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Team USA @ Oregon - 11/09/19
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myrtle



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 11:41 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
Howee wrote:
PLEASE dear Gawd....let Birdy ('n Taurasi 'n Augustus) show some graciousness and bow out. They just ain't got it no mo'.
. . . .
ps....anybody have a box score handy? I couldn't find one anywhere last night.


The box score is on the USAB site as a PDF. Your "ain't got it no mo'" trio had 33 points on 11-21 shooting, with 17 assists and 3 turnovers.


scoring is one thing. playing anything remotely like defense is another.



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 12:30 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It is telling that in the first three games the college teams were ahead until the second unite came in to pull away. Bird, DT and Agustas have been in decline for some time. There was a time when even in decline they were elite, but now they are average at best. As was mentioned, they no longer are able to play tough defense. What they did add in two of the games was shooting. Bird in one game and DT in this last one. Sure they can light it up sporatically, but what do they add when they are not shooting well?

Now I will get really critical. I suspect that DT and Bird got this core group idea together purely to give them an advantage with respect to getting picked for the team. I am sure the fact that these players are giving up their Overseas salaries will give all of them an edge. Life Time Achievement Awards should not be a factor in picking this team. Those three players know that once the missing players are added that talent will be sufficient to compensate for their personal shortcomings on the court.

Her personality aside, DT's on court abilities have always been obvious. She was the consummate winner. In contrast, Bird has always been one of my favorite players both on and off the court. But this issue with her desire to add to her Gold has totally changed my perspective of her. Beyond her smile are manifest the actions of a self entitled individual. You can not always tell a persons character by how generous they are. Rather how generous they are with things they personally value.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 12:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I think Bird and Taurasi were always going to Tokyo as long as they were largely healthy and wanted to. I don't think they needed this tour to secure it. I think it was mostly to get them paid for doing some training in the WNBA offseason when they didn't want to go overseas anyway. Plus a little bit of that 'grow the game', 'build the profile' stuff that actually gets said in public.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 4:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
Your "ain't got it no mo'" trio had 33 points on 11-21 shooting, with 17 assists and 3 turnovers.


....as compared to The Future Duo (Ionescu and Sabally) who scored 55 on 20-38 shooting. There. THAT point is settled.

But as stated above: scoring isn't the problem--defense ain't there.

It's pretty obvious that THE (final) Olympic Team should most certainly beat Oregon on its best day. But it's just as obvious that those in their late 30s should graciously step aside, rather than seeking glory in 'records' when so MANY others are capable of honoring USA with gold. It's The Right Thing To Do.



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J-Spoon



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 7:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Everyone should stop blaming Bird, DT, Augustus or Catch last time around for not stepping aside, it is not their responsibility to "do the right thing" and they don't make the decisions.

Last Olympics Candace Parker got left off the team, if the committee has the fortitude to make that move, than the committee can leave off any player they want. If the committee chooses to leave Bird, DT and others in place, than it is the committees decision.

I know, I know "the committee would never leave so and so off" well that ain't so and so's fault.

(also the Dream team in 92 got beat by a college team, it happens, if anything it will probably be a good wake up call for the individual players and the committee).


myrtle



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 8:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

J-Spoon wrote:
Everyone should stop blaming Bird, DT, Augustus or Catch last time around for not stepping aside, it is not their responsibility to "do the right thing" and they don't make the decisions.

.


They don't make the final decision but they would make it a helluva lot easier on "the committee" if they stepped aside and admitted that it was time for younger players to take their places. If Bird and/or DT are 100% healthy, I actually don't have a problem keeping them on the team as the old lady 'mentors', but why not give the up-and-coming players a lot more time on the floor to adjust? Sitting on the bench and watching the elders play most of the game doesn't amount to giving them experience. And while 'Mone still has that beautiful sweet midrange jumper, she really should just retire. It's time. And Catch surprised me by being me-first the last time around too.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 11/10/19 11:13 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
J-Spoon wrote:
Everyone should stop blaming Bird, DT, Augustus or Catch last time around for not stepping aside, it is not their responsibility to "do the right thing" and they don't make the decisions.

.


They don't make the final decision but they would make it a helluva lot easier on "the committee" if they stepped aside and admitted that it was time for younger players to take their places. If Bird and/or DT are 100% healthy, I actually don't have a problem keeping them on the team as the old lady 'mentors', but why not give the up-and-coming players a lot more time on the floor to adjust? Sitting on the bench and watching the elders play most of the game doesn't amount to giving them experience. And while 'Mone still has that beautiful sweet midrange jumper, she really should just retire. It's time. And Catch surprised me by being me-first the last time around too.

Catch has that unique blend of being A World's Best caliber of player embodied in the mindset of a woman knows when enough is enough. LET THE NEW CLASS PLAY.

Saying Bird and Taurasi don't have the last say on if they make the team? Maybe not, but they can certainly choose to graciously decline the offer to tryout, so the decision is much easier. They're clinging to glory days that no longer are relevant, AND in the process, delaying/preventing the Glory Days for the next generation.



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Michelle89



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 5:03 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
J-Spoon wrote:
Everyone should stop blaming Bird, DT, Augustus or Catch last time around for not stepping aside, it is not their responsibility to "do the right thing" and they don't make the decisions.

.


They don't make the final decision but they would make it a helluva lot easier on "the committee" if they stepped aside and admitted that it was time for younger players to take their places. If Bird and/or DT are 100% healthy, I actually don't have a problem keeping them on the team as the old lady 'mentors', but why not give the up-and-coming players a lot more time on the floor to adjust? Sitting on the bench and watching the elders play most of the game doesn't amount to giving them experience. And while 'Mone still has that beautiful sweet midrange jumper, she really should just retire. It's time. And Catch surprised me by being me-first the last time around too.


I dont get it. Finally Diggins and Gray are on this team as 'successors' to Bird and Taurasi and then people still hate on the oldies for not stepping aside Laughing Step aside for who? Clarendon? Plum? Canada? Please dont make me laugh Rolling Eyes Canada will need to work on her shot before she will be very effective in FIBA play.

Almost everyone else is overseas (Griner, Charles, Loyd etc.) or still injured (EDD, Stewie). That is why players like Clarendon and Allisha Gray are sitting on the bench and are the oldies playing big minutes while trying to get into playing shape (Bird hasnt played a game in a year before these games..) So i agree that Bird shouldnt play 26 minutes a game on team USA. But that will not be the case when the team is complete.

Someone said what is Bird bringing to this team when she is not hitting her shots. Um her 8 assists says enough. Not to mention leadership/experience and always a threat from outside. Cant leave her open from 3 or midrange even when she is missing her shots.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 9:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Team USA should be doing whatever they can to convince Ionescu to play for them instead of the 3x3 team.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 10:24 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Team USA should be doing whatever they can to convince Ionescu to play for them instead of the 3x3 team.


BINGO!! Cool



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Iluvacc



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 10:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The reason that we're left with the likes of Clarendon, Plum, and Canada is because "shady" USA basketball pissed off players like Vandersloot and Toliver. Not unlike what happened with Becky Hammon, Tweety Nolan, and Katie Douglas. Rolling Eyes Confused


Iluvacc



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 10:31 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
J-Spoon wrote:
Everyone should stop blaming Bird, DT, Augustus or Catch last time around for not stepping aside, it is not their responsibility to "do the right thing" and they don't make the decisions.

.


They don't make the final decision but they would make it a helluva lot easier on "the committee" if they stepped aside and admitted that it was time for younger players to take their places. If Bird and/or DT are 100% healthy, I actually don't have a problem keeping them on the team as the old lady 'mentors', but why not give the up-and-coming players a lot more time on the floor to adjust? Sitting on the bench and watching the elders play most of the game doesn't amount to giving them experience. And while 'Mone still has that beautiful sweet midrange jumper, she really should just retire. It's time. And Catch surprised me by being me-first the last time around too.



Nneka really deserved to be on that team instead of Catch, but after the whole debacle with Candace Parker, there was no way she was being left off.


pilight



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 11:33 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Iluvacc wrote:
Nneka really deserved to be on that team instead of Catch, but after the whole debacle with Candace Parker, there was no way she was being left off.


Yes, Geno excluding every Tennessee player would have been too obviously petty



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 1:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Theres absolutely no replay anywhere of this game ?



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toad455



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 1:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Pac-12's Facebook page had the stream, so check their page for a replay.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 1:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Or there's, y'know, the link I posted in the previous page of this thread.



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 2:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Archive of the full game here (minus the opening four minutes), for anyone that wants it: https://www.facebook.com/Pac12Conference/videos/618598528964177/



Thank you Richyyy!



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Howee



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 7:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Iluvacc wrote:
The reason that we're left with the likes of Clarendon, Plum, and Canada is because "shady" USA basketball pissed off players like Vandersloot and Toliver. Not unlike what happened with Becky Hammon, Tweety Nolan, and Katie Douglas. Rolling Eyes Confused


THIS. 1000x. The nepotism in USA basketball is absurd, and Bird & Taurasi going for a 5th Olympics are exhibit #1.

Yes, they're awesome players who've established their legacies. Being 'good enough' to make the team doesn't warrant their 5th crack at the Olympics, when others equally/even better are denied a spot. USA doesn't *need* them to dominate again.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 7:17 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

100% agree that neither Bird or Taurasi should be on this Olympic team in 2020. the list of American talent forced to go "international" because Team USA didn't give them a shot is absurd!!



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NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 11/11/19 8:17 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Personally, I don't have a problem with Bird or Taurasi being on the team. I do think they should be in less prominent roles than in the past...which will hopefully be accomplished as the Olympics get close. Bird won a championship with Seattle in 2018. It's not like she isn't still a high-end player. In this game, her D wasn't even the issue. Ionescu had trouble dealing with Sue being low to the ground, if anything.

And yes it's true. DT played zero D in this game. But let's keep in perspective that the team is missing a ton of length and height in EDD and BG. At the end of the day the team is still going to cruise in the Olympics. This was nothing more than an exhibition which turned out to be an entertaining surprise. It also showed off the incredible skill of Sabally and some underrated athletic ability of Hebard. I know it's not against the fastest team but you're still dealing with Nneka and Fowles, which is high-end for the W. Oregon has 3 very talented players themselves.

That's how I see it at least.



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 11/12/19 6:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
Personally, I don't have a problem with Bird or Taurasi being on the team. I do think they should be in less prominent roles than in the past...which will hopefully be accomplished as the Olympics get close. Bird won a championship with Seattle in 2018. It's not like she isn't still a high-end player. In this game, her D wasn't even the issue. Ionescu had trouble dealing with Sue being low to the ground, if anything.

And yes it's true. DT played zero D in this game. But let's keep in perspective that the team is missing a ton of length and height in EDD and BG. At the end of the day the team is still going to cruise in the Olympics. This was nothing more than an exhibition which turned out to be an entertaining surprise. It also showed off the incredible skill of Sabally and some underrated athletic ability of Hebard. I know it's not against the fastest team but you're still dealing with Nneka and Fowles, which is high-end for the W. Oregon has 3 very talented players themselves.

That's how I see it at least.
So basically you are saying the same thing I said. That there will be enough tree's in the post positions to compensate for any defensive liabilities that Bird or DT might have. In fact other players will carry them. Maybe they should apply as coaches if their mentorship is so valued. BS that is just an excuse. All they are going for is an unprecedented 5th Olympic appearance. How about giving someone else a fair shot to even get one? It's not like they are indispensable.



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 11/12/19 6:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
Personally, I don't have a problem with Bird or Taurasi being on the team. I do think they should be in less prominent roles than in the past...which will hopefully be accomplished as the Olympics get close. Bird won a championship with Seattle in 2018. It's not like she isn't still a high-end player. In this game, her D wasn't even the issue. Ionescu had trouble dealing with Sue being low to the ground, if anything.

And yes it's true. DT played zero D in this game. But let's keep in perspective that the team is missing a ton of length and height in EDD and BG. At the end of the day the team is still going to cruise in the Olympics. This was nothing more than an exhibition which turned out to be an entertaining surprise. It also showed off the incredible skill of Sabally and some underrated athletic ability of Hebard. I know it's not against the fastest team but you're still dealing with Nneka and Fowles, which is high-end for the W. Oregon has 3 very talented players themselves.

That's how I see it at least.
So basically you are saying the same thing I said. That there will be enough tree's in the post positions to compensate for any defensive liabilities that Bird or DT might have. In fact other players will carry them. Maybe they should apply as coaches if their mentorship is so valued. BS that is just an excuse. All they are going for is an unprecedented 5th Olympic appearance. How about giving someone else a fair shot to even get one? It's not like they are indispensable.



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 11/12/19 10:21 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Let's remember that Bird and Taurasi have played little competitive basketball for months, and are well aware that nothing they're doing now matters except in terms of getting back into game shape.

If they do get back to 100% of what they are now, they will be much better than we have seen, and plenty good enough to deal with the quickness they'll see at the Olympics.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 11/12/19 10:21 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Team USA should be doing whatever they can to convince Ionescu to play for them instead of the 3x3 team.


It’s all Team USA.



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PostPosted: 11/12/19 1:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
Let's remember that Bird and Taurasi have played little competitive basketball for months, and are well aware that nothing they're doing now matters except in terms of getting back into game shape.

If they do get back to 100% of what they are now, they will be much better than we have seen, and plenty good enough to deal with the quickness they'll see at the Olympics.


....AS WILL BE: Courtney Vandersloot, Sabrina Ionescu, Kristi Toliver, Ruthy Hebard, Kayla McBride, Arike Ogunbowale, Natasha Cloud, etc., ETCETERA.

How hoggish is it to use your tenure to get a 5th Gold Medal, when so many deserving players haven't had their first one?? People who endorse them are merely sentimental fans, and no one can say their skill sets are irreplaceable. Just plain ol' Homerism for The Ol' Gerlz.



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