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Should we start a Discord chat?

Yes

54%

[ 13 ]

45%

[ 11 ]

Total Votes : 24

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GlennMacGrady

Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 8227
Location: Heisenberg

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Posted: 08/24/22 7:08 pm :::

Luuuc wrote:

GlennMacGrady wrote:

It doesn't cost that much.

I think that might be kind of a "Your mileage may vary" thing, particularly if the entire contents are to be retained. From what I've been told, anyway.

--

Btw this discussion does not need multiple threads.

Luuuc, I'll honor your request for no additional threads, but any informed discussion of migrating this site will require a new thread.

I'm very willing to share my experience and costs in migrating from an old software platform to Xenforo, either publicly or privately. Since you seem to be the only staff member left standing, Luuuc, you would be the logical person to take over and migrate the site if Reb will agree to let go of the database and domain name.

The cost of migration and the yearly cost after that may be much less than you think.

The Boneyard, for example, uses the Xenforo platform and their participation rate rose after they migrated. So did participation on my site.

The RebKell thread archives (database) are worth saving, which is what a migration is. This site, as depopulated as it now is, still likely has the highest SEO for WCBB and WNBABB on the internet. That is, if someone is Google searching for terms such as "NCAA women's basketball discussion", "NCAA women's basketball forum", "WNBA discussion" or "WNBA forum", RebKell will appear at the top of the Google search list. That's because of the 1.7 million accumulated posts that have been indexed for almost two decades by Google and other search engines.

No Discord Servers (sites) will appear on search lists because search engine bots don't index Discord chats. They are not considered information worth preserving for the world, but rather just evanescent conversations meant to disappear soon after uttered.

It is a fact that this site will continue to die unless there is a technical migration with new and personally involved ownership/administration. But a fancy chatroom like Discord is not the answer, especially for the older folks who dominate the membership, and it won't preserve the existing archives or create new ones.

Again, if Reb, Jammer, Luuuc or someone else in charge wants to contact me about these issues, I'm happy to share anything I know.

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greatgator

Joined: 20 Dec 2012
Posts: 142

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Posted: 08/24/22 7:20 pm :::

eibln wrote:

We meant no harm to Rebkell by simply asking a questions and creating something to help.

Did you consider if your Discord suggestion is likely to hurt RebKell before posting it on RebKell?

Ex-Ref

Joined: 04 Oct 2009
Posts: 8947

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Posted: 08/24/22 7:32 pm :::

eibln wrote:

It seems that you refuse to reply to anything I say

What more do you want me to reply? I posted a response to, I think, every post of yours that wasn't really directed to someone else. I may have missed one, but I just looked through and I don't think that I did.

eibln wrote:

but only responding to the things help your cause

I wasn't in debate in school, but isn't that kind of the way that it works? I reply to/state things that support my cause and you reply to/state things that support yours?

eibln wrote:

Don't you want a bigger community, more friendly faces, more discussions?

No. I'm going to assume that you're young, 20 to 40 range, but reserve the right to be wrong on that. I'm a bit older. I've seen things. Lots of things. Hell, I even predate the AIAW. I've been in lots of gyms where there were just a hand full of fans. Where, if someone on the other side of the gym sneezed, you said "bless you."

I've been there when you could get close to the players and they even knew your name!! I've had player families know where I lived and would ask me about the weather they would be driving into on their way home because they knew that I lived between the game site and their home. Often, they had been in town visiting their daughter for a couple of days or stayed for back to back games, so would want to know what the roads were like. They knew that if I was there that they shouldn't have any trouble getting home, but just wanted that reassurance.

Then the programs grew. It became harder to go to away games and sit near the teams. Those seats were now for season ticket holders and player families. (Try getting a good seat for the NCAA Finals!!!) More ushers and security, meant that you were kept away from the players. They no longer got to know you. And I don't even mean by name. They had no recognition of you. You just became a face in the crowd. Nothing more.

I liken it to a mega-church or a 400 person lecture hall at college. Few know your name or anything about you. You don't develop relationships.

So no, bigger is not always better. Growth is not always positive.

eibln wrote:

We meant no harm to Rebkell

But that's what happens with things (people) are syphoned away. Longtime posters here will go to Discord. They will post there. Then not wanting to post it a second time here or not having the time to post it a second time here. It becomes cumbersome to live in two worlds. One will be left behind.

Think of the big box stores. Amazon. Apple. Microsoft. Google. They came in with words like new and better and more options and growth. Then what happened? Smaller stores started shutting down. People complain all the time about having to go to the big box stores and how crowded they are. Amazon has taken over you life in ways that governments never even dreamed of doing!!!!

So, no, I don't see it as a good thing. I know that you'll call me old and opposed to change and possibly some other things. Go right ahead. I guess I'm just past being impressed with bright lights and bells and whistles.

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Durantula

Joined: 30 Mar 2013
Posts: 5223

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Posted: 08/24/22 8:57 pm :::	Reply

What does discord LOOK like? Is it threaded posts like Rebkell? Is if more chat room format? Vbulletin? What does it look like. is the user experience on desktop good? Why does Discord not allow lurkers? Why can't I read without signing up? I want a test run but I'm not registering for some website, site unseen. They hide everything but then I have to give them my info to sign up?

eibln

Joined: 26 Apr 2021
Posts: 101

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Posted: 08/24/22 10:24 pm :::

Durantula wrote:

What does discord LOOK like? Is it threaded posts like Rebkell? Is if more chat room format? Vbulletin? What does it look like. is the user experience on desktop good?

Why does Discord not allow lurkers? Why can't I read without signing up? I want a test run but I'm not registering for some website, site unseen. They hide everything but then I have to give them my info to sign up?

We are going to attempt to try and post pictures of the discord here on Rebkell in the next day or so. You can lurk on discord but yes you need an account. But it is so easy to delete your account if you don’t like it. It is similar to a chat room format. And so far is going well. The user experience on desktop is pretty good, I like it just as much as I like the phone app.

Queenie

Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18031
Location: Queens

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Posted: 08/24/22 10:44 pm :::

Durantula wrote:

It’s more of a chatroom format. I like the user experience on desktop; that’s how I use it most of the time, because like some of the other posters who’ve commented in this thread, I have trouble typing on a phone. There's a light mode, too, but it is *very* light. As in if you showed it to a vampire they would spontaneously combust.

Here’s a screenshot of my Discord screen, showing the general chat for a mobile game I play. The little dude in the top left is where direct messages with my friends live. Different servers can be collected and collapsed into different folders. The open folder contains the two WBB servers I’m in, while the collapsed folder has my various Pokemon Go servers; the red numeral on that one indicates a notification on one of those servers. The little white dot on the left of the server icon indicates there are unread messages, but since there aren’t any red notifications, I don’t have to check those if I don’t want to.

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eibln

Joined: 26 Apr 2021
Posts: 101

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Posted: 08/24/22 11:09 pm :::

Queenie wrote:

Durantula wrote:

Are you able to post some screenshots of the WBB server to provide context of what it looks like?

Luuuc
#NATC

Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 21929

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Posted: 08/25/22 9:02 am :::

GlennMacGrady wrote:

Luuuc wrote:

--

Btw this discussion does not need multiple threads.

Luuuc, I'll honor your request for no additional threads, but any informed discussion of migrating this site will require a new thread.

Glenn, just to follow up from that post,
The "discussion not needing multiple threads" was unrelated to your post. I should have made that clearer. I wrote it because a second thread was started to promote the Discord channel, which IMO was overkill. (I'm not even entirely comfortable with this thread existing either, but due to the precarious nature of this forum's very existence I am inclined to allow it)

I appreciate your input, and agree that this thread is not the place for a separate discussion about migrating this board.

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Durantula

Joined: 30 Mar 2013
Posts: 5223

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Posted: 08/25/22 11:17 am :::	Reply

My worry is chatroom format is only good for game threads Look at the Coaching Changes thread on this board, there is so much information there on the 1st page and that is constantly updated. Discord would not seem to allow for robust detailed discussion of something like coaching changes like a threaded forum can. Am I off base? This seems like huge draw back. The first post in that thread is consistently edited and updated and is very long. I can send anyone a link to coaching changes thread and they can see the news. I can't send a discord link because well most people I know probably aren't even discord members. Not allowing people to read without a user name is a big wall they are putting up for no reason. We aren't discussing state secrets, its just basketball! They should have option for some public discords.

Howee

Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15739
Location: OREGON (in my heart)

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Posted: 08/25/22 1:36 pm :::	Reply

....and I'm thinking - where did they ever get the name "Discord" for this idea??? I do understand Durantula's point: it certainly seems as if the new idea is more conducive to 'real time' discussion about specific games, as opposed to threads whose very nature is to continue on for a long period. I'm also curious: I remember last season's college fantasy league playing out over there. Did that function as hoped for? And is it retrievable for any archival reason? _________________ Oregon: Go Ducks! "Inévitablement, les canards voleront"

pilight

Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66920
Location: Where the action is

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Posted: 08/25/22 1:55 pm :::

Howee wrote:

....and I'm thinking - where did they ever get the name "Discord" for this idea??? Razz

https://web.archive.org/web/20150706094918/https://blog.discordapp.com/2015-05-21-ama-transcript/

Quote:

Q (uppfinnarn): How about that name?

A (Jason): We picked the name because at the end of the day it just sounds cool and has to do with talking. We had a bunch of names that we bounced around, but picking a name for a product is a complicated process. You want a name that is easy to say, spell, remember, related to the function of the product, available for ™, and has a website you can get. There are a lot of things to consider and we had a number of different candidates. Discord met all the criteria that we had and we fell in love with the name.

A (Socrates): And Discord in the gaming community is the problem we are trying to solve with this product.

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undersized_post

Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 2864

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Posted: 08/25/22 8:44 pm :::

Durantula wrote:

My worry is chatroom format is only good for game threads

Look at the Coaching Changes thread on this board, there is so much information there on the 1st page and that is constantly updated.

Discord would not seem to allow for robust detailed discussion of something like coaching changes like a threaded forum can. Am I off base? This seems like huge draw back. The first post in that thread is consistently edited and updated and is very long.

I can send anyone a link to coaching changes thread and they can see the news. I can't send a discord link because well most people I know probably aren't even discord members. Not allowing people to read without a user name is a big wall they are putting up for no reason. We aren't discussing state secrets, its just basketball! They should have option for some public discords.

You bring up good points! I can't speak for everyone, but I think this illustrates what a lot of the Discord advocates have been trying to say: the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it. Some discussions might still be better suited to here for the reasons you've named. Can't know until we try!

Re: Howee. Yes, the Discord remained active through the fantasy season and we still like to chat in it. Quite frankly, it's really fun. That said, some users preferred to just post in the fantasy thread on here, and the thread here was our place of official business. Again, this illustrates that Discord offers features that are a nice complement to the forum but not a replacement.

I'd also like to clear up misconceptions regarding Discord's similarity to a chatroom. Unlike most chatrooms, the messages in a Discord do not vanish after a few minutes as some here have implied. The interface *looks* similar to a chat room, but you can scroll back ad infinitum to see prior messages in the various discussion topics. So if two users are having a real time discussion during a game, you can log in tomorrow and the messages will still be there for you to read and reply to if you wish.

No, a Discord won't register in a Google Search and the data isn't preserved in the same way -- but c'mon --- does posterity really need to have a permanent record of this dumpster fire of a thread? Laughing

The answer is no lmao.

Also unlike a chatroom is that Discord allows very easy editing, deleting, and direct replying to messages.

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Queenie

Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18031
Location: Queens

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Posted: 08/25/22 9:18 pm :::

Gonna say one last piece here then dip out of the thread, because I rather suspect minds aren’t going to get changed.

Ex-Ref wrote:

If this was Hank's House of Hot Dogs and eibln had stopped in and announced that they had a hot dog business down the street, how long do you think eibln would be welcome at Hank's??

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both. It’s a nice little treat, but it’s not as substantial. And if you try to do too much, you end up with a headache.

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pilight

Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66920
Location: Where the action is

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Posted: 08/25/22 10:24 pm :::	Reply

Also of note, Discord has a very shady history when it comes to data collection, privacy, and administrative abuse. _________________ I'm a lonely frog I ain't got a home

Howee

Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15739
Location: OREGON (in my heart)

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Posted: 08/25/22 10:29 pm :::

undersized_post wrote:

Re: Howee. Yes, the Discord remained active through the fantasy season and we still like to chat in it. Quite frankly, it's really fun. That said, some users preferred to just post in the fantasy thread on here, and the thread here was our place of official business. Again, this illustrates that Discord offers features that are a nice complement to the forum but not a replacement.

If I'm understanding correctly then, there already IS a 'Discord' thing rolling along with Reb's users, i.e., those who are involved in Fantasy League. Now, can that just expand to people who wanna do live game interactions? That is, can't people who enjoy Discord just go to that same site and talk about live games, or am I just naive re: this technology?

Playing further along on Queenie's analogy, maybe Reb's is more like ol' fashioned, traditional Fine Dining, and Discord is Fast Food....?

I personally am open to the experimentation. Can't know if something's good until one tries. I know I enjoy other websites that have both message boards AND live chat options, but that's all at one web address.

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tfan

Joined: 31 May 2010
Posts: 9627

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Posted: 08/26/22 2:24 am :::

Durantula wrote:

What does discord LOOK like?

From my limited experience it looks similar to multiple chat sessions for differing subjects that stay going from day to day. And I think the subjects are done by the moderator and from what I have seen, quite limited in number versus how many threads this board would have in a year.

But the big thing for Discord versus other "forums" is that it supports a voice chat (strictly audio I think). But given the disagreement you see here, a voice chat might not work. Audio disagreement would be a different cup of tea.

undersized_post

Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 2864

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Posted: 08/26/22 8:39 am :::

Howee wrote:

undersized_post wrote:

You're not naive! The new Discord eibln and others have set up is much better organized and more equipped to handle the significant amount of traffic that comes with bringing in new users. [/quote]

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undersized_post

Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 2864

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Posted: 08/26/22 9:03 am :::

tfan wrote:

Durantula wrote:

What does discord LOOK like?

This is mostly accurate! Your description of "multiple chat sessions for differing subjects that stay going from day to day" is nice. In that way, it's a lot like the threads on here. If you have news to share, and opinion to offer, a game to analyze, etc, you just choose the most relevant channel/thread to post in to keep things organized.

For reference, I've included a screenshot of the Discord below. The different channels (aka threads) are listed along the left hand column. To list a few: "welcome," "general-basketball-chat," "coaching-carousel-hot-seat," "conference-realignment," etc. Then below that there are a ton of channels for specific teams and conferences, which you can expand and contract as you wish. In the screenshot you can see ACC, Big East, Big Ten, and Big 12, which is currently on the Kansas State page, where we discussed Ayoka Lee's season ending injury yesterday.

What tfan said is technically true that a general user doesn't have the power to start a brand new channel on their own. But in my opinion it's not a bad thing. Firstly, the pre-existing channels are ample enough and cover pretty much every realm of discussion that you could nearly always find a good place to post. And secondly, if you *did* feel that you wanted a new channel, literally just ask the moderators and I'm sure they would create one as long as there is the demand for it. The structure is flexible so the moderators can create or delete new channels as needed to best reflect the things people want to discuss.

p.s. About the voice chat feature tfan mentioned -- yes it's technically possible, but I personally don't see myself ever using it. I would guess the same goes for most users. So don't let that be a deterrent to people. I prefer the anonymity of my keyboard.

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GlennMacGrady

Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 8227
Location: Heisenberg

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Posted: 08/26/22 3:14 pm :::

undersized_post wrote:

the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it.

Queenie wrote:

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both.

Could we please stop the disingenuous lack of candor and shell game.

If someone is participating in a WCBB game discussion on Discord they are highly unlikely to be participating in that game thread on RebKell. Game threads are the bulk of in-season WCBB posting on RebKell. Therefore, the Discord site being hawked here will be a direct competitor to RebKell for game thread posting, and is effectively an attempt to use the RebKell site to solicit RebKell posters away from the RebKell site.

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summertime blues

Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7845
Location: Shenandoah Valley

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Posted: 08/26/22 3:47 pm :::

pilight wrote:

Also of note, Discord has a very shady history when it comes to data collection, privacy, and administrative abuse.

Another reason I don't like it.

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FrozenLVFan

Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3516

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Posted: 08/26/22 3:55 pm :::

GlennMacGrady wrote:

undersized_post wrote:

the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it.

Queenie wrote:

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both.

That Discord screenshot shows very clearly that their threads are duplicating RebKell's, e.g. coaching carousel, recruiting talk, transfers...

I find it very unethical for a competitor to advertise their site on an existing board and then claim it's different and they're not trying to lure away members of the existing board. JMO.

undersized_post

Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 2864

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Posted: 08/26/22 3:59 pm :::

GlennMacGrady wrote:

undersized_post wrote:

the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it.

Queenie wrote:

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both.

You say this as if it's not already happening, but it is! I already participate in a Discord during games. I also often post on RebKell's during games. I sometimes check my own school's message board during games. I also check Twitter during games. (I also have a problem LMAO -- but that's a different subject.)

I disagree with your implication that the primary draw for RebKell's is game threads. I actually find it better suited to season long topics such as "Dallas Wings 2023" or the "Coaching Movement" thread that Durantula mentioned earlier. But the games threads aren't satisfying to me for the following reasons:
-- I don't want to have to refresh my browser during live action to see if anyone has said anything.
-- If multiple games are happening at once, it's especially annoying to have to click through various threads.
-- The technology is so slow on this site that the game has moved on by the chance I've managed to say about a specific play. (I'll concede it does work OK during quarter breaks/halftime.)
-- People *already* don't participate in most of the game threads, especially during the NCAA regular season. A certain someone creates dozens of threads each week, and only a small handful get genuine, engaged participation. The majority get no posts, or it's just someone giving live score updates. Which is pointless, to be honest, because I can sooner see that just be checking scores...

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Howee

Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15739
Location: OREGON (in my heart)

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Posted: 08/26/22 4:37 pm :::

FrozenLVFan wrote:

I find it very unethical for a competitor to advertise their site on an existing board and then claim it's different and they're not trying to lure away members of the existing board. JMO.

I s'pose that's all true. Is it the same as The Boneyard peeps coming over here and strongly advertising that all UConn fans go there? I know people do multiple boards/chats/media/etc. on wbb.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I believe (from what I've read here) that anybody can do whatever they want via choices. I'm not even clear on why this is up for a vote: can't anyone here start such a thing on their own, and pm people to join them?

I probably oughtta keep my opinions out of this, cuz frankly, I don't WANT live chat. I do NOT wanna deal with screens other than the TV I'm watching a game on. Any of you who know me remember that I rarely post anything WHILE a game is live. I seldom watch a game live - even the Big Games, I start on a 30 min delay, so I can zip through commercials, halftime bs, etc., eventually watching the 4th quarter live as I catch up.

THEN, I like going to the game thread here to read others' opinions on the game highlights, etc. Clearly, I don't need Discord and it doesn't need me. Razz

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eibln

Joined: 26 Apr 2021
Posts: 101

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Posted: 08/27/22 4:07 am :::

FrozenLVFan wrote:

GlennMacGrady wrote:

undersized_post wrote:

the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it.

Queenie wrote:

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both.

Actually your statement is false. The design of the discord was not based of or Rebkell, completely false. Yes it has a lot of the same threads, but it was actually based off the design template for the College softball discord I am apart of. The discord isn’t completely different and will always have similarities to chat board sites. I mean it’s sports, so a lot of the threads for any sports chat board are going to be similar. We have taken ideas from everywhere but Rebkell was not one. Discord is not suited for the mass texts of the coaching movement page or something similar but we are exploring how we could make something like that work because it is already in demand. We are always taking new ideas for the Discord.

FrozenLVFan

Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3516

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Posted: 08/27/22 12:04 pm :::

eibln wrote:

FrozenLVFan wrote:

GlennMacGrady wrote:

undersized_post wrote:

the goal isn't to replace RebKell's but to complement it.

Queenie wrote:

I don’t see a Discord server as a competing hot dog stand, but as the ice cream parlor down the road. You can do either depending on your mood. If you’re hungry, you can do both.

My statements were/are true. Those threads that I listed are duplicates of RebKell threads. Anyone who can read can see that. Regardless of the sources of your ideas, you've used RebKell's website to try to recruit people to discuss the same information on your own board.

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