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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009
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 Posted: 06/22/21 12:52 am ::: |
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but is this
Bird/Gray/Diggins-Smith
Taurasi/Loyd/Atkins
Stewart/Collier
Wilson/Charles
Griner/Fowles
Any less unbalanced than this
Bird/Gray
Taurasi/Loyd/Diggins-Smith
Stewart/Collier
Wilson/Charles/Ogwumike
Griner/Fowles
you can kind of argue that the 3 is really Collier/Atkins
but Atkins is really more of a 2 (she is listed at 5'8") and I can't see either Atkins or Collier starting ahead of
Bird
Taurasi
and then pick 3 of
Stewart/Wilson/Charles/Griner/Fowles
so Stewart is probably going to at least start at the 3
OTOH They could do this (which undercuts my argument)
Bird/Gray
Loyd/Diggins-Smith/Atkins
Taurasi/Collier
Stewart/Wilson/Charles
Griner/Fowles
which solves the balance problem
but
I also think Staley will want to start Wilson somehow
tbh Nneka not making the team isn't as important to me as it might seem based on the arguments I keep putting up. I just feel like Nneka had worked so hard for it.
I also agree that the Parker snub was much more egregious in 16 but we all kind of new there was some "something' between Parker and Geno and the committee. And it is hard to believe that there was some sort of "something" between Nneka and the committee. I can argue that she is a victim of circumstance as she looked like a shoe in in 2020 with Charles on the outside looking in, what a difference a year makes, but I still feel bad for Ogwumike.
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Tally24
Joined: 14 Feb 2012
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| Posted: 06/22/21 2:02 am ::: |
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| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
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snlMINAJ
Joined: 21 Jan 2010
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| Posted: 06/22/21 4:36 am ::: |
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| all devereaux did was spew anti-uconn propaganda.
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: New York
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| Posted: 06/22/21 8:06 am ::: |
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| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable.
Last edited by ucbart on 06/22/21 8:10 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Michelle89
Joined: 17 Nov 2010
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jmpenn90
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 06/22/21 9:55 am ::: |
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I agree with Richyyy -- USA Basketball did the brave thing and picked the best 12.
Nneka's a great player and she's paid her dues, but the Olympics are not about rewarding people, they're about winning gold.
And you can say "Oh the U.S. will win no matter who's there," but the pace of the tournament leads to injuries and you need depth at every position. The medal rounds are single elimination, and the teams the U.S. plays there will be filled with quality players, and if a team hits 60% of its threes and two Americans are hobbled with injuries ... well, upsets do happen.
As for Taurasi, she's a three-point shooter, a traditional weakness of U.S. teams and you need that threat to open up the inside. As mentioned, she appears to be a better pick than the wings who were left off. Nneka does not appear to be a better pick than the posts picked ahead of her.
And then there's Geno, the George Soros/Bill Gates of the anti-UConn group. Conspiracy theorists are everywhere, and it's true paranoids have enemies, but it's really hard to see the bias here. Well, at least for me ..
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undersized_post
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
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| Posted: 06/22/21 10:20 am ::: |
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I wonder what the details are of the alleged separate itineraries for UConn vs. non-UConn players.
| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
False, and sad you would go there.
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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Location: London
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| Posted: 06/22/21 10:28 am ::: |
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| In fairness to Staley, it's not like Nneka was left off so that they could take Khadijah Sessions. The only South Carolina player on the squad is A'ja Wilson, and no one's taking issue with her inclusion. If Tiffany Mitchell or Tyasha Harris had made this team, or even Allisha Gray (who wouldn't be much further down the list than Atkins), I'm sure Staley would be taking plenty of stick for it. |
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SCook
Joined: 09 Oct 2013
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Location: New Jersey
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| Posted: 06/22/21 10:36 am ::: |
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| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
How does this even make sense? Is Staley on the committee that picked the team? Did Nneka magically get left off for a South Carolina player? You can look back down the line and see where Uconn bias is present.
Staley being black is a part of her identity. But it's not all she is. Would this same conversation be happening if Kim Mulkey was the coach? I'm sure her being white wouldn't be brought into it. How low of you.
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Randy
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Iluvacc
Joined: 11 Jun 2005
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Iluvacc
Joined: 11 Jun 2005
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| Posted: 06/22/21 12:00 pm ::: |
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| SCook wrote: |
| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
How does this even make sense? Is Staley on the committee that picked the team? Did Nneka magically get left off for a South Carolina player? You can look back down the line and see where Uconn bias is present.
Staley being black is a part of her identity. But it's not all she is. Would this same conversation be happening if Kim Mulkey was the coach? I'm sure her being white wouldn't be brought into it. How low of you. |
Let’s be real, Geno was the coach for two Olympic cycles and is currently on the National Team Committee, there’s no way Staley yields the same kind of power and influence, hence why Dev Peters did not single her out in those tweets.
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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Location: London
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| Posted: 06/22/21 1:29 pm ::: |
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| I don't believe they've had to submit the squad to the IOC/FIBA yet, so I wonder what happens if someone in the named 12 gets hurt in the next week or two. Do they sheepishly phone up Nneka and say "do you fancy going after all?" |
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Libra_Girl
Joined: 12 Jul 2013
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 06/22/21 1:53 pm ::: |
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| Richyyy wrote: |
| I don't believe they've had to submit the squad to the IOC/FIBA yet, so I wonder what happens if someone in the named 12 gets hurt in the next week or two. Do they sheepishly phone up Nneka and say "do you fancy going after all?" |
Since it's not clear Taurasi will be able to play and they're taking her, why wouldn't they take another injured player as well...as long as they are able to travel? They really only need 7 or 8 to play and it might even help make the rotations easier.
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jmpenn90
Joined: 09 May 2008
Posts: 461
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| Posted: 06/22/21 1:53 pm ::: |
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Kelsey Bone weighing in on Twitter:
I hope y’all never find out the real reason Candace was left off that team in 2016! Cause whew!
And when someone said that you can’t blame Geno this time she responded
😂😂😂 Oh but you can!
Another tweet
Imagine being a fan and thinking you know more than the women who have actually been in the league! They’ve called me a lot of things but a liar has never been one! & while you’re considering things go look at what team I played on during the last Olympics!
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 67123
Location: Where the action is
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| Posted: 06/22/21 3:05 pm ::: |
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FOUR REASONS NNEKA OGWUMIKE IS THE BIGGEST SNUB IN TEAM USA’S OLYMPICS HISTORY
https://justwomenssports.com/nneka-ogwumike-is-the-biggest-snub-in-team-usa-olympics-history/
| Quote: |
| Dawn Staley told reporters that Ogwumike has been a “great voice” during training camp and practices |
_________________
I'm sick and tired of the stories that you always tell
Shakespeare couldn't tell a story that well
See, you're the largest liar that was ever created
You and Pinocchio are probably related
Full of criss-crossed fits, you lie all the time
Your tongue should be embarrassed, you're a threat to mankind
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 2830
Location: New York
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| Posted: 06/22/21 4:17 pm ::: |
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| SCook wrote: |
| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
How does this even make sense? Is Staley on the committee that picked the team? Did Nneka magically get left off for a South Carolina player? You can look back down the line and see where Uconn bias is present.
It makes sense as justification that Peters didn't bring her up. How do you not see this?
Staley being black is a part of her identity. But it's not all she is. Would this same conversation be happening if Kim Mulkey was the coach? I'm sure her being white wouldn't be brought into it. How low of you. |
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 2830
Location: New York
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| Posted: 06/22/21 4:22 pm ::: |
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| Iluvacc wrote: |
| SCook wrote: |
| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
How does this even make sense? Is Staley on the committee that picked the team? Did Nneka magically get left off for a South Carolina player? You can look back down the line and see where Uconn bias is present.
Staley being black is a part of her identity. But it's not all she is. Would this same conversation be happening if Kim Mulkey was the coach? I'm sure her being white wouldn't be brought into it. How low of you. |
Let’s be real, Geno was the coach for two Olympic cycles and is currently on the National Team Committee, there’s no way Staley yields the same kind of power and influence, hence why Dev Peters did not single her out in those tweets. |
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 2830
Location: New York
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| Posted: 06/22/21 4:47 pm ::: |
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| undersized_post wrote: |
I wonder what the details are of the alleged separate itineraries for UConn vs. non-UConn players.
| ucbart wrote: |
| Tally24 wrote: |
| Interesting that Staley is, seemingly, not being held responsible for Nneka’s snub, while Geno was the culprit for Parker. Dev Peters seemed to call everyone out BUT Staley. |
Staley is black. The end.
Dawn is the new Pat Summitt. She can do no wrong. She is coddled, revered, and protected from everything by the media, players, and fans. She can say, do, and act whatever way she wants and nothing will happen. She is totally untouchable. |
False, and sad you would go there. |
Sad I would go where? Her race played a VITAL role in why Deveraux Peters never once blamed her for Neka being left off the team. It's obvious.
The second part of my statement is 100% true, whether you like it or not.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014
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| Posted: 06/22/21 4:47 pm ::: |
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| mercfan wrote: |
Usually to be a known name you have to be....the best.
I am confused as to where this gets confusing to people. I am not a Seattle fan and Sue Bird is objectively the best pg in the game. She should be on the team. |
Courtney Vandersloot is, objectively, the best point guard in the game, in 2021. Sue Bird, at this particular point in her career, is merely the most accomplished.
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My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014
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| Posted: 06/22/21 5:21 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
| Nneka is now almost certain to be the first league MVP to never make an Olympic team. She'll be 33 in 2024, and hard to imagine her making her first team then. |
It happens. |
It's literally never happened. And, just in case you were only referring to the second sentence, and not the first, I'm reasonably sure that Ashja Jones is the oldest player ever to make their Olympic debut for the United States Women's Team, and she was still two years younger than Ogwumike will be in 2024.
| Quote: |
| There are a number of NBA MVPs who never played in the Olympics, like Steph Curry. |
First off, There is a world of difference between not being selected (Ogwumike) and declining an invitation (Curry). Secondly, when talking about NBA MVPs who never played on the Olympic team, it has to be acknowledged that pros were not eligible to play until 1992. Now, I will stipulate that my Internet-fu is weak, so I don't know whether there is enough information available online to say what all the eligibility requirements were, prior to 1992. But, TTBOMK, of the eight pre-92 NBA MVPs who never played in the Olympics, none of them, with the possible exception of Wilt Chamberlain, was actually eligible for the Olympic team, and not selected.
The only post-92 NBA MVP to not be selected for an Olympic team is Derrick Rose (withdrew due to injury in 2012, not selected in 2016, 2020) so, if by "a number" you mean "one," then sure.
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Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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miller40
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
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| Posted: 06/22/21 6:55 pm ::: |
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| mercfan wrote: |
| miller40 wrote: |
| mercfan wrote: |
| miller40 wrote: |
| mercfan wrote: |
I'm a big Nneka fan so it's obviously disappointing. More so because I think she is an excellent ambassador of the game. Unfortunately, it's just the most dominant position in the game at the moment. The forwards on team USA are considerably "better" than the group of guards. If Stewart or Wilson couldn't make it due to injury, she would be in. You can't even reposition because Fowles, Griner and Charles are arguably 3 of the 4 best U.S. centers ever if we're talking pure talent. It's just the way the cookie crumbles. I do have sympathy though and thought Chiney's piece was spot on.
FWIW Staley's comments do heavily imply that the injury was a major part of her omission and it seems like a lot of facts regarding decision making conversations have not been revealed.
I don't really care about term limits per say. It just doesn't matter to me if players are still arguably the best in their role. Playing international competition and excelling is more difficult than some of ya'll make it out to be. You can't just throw a bunch of 22 year olds on the court and call it a day at this level. Players like Bird and Taurasi have just made it look easy over the last 20 years. |
Ogwumike’s sister/s and her agent have all confirmed she will be just as healthy and ready to play by Olympics as Taurasi.
Dev Peters has a lot of info on USAWBB in this thread, it is worth a look:
https://twitter.com/mspeters14/status/1407099988388286466?s=21
It includes mention of there being separate activities for UConn and non-UConn Team USA members in London 2012. |
Right and I get that. However Taurasi and Nneka are not competing for a spot. She is competing with three healthy elite forwards.
Staley, the head coach literally said
"I mean, if we had to make a decision a month from now ... I'm sure she would be healthy. I know this is one of the things that she wanted to do. She came to every training camp, she's been a great voice in our training camp and our practices. We're definitely going to miss Nneka."
All I am implying is that this wasn't a "put names in a hat and only pick who we like". A lot goes in to this and finding a 12 person roster is NEVER going to come without anger. Someone or multiple people will always get the short end.
This doesn't happen in the NBA because the best players choose to skip the olympics. Otherwise we would be discussing Curry vs Lillard vs Paul vs Irving vs Westbrook non stop on social. The bottom line is that there are not enough spots for everyone to make the team. |
Right and I get that. However Taurasi and Nneka are not competing for a spot. She is competing with three healthy elite forwards.
Are you suggesting there weren’t healthy elite wings in the pool to compete against Taurasi?
Anyway, I wasn’t suggesting they were fighting for the same spot, and don’t think I came anywhere near suggesting that. I was pointing out the hypocrisy of one being sidelined due to an injury while one wasn’t, when they both have similar recovery timeframes. You even said Staley hinted at injury being the deciding factor. My point is, why is it the deciding factor for some but not others? That question isn’t dependent on which position they play. |
Right but it is dependent on other factors, Taurasi is not competing with two MVP level wings, who are both above her in the ranks for an Olympic spot. If there were two individuals at the shooting guard position who were at the level of Stewart and Wilson, Taurasi would have been left off. But the closest you can get is Arike, Courtney Williams, Tiffany Hayes, and Jackie Young. There just isn't a plethora of talent in that spot. Bonner is better than Williams, Hayes and Young and we aren't even talking about her because that position is that deep. There's plenty of elite forwards that did not make the roster. Notice that we aren't talking about guard snubs, like at all? Hell there's only 3 outstanding pg's in the entire league and two of them are on the team.
It's not always a conspiracy. |
I also never said it’s a conspiracy. And I disagree with you about a lack of depth at the wing. I’m going to agree to disagree.
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canadaball
Joined: 24 May 2013
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| Posted: 06/22/21 8:15 pm ::: |
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| Silky Johnson wrote: |
| mercfan wrote: |
Usually to be a known name you have to be....the best.
I am confused as to where this gets confusing to people. I am not a Seattle fan and Sue Bird is objectively the best pg in the game. She should be on the team. |
Courtney Vandersloot is, objectively, the best point guard in the game, in 2021. Sue Bird, at this particular point in her career, is merely the most accomplished. |
This makes about as much sense as saying that Cambage is better than Sylvia Fowles. Don't u know Sloot has foreign passport and thus not eligible for USA?
BTW who u want running team in last seconds of close game? remember the Sloot blunder/choke that lost playoff game to Vegas; I don't think the ancient Bird makes that bad play.
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I dont see Staley being called out at all WTF. This is just past frustration being brought into a different situation.
Since she wasn’t available for the pre-tournaments, and world championships and other practices, etc etc. It was all just a bunch of BS and “they” didn’t want her on the team. Plain and simple!