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Who will win this game? |
Iowa |
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26% |
[ 6 ] |
South Carolina |
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73% |
[ 17 ] |
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Total Votes : 23 |
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MsProudSooner
Joined: 15 Apr 2015 Posts: 49 Location: United States
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Posted: 04/01/23 7:41 am ::: |
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mercfan3 wrote: |
If Iowa Wins, it’ll Be the first time I’ve personally seen a heliocentric
Nitric offense win a championship. |
I had to look up heliocentric! The last team I can remember is Baylor in 2012 but Iowa seems to rely or Clark even more than Baylor relied on Griner.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19760
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Posted: 04/01/23 7:56 am ::: |
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MsProudSooner wrote: |
mercfan3 wrote: |
If Iowa Wins, it’ll Be the first time I’ve personally seen a heliocentric
Nitric offense win a championship. |
I had to look up heliocentric! The last team I can remember is Baylor in 2012 but Iowa seems to rely or Clark even more than Baylor relied on Griner. |
Baylor had Simmons too.
Heliocentric offenses usually revolve around a guard or forward. The Mavs prior to getting Kyrie, or LeBron’s early years.
High usage rate is a key indicator. It’s just usually beaten by a great team, because a great defensive team can stop one player. But they didn’t stop Clark.
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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Youth Coach
Joined: 23 Mar 2008 Posts: 4760
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Posted: 04/01/23 8:08 am ::: |
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Man, Clark was hitting shots that would've made Steph Curry envious.
I don't have a real rooting interest in who wins the tournament since Tennessee is out but I will say that I'm kind of hoping Iowa wins. If not to see Clark cap her season with the net and the title but can you imagine if Kim Mulkey wins? She'll be impossible to live with even more than ever. |
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MsProudSooner
Joined: 15 Apr 2015 Posts: 49 Location: United States
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undersized_post
Joined: 01 Mar 2021 Posts: 2864
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Posted: 04/01/23 9:36 am ::: |
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snlMINAJ wrote: |
undersized_post wrote: |
snlMINAJ wrote: |
call me a hater, but the officiating has to eventually catch up with SCar and Boston specifically. she gets away with so much, and gets so many 'hypocritical calls' her way.
yes Iowa needs everything to go right, but i do think it comes down to officiating. |
The suggestion that officiating is the primary thing standing in the way between Iowa beating South Carolina is just... absurd. And I am an Iowa fan. |
i think officiating certainly helped iowa, and i think boston got some fouls called on her that she normally would not. |
Clark and Czinano also battled foul trouble.
And I thought South Carolina had endless post depth? I can't even count the number of times I've heard South Carolina's bench described as a Final Four caliber team in their own right.
_________________ RebKell's 2021-2022 NCAA Fantasy League Regular Season Champion 🏆
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66922 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 04/01/23 9:51 am ::: |
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snlMINAJ wrote: |
i think officiating certainly helped iowa, and i think boston got some fouls called on her that she normally would not. |
South Carolina got called for two more fouls than Iowa, 20-18. Since the Gamecocks committed two intentionals to end the game, we'll call that even. Iowa shot one more FT than South Carolina, 14-13. Again, the Gamecocks gave them four at the end of the game so that's advantage South Carolina.
Boston played 25 minutes. Her season average was 26. That doesn't seem like a huge difference.
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005 Posts: 8228 Location: Heisenberg
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:08 am ::: |
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undersized_post wrote: |
And I thought South Carolina had endless post depth? I can't even count the number of times I've heard South Carolina's bench described as a Final Four caliber team in their own right. |
SCar's bench five did outscore their starting five, 38 to 35, and out-rebounded them, 25-21. Only three of SCar's starters scored at all, and Cooke scored 24 of those 35 points. Cardoso had by far the best +/- for SCar (and Iowa) at +10. Iowa's four player bench scored only six points with one rebound. So, I'd say that SCar's bench did live up to their deserved billing.
What didn't live up to billing was SCar's defense. By having their bigs frequently come out to the perimeter, often opening up large spaces on one side of the interior court with no paint defenders, they completely underestimated Clark's superb driving ability and Iowa's pick & roll action to score right around those perimeter bigs. For that reason alone, I'd say Bluder out-coached Staley even though Staley had a humongous rebounding and second chance points advantage. |
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66922 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:14 am ::: |
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Garbage stats aside, Cardoso was a huge defensive liability. She was constantly out of position to help on Iowa's driving to the basket. Saxton was key to their post defense all season but was inexplicably nailed to the bench last night.
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2815 Location: New York
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:18 am ::: |
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NoDakSt wrote: |
Boston and Raven Johnson were composed and gracious in the presser. |
Sadly, the same can't be said about Dawn. I've never seen a person who has so much going for them be such a victim.
She has commercials, undeserved awards named after her, the best group of players and people that women's basketball has ever seen, she's the highest paid coach, ADORED by the media and opposing fans, and her own fans treat her like a religious experience. It's simply mind blowing to me that she has all that and is still living in this constant state of being disrespected.
She was a sore loser last night. But it's Dawn, so she gets a free pass.
PS-I must give it to Peck and McNutt, they did about as well as they could've after the game.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63780
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:33 am ::: |
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<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kupVvFTCn_E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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justinabina
Joined: 19 May 2014 Posts: 162
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:33 am ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
NoDakSt wrote: |
Boston and Raven Johnson were composed and gracious in the presser. |
Sadly, the same can't be said about Dawn. I've never seen a person who has so much going for them be such a victim.
She has commercials, undeserved awards named after her, the best group of players and people that women's basketball has ever seen, she's the highest paid coach, ADORED by the media and opposing fans, and her own fans treat her like a religious experience. It's simply mind blowing to me that she has all that and is still living in this constant state of being disrespected.
She was a sore loser last night. But it's Dawn, so she gets a free pass.
PS-I must give it to Peck and McNutt, they did about as well as they could've after the game. |
Oh my goodness, I had to laugh out loud when I read this post. It's serving up the very disrespect that you claim Staley doesn't have to deal with.
She's done an incredible job at South Carolina. Her players love her. She shows a lot of respect for her coaching colleagues and for players on other teams. She's smart, poised, forthright in the interviews I've seen her give... I don't understand the disdain and the putdowns ("undeserved awards named after her," "sore loser").
I don't have any college affiliations - I'm not American - and I'm also more of a WNBA fan than NCAA fan so, looking at Dawn Staley from outside college basketball fandom, I'd say she is an excellent representative of the game.
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njjosh
Joined: 07 Nov 2004 Posts: 1458
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Posted: 04/01/23 10:42 am ::: |
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GlennMacGrady wrote: |
What didn't live up to billing was SCar's defense. By having their bigs frequently come out to the perimeter, often opening up large spaces on one side of the interior court with no paint defenders, they completely underestimated Clark's superb driving ability and Iowa's pick & roll action to score right around those perimeter bigs. For that reason alone, I'd say Bluder out-coached Staley even though Staley had a humongous rebounding and second chance points advantage. |
I completely agree. While Dawn Staley is a tremendous coach, last night was not her finest moment.
That said, the Gamecocks have been a poor outside shooting team all season. Their incredible offensive rebounding prowess made up for that, but it couldn't quite do so last night. I'm surprised, given that Dawn was one of the best guards in WCBB history, that she hasn't been able to recruit and develop better outside shooters.
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singinerd54
Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 1817 Location: Missouri
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PRballer
Joined: 18 Apr 2007 Posts: 2544
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PG4ever
Joined: 14 May 2020 Posts: 429
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Posted: 04/01/23 12:27 pm ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
snlMINAJ wrote: |
i think officiating certainly helped iowa, and i think boston got some fouls called on her that she normally would not. |
South Carolina got called for two more fouls than Iowa, 20-18. Since the Gamecocks committed two intentionals to end the game, we'll call that even. Iowa shot one more FT than South Carolina, 14-13. Again, the Gamecocks gave them four at the end of the game so that's advantage South Carolina.
Boston played 25 minutes. Her season average was 26. That doesn't seem like a huge difference. |
True but context matters. Playing 25 minutes because your team is blowing the other team out by 30 is not the same as playing 25 because you get get 2 fouls in the first quarter of the Final Four against Iowa. The numbers may not be a much different but the calls made a big difference.
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PG4ever
Joined: 14 May 2020 Posts: 429
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Posted: 04/01/23 12:39 pm ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
NoDakSt wrote: |
Boston and Raven Johnson were composed and gracious in the presser. |
Sadly, the same can't be said about Dawn. I've never seen a person who has so much going for them be such a victim.
She has commercials, undeserved awards named after her, the best group of players and people that women's basketball has ever seen, she's the highest paid coach, ADORED by the media and opposing fans, and her own fans treat her like a religious experience. It's simply mind blowing to me that she has all that and is still living in this constant state of being disrespected.
She was a sore loser last night. But it's Dawn, so she gets a free pass.
PS-I must give it to Peck and McNutt, they did about as well as they could've after the game. |
I couldn't disagree with you more about Staley being a sore loser/playing the victim last night. She never complained about herself being disrespected and she doesn't care if people like her; for her, it's always about sticking up for her players when people (in this case she was speaking about media members) make disparaging comments about them. I respect that she stands up for her players. She gave props to CC and Iowa in the post-game presser. I'm curious what she said last night that made her a sore loser. Like can you point me to places in the post-game presser or something?
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Michael
Joined: 23 Mar 2006 Posts: 602
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Posted: 04/01/23 12:57 pm ::: |
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njjosh wrote: |
GlennMacGrady wrote: |
What didn't live up to billing was SCar's defense. By having their bigs frequently come out to the perimeter, often opening up large spaces on one side of the interior court with no paint defenders, they completely underestimated Clark's superb driving ability and Iowa's pick & roll action to score right around those perimeter bigs. For that reason alone, I'd say Bluder out-coached Staley even though Staley had a humongous rebounding and second chance points advantage. |
I completely agree. While Dawn Staley is a tremendous coach, last night was not her finest moment.
That said, the Gamecocks have been a poor outside shooting team all season. Their incredible offensive rebounding prowess made up for that, but it couldn't quite do so last night. I'm surprised, given that Dawn was one of the best guards in WCBB history, that she hasn't been able to recruit and develop better outside shooters. |
I was shocked, end of the game, Iowa is still killing USCar with the same pick and roll action they had all game and Staley never once adjusted to it by having her bigs sag down off Iowa's. Even Clark called it out as curious.
_________________ Michael
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19760
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2815 Location: New York
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Posted: 04/01/23 3:41 pm ::: |
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PG4ever wrote: |
ucbart wrote: |
NoDakSt wrote: |
Boston and Raven Johnson were composed and gracious in the presser. |
Sadly, the same can't be said about Dawn. I've never seen a person who has so much going for them be such a victim.
She has commercials, undeserved awards named after her, the best group of players and people that women's basketball has ever seen, she's the highest paid coach, ADORED by the media and opposing fans, and her own fans treat her like a religious experience. It's simply mind blowing to me that she has all that and is still living in this constant state of being disrespected.
She was a sore loser last night. But it's Dawn, so she gets a free pass.
PS-I must give it to Peck and McNutt, they did about as well as they could've after the game. |
I couldn't disagree with you more about Staley being a sore loser/playing the victim last night. She never complained about herself being disrespected and she doesn't care if people like her; for her, it's always about sticking up for her players when people (in this case she was speaking about media members) make disparaging comments about them. I respect that she stands up for her players. She gave props to CC and Iowa in the post-game presser. I'm curious what she said last night that made her a sore loser. Like can you point me to places in the post-game presser or something? |
Well. For one, blaming the officials is comedy and being a poor sport. Second, please read this.
https://apple.news/AZ_6GDvFCQ76KMJDpLJktBQ
Staley added: "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters. This team exemplifies how you need to approach basketball on the court and off the court. ... You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it -- that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. I'm not changing.“
Monkeys? Thugs? Shame on her. She’s putting words in people’s mouths. Now this narrative is going to take off and her being the poor little victim will be the story again.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3516
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Posted: 04/01/23 4:46 pm ::: |
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I thought Dawn seemed tired, sick, and/or unmotivated last night in her conversation with Holly. She didn't have the usual fire in a big game.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32335
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Posted: 04/01/23 4:53 pm ::: |
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Cooke complaining about the refs was ridiculous. They complain about Boston getting two fouls but don't mention Czinano sitting most of the first half as well. And SoCaro is much deeper in the post than Iowa. The fouls went both ways but SoCaro is used to having a lot fewer fouls than the other team. For a team that plays as physical as they do, that shouldn't be the case.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19760
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Posted: 04/01/23 5:29 pm ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
PG4ever wrote: |
ucbart wrote: |
NoDakSt wrote: |
Boston and Raven Johnson were composed and gracious in the presser. |
Sadly, the same can't be said about Dawn. I've never seen a person who has so much going for them be such a victim.
She has commercials, undeserved awards named after her, the best group of players and people that women's basketball has ever seen, she's the highest paid coach, ADORED by the media and opposing fans, and her own fans treat her like a religious experience. It's simply mind blowing to me that she has all that and is still living in this constant state of being disrespected.
She was a sore loser last night. But it's Dawn, so she gets a free pass.
PS-I must give it to Peck and McNutt, they did about as well as they could've after the game. |
I couldn't disagree with you more about Staley being a sore loser/playing the victim last night. She never complained about herself being disrespected and she doesn't care if people like her; for her, it's always about sticking up for her players when people (in this case she was speaking about media members) make disparaging comments about them. I respect that she stands up for her players. She gave props to CC and Iowa in the post-game presser. I'm curious what she said last night that made her a sore loser. Like can you point me to places in the post-game presser or something? |
Well. For one, blaming the officials is comedy and being a poor sport. Second, please read this.
https://apple.news/AZ_6GDvFCQ76KMJDpLJktBQ
Staley added: "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters. This team exemplifies how you need to approach basketball on the court and off the court. ... You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it -- that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. I'm not changing.“
Monkeys? Thugs? Shame on her. She’s putting words in people’s mouths. Now this narrative is going to take off and her being the poor little victim will be the story again. |
Have those things been said to her team during a game? Fans can be awful. And if she’s hearing those comments paired together, sure it could
Be upsetting.
She does need to calm down about other coaches being frustrated that her team is so physical. It’s absolutely fine that she chooses that style to coach. It’s effective. But of course one of the ways other coaches will battle her team is putting the refs on notice that they foul. It’s not personal it’s basketball advantage.
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19760
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Posted: 04/01/23 5:30 pm ::: |
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Double post
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18031 Location: Queens
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Posted: 04/01/23 7:46 pm ::: |
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ucbart wrote: |
Staley added: "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters. This team exemplifies how you need to approach basketball on the court and off the court. ... You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it -- that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. I'm not changing.“
Monkeys? Thugs? Shame on her. She’s putting words in people’s mouths. Now this narrative is going to take off and her being the poor little victim will be the story again. |
No, sadly, apparently she was *not* putting words in people's mouths, there *were* apparently people using that terminology about her team. I don't want to believe it either, but here we are.
_________________ Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009 Posts: 8949
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Posted: 04/01/23 7:52 pm ::: |
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Queenie wrote: |
ucbart wrote: |
Staley added: "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters. This team exemplifies how you need to approach basketball on the court and off the court. ... You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it -- that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. I'm not changing.“
Monkeys? Thugs? Shame on her. She’s putting words in people’s mouths. Now this narrative is going to take off and her being the poor little victim will be the story again. |
No, sadly, apparently she was *not* putting words in people's mouths, there *were* apparently people using that terminology about her team. I don't want to believe it either, but here we are. |
Can you please share how you know this?
_________________ "Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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