| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7819
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Back to top |
 Posted: 01/24/19 6:49 pm ::: |
Reply  |
|
Here is what's going on at Tennessee. At the start of the season, they looked to have two good senior post players (one a grad transfer), plus another senior leader in Meme Jackson and they had hopes for a third junior post player in Kamera Harris, who so far hadn't picked up. They had two stellar recruiting classes in the past two years.
Here is what reality looks like right now. Lou Brown, the grad transfer, tore her ACL before practice had even really got rolling. Harris *still* doesn't seem to have picked up on the program and seems destined to ride the pine. Meme Jackson was going great guns, then suddenly and inexplicably went into a shooting slump and now has a "lower leg injury", IOW a high ankle sprain. This leaves them with a team of nine...7 freshmen and sophomores, Harris (who has played in a total of 28 games), and Cheridene Green...to face Notre Dame. Now y'all can talk about how Notre Dame had 7 or 8 players last year, but I think they had a *few* more experienced players. Of course, I could be wrong. But ya know, sometimes it's not all the coach's fault. Sometimes it's just really bad luck. And I don't think Phil is going to fire her over that.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
Back to top |
| Posted: 01/27/19 2:24 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Ya know, that excuse might fly if they were just losing to Ky and ND and Miss St and Scar and so forth. But they still have six McD AAs and they're losing to the likes of Ark and Bama and UGA.
I don't care how young the are. The talent advantage is overwhelming and is being completely wasted.
|
|
CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18371
Location: Phoenix
Back to top |
|
Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
Posts: 5223
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/18/19 9:38 am ::: |
Reply |
|
So I posted about a bunch of schools one month ago. Here are some new ones and then some updates on some old ones.
Do people think Alabama is on hot seat? Year 6 and they are 3-9 in SEC and lost to Auburn yesterday by 39 points.
How about Cal? 5-9 in Pac 12 and this is with their best player in program history, Kristine Anigwe, who is a senior. Their backcourt is two seniors too. So if this is a non NCAA tournament team, outlook for post Anigwe years does not seem that optimistic.
In January I had UNC, but they have been playing well as of late and I think they should make the NCAA tournament? If not I think there are some questions there.
Penn State I had mentioned last month and well they have lost 6 in a row including by 30 to Minnesota yesterday. Like Cal, Penn State has a 2,000 point scorer about to graduate.
Oklahoma and Kansas are both 2-11 in Big XII play. Hard to imagine Sherri Coale on a hot seat though.
Wake Forest is 1-11 in ACC play. Duke is 3-9.
|
|
CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18371
Location: Phoenix
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/19/19 3:59 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Durantula wrote: |
| In January I had UNC, but they have been playing well as of late and I think they should make the NCAA tournament? If not I think there are some questions there. |
Hatchell's contract runs through 2019-20. I cannot see UNC buying her out with one year remaining.
| Durantula wrote: |
| Duke is 3-9. |
Joanne P. McCallie has two years remaining on her contract; the extension announced in August 2017 keeps her under contract through the end of the 2020-21 season. Assuming the extension (which added two years to her then-current deal) was at the same rate of pay, her estimated annual compensation is approximately $900,000 or so. That means a buyout of the remaining two years would be $1.8 million.
In addition, Duke would have to pay a new women's basketball coach to take over for Coach P. Conservatively (given's Duke WBB status as a former national power), put that figure at $600,000 per year. This would mean that for 2019-20 and 2020-21, Duke would be paying $1.5 million per year for salaries of WBB head coaches and $3 million total for the two remaining years. This is just for the salaries of head coaches -- not assistant coaches, not staff, not basketball-related operations expenses, etc.
|
|
CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18371
Location: Phoenix
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/19/19 4:05 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
Joanne P. McCallie has two years remaining on her contract; the extension announced in August 2017 keeps her under contract through the end of the 2020-21 season. Assuming the extension (which added two years to her then-current deal) was at the same rate of pay, her estimated annual compensation is approximately $900,000 or so. That means a buyout of the remaining two years would be $1.8 million.
In addition, Duke would have to pay a new women's basketball coach to take over for Coach P. Conservatively (given's Duke WBB status as a former national power), put that figure at $600,000 per year. This would mean that for 2019-20 and 2020-21, Duke would be paying $1.5 million per year for salaries of WBB head coaches and $3 million total for the two remaining years. This is just for the salaries of head coaches -- not assistant coaches, not staff, not basketball-related operations expenses, etc. |
As a supplement to my previous post, here is a little backstory and data.
Duke - Equity in Athletics Team Information (2015)
Total Expenses (Men’s and Women’s Teams): $91,174,723
Total Revenues (Men’s and Women’s Teams): $91,688,202
Total Expenses (Women's Teams): $18,611,140
Total Revenues (Women's Teams): $15,897,197
Total Expenses (Women’s Basketball): $5,511,458
Total Revenues (Women’s Basketball): $3,194,313
Grand Total Revenue minus Grand Total Expenses (2015): +$513,479
Total Revenues for Women’s Sports minus Total Expenses for Women’s Sports (2015): -$2,713,943
Total Revenues for WBB minus Total Expenses for WBB (2015): -$2,317,145
(Source: Duke: Equity in Athletics Team Information (2015))
Duke - Equity in Athletics Team Information (2018)
Total Expenses (Men’s and Women’s Teams): $108,585,925
Total Revenues (Men’s and Women’s Teams): $108,585,925
Total Expenses (Women's Teams): $24,539,320
Total Revenues (Women's Teams): $19,732,911
Total Expenses (Women’s Basketball): $6,940,064
Total Revenues (Women’s Basketball): $3,810,612
Grand Total Revenue minus Grand Total Expenses (2018): $0
Total Revenues for Women’s Sports minus Total Expenses for Women’s Sports (2018): -$4,806,409
Total Revenues for WBB minus Total Expenses for WBB (2018): -$3,129,452
(Source: Duke - Equity in Athletics Team Information (2018))
***It should be noted that Duke added women's softball for 2018, meaning there were 11 women's sports for 2015 and 12 women's sports for 2018. For 2018, women's softball expenses were $1,344,166, with revenues of $807,718. If we just compare the 11 sports that were in existence in both 2015 and 2018, this is the result:
Duke - Equity in Athletics Team Information (2018)
Total Expenses (Men’s and Women’s Teams, not including softball): $107,241,759
Total Revenues (Men’s and Women’s Teams, not including softball): $107,778,207
Total Expenses (11 Women's Teams, not including softball): $23,195,154
Total Revenues (11 Women's Teams, not including softball): $18,925,193
Total Expenses (Women’s Basketball): $6,940,064
Total Revenues (Women’s Basketball): $3,810,612
Grand Total Revenue (not including softball) minus Grand Total Expenses (not including softball)(2018): +$536,648
Total Revenues for 11 Women’s Sports (not including softball) minus Total Expenses for 11 Women’s Sports (not including softball) (2018): -$4,269,961
Total Revenues for WBB minus Total Expenses for WBB (2018): -$3,129,452
(Source: Duke - Equity in Athletics Team Information (2018))
In other words...
--- For 2015, women's basketball was an incredibly large percentage of expenses for all 11 women's sports at Duke (29.61 percent), did not bring in a corresponding percentage of revenue (20.09 percent), and represented the overwhelming majority of the deficit when examining total revenues minus total expenses (85.38 percent).
--- For 2018, women's basketball represents an incredibly large percentage of expenses for women's sports at Duke (over 28 percent, for all 12 women's sports; nearly 30 percent without softball), does not bring in a corresponding percentage of revenue (19.3 percent, for all 12 women's sports; 20.13 percent without softball), and still represents the majority of the deficit when examining total revenues minus total expenses (65.11 percent, for all 12 women's sports; 73.29 percent without including softball).
Given all of the expenses for athletics at Duke, the lack of a large net margin/income (in terms of Grand Total Revenue minus Grand Total Expenses), the percentage of expenses for women's sports that is spent for women's basketball, and the overwhelming percentage of the deficit of women's sports attributable to women's basketball, I cannot see Duke Athletics spending an additional $600,000 per year for each of the next two years for a new WBB head coach while still paying approximately $900,000 or so for each of the next two years to Coach P, per her contract.
|
|
mzonefan
Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 4878
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/20/19 2:05 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Durantula wrote: |
Penn State I had mentioned last month and well they have lost 6 in a row including by 30 to Minnesota yesterday. Like Cal, Penn State has a 2,000 point scorer about to graduate.
|
PSU finished 1st in the B1G in 2014 and made it to the Sweet 16.
2015: B1G tied for 13th, no post-season
2016: B1G 11th, no post-season
2017: B1G tied for 6th, lost in 3rd round of WNIT
2018: B1G 11th, lost in 1st round of WNIT
2019: currently tied for 12th with 4 games left - vs Purdue, at Illinois, at Michigan State and vs Nebraska. Overall record wouldn't support a post-season bid.
Unless I missed a contract extension announcement, Coquese is in the final season of the extension she received at the end of the 2015 season.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/20/19 7:03 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Mzonefan, 2 or 3 years ago I expressed the view that Barnes Arico was falling far short of the hype surrounding her hire and queried how long Mich would put up with that. You were strongly defensive saying she needed more time to build the program.
It's now six years, she isn't recruiting all americans (which is generally expected for Mich athletic teams across the board), she's not a B10 contender, and in the weakest bubble season in memory, Mich is very tenuously on the bubble and has not been a consistent NCAA team.
Is her performance good enough to keep her job when her contract expires, or will Mich try again to make a splash and move up the ranks? What's the take on her among Mich fans?
Given the lack of interest by most ADs, at most schools her performance would probably be good enough to hang around for decades. But I thought Michigan wanted to step it up and win B10 titles at least. Is she safe or is her seat getting warm?
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/20/19 7:03 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Duplicate
|
|
mzonefan
Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 4878
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/21/19 5:50 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| Mzonefan, 2 or 3 years ago I expressed the view that Barnes Arico was falling far short of the hype surrounding her hire and queried how long Mich would put up with that. You were strongly defensive saying she needed more time to build the program. |
Actually, you posted this after I posted the announcement about her first contract extension in fall of 2015.
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Three year conference record in a mediocre WBB conference:
2012-13 : 9-7, 5th place
2013-14 : 8-10, 8th place
2014-15 : 8-10, 8th place
Sure sounds deserving of a raise and extension to me. Rolling Eyes
How exactly has her record been an improvement over Borseth's?
I wonder if Mich would have given a raise to a MBB or FB or Hockey coach with that performance. |
I responded with this:
| mzonefan wrote: |
You might as well get the numbers right for 13-14.
Borseth wasn't granted an extension after year three. He was under a previous A.D., so it's kind of a moot issue. Considering the big dip he took in year two, I wouldn't have considered taking the risk after year three either.
Borseth's first three years:
2007-08 19-14 9-9 #7 seed WNIT Quarterfinal
2008-09 10-20 3-15 #11 seed (ended w/8 straight losses)
2009-10 21-14 8-10 #7 seed WNIT Semifinal
Barnes Arico's:
2012-13 22-11 9-7 #5 seed NCAA, 2nd Round
2013-14 20-14 8-8 #7 seed WNIT, 3rd Round
2014-15 20-15 8-10 #8 seed* WNIT, semifinals
Seed is for Big Ten Tournament.
*BIG increased to 14 teams |
Since then:
2015-16 21-14 9-9 tied 7th WNIT semifinals
2016-17 28-9 11-5 3rd WNIT champion
2017-18 23-10 10-6 tied 5th NCAA 2nd round
It's a mixed bag. Would I like to see us get off of the perpetual bubble? For sure. At the same time, I've watched the program long enough to see two o-fer seasons in U-M history (Trish Roberts and Cheryl Burnett). I watched Sue Guevara coach on a year-to-year basis with no contract, go to three NCAA tournaments and then see her last two teams drop off into the abyss. I watched Burnett with two Final Fours to her resume come in and leave the program worse than she found it. I watched a successful coach in Borseth walk away after getting the program into it's first NCAA game in a decade.
Kim's had 20 wins every season and been in either the WNIT or NCAA every year. (No previous U-M coach had ever done that.) She's the winningest coach in Michigan program history. She was B1G COY in 2017 and hung the program's first banner (2017 WNIT). She just had her second player in two years hit the 2000 point mark. (Only one player, from the 1980's, had gone over 2000 before.)
She recruits well to a school that has higher academic requirements than most. Her kids graduate and seem to love playing for her. Attendance has increased by a third. I enjoy her on a personal level.
I'll be the first to say I'm not a great basketball mind. I just follow the bouncing ball and cheer when we make a shot or get a stop. I've heard some fans say she's not good at in-game adjustments. One of the things that will get most in a Michigan fan's craw is her 4-10 record against Michigan State.
Since I think your post may have come in response to mine about one of your beloved Irish alums, I will say this. Seven years ago, Coquese toyed with leaving Penn State and taking the Michigan job after Borseth left. I would have been delighted to have her. Instead she turned the situation into a contract extension and raise (good for her). Although I think I'd enjoy Coquese just as much on a personal level, I am glad we got Kim based on results from the last five years. Kim has done more with less, as Coquese has had 4 or 5 McD's AAs and had a consistently nationally recognized program at the foundation.
Kim's had two contract extensions in six seasons. I'd say she's very safe for a few years considering her second extension was just done in July.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/21/19 6:24 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| mzonefan wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| Mzonefan, 2 or 3 years ago I expressed the view that Barnes Arico was falling far short of the hype surrounding her hire and queried how long Mich would put up with that. You were strongly defensive saying she needed more time to build the program. |
Actually, you posted this after I posted the announcement about her first contract extension in fall of 2015.
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
Three year conference record in a mediocre WBB conference:
2012-13 : 9-7, 5th place
2013-14 : 8-10, 8th place
2014-15 : 8-10, 8th place
Sure sounds deserving of a raise and extension to me. Rolling Eyes
How exactly has her record been an improvement over Borseth's?
I wonder if Mich would have given a raise to a MBB or FB or Hockey coach with that performance. |
I responded with this:
| mzonefan wrote: |
You might as well get the numbers right for 13-14.
Borseth wasn't granted an extension after year three. He was under a previous A.D., so it's kind of a moot issue. Considering the big dip he took in year two, I wouldn't have considered taking the risk after year three either.
Borseth's first three years:
2007-08 19-14 9-9 #7 seed WNIT Quarterfinal
2008-09 10-20 3-15 #11 seed (ended w/8 straight losses)
2009-10 21-14 8-10 #7 seed WNIT Semifinal
Barnes Arico's:
2012-13 22-11 9-7 #5 seed NCAA, 2nd Round
2013-14 20-14 8-8 #7 seed WNIT, 3rd Round
2014-15 20-15 8-10 #8 seed* WNIT, semifinals
Seed is for Big Ten Tournament.
*BIG increased to 14 teams |
Since then:
2015-16 21-14 9-9 tied 7th WNIT semifinals
2016-17 28-9 11-5 3rd WNIT champion
2017-18 23-10 10-6 tied 5th NCAA 2nd round
It's a mixed bag. Would I like to see us get off of the perpetual bubble? For sure. At the same time, I've watched the program long enough to see two o-fer seasons in U-M history (Trish Roberts and Cheryl Burnett). I watched Sue Guevara coach on a year-to-year basis with no contract, go to three NCAA tournaments and then see her last two teams drop off into the abyss. I watched Burnett with two Final Fours to her resume come in and leave the program worse than she found it. I watched a successful coach in Borseth walk away after getting the program into it's first NCAA game in a decade.
Kim's had 20 wins every season and been in either the WNIT or NCAA every year. (No previous U-M coach had ever done that.) She's the winningest coach in Michigan program history. She was B1G COY in 2017 and hung the program's first banner (2017 WNIT). She just had her second player in two years hit the 2000 point mark. (Only one player, from the 1980's, had gone over 2000 before.)
She recruits well to a school that has higher academic requirements than most. Her kids graduate and seem to love playing for her. Attendance has increased by a third. I enjoy her on a personal level.
I'll be the first to say I'm not a great basketball mind. I just follow the bouncing ball and cheer when we make a shot or get a stop. I've heard some fans say she's not good at in-game adjustments. Her highest finish in the B1G was 3rd, but she's only had one losing B1G season (lowest finish was 8th). One of the things that will get most in a Michigan fan's craw is her 4-10 record against Michigan State.
Since I think your post may have come in response to mine about one of your beloved Irish alums, I will say this. Seven years ago, Coquese toyed with leaving Penn State and taking the Michigan job after Borseth left. I would have been delighted to have her. Instead she turned the situation into a contract extension and raise (good for her). Although I think I'd enjoy Coquese just as much on a personal level, I am glad we got Kim based on results from the last five years. Kim has done more with less, as Coquese has had 4 or 5 McD's AAs and had a consistently nationally recognized program at the foundation.
Kim's had two contract extensions in six seasons. I'd say she's very safe for a few years considering her second extension was just done in July. |
Actually it wasn't in response to your Penn St post. I can't explain why Coquese's team has fallen off a cliff (they've had a lot of unfortunate injuries, but that doesn't excuse it) and I haven't attempted to defend her. She can't go on like this for long. I would think she's used up most of the good will she had earned.
No, this was just about Michigan. As I said, Barnes Arico's performance would be satisfactorily mediocre at most schools. But Michigan always touts how it pursues excellence in all sports, revenue and non-revenue, and this seems to fall well short of excellence. I just wondered whether she is on the hot seat, especially if they miss the NCAAs again.
I asked in the post you quoted above "I wonder if Mich would have given a raise to a MBB or FB or Hockey coach with that performance." Now I wonder whether they'd keep a coach in those sports with her record. "She needs more time" doesn't fly after six years.
I'd like to see big athletic programs that compete hard in a broad range of sports not to treat WBB like a cast off. We know some schools pick and choose favored sports. But if the sport is to advance, schools like Michigan have to commit to WBB and demand the same performance they apply to most other sports.
|
|
mzonefan
Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 4878
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/21/19 10:56 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program.
|
|
summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7819
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/22/19 11:58 am ::: |
Reply |
|
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
|
|
Marquette Fan
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 3573
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/22/19 1:08 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| summertime blues wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT. |
I heard a little part of a Wisconsin sports report on the radio last night and the commentator said UW's 13 wins this season are the most since the 2010-11 season. That shocked me if that stat is correct. I'd really like to see that program get going again.
|
|
purduefanatic
Joined: 10 Aug 2011
Posts: 2819
Location: Indiana
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/22/19 1:52 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT. |
I heard a little part of a Wisconsin sports report on the radio last night and the commentator said UW's 13 wins this season are the most since the 2010-11 season. That shocked me if that stat is correct. I'd really like to see that program get going again. |
Wisconsin is definitely improving.
On the other hand, Purdue is not.
|
|
summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7819
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/22/19 2:45 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT. |
I heard a little part of a Wisconsin sports report on the radio last night and the commentator said UW's 13 wins this season are the most since the 2010-11 season. That shocked me if that stat is correct. I'd really like to see that program get going again. |
I would too...it's my alma mater. Jane Albright left it in pretty decent shape but then-AD Pat Richter broke it, and don't get me started on that arrogant fool. It looks like maybe the hiring of Jonathan Tsipis might be the key to starting it on the road back, if they'll just give him the support he deserves and not yank the rug out from under him.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
|
|
Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15729
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
Back to top |
|
Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
Posts: 5223
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/24/19 10:58 am ::: |
Reply |
|
| mzonefan wrote: |
| Durantula wrote: |
Penn State I had mentioned last month and well they have lost 6 in a row including by 30 to Minnesota yesterday. Like Cal, Penn State has a 2,000 point scorer about to graduate.
|
PSU finished 1st in the B1G in 2014 and made it to the Sweet 16.
2015: B1G tied for 13th, no post-season
2016: B1G 11th, no post-season
2017: B1G tied for 6th, lost in 3rd round of WNIT
2018: B1G 11th, lost in 1st round of WNIT
2019: currently tied for 12th with 4 games left - vs Purdue, at Illinois, at Michigan State and vs Nebraska. Overall record wouldn't support a post-season bid.
Unless I missed a contract extension announcement, Coquese is in the final season of the extension she received at the end of the 2015 season. |
Was 2014 Maggie Lucas last year and 2015 the first year without Lucas? Is it as simple as that, Maggie Lucas was a game changer for Penn State and as soon as she left the program just could not rebound? I don't know how else to explain this movement from top of the league to bottom of the league so quickly.
|
|
PRballer
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 2544
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/24/19 12:58 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Durantula wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
| Durantula wrote: |
Penn State I had mentioned last month and well they have lost 6 in a row including by 30 to Minnesota yesterday. Like Cal, Penn State has a 2,000 point scorer about to graduate.
|
PSU finished 1st in the B1G in 2014 and made it to the Sweet 16.
2015: B1G tied for 13th, no post-season
2016: B1G 11th, no post-season
2017: B1G tied for 6th, lost in 3rd round of WNIT
2018: B1G 11th, lost in 1st round of WNIT
2019: currently tied for 12th with 4 games left - vs Purdue, at Illinois, at Michigan State and vs Nebraska. Overall record wouldn't support a post-season bid.
Unless I missed a contract extension announcement, Coquese is in the final season of the extension she received at the end of the 2015 season. |
Was 2014 Maggie Lucas last year and 2015 the first year without Lucas? Is it as simple as that, Maggie Lucas was a game changer for Penn State and as soon as she left the program just could not rebound? I don't know how else to explain this movement from top of the league to bottom of the league so quickly. |
Recruiting recruiting recruiting.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
Posts: 14550
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/25/19 9:25 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Way back last October I wrote that I thought Karen Aston has taken over from P. McCallie as the leader of the "gets the least from the most" gang. And I said the starting 5 would probably include Aston, McCallie, Close, Warlick, and Gottlieb.
Nothing that happened this year so far has changed my view. The one closest to getting off the team might be Close; UCLA has a couple of nice wins but also has some inexcusable losses, and they certainly haven't done enough to erase the way Close squandered the #1 recruiting class.
The remarkable thing to me is that none of these five appear to be in serious risk of losing their jobs any time soon. I guess subsumed in the characterization is that all of them have recruited talent, and if you collect enough talent, you can keep winning enough games to save your job no matter how badly you underperform considering that talent. If you're Aston you might even keep finishing 2nd every year in a piss-poor conference where no one except the perrenial champ has talent remotely your equal. McCallie is not so lucky. There are a lot of good teams in the ACC this year and Duke's record reflects that.
|
|
Marquette Fan
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 3573
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/25/19 10:08 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Brian Neal is in his 6th season at Xavier and they are awful - by far the worst team in the Big East. They have only 2 league wins and the next worse team has 6 wins. Their program is in need of an upgrade. I have no idea if his job is on the line or not.
|
|
Marquette Fan
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 3573
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/25/19 10:11 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| summertime blues wrote: |
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT. |
I heard a little part of a Wisconsin sports report on the radio last night and the commentator said UW's 13 wins this season are the most since the 2010-11 season. That shocked me if that stat is correct. I'd really like to see that program get going again. |
I would too...it's my alma mater. Jane Albright left it in pretty decent shape but then-AD Pat Richter broke it, and don't get me started on that arrogant fool. It looks like maybe the hiring of Jonathan Tsipis might be the key to starting it on the road back, if they'll just give him the support he deserves and not yank the rug out from under him. |
He's in his third season now though, right? I'm not saying he should necessarily be fired yet - just not sure how much time they'll give him.
|
|
Happycappie25
Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 4174
Location: QUEENS!!!!
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/25/19 10:49 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| Brian Neal is in his 6th season at Xavier and they are awful - by far the worst team in the Big East. They have only 2 league wins and the next worse team has 6 wins. Their program is in need of an upgrade. I have no idea if his job is on the line or not. |
I hope so...f only cuz big East can use another female coach but Neil has done a poor job remember when X was a mid major powerhouse under balcomb and mcguff but since then a shadow of itself really sad...if only dee dee made that layup lol
_________________
"Leave it to the NCAA women's basketball committee to turn a glass slipper into glass ceiling" Graham Hays
|
|
Marquette Fan
Joined: 06 Mar 2005
Posts: 3573
Back to top |
|
summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7819
Location: Shenandoah Valley
Back to top |
| Posted: 02/26/19 11:05 am ::: |
Reply |
|
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| Marquette Fan wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
| mzonefan wrote: |
I think Michigan treated WBB like a castoff for a long time. I don’t think that it’s that way at all now. U-M’s AD, Warde Manuel, is a Former Michigan FB player who worked his way through the ranks, left to become Buffalo’s AD and then UCONN’s before returning to his alma mater. He’s been around the best.
In July 2018, Manuel extended Barnes Arico until 2023. She is not on the hot seat, and yes, I would say Jim Harbaugh has been given some of the same latitude. He’s expected to beat OSU and MSU and win B1G championships but hasn’t.
At this moment Kim’s got the longest winning streak in the B1G and is poised for her 7th 20-win season. Consistency and stability go a long way when you look at the overall history of Michigan’s program. |
I think a lot of B!G schools have treated WBB as a second-class sport....Maryland and Rutgers of course do not, but they are recent immigrants to the B1G. Purdue didn't for a long time, but it seems that recently they've slipped. Iowa has improved a lot, partially I think because of competition with Iowa State for players, and partly because of girls' basketball being such a big deal in the state. Minnesota's improved a lot. But some of the other schools....looking at YOU, Wisconsin!....really need to pick things up a LOT. |
I heard a little part of a Wisconsin sports report on the radio last night and the commentator said UW's 13 wins this season are the most since the 2010-11 season. That shocked me if that stat is correct. I'd really like to see that program get going again. |
I would too...it's my alma mater. Jane Albright left it in pretty decent shape but then-AD Pat Richter broke it, and don't get me started on that arrogant fool. It looks like maybe the hiring of Jonathan Tsipis might be the key to starting it on the road back, if they'll just give him the support he deserves and not yank the rug out from under him. |
He's in his third season now though, right? I'm not saying he should necessarily be fired yet - just not sure how much time they'll give him. |
I think they'll give him some more time. They'd be dumb if they don't, since he's done more for the team than any coach *since* Albright!! However, I'm not sure how to gauge this AD and whether he's a mostly football guy or not. It mostly depends on that.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
|
|
|
|
as you know of course.