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Baylor accepts invitation to visit White House
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TechDawgMc



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PostPosted: 04/25/19 10:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:


(*I'm thinking Britney didn't HAFTA 'come out'....and they never actually crucified her. But....didn't a former player--Emily something?--feel backlash from their 'rules'?)


Everyone knew Britney was gay and she was well received at Baylor -- though not at all the tolerant schools in the B12, where she was called all kinds of things.

You're thinking of Emily Nieman -- she told a bit different story than what everyone else remembers. Emily was a member of a VERY conservative church in Waco, one WAAAAYYY to the right of Baylor. She was known for conflict with the lesbians on the team. Everyone was shocked when she went off to follow her girlfriend. She wasn't hiding, she was confused. She told the story later in a way that made her seem more sympathetic.


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PostPosted: 04/25/19 11:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://www.hoopfeed.com/content/2013/04/22/before-brittney-emily-nkosi-a-member-of-baylors-first-national-championship-team-talks-about-griner-and-life-since-leaving-baylor-after-coming-out-in-exclusive-interview/



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/25/19 3:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
calbearman76 wrote:
The politics of schools is an interesting issue. Of the schools listed I would say that BYU and Liberty are the schools that most impose their theology on their students. From what I understand Baylor is also fairly strict in that regard, as evidenced by Britney Griner not being allowed to come out while she was there.* Baylor is also the school that hired Kenneth Starr as its president. Notre Dame appears to be far different, maintaining a strict Catholic position at the administrative level but being much more accommodating in terms of its students and faculty. If I remember correctly ND had covered contraception for its employees under its health plan prior to Obamacare.


This is the gist of my point, originally in response to Clay's casting aspersions on Baylor's intolerance. Schools can have religious origins/affiliations, but enforce their ideological tenets in varying degrees. Baylor isn't the ONLY school in the conversation.

I've never thought of ND as 'anti-gay'.....and isn't it a bit sad that its tolerance IS in fact, diametrically opposed to its religious origins? Maybe The Church will catch up with ND one day. Cool

(*I'm thinking Britney didn't HAFTA 'come out'....and they never actually crucified her. But....didn't a former player--Emily something?--feel backlash from their 'rules'?)


I did cast some aspersions, but I still would like to know if Baylor has an official anti-gay policy ... and if dancing is allowed.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 04/25/19 8:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
I did cast some aspersions, but I still would like to know if Baylor has an official anti-gay policy ... and if dancing is allowed.

IIRC, Kim did some 'dirty dancin' on national TV, didn't she? She's certainly done some suggestive moves before. Laughing
TechDawgMc wrote:
You're thinking of Emily Nieman -- she told a bit different story than what everyone else remembers. Emily was a member of a VERY conservative church in Waco, one WAAAAYYY to the right of Baylor. She was known for conflict with the lesbians on the team. Everyone was shocked when she went off to follow her girlfriend. She wasn't hiding, she was confused. She told the story later in a way that made her seem more sympathetic.

Didn't Sophia Young also play on that team? And we all know HER ideas about gays. Razz

What even bothers me more are public universities, like Oklahoma and K-State, where there's been a history of mandatory(?) religion foisted upon the players.



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TechDawgMc



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 8:32 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:


What even bothers me more are public universities, like Oklahoma and K-State, where there's been a history of mandatory(?) religion foisted upon the players.


I don't guess I've heard about that. If it's happening, it needs to stop. I am, though, always a bit suspicious of such reports--since I know how stuff like that gets sensationalized (like Clay's "Baylor bans gays" comment, for instance)


ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 9:37 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

TechDawgMc wrote:
Howee wrote:


What even bothers me more are public universities, like Oklahoma and K-State, where there's been a history of mandatory(?) religion foisted upon the players.


I don't guess I've heard about that. If it's happening, it needs to stop. I am, though, always a bit suspicious of such reports--since I know how stuff like that gets sensationalized (like Clay's "Baylor bans gays" comment, for instance)


So does anyone know, or willing to say, what Baylor's official policy is about gays? Or dancing?

Still wondering ...



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Ex-Ref



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 9:44 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
TechDawgMc wrote:
Howee wrote:


What even bothers me more are public universities, like Oklahoma and K-State, where there's been a history of mandatory(?) religion foisted upon the players.


I don't guess I've heard about that. If it's happening, it needs to stop. I am, though, always a bit suspicious of such reports--since I know how stuff like that gets sensationalized (like Clay's "Baylor bans gays" comment, for instance)


So does anyone know, or willing to say, what Baylor's official policy is about gays? Or dancing?

Still wondering ...



If you're wanting an official policy, you should probably contact Baylor. Anything from one of us probably won't be official.



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osubeavers



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 9:52 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ex-Ref wrote:
linkster wrote:
There has never been a shortage of asshole presidents. The honor is in being invited to the white house. Good for Baylor. As simple a thing as a photo with you and the president sitting on your desk or on the wall at work can make your career.


Or break it.


Absolutely. Be careful Baylor, ETTD (Everything Trump Touches Dies).



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TechDawgMc



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 10:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
TechDawgMc wrote:
Howee wrote:


What even bothers me more are public universities, like Oklahoma and K-State, where there's been a history of mandatory(?) religion foisted upon the players.


I don't guess I've heard about that. If it's happening, it needs to stop. I am, though, always a bit suspicious of such reports--since I know how stuff like that gets sensationalized (like Clay's "Baylor bans gays" comment, for instance)


So does anyone know, or willing to say, what Baylor's official policy is about gays? Or dancing?

Still wondering ...


Dances weren't allowed *on campus* for a long time. That actually changed 20 years ago. It's not even an issue.

It's been a while since I read the statement (it is available online) but the basic principle is that sex belongs in a marriage relationship. Technically, students are not supposed to have any other kind of sexual relationships. That rule is basically unenforced unless it's badly flaunted. Even officially, though, orientation is irrelevant--practice is what would matter.

The rule that does effect gays is the "do not advocate something that is outside the traditional Christian beliefs" rule. Since homosexual behavior qualifies as outside, the BU administration doesn't allow advocacy groups for gay issues. A strict interpretation of the rule would mean that coming out would be a problem, but the practice of interpretation seems more to be "be discreet about what you say". With the basketball team, for instance, fans would rarely be surprised by who is a lesbian, unless it's a case like Emily's where she shifted so radically so quickly.


pilight



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PostPosted: 04/26/19 8:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The men's champs declined their invitation

https://www.richmond.com/sports/college/schools/university-virginia/uva-basketball-team-will-decline-to-visit-white-house-after/article_a622d77a-6b74-5b64-a0d1-e0dfae3749ce.html

Quote:
“We have received inquiries about a visit to the White House,” UVA coach Tony Bennett said in a statement the school released Friday. “With several players either pursuing pro opportunities or moving on from UVA, it would be difficult, if not impossible to get everyone back together. We would have to respectfully decline an invitation.”



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Carol Anne



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PostPosted: 04/27/19 8:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

TechDawgMc wrote:
The rule that does effect gays is the "do not advocate something that is outside the traditional Christian beliefs" rule. Since homosexual behavior qualifies as outside, the BU administration doesn't allow advocacy groups for gay issues. A strict interpretation of the rule would mean that coming out would be a problem, but the practice of interpretation seems more to be "be discreet about what you say". With the basketball team, for instance, fans would rarely be surprised by who is a lesbian, unless it's a case like Emily's where she shifted so radically so quickly.


IMO, Emily didn't "shift," but came out, bit by bit.

Unhealthy climate by Luke Cyphers and Kate Fagan
This story appeared in ESPN The Magazine's Feb. 7, 2011, issue.

"...Emily Nkosi, who as Emily Niemann hit five three-pointers for Baylor in its 2005 title win against Michigan State, remembers that when recruiters came to her Houston home, as they did by the dozens in 2002, they had to pass a test. "On home visits," Nkosi says, "my dad was assigned the question: 'Do you have a bunch of lesbians on your team?'" Nkosi says her youth coaches abetted the process, vetting programs with their own inquiries about a "healthy climate" and the like. "You know," Nkosi says, "the code words."

This line of questioning was especially fraught for Nkosi because, deep down, she knew she was a lesbian. But she was also a fundamentalist Christian who feared the religious repercussions of that reality. When Baylor coach Kim Mulkey made her visit to the Niemanns', she skillfully evaded the family question. (Baylor did not respond to The Mag's interview request.)

According to Nkosi, Mulkey said she had no idea what her players did away from the gym, only that inside it they were winning games. And that was good enough for Emily, who figured that at Baylor, a Baptist school, she could suppress the truth about herself.

And for a while she did. But after a couple of years, in the months following her Final Four glory, she fell in love with her future spouse, a graduate student named Ashley Taylor....

http://www.espn.com/ncw/news/story?page=Mag15unhealthyclimate


ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/27/19 9:31 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Thanks for the clarification and update ...

Presumably most Christian schools have similar guidelines, so Baylor is not out of the ordinary in that regard.



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Carol Anne



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PostPosted: 04/28/19 6:40 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
Thanks for the clarification and update ...

Presumably most Christian schools have similar guidelines, so Baylor is not out of the ordinary in that regard.
You're welcome.


TechDawgMc



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 10:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Carol Anne wrote:
TechDawgMc wrote:
The rule that does effect gays is the "do not advocate something that is outside the traditional Christian beliefs" rule. Since homosexual behavior qualifies as outside, the BU administration doesn't allow advocacy groups for gay issues. A strict interpretation of the rule would mean that coming out would be a problem, but the practice of interpretation seems more to be "be discreet about what you say". With the basketball team, for instance, fans would rarely be surprised by who is a lesbian, unless it's a case like Emily's where she shifted so radically so quickly.


IMO, Emily didn't "shift," but came out, bit by bit.


From an internal perspective, I'd be inclined to buy that. In terms of what she was showing others, it was pretty abrupt.


pilight



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 4:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote




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Shades



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 5:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/lDxY6AczDu4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



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PUmatty



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 7:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

And served them fast food trash.


Iluvacc



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 7:09 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Some of those facial expressions are priceless Laughing Laughing


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PostPosted: 04/29/19 7:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Iluvacc wrote:
Some of those facial expressions are priceless Laughing Laughing


They look like they would rather be in a two hour final for their most difficult class.

Even Kim looks like she just swallowed a big mouthful of bile.



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 8:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
Smile Ladies!



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CalwbbFan



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 9:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Here’s a good overview of the event: https://thinkprogress.org/baylor-womens-basketball-team-white-house-invitation-bca098a939e0/
“It was a creepy, cringeworthy, cheeseburger-filled affair...”

Quote:
The policies and rhetoric coming out of Trump’s White House are racist, sexist, and homophobic. Basketball — and particularly women’s basketball — is a sport dominated by black women, with a prominent queer community. These are some of the groups most marginalized by the Trump administration. By choosing to accept Trump’s invitation, Mulkey was sending a clear message that in the face of that sort of disrespect, the proper thing to do is to bite one’s tongue, shake hands, and smile for a photo op.

She was also signaling that even though president has disrespected so many women’s basketball champions in the past, as long as he invited Baylor, all is forgiven.


pilight



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 9:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

She lost me in the second paragraph when she couldn't get the score of the final correct



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Howee



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 10:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
She lost me in the second paragraph when she couldn't get the score of the final correct

Sometimes, you stat savants miss the IMPORTANT things.... Laughing



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pilight



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PostPosted: 04/29/19 10:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
pilight wrote:
She lost me in the second paragraph when she couldn't get the score of the final correct

Sometimes, you stat savants miss the IMPORTANT things.... Laughing


If you're gonna write about disrespect for WBB, it's best not to demonstrate your own disrespect for WBB



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PostPosted: 04/30/19 12:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Well, Kim looks happy.


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