Location: London
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Posted: 09/17/17 12:41 pm ::: |
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The heavy tanking year from the Warriors was when they dropped to keep their pick in the year they took Harrison Barnes. The Steph year they basically just sucked. |
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6827
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Posted: 09/20/17 10:57 pm ::: |
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So Liberty fans there seem to be some unrestricted free agents out there next year that could fit in NY, who should we offer some money to?
likely based on things read in other threads
R. Montgomery, Swords, Christmas, Currie, C. Little, T. Young, Langhorne
IDK but could be list
January, Perkins, Bentley, Lavender, Clark, Latta, Pondexter, Paris, K. Thomas, Lyttle, A. Montgomery, Carson
and what about on our team
Vaughn? Zellous? Prince? I know Hartley is a RFA.
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Posted: 09/20/17 11:59 pm ::: |
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Don't forget Wright, who when last seen was a cored UFA. There had to be some thinking behind that decision. It wasn't the obvious thing to do. You also have Schimmel who will be a Reserve Player. No big deal, but you do have to make a qualifying offer if you want to retain her rights.
_________________ You can always do something else.
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Michelle89
Joined: 17 Nov 2010 Posts: 16467 Location: Holland
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Posted: 09/21/17 2:07 am ::: |
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Clark had 1 more year according to the salary thingie
_________________ "Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clich�s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." �Karen Bryant
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6827
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Posted: 09/21/17 2:20 am ::: |
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I never looked at that thread and now my ancient operating system is having difficulty opening it but that means we actually already have a list of free agents next year that is pretty cool.
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Wiseone1
Joined: 13 Oct 2011 Posts: 267
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Posted: 09/21/17 11:54 am ::: |
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J-Spoon wrote: |
So Liberty fans there seem to be some unrestricted free agents out there next year that could fit in NY, who should we offer some money to?
likely based on things read in other threads
R. Montgomery, Swords, Christmas, Currie, C. Little, T. Young, Langhorne
IDK but could be list
January, Perkins, Bentley, Lavender, Clark, Latta, Pondexter, Paris, K. Thomas, Lyttle, A. Montgomery, Carson
and what about on our team
Vaughn? Zellous? Prince? I know Hartley is a RFA. |
Also Free Agents, Nneka, Kizer, Glory, Stricklen, and Shenice Johnson
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