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WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 8847
Location: Dallas , Texas


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 12:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

DFWub2018 wrote:
Stormeo wrote:
DFWub2018 wrote:
Stormeo wrote:
So, uhh... does the mutual unfollowing between the IGs of Skylar & the Wings not mean anything?
Also, idk who would be advocating for this Wings team to relocate Question They seem to have a good arena setup and a decent & growing fan base/attendance. If Skylar does want out, hopefully they get a good deal for her in return & both parties can begin to flourish. On that note, hopefully her mental health too isn’t in a bad place. Twitter rants, I’ve learned circa Nov. 2016, may not be indicative of good mental health though Confused


"Decent fan base!" What exactly do we have to do in order to meet the approval of the rest of the WNBA cities to be excepted?


Good lord, I didn't mean it to be a backhanded compliment of any sort - chip on the shoulder, I see Laughing Guess I should've said "young" instead or something. While Dallas was one of the teams to somehow bump their attendance numbers from last year, they still were 8th in the league and averaged 5,000 per game. To me, that's "decent", but in a good way! Dallas has only had a team for a few years - never a title contender, at that - and still finds itself above the bottom third instead of in it with rising attendance. They'll probably get to that 7,000 capacity once they enter contending years (which they will, so long as Agler commits to raising that young team imo. The last two teams he coached for got a title!).
I'm gonna put it out there that, including me, more fans than not do want to see Dallas & any other WNBA city succeed, I'm sorry that you've seen otherwise.



Stormeo,

I promise I'm not trying to argue with you, but you just actually proved my point for me....if we are averaging over 5,000 in an arena with a capacity of 7,500 I'd say that's better than the MAJORITY of the league, most of whom have arenas seating 10,000 or more, but filling up only a fraction of the space, even those with championship banners hanging from the rafters!!!


Dfdub no help needed , you and stormeo both spoke it for me. Capacity 7,000 and we average 5,000 plus with a losing season. Speaks volumes I guarantee we will be around longer than skylars career when it’s said and done. I’m more concerned with keeping snoppy than Diggy tbh.



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Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 358
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 12:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
But if Skylar makes it clear she doesn't want to play for Dallas, and she's 29, and her level of play is uncertain, why core her?


So that you can at least trade for something in return, even if it's another star-player trade that the team trading away will surely "lose". Otherwise, you get nothing. Just as well though, Glory Johnson this season could also be cored. There's an argument to be made that since there's less of a chance she wants out of Dallas (she hasn't voiced anything publicly yet, at least), Dallas would have more bargaining power in trying to trade her, and therefore more of a chance of getting equal or even better return, rather than Diggins-Smith.

DFWub2018 wrote:
I promise I'm not trying to argue with you, but you just actually proved my point for me....if we are averaging over 5,000 in an arena with a capacity of 7,500 I'd say that's better than the MAJORITY of the league, most of whom have arenas seating 10,000 or more, but filling up only a fraction of the space, even those with championship banners hanging from the rafters!!!


That's totally fair to think, as these smaller arenas really can produce a better atmosphere, and thus make for a more inviting & fan-growing product. Anyways, I said what I've thought about it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

pilight wrote:
Those were both teams with established stars and a track record of success. Dallas no record of success and the stars have either gotten out or are looking to get out. Agler has never successfully built up a young team.


Yeah, totally different situations between Dallas and his past teams. I do give him credit for signing with Dallas right when they were in the middle of trying to trade away Cambage, in which the aftermath of that trade was unpredictable in the sense of return, but predictable in that the team would certainly have less talent on the floor because of it. I think it was the only team with a head coach opening at the time that he resigned from LA, but still, no one forced him to go there. I do wonder though if he still would've went there given this past first year with not only all the injuries, but now this Diggins-Smith controversy, however big it is internally. But to some degree - enough of one - I still say that he knew what he was getting into in terms of the process of building up the team.

And personally, I think if he chooses to stay, he will make it into a contender. However, I also think it's just as likely he jumps ship after, say, next year - or even this year if he can just resign like *that* - if he looks at other teams' situations as significantly more favorable or even just closer to contending than the situation he's in now. He might see Indiana or New York (aka Brooklyn) as being better situations for him to be in.


Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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Location: OREGON (in my heart)


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 1:57 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
Her comment on 'support' is puzzling. I thought she got paid this whole year even though she was sitting out? That seems like quite a bit of support.


Yeah....really. And she's claiming she played all/much of '18 pregnant without telling anyone. How does one expect 'support' for something one hides? And post-partum is serious stuff, but....most new mothers don't have the resources available to a comparatively wealthy woman like her. What exactly is her beef? Shocked



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DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 260
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 2:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
DFWub2018 wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
Bibb paid her a full salary while she sat out the entire season and yet this will still end up his fault once she leaves . Loyalty doesn’t exist in Dallas obviously. Lately she’s only played every other season here in dallas anyway so if we need to move on I’m not gon cry Mary J. I’d love to have her , but MoJeff Arike Lauren and whomever are a team I’d like to grow with going forward if I’m Snoopy and Bibb. Skylar is a assett to that group albeit a major all star assett would make this team better sooner without her it’s not the end of the world.


I actually like the idea zune69 came up with: Vivian's, Wheeler and the #3 pk from Indiana for Skylar....I'd do it a heartbeat, plus you still have picks#2 &9 in the first round!!!


Dfdub were on the same page. #WFFL


No doubt....#WFFL


DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 260
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 2:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
DFWub2018 wrote:
Stormeo wrote:
DFWub2018 wrote:
Stormeo wrote:
So, uhh... does the mutual unfollowing between the IGs of Skylar & the Wings not mean anything?
Also, idk who would be advocating for this Wings team to relocate Question They seem to have a good arena setup and a decent & growing fan base/attendance. If Skylar does want out, hopefully they get a good deal for her in return & both parties can begin to flourish. On that note, hopefully her mental health too isn’t in a bad place. Twitter rants, I’ve learned circa Nov. 2016, may not be indicative of good mental health though Confused


"Decent fan base!" What exactly do we have to do in order to meet the approval of the rest of the WNBA cities to be excepted?


Good lord, I didn't mean it to be a backhanded compliment of any sort - chip on the shoulder, I see Laughing Guess I should've said "young" instead or something. While Dallas was one of the teams to somehow bump their attendance numbers from last year, they still were 8th in the league and averaged 5,000 per game. To me, that's "decent", but in a good way! Dallas has only had a team for a few years - never a title contender, at that - and still finds itself above the bottom third instead of in it with rising attendance. They'll probably get to that 7,000 capacity once they enter contending years (which they will, so long as Agler commits to raising that young team imo. The last two teams he coached for got a title!).
I'm gonna put it out there that, including me, more fans than not do want to see Dallas & any other WNBA city succeed, I'm sorry that you've seen otherwise.



Stormeo,

I promise I'm not trying to argue with you, but you just actually proved my point for me....if we are averaging over 5,000 in an arena with a capacity of 7,500 I'd say that's better than the MAJORITY of the league, most of whom have arenas seating 10,000 or more, but filling up only a fraction of the space, even those with championship banners hanging from the rafters!!!


Dfdub no help needed , you and stormeo both spoke it for me. Capacity 7,000 and we average 5,000 plus with a losing season. Speaks volumes I guarantee we will be around longer than skylars career when it’s said and done. I’m more concerned with keeping snoppy than Diggy tbh.



Awwwwwwhhhh, all is well again in DFWub🤓🤓🤓


Brinx



Joined: 03 Oct 2013
Posts: 866
Location: CA


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PostPosted: 10/20/19 2:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
myrtle wrote:
Her comment on 'support' is puzzling. I thought she got paid this whole year even though she was sitting out? That seems like quite a bit of support.


Yeah....really. And she's claiming she played all/much of '18 pregnant without telling anyone. How does one expect 'support' for something one hides? And post-partum is serious stuff, but....most new mothers don't have the resources available to a comparatively wealthy woman like her. What exactly is her beef? Shocked


Given her comments about people saying she gave up on her team I think her beef probably has more to do with this past season she sat out rather than the previous one that she played in while pregnant. Maybe people expected/wanted her to come back before she felt ready?


pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 59889
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PostPosted: 10/20/19 2:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The players who have come back quickly, sometimes as soon as six weeks after giving birth, may have created an unrealistic expectation among fans and male dominated front offices as far as what to expect from players returning.



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Randy



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PostPosted: 10/20/19 2:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Brinx wrote:
Howee wrote:
myrtle wrote:
Her comment on 'support' is puzzling. I thought she got paid this whole year even though she was sitting out? That seems like quite a bit of support.


Yeah....really. And she's claiming she played all/much of '18 pregnant without telling anyone. How does one expect 'support' for something one hides? And post-partum is serious stuff, but....most new mothers don't have the resources available to a comparatively wealthy woman like her. What exactly is her beef? Shocked


Given her comments about people saying she gave up on her team I think her beef probably has more to do with this past season she sat out rather than the previous one that she played in while pregnant. Maybe people expected/wanted her to come back before she felt ready?


I guess if she really wanted to be understood she could have been a lot less vague in her tweet.



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myrtle



Joined: 02 May 2008
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PostPosted: 10/20/19 5:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
The players who have come back quickly, sometimes as soon as six weeks after giving birth, may have created an unrealistic expectation among fans and male dominated front offices as far as what to expect from players returning.


In the interviews with Agler he always said something to the effect that she will come back whenever she feels healthy enough and wants to come back. That sounded reasonable and not like he was pressuring her. But perhaps pressure was coming from others? Or perhaps she was simply pressuring herself, then feeling like others were pressuring her. Post partum depression can do weird things to the mind.



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Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 358
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 10/21/19 2:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Skylar’s life has just been pretty polarized for quite a while now. She was one of the main reasons Notre Dame WBB rose to the consistent upper-echelon level it’s at now, but try as she might, she couldn't get that championship. Years later, she would watch her alma mater win it all; and as happy as I’m sure she was, I too wouldn’t be surprised if it were still a bit bittersweet not only watching players that were there partly because of her do what she couldn’t do, but (sub)consciously comparing her old program having success that she influenced with her own lack of success at the next level. Since she came into the league in 2013, she has played in TWO playoff games (both opening-round single-elim. road losses). The best pro team she played on was the 2015 Tulsa Shock, in which the team started 7-1 before she tore her ACL in the final minute of that ninth game, which would become her last one in Tulsa. Oh, what could have been. Sad Her team would go on to finish 18-16, which despite her devastating injury not even a third of the way into the season is to this day still the best record a WNBA team with Skylar on it has ever had.! I wouldn't be surprised if she knows all these specific numbers off the top of her head even now. And just as it was the Tulsa Shock's "best" season, it would also be their last before moving to Dallas the following year, marking the start of another fresh start that to a degree continues to live on.

Fast forward to today – past whatever short-lived Odyssey Sims drama there was, past wherever she discreetly stood on that Candice Wiggins bullsh!t, and past the final chapter of the Liz Cambage saga that had its own mental health-related element to it – where she's calling out “her own organization” (which I for one will continue to believe is the Dallas Wings and not the overarching WNBA) for their lack of support and chooses to reveal that she played all of 2018 pregnant apparently without "[telling] a soul" – however far that really ranges. Even though as mentioned in these discussions that Brian Agler publicly supported an open-ended timetable for Skylar to return and the Wings' decision-makers chose to pay her her full 2019 salary when she was only entitled half of it, it's a shame for both parties that to her, they weren’t supportive enough of her during her pregnancy-and-post-partum experience. As for 2018, I’m guessing she chose to play in order to avoid disappointing her teammates – having endured that emotional 2015 season where she was sorely missed on the court – and it’s more than possible she felt she couldn’t trust ownership to encourage her to make the best decision for herself. Although, if she had gotten injured and that injury damaged the development of her baby, I’m sure it would’ve been a decision she would come to badly regret. Just an astounding decision I can’t imagine not only making at first, but then also having to constantly commit to throughout the course of an entire season.

My position is this: there are at least three sides to this story, with Skylar’s side, the Wings’ side, and the truth being three of them. The Wings org. just got done being scrutinized by Liz Cambage, the women’s sports media, and us regular fans on how it conducts itself. And really since she became a national figure at Notre Dame, Skylar has had a life filled with highs – Final Fours, Nike/Puma & Roc Nation deals, starting a family – but also an unfortunate amount of lows underscored by the seemingly diminishing success on the court she's enjoyed; combine that with the general chip on her shoulder from the plentiful adversity she has faced, and maybe this whole thing is also about how her demeanor + how she perceives things have become distorted over time. I'm not really interested in picking any side; I'd like to see both parties find success - to me, cleaning their slates of each other and moving on is the only way they'll both heal and accomplish that, and next year seems like a good opportunity for that to happen.


Carol Anne



Joined: 09 Apr 2005
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Location: Seattle


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PostPosted: 10/21/19 8:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Conducting one's personal and professional life on Twitter is a mistake. Adults should sit down together and talk.
It's sad that non-sports media love it so when WNBA players have difficulties in their private lives go public.
https://twitter.com/carol_sundahl/status/1186245636259119105?s=20
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceceliatownes/2019/10/20/pregnancy-and-motherhood-are-bad-for-business/#68cb45847197


hyperetic



Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 5175
Location: Fayetteville


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PostPosted: 10/26/19 11:53 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Carol Anne wrote:
Conducting one's personal and professional life on Twitter is a mistake. Adults should sit down together and talk.


I agree.

The "I played while pregnant but nobody knew." thing is curious to me also. I do kind of remember an Instagram post about her impending pregnancy or eluding to a pregnancy. Don't the players get physicals before the start of training camp? How does nobody know? Wouldn't she have to be medically cleared to play if pregnant?
Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 358
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 10/27/19 12:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

hyperetic wrote:
Carol Anne wrote:
Conducting one's personal and professional life on Twitter is a mistake. Adults should sit down together and talk.


I agree.

The "I played while pregnant but nobody knew." thing is curious to me also. I do kind of remember an Instagram post about her impending pregnancy or eluding to a pregnancy. Don't the players get physicals before the start of training camp? How does nobody know? Wouldn't she have to be medically cleared to play if pregnant?


Good point Shocked Maybe she just happened to get pregnant right after the start of training camp? Almost like some sort of loophole Razz Which makes me wonder... did she mean to get pregnant before the start of the season or did it just happen? Was this baby an accident? Yikes-a-rooni if that's the case! #SkylarDigginsSmithPregnancyConspiracy


toad455



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PostPosted: 10/27/19 7:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The timeline just doesn't align correctly. She gave birth in April 2019. Odds are she wasn't pregnant at the beginning of the season. Even if she had a long pregnancy, the earliest she was pregnant was late June. So SDS is stretching things by saying she played the entire season pregnant.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 10/27/19 7:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
The timeline just doesn't align correctly. She gave birth in April 2019. Odds are she wasn't pregnant at the beginning of the season. Even if she had a long pregnancy, the earliest she was pregnant was late June. So SDS is stretching things by saying she played the entire season pregnant.


Wait. If she gave birth in April, then....the pregnancy couldn't have started much before August. Human gestation is still ~ 9 months....right? Shocked



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root_thing



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PostPosted: 10/27/19 8:13 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
toad455 wrote:
The timeline just doesn't align correctly. She gave birth in April 2019. Odds are she wasn't pregnant at the beginning of the season. Even if she had a long pregnancy, the earliest she was pregnant was late June. So SDS is stretching things by saying she played the entire season pregnant.


Wait. If she gave birth in April, then....the pregnancy couldn't have started much before August. Human gestation is still ~ 9 months....right? Shocked


It just proves that Skylar isn't human. Call the Men In Black!



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pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 10/27/19 9:03 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
toad455 wrote:
The timeline just doesn't align correctly. She gave birth in April 2019. Odds are she wasn't pregnant at the beginning of the season. Even if she had a long pregnancy, the earliest she was pregnant was late June. So SDS is stretching things by saying she played the entire season pregnant.


Wait. If she gave birth in April, then....the pregnancy couldn't have started much before August. Human gestation is still ~ 9 months....right? Shocked


280 days is normal. Late June to early April is not unreasonable. A June 25th conception yields a due date of April 1st. That's the median, but the actual time varies. A baby isn't considered overdue until 295 days.

It's also possible that she's a big Friends fan and wanted to emulate Rachel's 12 month pregnancy with Emma.



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ChiSky54



Joined: 19 Jun 2019
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PostPosted: 10/27/19 9:46 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I too thought the timeline didn't add up and was too lazy to look it up!

I am largely a social media lurker. It amazes me how folks feel the need to share their every thought and action with people who then feel the need to respond, and often in a bad spirited way. Comments sections are out of control.

Every thought should not have a voice!

A shame Skylar feels unsupported. Didn't she think people would "dig" around to see what happened? Once something is on the internet, it can be found by those who know how to look.



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DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
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Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 10/27/19 1:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ChiSky54 wrote:
I too thought the timeline didn't add up and was too lazy to look it up!

I am largely a social media lurker. It amazes me how folks feel the need to share their every thought and action with people who then feel the need to respond, and often in a bad spirited way. Comments sections are out of control.

Every thought should not have a voice!

A shame Skylar feels unsupported. Didn't she think people would "dig" around to see what happened? Once something is on the internet, it can be found by those who know how to look.


This is what makes me so angry about comments people make against the Dallas Wings organization, and sometimes the Wings fans as a whole, when they don't have all the facts to each complaint by specific players that have come and gone for whatever reason, instead they automatically side with the famous athlete, and goes to show how easy it is for entertainers to shape the minds of those who follow and admire them, instead of them waiting for all the facts to come out!!!


WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: 10/27/19 7:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SDS tried to ride the Cabbage Bad organization wave and failed expeditiously.



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DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
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PostPosted: 10/28/19 7:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
SDS tried to ride the Cabbage Bad organization wave and failed expeditiously.


Now I have nothing but distain for her and probably Rock Nation, who probably had some type of influence in this to get her to NY, and I'm waiting anxiously to hear the news of a blockbuster trade ASAP!!!


Randy



Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 10/28/19 7:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

She's probably unhappy because Arike has made everyone forget about her.



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Skyfan22



Joined: 12 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 10/28/19 8:01 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Didn’t you feel this was going to happen with all the buzz last season? Various STH say she’s the reason that Powers was forced out. She never got on with Cambage. With Ariel, there seemed to be an elephant in the room about there not being enough opportunities for both of them. Plus they both have pretty large personalities.

Frankly, as a long suffering Sky fan and now Wings fan, I have seen enough of these forced trades against my team that if they wanna go, get what you can and move on. The team always gets the raw end. Krayveld and Thorne and the other who played two games before getting her orbit fractured. Piph for an aged pondexter, Fowles for Erica, EDD for purple hair, Cabbage for Izzie’s and Jefferson.

I once mused that these women should show altruism for the entity of basketball for Women similar to Billie Jean King and her initial band that formed the WTA. Thinking that a bit of altruism down the road may help the WNBA, the players pocketbooks and the fight for equality in general, but I have been much more cynical about the possible fruits of such efforts.

Now for me, It really comes down to being a better organization so that people don’t want to leave, which given the personality of Bibb, that is a strike against Dallasthat will be hard to overcome. Also, better consideration of players is critical before drafting and trading. Obviously, Cox is the only consideration for the 2 pick.

I sure hope that the Wings can get something for Diggins in one player, not a bunch of pieces. The wings do not need another accessory.


Skyfan22



Joined: 12 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 10/28/19 8:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I’ve also said all summer that if she wants to go send her. Her attitude can only possibly make her a beneficial player to the team where she wants to be.

As a trade idea, total Homerism!!!, I like SDs for Vanderquigs!!


DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 260
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 10/28/19 10:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
She's probably unhappy because Arike has made everyone forget about her.


WOOOOOOOOWUH, somebody else said the same thing to me a few days ago!!!


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