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Genero36
Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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 Posted: 04/07/20 9:52 pm ::: Which Championship Player(s) Have Benefited The Most? |
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Which all-time great player(s) who have won at least one WNBA championship have benefited the most from playing with another great(s)?
With all due respect to their teammates, how does it help the argument Delle Donne & Catchings (especially Catch who won a championship over a legendary lineup) are that much greater than those listed below due to winning with less star power around them? This isn’t my argument but I just thought it would be an interesting question to ask.
You say what???
Cynthia Cooper (Swoopes, Thompson, Arcain)
Sheryl Swoopes (Cooper, Thompson, Arcain)
Tina Thompson (Cooper, Swoopes, Arcain)
Lisa Leslie (Delisha Milton-Jones)
Deanna Nolan (Cash, Ford, Smith)
Katie Smith (Nolan, Ford)
Swintayla Cash Canal (Ford, Nolan, Smith, Jackson, Bird, Smith)
Lauren Jackson (Sue Bird)
Sue Bird (Lauren Jackson)
Diana Taurasi (Pondexter, Taylor, Griner)
Cappie Pondexter (Taurasi, Taylor)
Brittney Griner (Taurasi, Taylor)
Maya Moore (Augustus, Whalen, Fowles)
Sylvia Fowles (Moore, Augustus, Whalen, Brunson)
Lindsay Whalen (Moore, Augustus, Fowles, Brunson)
Seimone Augustus (Moore, Fowles, Whalen, Brunson)
Rebekkah Brunson (Moore, Fowles, Whalen, Augustus)
Yolanda Griffith (Penicheiro)
Patrícia Penicheiro (Griffith)
Candace Parker (Ogwumike)
Nneka Ogwumike (Parker)
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Last edited by Genero36 on 04/10/20 12:46 am; edited 2 times in total |
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adamj95
Joined: 09 May 2014
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| Posted: 04/07/20 10:53 pm ::: |
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| Maya Moore. Amazing talent but fell into a great situation with the Lynx and then got Fowles to join halfway through the Dynasty.
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4 time WNBA Champion, 3rd all time in Assists, Minnesota's own: LINDSAY WHALEN.
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mavcarter
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| Posted: 04/07/20 11:17 pm ::: |
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Fowles._________________
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| Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree? |
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 04/08/20 7:51 am ::: |
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| Brunson is probably the only player that benefitted from the Monarchs' folding.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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| Posted: 04/08/20 8:49 am ::: |
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| The Lottery Lynx went from lottery team to championship in Maya’s rookie year. How often does that happen? Maybe once under the old Shock team? I would say the Lynx benefitted from Maya more than the other way around. That’s how great she is. Her presence changed the culture of the team just like that.
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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/08/20 9:11 am ::: |
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Notice who's not even an option on that list?
Catchings.
GOAT.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/08/20 9:39 am ::: |
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This is difficult because sometimes great players make others look better.
I think Cappie benefited the most in terms of considerations of individual greatness. Her numbers stayed great for a little while in NYC - but she didn't look like the same player.
But Moore benefited the most in terms of championships. Or really, all of the Minnesota players did. I still think Whalen was the most important player on those championship teams.
Catch's Indiana team reminded me the great Detroit Pistons that beat the stacked Kobe/Shaq Lakers team from the get go. They weren't all stars, but you weren't going to score on them.
If we get an NBA playoffs this year, it's why I fully expect the Clippers to win. They do have one more star than Indiana (and 2 more, really) and Detroit had - but they aren't the huge names that some other team has...and again..no one will score on them.
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mayajustwins
Joined: 14 Sep 2019
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| Posted: 04/08/20 9:53 am ::: |
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[quote="mercfan3"]
But Moore benefited the most in terms of championships. Or really, all of the Minnesota players did. I still think Whalen was the most important player on those championship teams.
/quote]
There are a lot of Lynx fans who will swear by Brunson. She was the one who would just figure what was needed and do it. A block, a crucial pass, a board. She was unafraid to get dirty to get a win. In the 2017 Finals, her best 3 games were the 3 Lynx victories.
Whalen gave the leadership, Moore the commitment to compete, Augustus the willingness to let others have the spotlight and the willingness to defend. Fowles was the icing on the cake, the pure post presence.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 04/08/20 10:09 am ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
| Notice who's not even an option on that list? |
Angel McCoughtry?
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Genero36
Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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| Posted: 04/08/20 11:36 am ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
| Notice who's not even an option on that list? |
Angel McCoughtry? |
Sorry pilight. This is just about who has won at least one championship.
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mayajustwins
Joined: 14 Sep 2019
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| Posted: 04/08/20 12:01 pm ::: |
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| Bonner.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014
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| Posted: 04/08/20 12:38 pm ::: |
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| mayajustwins wrote: |
| Bonner. |
Uh, what's say we hold off on calling Bonner a "great" player, yeah? She has yet to play a meaningful game without at least 2 of the Top 15 players in the league backing her up. And the only time in her career that she's played a significant number of games without some combination of Taurasi, Taylor, Pondexter, Dupree and/or Griner, they went 7-27.
Based on available data, she's a "great" player in about the same sense that Draymond Green is a "great" player, in the men's game.
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RavenDog
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
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| Posted: 04/08/20 3:27 pm ::: |
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| Lauren Jackson (Sue Bird)
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jap
Joined: 01 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 04/09/20 12:21 am ::: |
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| Genero36 wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
| Notice who's not even an option on that list? |
Angel McCoughtry? |
Sorry pilight. This is just about who has won at least one championship. |
Teams win championships - not individual players![/b]
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Genero36
Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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| Posted: 04/09/20 12:27 am ::: |
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| jap wrote: |
Teams win championships - not individual players![/b] |
This thread isn't about teams. It's about individual players who have helped lead their teams to championships.
If anything, it's about which great championship player would most likely be in McCoughtry´s position had she didn't have the benefit of her championship teammate(s).
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Silky Johnson
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| Posted: 04/09/20 2:27 pm ::: |
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| Genero36 wrote: |
| If anything, it's about which great championship player would most likely be in McCoughtry´s position had she didn't have the benefit of her championship teammate(s). |
The #HateHard in me wants to say Maya Moore, but the correct answer is Seimone Augustus... Except there's no way in hell that the 2010 version of McCoughtry misses the playoffs, on a team that had Prime!Whalen and Prime!Brunson.
Mone played three seasons (she gets a Mulligan on the injury season) without a superteam built around her, and one season with three-quarters of one built around her, and never even sniffed the playoffs.
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/09/20 8:57 pm ::: |
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| Genero36 wrote: |
| If anything, it's about which great championship player would most likely be in McCoughtry´s position had she didn't have the benefit of her championship teammate(s). |
McCoughtry never had teammates of the caliber of any of those listed, or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates.
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mavcarter
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| Posted: 04/10/20 11:28 am ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates. |
What teammates has Catchings played with who are so much better than what McCoughtry has played with?_________________
| wrote: |
| Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree? |
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/10/20 12:24 pm ::: |
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| mavcarter wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates. |
What teammates has Catchings played with who are so much better than what McCoughtry has played with? |
Nikki McCray and Natalie Williams are Hall of Famers. McCoughtry hasn't played with anyone likely to make the HOF.
Katie Douglas is a four time All WNBA player and was a first teamer before she ever put on a Fever uniform. All of McCoughtry's Dream teammates combined have three All WNBA nods, two of which belong to a player who only played half a season in Atlanta.
Briann January is 10x as good as any PG Atlanta has ever had.
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mavcarter
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Randy
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PUmatty
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| Posted: 04/10/20 2:59 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| mavcarter wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates. |
What teammates has Catchings played with who are so much better than what McCoughtry has played with? |
Nikki McCray and Natalie Williams are Hall of Famers. McCoughtry hasn't played with anyone likely to make the HOF.
Katie Douglas is a four time All WNBA player and was a first teamer before she ever put on a Fever uniform. All of McCoughtry's Dream teammates combined have three All WNBA nods, two of which belong to a player who only played half a season in Atlanta.
Briann January is 10x as good as any PG Atlanta has ever had. |
Yes.
And also: McCray and Williams both joined the Fever well past their prime. McCray was there for two years, and in the second scored just under 4 points a game. Williams was in Indiana the last three years before she retired. In the first she looked mostly like the Natalie Williams we all think of, but was nothing like the prime-time Williams.
Briann January was steady and a great defender. She also has the same number of all-star appearances as Izi Castro-Marquez, Layshia Clarendon, Elizabeth William, etc.
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pilight
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| Posted: 04/10/20 3:08 pm ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| mavcarter wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates. |
What teammates has Catchings played with who are so much better than what McCoughtry has played with? |
Nikki McCray and Natalie Williams are Hall of Famers. McCoughtry hasn't played with anyone likely to make the HOF.
Katie Douglas is a four time All WNBA player and was a first teamer before she ever put on a Fever uniform. All of McCoughtry's Dream teammates combined have three All WNBA nods, two of which belong to a player who only played half a season in Atlanta.
Briann January is 10x as good as any PG Atlanta has ever had. |
Yes.
And also: McCray and Williams both joined the Fever well past their prime. McCray was there for two years, and in the second scored just under 4 points a game. Williams was in Indiana the last three years before she retired. In the first she looked mostly like the Natalie Williams we all think of, but was nothing like the prime-time Williams.
Briann January was steady and a great defender. She also has the same number of all-star appearances as Izi Castro-Marquez, Layshia Clarendon, Elizabeth William, etc. |
There was not a time in Catchings career that the Fever would have traded January straight up for any of them
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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/10/20 3:21 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| mavcarter wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
| or even the caliber of Catchings' teammates. |
What teammates has Catchings played with who are so much better than what McCoughtry has played with? |
Nikki McCray and Natalie Williams are Hall of Famers. McCoughtry hasn't played with anyone likely to make the HOF.
Katie Douglas is a four time All WNBA player and was a first teamer before she ever put on a Fever uniform. All of McCoughtry's Dream teammates combined have three All WNBA nods, two of which belong to a player who only played half a season in Atlanta.
Briann January is 10x as good as any PG Atlanta has ever had. |
Yes.
And also: McCray and Williams both joined the Fever well past their prime. McCray was there for two years, and in the second scored just under 4 points a game. Williams was in Indiana the last three years before she retired. In the first she looked mostly like the Natalie Williams we all think of, but was nothing like the prime-time Williams.
Briann January was steady and a great defender. She also has the same number of all-star appearances as Izi Castro-Marquez, Layshia Clarendon, Elizabeth William, etc. |
There was not a time in Catchings career that the Fever would have traded January straight up for any of them |
True.
The point, though, is that with the big exception of Douglas the gap isn't nearly as big as you want to make it.
I say that has someone who has consistently thought the Angel was ridiculously underrated.
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mavcarter
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