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Minnesota Lynx 2019
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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 02/06/19 12:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

shontay33 wrote:
TigerVol wrote:
pilight wrote:
TigerVol wrote:
pilight wrote:
justintyme wrote:
pilight wrote:
This sort of gobbledy-gook is why people don't take the W seriously. When was the last time an NBA star just took a year off for no particular reason?

When was the last time a NBA star had to play 12 months out of the year? NBA stars are given both the off season time and the financial resources to chase whatever other passions they have (you know, like strip clubs and Kardashians).

Male professional athletes often refer to the "slog" of the season and how it is mentally and physically draining. Well, what if that season never really ended and one just bled into the next?

I wish her the best and hope she is able to get whatever she needs out of her season away and comes back mentally, physically, and spiritually recharged.


That doesn't really apply here, since Moore took the winter off also.

Besides which, it usually isn't 12 months a year anymore. Most of the big stars are playing half seasons overseas these days.

And yeah, the financial resources is what I was getting at. The W needs to pay better so this won't happen. This is 100% about the CBA.


How is this 100% about the CBA?


She's not getting paid enough to put her body through the rigors of a WNBA season. Unlike previous sit-outs, she didn't play this winter so she's healthy and rested. She's sitting out purely because the W doesn't pay enough. It's not a coincidence that she's doing it immediately ahead of the CBA negotiations. The message she's sending is clear. Pay us like you value us or we won't value you.


To me the fact she is rested and is not just sitting out the WNBA season negates your position.


She is healthy and rested and is choosing not to play in 2019.


I'm no fan but unless you know her personally it seems presumptuous to say she is sitting out purely because the wnba doesn't pay enough when she has said otherwise.


You may not agree with or understand the reasons she has stated but they seem to ring true with who she has portrayed herself to be.


Using her family and faith as a misdirect for her "real" and reasons... Does not seem in character for this player.


Tiger Vol, why are the reasons that she gave not adequate enough? I and many others think that they are. I think she is to be admired for wanting to spend time with her family and most of all pursue what has been on her heart to do for years helping and reaching other people. Not many people are willing to do that or put their jobs on hold to do that.


I don’t know if you’re responding to TigerVol like this because you agree with them, but I felt TigerVol’s response nearly perfect, except maybe change the bolded part to who she is. Trust me, I’ve been following her on twitter for 8 years. This is who she is. Never any competitive banter. Never an unkind word to anyone. Most often laying down scriptures. I can’t relate to her but, unlike pilight, I can understand and respect her.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 12:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
I think her stated reasons are a smokescreen, she's sitting out for CBA leverage.

Why sign a contract, especially a multi-year one, if your primary reason for sitting out is CBA leverage?



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 12:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
I think her stated reasons are a smokescreen, she's sitting out for CBA leverage.

I'm being optimistic, BTW. When WBB players get religious it usually turns out badly, and almost always in the same direction. See Candice Wiggins, Sophia Young, Sandora Irvin, goddamn Camille Lenoir, etc.

I see what you are saying, and it is a legitimate fear. But I personally think what you are missing is that she didn't "get religious". If you followed her career closely and spoken to her in person a few times, it became clear pretty quickly how important faith always was/is to her. I don't know if I ever had an interaction with her where it wasn't at least referenced in some way, big or small.

So this isn't someone going through a sudden personality change where they are using religion to fill whatever hole they have in their life and it makes them go off the deep end. This seems more of an exploration of self.



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TigerVol



Joined: 16 Jul 2008
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PostPosted: 02/06/19 12:57 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
I think her stated reasons are a smokescreen, she's sitting out for CBA leverage.

I'm being optimistic, BTW. When WBB players get religious it usually turns out badly, and almost always in the same direction. See Candice Wiggins, Sophia Young, Sandora Irvin, goddamn Camille Lenoir, etc.


So you think Moore is lying.

Interesting.

It isn't logical to use a smoke screen.

What leverage does that give exactly?

You want leverage you say sitting out because of the grind. Or to save her body for the overseas leagues that pay more money.

Those reasons give leverage during negotiations.

I am totally stepping away from all basketball to focus on other priorities does not tie to the cba. That is a personal life decision.

If she were to later say just kidding it is smoke screen she damages her credibility. Why take that risk when you could very easily say "saving my body from the grind" or burned out from year round play because of low salaries?"


Hate to break it to you but she didnt just "get" religious. I'm not even a fan and it has always been apparent she is SUPER religious. And people that grounded in their faith are called when they feel called.


How her faith manifests long term remains to be seen. Nothing would shock me on this front.



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pilight



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 1:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
pilight wrote:
I think her stated reasons are a smokescreen, she's sitting out for CBA leverage.

Why sign a contract, especially a multi-year one, if your primary reason for sitting out is CBA leverage?


To show she's willing to play in the league if the conditions change



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TigerVol



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 1:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

@Shades - Thanks for the additional context.

I caveat because I don't follow her closely so am speaking from the limited interviews and articles I've seen and not the full body of work.

What I've seen and commented on has been apparent and consistent her entire career.



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Silky Johnson



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 2:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
Of course a truly cynical person would find it convenient that this calling came the first time in her life she wasn't going have star teammates at every other position. Luckily, I am not that far gone.


Well, that makes one of us! #HateHard

FTR, I'm not with @pilight about the idea of Moore sitting out for CBA leverage. Also, I don't think that she's lying about her faith: I don't believe in god, but I believe that she believes in god. What I think is convenient is how her decision to focus on her family and her ministry "just happens" to coincide with the first time in her basketball career (amateur and professional) when she was going to have to play on a team that wasn't expected to make any noise in the postseason, if they even made it, at all... so I do agree with him about it being a "smoke screen," from that point of view. I think that it's the exactly the sort of thing someone would say, if they don't want to be questioned about their ulterior motives because, let's face it, there aren't many people who are going to actually question Moore's commitment to serving her god.



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Michelle89



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 3:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..



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Silky Johnson



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 3:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..

Remind me, how far'd they get last year?

What'd they do over last year, besides get even older?



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CamrnCrz1974



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 4:14 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..


Did you mean Minnesota or Los Angeles?


ClayK



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 4:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

First, why would Maya lie? So I'm taking the religious aspect at face value... of course, there may be other reasons, from burnout to lack of star power around her to sending a message to the WNBA.

Second, though Maya Moore is a tremendous player, one of the best of her generation, she's not someone that sells a lot of tickets, for lack of a better phrase. People react emotionally to Diana Taurasi, and did to Lisa Leslie, to name just two stars with charisma -- I don't put Moore in that category. She's like Breanna Stewart; you admire their play but they don't stir passions. So I don't know how much the league will "miss" her and I don't know if her absence will have enough of an impact on ticket sales/TV ratings to make the WNBA rewrite the CBA.

Finally, Minnesota was going to be above average with her, and now they're below average without her, but the balance of power in the league doesn't shift much. The Lynx weren't going to be a top three or bottom three team before, and they aren't now either, so really not much has changed.

Of course, it would be better if Moore played, but as mentioned above, the WNBA was here before she arrived and will be around after she leaves for good.



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Michelle89



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 4:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Silky Johnson wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..

Remind me, how far'd they get last year?

What'd they do over last year, besides get even older?


I know how far(or notfar in their case) they went. They underachieved big time. But any team that has Maya and Fowles on their team should do better then what they did. Other teams (like the Dream) did better with less talent. I dont care how old the rest is. I found it very strange to see them struggle that bad



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bballgrl



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 4:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Silky Johnson wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..

Remind me, how far'd they get last year?

What'd they do over last year, besides get even older?


Fowles might be a top 3 player in her position but she was MVP the 1st time only because Griner had missed 2 many games to get the honor she deserved.

Also, folks need to stop questioning Maya's reason for sitting out. She is not the type to use an excuse that is not true as she is highly religous and has no reason to do otherwise.


Shades



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 5:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Michelle89 wrote:
Silky Johnson wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..

Remind me, how far'd they get last year?

What'd they do over last year, besides get even older?


I know how far(or notfar in their case) they went. They underachieved big time. But any team that has Maya and Fowles on their team should do better then what they did. Other teams (like the Dream) did better with less talent. I dont care how old the rest is. I found it very strange to see them struggle that bad


It was a very compacted season, which works much more against the older teams. Maya went from Euroleague playoff finals to WNBA with no break. Literally none. Fowles was playing through injury half the season. Brunson was out near the end of the season, and Reeve struggled to find another decent backup post after Kizer and Miyem ended up being busts. Reeve finally figured out that Whalen was a net liability. Oh, and DRob ended up getting a fairly serious injury too. I’m the only one who can remember all this?

With Fowles healthy and Maya rested in a normal season, they would have been contenders like they have always been. Now, if everyone stays healthy and Reeve can make one more good FA move (besides Dantas) and at least one good draft pick, I’m calling that this year’s team will have a better record than last year’s team (18-16).



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 7:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
Silky Johnson wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
I still find it nonsense that a team with 2 former mvp s both top 3players at their position in the world cant make it far in the playoffs..

Remind me, how far'd they get last year?

What'd they do over last year, besides get even older?


I know how far(or notfar in their case) they went. They underachieved big time. But any team that has Maya and Fowles on their team should do better then what they did. Other teams (like the Dream) did better with less talent. I dont care how old the rest is. I found it very strange to see them struggle that bad


It was a very compacted season, which works much more against the older teams. Maya went from Euroleague playoff finals to WNBA with no break. Literally none. Fowles was playing through injury half the season. Brunson was out near the end of the season, and Reeve struggled to find another decent backup post after Kizer and Miyem ended up being busts. Reeve finally figured out that Whalen was a net liability. Oh, and DRob ended up getting a fairly serious injury too. I’m the only one who can remember all this?

With Fowles healthy and Maya rested in a normal season, they would have been contenders like they have always been. Now, if everyone stays healthy and Reeve can make one more good FA move (besides Dantas) and at least one good draft pick, I’m calling that this year’s team will have a better record than last year’s team (18-16).

Spot on.

People seem to forget that run that the Lynx went on last year after the team gelled but before the injuries. Everyone was talking about how they were back.

When max contracts are given out to people who aren't playing at that level (like Whalen and Augustus), it's hard to have depth to make up for injuries. And the ones to DRob and Brunson hurt. Bad.



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Randy



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 7:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Sounds like at least you two think something like a 20 win season is a reasonable expectation given a little more help from FA and the draft. I would say then that the 2019 will be a better test of Reeve the coach than most of the past 8 seasons.


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 7:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Notwithstanding my personal view that atheism requires more faith than theism, let's just say that people of no faith perhaps do not understand the priorities and motivations of people of great faith . . . and perhaps vice versa.

Maya Moore has always been a person of great Christian faith.

Her writing is purposely simple and purposefully clear: "I measure success by asking, 'Am I living out my purpose?' I learned a long time ago that my purpose is to know Jesus and to make Him known."

Her long-time autographic reference to Colossians 3:23 emphasizes her primary life purpose:

Silky Johnson



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
Notwithstanding my personal view that atheism requires more faith than theism...


:: snickers ::



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SpaceJunkie



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
When max contracts are given out to people who aren't playing at that level (like Whalen and Augustus), it's hard to have depth to make up for injuries. And the ones to DRob and Brunson hurt. Bad.


It's not Whalen & Augustus making big bucks, since, by law, they are Lynx for life. It's the contracts given to Kizer, Miyem, and Wright last offseason (all 3 who contributed approximately nothing) should've went to Howard and any rookie or cheap signing, and Lynx would've been better off (Lynx would've been better, Storm not as good, so Lynx closer to staying on top).


Richyyy



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Don't forget that Fowles was beaten up at the end of last season, with an elbow injury that might've been more serious than anyone wanted to admit. That's why I said 'probably' Fowles when listing the vets for Reeve to run into the ground. We don't really know how healthy she is at the moment, and if she's limited or even out then Suck for Sabrina will very much be on in Minnesota (as long as she stays in school).



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
We don't really know how healthy she is at the moment, and if she's limited or even out then Suck for Sabrina will very much be on in Minnesota (as long as she stays in school).

If she is legitimately injured still coming into this season, I am more than okay with the team not being aggressive in finding replacements and having a down year with the hopes that some ping pong luck would bring Dynasty part 2. But I'm not cool with it if she is actually ready to go.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ChasingRatDogmaSalade wrote:
pilight wrote:
This sort of gobbledy-gook is why people don't take the W seriously. When was the last time an NBA star just took a year off for no particular reason?


Michael Jordan - 1993-94


There is speculation that Jordan was "secretly suspended" due to his gambling.


tfan



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Don't forget that Fowles was beaten up at the end of last season, with an elbow injury that might've been more serious than anyone wanted to admit.


Whose face did she injure it on?


Randy



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
Richyyy wrote:
Don't forget that Fowles was beaten up at the end of last season, with an elbow injury that might've been more serious than anyone wanted to admit.


Whose face did she injure it on?


It was an overuse injury. The combined effect of all of the faces she mashed not just one in particular.


tfan



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PostPosted: 02/06/19 8:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
tfan wrote:
Richyyy wrote:
Don't forget that Fowles was beaten up at the end of last season, with an elbow injury that might've been more serious than anyone wanted to admit.


Whose face did she injure it on?


It was an overuse injury. The combined effect of all of the faces she mashed not just one in particular.


Laughing


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