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dreamfan11



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PostPosted: 02/22/20 9:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

hahha Smile



[quote="RI_Sun_Fan"]Maybe Amber Cox and the marketing department used "Burn it Down" a year early... this feels like the start of Burn it Down.[/quote]


toad455



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PostPosted: 02/24/20 6:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So does January start or does Mosqueda-Lewis start at SG? Sun finally adding to their bench.



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Stormeo



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PostPosted: 02/24/20 11:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
So does January start or does Mosqueda-Lewis start at SG? Sun finally adding to their bench.


At this point it seems like a genuinely up-for-grabs spot. Assuming Connecticut will still be a contender this season, it would be interesting to see KML start for that kind of team - I do hope that happens for her. She honestly seemed to play better in the few games she started for the Storm last year than she did on the bench.

I wonder if the KML acquisition basically means that Banham's time in Connecticut has ended. KML's more of a SF than SG, but they both seem to do the same thing - shoot 3's at a worse-than-expected percentage. Razz


toad455



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PostPosted: 02/25/20 10:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:
toad455 wrote:
So does January start or does Mosqueda-Lewis start at SG? Sun finally adding to their bench.


At this point it seems like a genuinely up-for-grabs spot. Assuming Connecticut will still be a contender this season, it would be interesting to see KML start for that kind of team - I do hope that happens for her. She honestly seemed to play better in the few games she started for the Storm last year than she did on the bench.

I wonder if the KML acquisition basically means that Banham's time in Connecticut has ended. KML's more of a SF than SG, but they both seem to do the same thing - shoot 3's at a worse-than-expected percentage. Razz


There's really no point to have both KML and Banham on this roster. Banham to Minnesota was in place as of last week, just wonder what the delay is.

SUN 2020:
PG: JThomas/Hiedeman
SG: January/Holmes
SF: Bonner/KML
PF: AThomas/Plaisance
C: JJones/BJones



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toad455



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PostPosted: 03/14/20 6:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Sun with their additions of Gemelos & Huff.

SUN 2020:
PG: JThomas/Hiedeman
SG: January/Holmes/Gemelos
SF: Bonner/KML
PF: AThomas/Plaisance/Huff
C: JJones/BJones



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 03/23/20 2:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Having KML play the shooting guard position would be a disaster. She has little mobility and is basically just a spot-up corner shooter. I frankly do not know how she has lasted in the league this long because she is a defensive liability when ever she is not the court.



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 03/23/20 4:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
Having KML play the shooting guard position would be a disaster. She has little mobility and is basically just a spot-up corner shooter. I frankly do not know how she has lasted in the league this long because she is a defensive liability when ever she is not the court.


especially when she is on the court. Very Happy



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 03/23/20 5:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
willtalk wrote:
Having KML play the shooting guard position would be a disaster. She has little mobility and is basically just a spot-up corner shooter. I frankly do not know how she has lasted in the league this long because she is a defensive liability when ever she is not the court.


especially when she is on the court. Very Happy

Yes! You certainly have to be pretty bad defensively if you are a liability even while sitting on the bench. Laughing



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Stormeo



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PostPosted: 03/23/20 6:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
Having KML play the shooting guard position would be a disaster. She has little mobility and is basically just a spot-up corner shooter. I frankly do not know how she has lasted in the league this long because she is a defensive liability when ever she is [on] the court.


How I look at it is, in the W, the SG spot is more of an offense-oriented position whereas the SF spot is more defense-oriented. If KML could get acclimated to playing SG (and as we all know, her only "calling card" of sorts is her shooting) and get to play alongside someone who can play/defend the SF (maybe that's where a G/F like 6'1 Bria Holmes comes in? Heck, even Bonner if KML starts), that might be a winning combination for the Sun, especially as they could switch who plays what position depending on the matchup. Bonner and Holmes bring a variety of skills to the team on both ends of the floor, but pure shooting isn't either's strong-suit. Defensively KML's a lost cause no matter which spot she's at, but to me, she could theoretically get away with being a bad defensive player better as the SG if that means she's more involved offensively. IMO if she just had any sort of ball-handling skills, she'd already be a full-time SG.

Weird to think about how she once was a #1 overall high school recruit. As someone who never heard of her let alone saw her play before the UConn days, that implies to me that at one point, she did a variety of things well and had few weaknesses as a player...? Shocked



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mavcarter
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PostPosted: 03/23/20 10:53 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Then again, Miller had some success with hiding Stricklen on defense..



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 03/24/20 10:00 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
Then again, Miller had some success with hiding Stricklen on defense..


At this level, matchups are critical ... in certain situations, you can hide KML (or Stricklen) but they have to be productive on the other end to justify the risk.

To win a title in 2020 or beyond, though, I don't think you can have a huge defensive liability on the court for long stretches.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 03/24/20 10:33 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stricklen has the benefit of being pretty big/long for a perimeter player. At the very least she takes up space or gets in the way. Problem with KML is she's both slow and short for a 3. Given the right teammates and system you can hide anyone to a certain extent, but some are obviously more difficult to hide than others.



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mavcarter
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PostPosted: 03/24/20 12:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
At this level, matchups are critical ... in certain situations, you can hide KML (or Stricklen) but they have to be productive on the other end to justify the risk.

To win a title in 2020 or beyond, though, I don't think you can have a huge defensive liability on the court for long stretches.


Richyyy wrote:
Stricklen has the benefit of being pretty big/long for a perimeter player. At the very least she takes up space or gets in the way. Problem with KML is she's both slow and short for a 3. Given the right teammates and system you can hide anyone to a certain extent, but some are obviously more difficult to hide than others.


No argument from me on either points, was just pointing out that Miller had a pinch of success with a similar player in Stricklen regarding Mosqueda-Lewis and looking at the bright side.

Why am I doing that? I have no idea, clearly my brain is fried from no basketball.



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Stormeo



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PostPosted: 03/26/20 3:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It's too bad that it's probably too late for Alyssa Thomas to schedule a surgery for her two torn shoulder labrums. The recovery time would've kept her out for a little less than a full year, but how much court time would she really be missing at this point?



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 12:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:
..Weird to think about how she once was a #1 overall high school recruit. As someone who never heard of her let alone saw her play before the UConn days, that implies to me that at one point, she did a variety of things well and had few weaknesses as a player...?: shock:

She was much faster and quicker in high school. When she got to UConn, she began to put on weight. I believe it was her genetics rather than being out of shape. Her body type changed in those years. For her, it was a matter of maturing and into her predisposed body type dictated by her genes. .

With respect to her other skills, some players just mature and hit their ceilings in high school. She has always remained an excellent shooter and UConn and Geno knew just how to get the best out of her while covering for her weaknesses. She was really over-drafted. But then the WNBA does a bad job of scouting and basically relies on AAA teams.

Because of her bring a defensive liability and an excellent shooter they stuck and kept her in the corner on offense where she really did not have an opportunity to enhance her ball skills in a game. I don't know what good it would do her because as you and people have stated she is both slow and short. And those are two things you can not improve on.



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Stormeo



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 12:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
Stormeo wrote:
..Weird to think about how she once was a #1 overall high school recruit. As someone who never heard of her let alone saw her play before the UConn days, that implies to me that at one point, she did a variety of things well and had few weaknesses as a player...?: shock:

She was much faster and quicker in high school. When she got to UConn, she began to put on weight. I believe it was her genetics rather than being out of shape. Her body type changed in those years. For her, it was a matter of maturing and into her predisposed body type dictated by her genes. .

With respect to her other skills, some players just mature and hit their ceilings in high school. She has always remained an excellent shooter and UConn and Geno knew just how to get the best out of her while covering for her weaknesses. She was really over-drafted. But then the WNBA does a bad job of scouting and basically relies on AAA teams.

Because of her bring a defensive liability and an excellent shooter they stuck and kept her in the corner on offense where she really did not have an opportunity to enhance her ball skills in a game. I don't know what good it would do her because as you and people have stated she is both slow and short. And those are two things you can not improve on.


I still remember how Jenny Boucek as the Storm's coach adamantly said that the top 3 players in the 2015 Draft were Loyd, Zahui B., and KML. Really, all the 1st-rounders still in the league from that draft that were picked after KML have better careers: E. Williams, Ch. Parker, Hamby, Harrison, even arguably Boyd & Stokes (though if so, not by a whole lot). Who knows who we would've chosen had Boucek not been so captivated by KML's collegiate accomplishments.

One thing Geno was able to do with KML's "bulkier" body at UConn was teach her how to score posting-up. To Boucek's credit, she sort of tried working that skill into her sets, but then when Hughes took over he seemed to all but go away from it entirely. If the Sun can tap into that specific ability of KML's, that may be the key to maximizing her usefulness. And I would think she would be able to score or even facilitate posting-up with more success as the SG rather than the SF, as she would be theoretically guarded by shorter and/or less meaty players more of the time. She was never the SG enough in Seattle for us to find out if that would indeed be the case, since, y'know, we had drafted our starting SG of the future earlier in that very draft. Rolling Eyes



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root_thing



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 9:12 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Boyd has a career PER of 14.3 in 2375 minutes played. Stokes has a career PER of 14.9 in 2605 minutes played. Contrast that to Mosqueda-Lewis' career PER of 9.4 in 1804 minutes played. Boyd and Stokes have been way better in significantly more minutes. It's not even close. Not suggesting that Boyd or Stokes are anything great -- it's more like Mosqueda-Lewis has done nothing in this league.



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 9:39 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

root_thing wrote:
Boyd has a career PER of 14.3 in 2375 minutes played. Stokes has a career PER of 14.9 in 2605 minutes played. Contrast that to Mosqueda-Lewis' career PER of 9.4 in 1804 minutes played. Boyd and Stokes have been way better in significantly more minutes. It's not even close. Not suggesting that Boyd or Stokes are anything great -- it's more like Mosqueda-Lewis has done nothing in this league.


Very true ...

But pro leagues make draft mistakes all the time, so I don't blame the WNBA for bad scouting (think of the NFL and all its resources) or Seattle for being wrong necessarily -- though a lot of people had serious doubts about KML.

And posting up guards in this league has not worked, as far as I can recall. The weakside help is just too quick and too tall. Not to mention it messes up your entire offense to take a perimeter player and put them on the block, and a post player and put them on the perimeter.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 10:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

KML remains one of the most over-hyped college players in league history.



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root_thing



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 11:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
root_thing wrote:
Boyd has a career PER of 14.3 in 2375 minutes played. Stokes has a career PER of 14.9 in 2605 minutes played. Contrast that to Mosqueda-Lewis' career PER of 9.4 in 1804 minutes played. Boyd and Stokes have been way better in significantly more minutes. It's not even close. Not suggesting that Boyd or Stokes are anything great -- it's more like Mosqueda-Lewis has done nothing in this league.


Very true ...

But pro leagues make draft mistakes all the time, so I don't blame the WNBA for bad scouting (think of the NFL and all its resources) or Seattle for being wrong necessarily -- though a lot of people had serious doubts about KML.

And posting up guards in this league has not worked, as far as I can recall. The weakside help is just too quick and too tall. Not to mention it messes up your entire offense to take a perimeter player and put them on the block, and a post player and put them on the perimeter.


I don't blame the scouts either. That was a very weak draft with a lot of flawed players. All you can do is prioritize a couple of factors -- athleticism, intangibles, positional need, functional need, etcetera -- and go with it. Seattle bet on the NCAA career 3-pt leader and her UConn pedigree. It didn't work out.



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 11:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
KML remains one of the most over-hyped college players in league history.


I do recall for a time we were calling her draft year "The KML draft". Of course, some questioned it. When Loyd and Zahui B. declared the "KML draft" was history. There were 7 players who have had better careers (E-Will, Parker, Hamby, Stoke, Boyd, Harrison and Cloud) taken after her in the draft.



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PostPosted: 03/27/20 2:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
toad455 wrote:
KML remains one of the most over-hyped college players in league history.


I do recall for a time we were calling her draft year "The KML draft". Of course, some questioned it. When Loyd and Zahui B. declared the "KML draft" was history. There were 7 players who have had better careers (E-Will, Parker, Hamby, Stoke, Boyd, Harrison and Cloud) taken after her in the draft.


In general, though, 2015 has proven to be a pretty bad draft. Loyd is very good, but there are no all-star type players in the draft. That list of 7 players with better careers includes some nice enough players, but no one is really kicking themselves over missing.

It's not like she was, say, Chantelle Anderson picked before Cheryl Ford.


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