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toad455



Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 05/26/20 5:45 pm    ::: Suspended/Opt-out list 2020 Reply Reply with quote

With all that happened due to the delay in the season, here's the full list of suspended, temporary suspended & opt-out players for this season:

SUSPENDED
Mikayla Pivec, Atlanta Dream
Maite Cazorla, Atlanta Dream
Kiah Gillespie, Chicago Sky
Imani McGee-Stafford, Dallas Wings
Luisa Geiselsoder, Dallas Wings
Bernadett Hatar, Indiana Fever
Ji-Su Park, Las Vegas Aces
Leonie Fiebich, Los Angeles Sparks
Maria Vadeeva, Los Angeles Sparks
Jessica Shepard, Minnesota Lynx
Maya Moore, Minnesota Lynx
Han Xu, New York Liberty
Marine Johannes, New York Liberty
Stephanie Talbot, New York Liberty
Yvonne Turner, Phoenix Mercury
Kitija Laksa, Seattle Storm
Lee-Seul Kang, Washington Mystics

TEMPORARY SUSPENSION
Odyssey Sims, Minnesota Lynx

OPT-OUT
Tiffany Hayes, Atlanta Dream
Renee Montgomery, Atlanta Dream
Jonquel Jones, Connecticut Sun
Liz Cambage, Las Vegas Aces
Chiney Ogwumike, Los Angeles Sparks
Kristi Toliver, Los Angeles Sparks
Cecilia Zandalasini, Minnesota Lynx
Asia Durr, New York Liberty
Rebecca Allen, New York Liberty
Jessica Breland, Phoenix Mercury
Dan Hughes, Seattle Storm
Tina Charles, Washington Mystics
LaToya Sanders, Washington Mystics
Natasha Cloud, Washington Mystics



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Last edited by toad455 on 07/17/20 5:46 pm; edited 15 times in total
bluedevilaztecfan5



Joined: 16 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: 05/26/20 5:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Anybody know what happens with the player’s contract?

Johannes for example just signed a two year contract for 2020 and 2021.
Does this mean her contract is now for 2021 and 2022?
Or does she just not get paid for 2020, contract still ends after 2021 season?


Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 05/26/20 6:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Anybody know what happens with the player’s contract?

Johannes for example just signed a two year contract for 2020 and 2021.
Does this mean her contract is now for 2021 and 2022?
Or does she just not get paid for 2020, contract still ends after 2021 season?

The latter. Contracts keep ticking, but player doesn't get paid and doesn't get credit for a year of service if she doesn't play.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 05/26/20 6:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

By the way, the Mavunga suspension was a bit different from the others the last I heard, but given that neither the League nor the Fever have said a damn thing about it I'm not entirely sure whether that remains the case.



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Randy



Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 05/26/20 6:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Anybody know what happens with the player’s contract?

Johannes for example just signed a two year contract for 2020 and 2021.
Does this mean her contract is now for 2021 and 2022?
Or does she just not get paid for 2020, contract still ends after 2021 season?

The latter. Contracts keep ticking, but player doesn't get paid and doesn't get credit for a year of service if she doesn't play.


It seems a bit hard to believe that many players just decided they didn't want to play - esp. because many of them are rookies or on the fringes anyway and would have probably wanted to be able to prove themselves.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 05/26/20 6:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
It seems a bit hard to believe that many players just decided they didn't want to play - esp. because many of them are rookies or on the fringes anyway and would have probably wanted to be able to prove themselves.

The American ones, absolutely. But once you discount the ones who are injured or recovering it's a fairly short list. Gillespie and Pivec plus Thornton (and maybe Martin) never signed in the first place. For whatever reason they'd rather be tied to their current franchises rather than UFAs. I think pretty much everyone else is either injured or international. Maybe some of the international players would like to have played, but given the current state of the world it wouldn't take much persuasion from the franchise to get me to agree to stay home.



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bluedevilaztecfan5



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PostPosted: 05/26/20 6:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Anybody know what happens with the player’s contract?

Johannes for example just signed a two year contract for 2020 and 2021.
Does this mean her contract is now for 2021 and 2022?
Or does she just not get paid for 2020, contract still ends after 2021 season?

The latter. Contracts keep ticking, but player doesn't get paid and doesn't get credit for a year of service if she doesn't play.


Got it, thank you Smile


toad455



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 8:48 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bumping and expanding this thread to include any players that decide to opt-out. Players have until June 25 to announce if they're are sitting out this season.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 9:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

As mentioned before, Mavunga's only a temp suspension, so you may want to remove her from your initial list (or add Sims, who's functionally in the same situation).



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root_thing



Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: 06/16/20 9:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It’s going to be interesting since almost a quarter of the players didn’t vote for the agreement. 23% is 32 people. We don’t know if they voted “no”, abstained or simply missed the vote (e.g., out at BLM demonstrations). However, even if only a quarter of these players opt-out, that’s 8 people. One-third would be 10 or 11. In all likelihood, any player who sits-out voluntarily will be a veteran. And we know some teams (Dallas? NY?) will have no one. That means a few franchises could be missing more than one veteran player – probably the teams we’ve been picking as playoff favorites.



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Stormeo



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 1:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So when some players inevitably decide to opt-out, I wonder if there’s any remote possibility that the rookies whose contracts were full-year suspended could actually be re-activated & allow the player to go back on the roster if there’s an open spot. (Unless they mostly agreed to being suspended due to the health risk, of course.) If not, there now might be an advantage to those rookies who were just flat-out waived to go back on their roster, as opposed to the ones who were gonna wait til next year to try out.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 2:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:
So when some players inevitably decide to opt-out, I wonder if there’s any remote possibility that the rookies whose contracts were full-year suspended could actually be re-activated & allow the player to go back on the roster if there’s an open spot. (Unless they mostly agreed to being suspended due to the health risk, of course.) If not, there now might be an advantage to those rookies who were just flat-out waived to go back on their roster, as opposed to the ones who were gonna wait til next year to try out.

I wondered the same thing, but again they've followed the existing paperwork at every step this season as much as possible. So my feeling is that people who've been full-season suspended will have to remain full-season suspended. And yeah, it's another reason to add to the pile for why it made no sense to agree to that from the perspective of the American players who did it.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 5:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Alexa Philippou on the Sun's recent Zoom call. Here's her report about the Sun.

https://twitter.com/alexaphilippou/status/1272950697009520640

Quote:
Curt Miller said he wasn't completely sure how it'll work if players opt-out and teams need to replace their spot on rosters... says he expects the opt-out date being next week allows teams to add someone to roster who'll still have time to go through proper medical testing


So replacement players will be able to get signed and tested before heading down to Bradenton.

Quote:
Miller says that Jonquel Jones is still in the Bahamas. If she opts into the season, will have to figure out logistics of getting her to Florida given limited international flight options


Has to be the same conditions for any foreigner trying to play this season.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 5:13 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://thenext.substack.com/p/i-think-there-will-be-a-lot-of-sacrifices

Nicki Collen isn't expecting anyone from the Dream to "opt-out", but says that could change.

Quote:
At this point, the Dream are unaware of any Atlanta players who will be exercising that option, though it is certainly possible that that will change in the coming days before the deadline. And when the roster is finalized, Collen plans to head into Florida with 12 players who are ready to go.



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 06/16/20 6:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Aneela Khan: ACTIVE WNBA PLAYER DATABASE – Who is Playing and who is not?

Quote:
This year, the WNBA season will be much different. All 12 teams will be housed in one location and all of the WNBA players and involved personnel will have to stay within one area. With all of that in mind, I decided to create an active WNBA Player Database to track every single signed player. I will update it every time we hear of a WNBA player that will not play until the day the WNBA officially tips off.


https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vT0V2lwmGiiYXw7-jXg1c_nJeR_k70LrO44HI4L-9LbShkzx3Wjfu6CM5nHSwHr3Gl3J4RiZJJ6KoTq/pubhtml?gid=0&single=true&widget=true&headers=false



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root_thing



Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: 06/17/20 1:40 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:

... again they've followed the existing paperwork at every step this season as much as possible.


If the WNBA is intent on following the normal rules, then the opt-out situation is going to be really ugly. Anyone with a medical waiver opt-out should at least hit the salary cap because they’re getting paid. Normally, they should also occupy a roster spot since an ill player is like an injured player. The only people who get paid but don’t take up roster space are those who receive termination settlements – like Tayler Hill. In short, teams shouldn’t be allowed to reuse the roster spot of a medical opt-out nor should they receive cap relief if normal rules apply.

For those who opt-out without pay, teams could place them on full-year suspension if this were preseason. However, since WNBA players are getting paid like the season already started, doesn’t that suggest we’re too late? In that case, voluntary opt-out players can only be temporarily suspended. Once again, that means people have to be counted against the salary cap. Any team pushing against the cap wouldn't have room for an additional player. However, since some teams are already at the 11-player minimum, then I guess they'd have to be given a hardship exemption.

Welcome to Opt-Out World! Smile



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 5:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah, its awkward. My guess - and I stress that this is a guess, not sourced info - is that players who opt out just through choice get counted as if they never showed up for the season, and therefore written off as a zero (and presumably then suspended for the year). Players have only received two paychecks (out of 12), so as long as it's a relatively small number of players I don't think it'd be a big deal to ignore. Their roster spots would also then open up.

The more complicated ones are players who have a medical justification to opt out, and therefore receive full salary while not being on the team. Hopefully no individual team has more than one, but if, say, Delle Donne opts out, Washington already don't have the cap space to sign another player and would be down to 10. The League would either need a special rule, or we're getting into Exceptions pretty much immediately.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 5:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Updated to remove Mavunga and add Zandalasini. Would Ceci be the first "opt-out"?



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root_thing



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 7:09 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Updated to remove Mavunga and add Zandalasini. Would Ceci be the first "opt-out"?


Probably, but what does “opt-out” really mean? Is it a new category that both sides agreed upon and is essentially an addendum to the CBA? Or are they forcing the opt-outs into existing categories like Non-Active – Personal Decision (Full Season) and whatever they’re calling temporary suspensions these days? Minnesota is way under the salary cap, so they can actually carry Huff without Zandalisini dropping off. Consequently, we won’t know what’s happening until we see the official listing on WNBA.com – assuming they get around to it.



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Aside from separately going on trial for murder and treason, Aaron Burr seemed like a pretty nice guy.
Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 7:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Or until someone like me writes/tweets about it Smile. Details coming soon, I promise. Suffice it to say, if I do another one of those salary sheet articles, it's going to be obnoxiously more complicated...



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root_thing



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 8:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Some of us are geeky and we like obnoxiously complicated. Very Happy



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Aside from separately going on trial for murder and treason, Aaron Burr seemed like a pretty nice guy.
toad455



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PostPosted: 06/17/20 8:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Or until someone like me writes/tweets about it Smile. Details coming soon, I promise. Suffice it to say, if I do another one of those salary sheet articles, it's going to be obnoxiously more complicated...


I'm looking forward to it.



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miller40



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PostPosted: 06/18/20 9:06 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://twitter.com/itsreneem_/status/1273615398961844224?s=21

Renee Montgomery is opting out to focus on social justice.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 06/18/20 10:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

miller40 wrote:
https://twitter.com/itsreneem_/status/1273615398961844224?s=21

Renee Montgomery is opting out to focus on social justice.



Made room for a Carter , Hayes & Williams line up .



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/18/20 10:26 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Some details on how they're handling all this:

https://twitter.com/RichardCohen1/status/1273637579569737728?s=20
https://twitter.com/RichardCohen1/status/1273637580723060739?s=20

As before, it's pretty much as close to standard operating procedure as they can come under these circumstances.



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