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Detroit Ends Season

 
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mzonefan



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
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Location: Ann Arbor, MI


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PostPosted: 01/21/21 10:33 pm    ::: Detroit Ends Season Reply Reply with quote

Some people can’t change. At Eastern Michigan, AnnMarie Gilbert was suspended by Eastern Michigan over violations of practice rules and then show caused by the NCAA for threatening her players with losing their scholarships if they didn’t lie to the NCAA investigators.

In eerily similar reports, Detroit has suspended their season over the same acts in Gilbert’s first season as the Titans coach.

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/2021/01/21/detroit-mercy-womens-basketball-players-annmarie-gilbert-abuse-ncaa-violations/4245788001/

Good for the players who refused to play for her any further, and good for their parents who put together a thorough and cohesive letter to the school.


Queenie



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 01/21/21 10:53 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

There are some absolutely infuriating events detailed in that letter. I'm not sure what angered me most: the demand that players change their majors or drop required courses because the labs conflicted with practice, the insistence on covering up medical issues like concussions or COVID symptoms, the unprofessional behavior towards assistant coaches (because to me that suggests some serious emotional issues, not just the petty tyranny of your typical unbalanced coach), or the gossiping to her high-school-aged daughter. Or, come to think of it, the idea that Gilbert learned nothing from the first time she got unceremoniously booted from a school in Michigan.

The article notes at the end that Gilbert's daughter is a 4-star Kentucky commit. I wonder if her behavior is egregious enough to make Kentucky revisit that commitment. I'd feel sorry for the kid, but on the other hand, if I'm Kyra Elzy, do I want a parent around my program who has publicly and repeatedly shown she doesn't care about NCAA regulations, respects no authority but her own, and has severe boundary issues?

Also, DON'T READ THE COMMENTS.



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PUmatty



Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 01/21/21 10:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Queenie wrote:
There are some absolutely infuriating events detailed in that letter. I'm not sure what angered me most: the demand that players change their majors or drop required courses because the labs conflicted with practice, the insistence on covering up medical issues like concussions or COVID symptoms, the unprofessional behavior towards assistant coaches (because to me that suggests some serious emotional issues, not just the petty tyranny of your typical unbalanced coach), or the gossiping to her high-school-aged daughter. Or, come to think of it, the idea that Gilbert learned nothing from the first time she got unceremoniously booted from a school in Michigan.

The article notes at the end that Gilbert's daughter is a 4-star Kentucky commit. I wonder if her behavior is egregious enough to make Kentucky revisit that commitment. I'd feel sorry for the kid, but on the other hand, if I'm Kyra Elzy, do I want a parent around my program who has publicly and repeatedly shown she doesn't care about NCAA regulations, respects no authority but her own, and has severe boundary issues?

Also, DON'T READ THE COMMENTS.


Well, now I just want to read the comments ...

Also, why in the world would Detroit have hired this person??


Queenie



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PostPosted: 01/21/21 11:03 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

In between getting show-caused at Eastern Michigan and traumatizing Detroit Mercy, she was very successful at D-II Virginia Union. Which, I suppose, means we have to ask what she got away with at Virginia Union that got overlooked because it was D-II and she was winning.



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SDHoops



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PostPosted: 01/22/21 4:46 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Wow, true Joanne protégé in every sense!


mzonefan



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: 01/22/21 10:04 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Queenie wrote:
There are some absolutely infuriating events detailed in that letter. I'm not sure what angered me most: the demand that players change their majors or drop required courses because the labs conflicted with practice, the insistence on covering up medical issues like concussions or COVID symptoms, the unprofessional behavior towards assistant coaches (because to me that suggests some serious emotional issues, not just the petty tyranny of your typical unbalanced coach), or the gossiping to her high-school-aged daughter. Or, come to think of it, the idea that Gilbert learned nothing from the first time she got unceremoniously booted from a school in Michigan.

The article notes at the end that Gilbert's daughter is a 4-star Kentucky commit. I wonder if her behavior is egregious enough to make Kentucky revisit that commitment. I'd feel sorry for the kid, but on the other hand, if I'm Kyra Elzy, do I want a parent around my program who has publicly and repeatedly shown she doesn't care about NCAA regulations, respects no authority but her own, and has severe boundary issues?

Also, DON'T READ THE COMMENTS.


Here’s the NCAA report from the EMU violations.

https://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/press-releases/eastern-michigan-found-failure-monitor-womens-basketball

Quote:
From spring of 2007 through August 2010, the former head coach did not follow practice limitation rules, which resulted in her failure to promote an atmosphere for compliance within the women’s basketball program. In its report, the committee noted that the limitations on playing and practice hours exist to safeguard student-athlete well-being and prohibit unfair competitive advantages from occurring, and the former head coach admitted that the program benefitted from the additional practice time.

“The committee was particularly troubled by comments on the record,” stated the public report. “For example, the former head coach told student-athletes who complained about excessive practices or sought to leave early to study that they were ‘soft,’ and that they had ‘the rest of [their lives] to retake a class.”


Another nugget? She was the Assistant Athletic Director and Senior Women's Administrator at VUU.


purduefanatic



Joined: 10 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: 01/22/21 10:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Why she was hired in the first place is beyond me. When I saw it, I cringed. I will say this though...some of the complaints are kinda out there. I don't know a single coach that hasn't said they were disappointed with their team or said I should just sit and quit coaching this game. And giving them set times for a distance run is common practice as well. In addition, I would bet the 20-hour rule is the most commonly broken one by every single program in the nation. When you factor in on-court time, film breakdown, workouts, weights, position/team meetings, etc, every program exceeds 20 hours. It only comes to light in these types of situations.

In regards to how she treats her assistants, I don't know but it is also extremely common for the head coach to yell out "Coach Smith, looks like you haven't taught those post players how to box out" or "Coach Jackson, you better get those guards going or I'm gonna have to find someone that will". Now, with any situations I have been involved in, the coaching staff knew not to take any of that to heart as it was a way for the head coach to motivate the players. In just about every program, the players tend to have closer relationships with the assistants, particularly their position coaches. When they hear the head coach get upset with the asst, generally speaking, it can light a fire under the players. Again, I don't know this situation at all and it probably isn't as positive as what I'm familiar with.

So, all that said, the academic portion of this is terrible. We always adjusted practice times or made sure the player that had to miss some or all of practice met with a coach to review what was missed, whether on the court or in the office or both. In many situations, practice time can be hard to come by due to the lack of facilities and the number of teams that have to use it, so adjusting start times can be problematic. So, you adjust with that players meeting with a coach. It really isn't a huge deal at all so for her to make this such a mountain speaks to her ability to lead a team and develop people.

The being told to ignore injuries or not report covid symptoms is not good, not good at all. A good trainer is a must as is a trusting relationship between the coach and trainer. The trainer needs to trust that the coach will take care of the kids and know when to pull back the reins a little while the coach has to be able to trust the trainer and know they will be aggressive in their treatment to make sure the player gets healthy as quick as possible. I doubt this kind of relationship existed and honestly, not sure one can with the coach in question.

Anyway, this is definitely a bad situation and one that, quite frankly, UD brought upon itself. Didn't anybody in the UD administration think to ask someone that was at Eastern Michigan during her time?


SDHoops



Joined: 09 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: 01/22/21 3:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

That article mentions Niecee Nelson of PFW who was put on blast in the past few days. It noted that her contract expires on March 31, so I'm sure they're just letting it run out.


summertime blues



Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 6047
Location: Shenandoah Valley


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PostPosted: 01/22/21 4:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

PUmatty wrote:
Queenie wrote:
There are some absolutely infuriating events detailed in that letter. I'm not sure what angered me most: the demand that players change their majors or drop required courses because the labs conflicted with practice, the insistence on covering up medical issues like concussions or COVID symptoms, the unprofessional behavior towards assistant coaches (because to me that suggests some serious emotional issues, not just the petty tyranny of your typical unbalanced coach), or the gossiping to her high-school-aged daughter. Or, come to think of it, the idea that Gilbert learned nothing from the first time she got unceremoniously booted from a school in Michigan.

The article notes at the end that Gilbert's daughter is a 4-star Kentucky commit. I wonder if her behavior is egregious enough to make Kentucky revisit that commitment. I'd feel sorry for the kid, but on the other hand, if I'm Kyra Elzy, do I want a parent around my program who has publicly and repeatedly shown she doesn't care about NCAA regulations, respects no authority but her own, and has severe boundary issues?

Also, DON'T READ THE COMMENTS.


Well, now I just want to read the comments ...

Also, why in the world would Detroit have hired this person??



^^^^THIS^^^^ Plus also wondering about her tenure at Virginia Union.....



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pilight



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PostPosted: 01/22/21 4:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

PUmatty wrote:
Also, why in the world would Detroit have hired this person??


She was the cheapest option that gave the minimum appearance of giving a shit



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FrozenLVFan



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PostPosted: 01/22/21 5:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I don't really understand a couple of things here. The first is the parents jumping in with Zoom meetings and petitions. It appears the whole team was in agreement but never had a meeting with the AD or the NCAA compliance person or anyone. Is this consistent with the way college kids manage things now, to punt things back to their parents? Or did the parents have a meltdown over common issues as purdue discussed and push the kids to this?

And the other is why there's no mention of continuing the season with one of the AC's as interim-HC. Was this "encouraged" by the AD, possibly due to budgetary issues during the pandemic?

I have no doubt Gilbert crossed a lot of lines but I don't think the whole story is out there.


Queenie



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 01/22/21 6:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It sounds like the only full-time assistant that would have been acceptable is Webb, which might be a conflict of interest since he's also one of the concerned player parents. I think that's part of what makes the situation weird.

For what it's worth, I think "why didn't the players go to administration?" was loosely addressed in the article, where someone talked to the AD about a minor peripheral issue and was then harangued for 45 minutes by the coach for going over her head and not respecting the chain of command. It's also possible that the players were discussing action of their own and the parents acted first.

I suspect the smaller issues, but the ones that are NCAA violations, were brought up not out of any serious belief that these are genuine problems, but because "NCAA violations" is a more concrete reason for an administration to have to act. It's like getting Al Capone on tax evasion; it's not the biggest issue, but it's the most actionable one.

I do think the element of one of the concerned player parents being one of the assistants she belittled is a major part of this; you have both a conflict of interest and a non-player witness to the allegations in play.



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PickledGinger



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PostPosted: 01/22/21 7:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The dad being an AC is surreal. I wonder whether or not he had gone to the AD previously and been ignored, or what. But yeah, that behavior is reprehensible, especially the Injury/Illness/COVID shaming. Definitely not a healthy environment in any way. I'm glad she is being removed from these young women's lives. I wonder if she raises her children with that mentality. Crying or Very sad


Ex-Ref



Joined: 04 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: 01/23/21 10:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

HS coach in Indiana on administrative leave now. Verbal and mental abuse allegations.

https://www.wthr.com/article/news/local/avon-girls-basketball-coach-on-administrative-leave-amid-investigation/531-0bccfb37-d3ba-41d3-a573-f9b35296288e



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Marquette Fan



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PostPosted: 01/23/21 9:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SDHoops wrote:
That article mentions Niecee Nelson of PFW who was put on blast in the past few days. It noted that her contract expires on March 31, so I'm sure they're just letting it run out.


I see they are 0-14 this season. They can't lose next weekend though as they were supposed to play Detroit Mercy...


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