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pilight



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 11:50 am    ::: I’m a W player. Men won’t stop challenging me to play 1 Reply Reply with quote

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/im-a-wnba-player-men-wont-stop-challenging-me-to-play-one-on-one/2018/08/02/2deabeb2-8f6b-11e8-bcd5-9d911c784c38_story.html

Quote:
Why risk what I do for a living to prove myself to a rough-and-tumble nobody, the kind of guy who has probably never played real basketball?



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NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 12:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

She hits the nail on the head. Men's attitudes toward women's ball all-too-often go just beyond pure ability/entertainment value. I'll never understand the get-back-in-the-kitchen mentality. If someone doesn't like the sport, whatever. But the need to denigrate...just can't understand it..



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Shades



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 12:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Geez, a whole long article just to say everyday guys (probably on twitter) think they can beat her at basketball, but she won’t take the challenge because she might get hurt and she’s got nothing to prove.

It’s all talk on both sides. Neither side wants to risk getting embarrassed. She’s a very defensive person with some big old walls.



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justinabina



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 1:06 pm    ::: Re: I’m a W player. Men won’t stop challenging me to pla Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/im-a-wnba-player-men-wont-stop-challenging-me-to-play-one-on-one/2018/08/02/2deabeb2-8f6b-11e8-bcd5-9d911c784c38_story.html

Quote:
Why risk what I do for a living to prove myself to a rough-and-tumble nobody, the kind of guy who has probably never played real basketball?


Great article. Appreciate her sense of humour about something that has no doubt been frustrating, irritating, ongoing since she was quite young - and that many players can probably relate to.

Thanks for posting!


justintyme



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 1:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Geez, a whole long article just to say everyday guys (probably on twitter) think they can beat her at basketball, but she won’t take the challenge because she might get hurt and she’s got nothing to prove.

It’s all talk on both sides. Neither side wants to risk getting embarrassed. She’s a very defensive person with some big old walls.

Pretty sure you missed the point.

It's not just that people think they can beat her, she is talking about the sick pathology that some men have when it comes to basketball/professional women's sports. Seriously, as she noted, what other profession has random people denigrating professionals? Could you imagine a female surgeon being told by some Twitter rando that they could do that coronary artery bypass better than she could because he took a CPR certification class at his local gym?



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 1:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Geez, a whole long article just to say everyday guys (probably on twitter) think they can beat her at basketball, but she won’t take the challenge because she might get hurt and she’s got nothing to prove.

It’s all talk on both sides. Neither side wants to risk getting embarrassed. She’s a very defensive person with some big old walls.



+1 i actually liked the article but the part where she started talking about her accomplishments as if she led in those situations was hilarious. "High school state champ, 2 time National championships *Lost Both* , 2 time WNBA champion, 2 time overseas champ " Devereaux calm down Laughing



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 2:21 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'm sure there are trolls, etc., but there is such a thing as healthy curiousity -- and really, the only way to tell how good a player is, male or female, is to play against them. Then you get a real sense of the quickness, strength and level of play.

Those who have ever played against female D1 and pro players know exactly how good they are, just as playing against a male D1 player or pro -- even if they're not necessarily going all out -- really opens your eyes.

Everyone likes to play against elite players, or celebrities, just to say they have done so. I'm sure there are jerks out there, but there are also guys who just want to know what the league is all about.



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justintyme



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 5:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
I'm sure there are trolls, etc., but there is such a thing as healthy curiousity -- and really, the only way to tell how good a player is, male or female, is to play against them. Then you get a real sense of the quickness, strength and level of play.

Those who have ever played against female D1 and pro players know exactly how good they are, just as playing against a male D1 player or pro -- even if they're not necessarily going all out -- really opens your eyes.

Everyone likes to play against elite players, or celebrities, just to say they have done so. I'm sure there are jerks out there, but there are also guys who just want to know what the league is all about.


The ones who are simply curious are obviously not the ones this piece was addressed to. I mean surely you aren't trying to equate how NBA stars are treated versus how WNBA ones are. No one is going to ask to play 1 on 1 versus an NBA player (even an end-of-the-bench one) and assume they are going to win, much less "wipe the floor" with them. Yet not a day goes by that some rec league "superstar" doesn't inform a WNBA player that they are going to do just that. Just the base assumption is insulting, and it goes beyond online trolls.

The people who are actually curious are going to approach the WNBA player much more respectfully and with some humility that demonstrates that they appreciate just how much better that WNBA player is than them. The ones she is talking about are the ones demanding to play the game so they can put these "uppity" women in their place and demonstrate their assumed superiority. And of those these players encounter, I'd be willing to bet the vast majority are the later.



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Mojo



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 5:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Rather than getting caught up in men vs women conversation, I would like to say...
I love love LOVE the WNBA ! ! !
I won't let negativity ruin my day
Love the sport on the court.
Evasive dribble down the middle.
Layup, jump, 3pt, toe the line.
Everyone has a chance to shine.
Defense defense defense.
If the ref make a call against my team
They are just wrong, wrong wrong.
Love my team, my WNBA.
Wouldn't have it any other way.
That's what it all about,
Lovin my WNBA! ! !


NYSports56



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 6:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah, there are some curious people. Those people would probably also challenge a pro male player just as quickly. I personally would never presume to ask unless the player was a good friend, but who wouldn't like to experience what it's like to go up against a really great player? People with genuine game would probably relish it even more. These types of people don't discriminate between men and women.

If there's a huge difference between the amount WNBA players are challenged vs. NBA players, then that difference is made up of people who fall into the "get back in the kitchen" mentality. I think WNBA players are wise to avoid accepting challenges from these people. The injury risk is greater against a hostile challenger, never mind one who might get overly physical if his worldview of male superiority is challenged by the outcome.


Silky Johnson



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PostPosted: 08/02/18 9:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
I'm sure there are trolls, etc., but there is such a thing as healthy curiousity...


I feel like you have a much more charitable opinion of people's motives than most people deserve.



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Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 1:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Silky Johnson wrote:
ClayK wrote:
I'm sure there are trolls, etc., but there is such a thing as healthy curiousity...


I feel like you have a much more charitable opinion of people's motives than most people deserve.


Agreed.


Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 1:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
The ones who are simply curious are obviously not the ones this piece was addressed to. I mean surely you aren't trying to equate how NBA stars are treated versus how WNBA ones are. No one is going to ask to play 1 on 1 versus an NBA player (even an end-of-the-bench one) and assume they are going to win, much less "wipe the floor" with them. Yet not a day goes by that some rec league "superstar" doesn't inform a WNBA player that they are going to do just that. Just the base assumption is insulting, and it goes beyond online trolls.

The people who are actually curious are going to approach the WNBA player much more respectfully and with some humility that demonstrates that they appreciate just how much better that WNBA player is than them. The ones she is talking about are the ones demanding to play the game so they can put these "uppity" women in their place and demonstrate their assumed superiority. And of those these players encounter, I'd be willing to bet the vast majority are the later.


Well said.


RavenDog



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 4:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

There are millions of ignorant misguided complete assholes of both sexes lurking everywhere who try to assuage their own insecurities, weakness, prejudices, failures etc. by jealously and/or enviously challenging, berating and bigoting others. Taking these people seriously is unhealthy and it gives them a modest self-sense of credibility. There are several perpetrators on this website who cherish some of these same behaviors and the most effective way to discourage/reduce these defective behaviors is to ignore them in lieu of encouraging them by giving them a stance by responding to them.

People who cling to, continuously bring up and like to complain about these debilitating psychiatric behaviors symptomatically suffer from the same insecurities and defective behaviors as the perpetrators. These people too need to take a close look at themselves and try to make amends/changes to their own psyches, prejudices, beliefs and behaviors. Recognizing these behaviors and taking the appropriate positive remedies will help both them and the perpetrators to curtail or correct these unhealthy actions.

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


justinabina



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 7:12 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?


justintyme



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 10:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justinabina wrote:
RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?

My thoughts exactly. Telling someone to just "get over" what has to be an infuriating cultural failing seems unfair at the least. These comments and assumptions made by these "millions of misguided complete assholes" shape the views of others when they are left to themselves. The idea that a rec league caliber male player could beat professional women is not some abnormal, quaint belief held onto by a few Neanderthals, it is actually the prevalent assumption in many places. And when the same thing is heard over and over people begin to believe it is the truth.

Wanting to counter that does not stem from insecurity, but rather trying to fight the good fight to make our culture better. And one of the best ways out there is to counter these tired old narratives.



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 11:03 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
justinabina wrote:
RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?

My thoughts exactly. Telling someone to just "get over" what has to be an infuriating cultural failing seems unfair at the least. These comments and assumptions made by these "millions of misguided complete assholes" shape the views of others when they are left to themselves. The idea that a rec league caliber male player could beat professional women is not some abnormal, quaint belief held onto by a few Neanderthals, it is actually the prevalent assumption in many places. And when the same thing is heard over and over people begin to believe it is the truth.

Wanting to counter that does not stem from insecurity, but rather trying to fight the good fight to make our culture better. And one of the best ways out there is to counter these tired old narratives.


I admire everyone who fights "the good fight" against any form of bias, bigotry, and discrimination.


hyperetic



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 1:03 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Truth, plain and simple. Even male college athletes that play pickup games put their potential livelihood on the line against guys that just wanna show them up or for their own self-esteem issues. The fouls are harder. The undercutting is more frequent. The aggressiveness can get to an off the charts level. Now add to that chauvinistic, man-baby issues and its a recipe for disaster.
calbearman76



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 10:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justinabina wrote:
RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?



Her article may not show insecurity, but it does show annoyance, and so I agree that Peters should get over it. She is complaining about her situation when she needn't prove herself or even react. I have my own complaints about the way I am sometimes treated by people who nothing of who I am, and while it may bother me I wouldn't write about it in the Washington Post.

It is never a good look to play the victim and at least in this article she comes off that way. Be thankful for your skill and your success because I know there are many women who would love to have those same men say ANYTHING to them. You can always choose not to engage.


Luuuc



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 10:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

calbearman76 wrote:
justinabina wrote:
RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?



Her article may not show insecurity, but it does show annoyance, and so I agree that Peters should get over it. She is complaining about her situation when she needn't prove herself or even react. I have my own complaints about the way I am sometimes treated by people who nothing of who I am, and while it may bother me I wouldn't write about it in the Washington Post.

It is never a good look to play the victim and at least in this article she comes off that way. Be thankful for your skill and your success because I know there are many women who would love to have those same men say ANYTHING to them. You can always choose not to engage.

Her entire career is constantly, relentlessly subjected to disrespect and ridicule. IMO she has every right to be annoyed by that. I'd be stunned if anyone wasn't annoyed by that. I have nothing but applause & support to send her way.



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pilight



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 10:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

calbearman76 wrote:
justinabina wrote:
RavenDog wrote:

Although none of this behavior is appreciated or acceptable, it's part of life and a growing maturity. Devereaux needs to get a grip on her insecurities and move on.


I wonder if we read the same article. Where did you see her expressing insecurity?



Her article may not show insecurity, but it does show annoyance, and so I agree that Peters should get over it. She is complaining about her situation when she needn't prove herself or even react. I have my own complaints about the way I am sometimes treated by people who nothing of who I am, and while it may bother me I wouldn't write about it in the Washington Post.

It is never a good look to play the victim and at least in this article she comes off that way. Be thankful for your skill and your success because I know there are many women who would love to have those same men say ANYTHING to them. You can always choose not to engage.


Do people come up to you on the street and challenge you?



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 10:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Luuuc wrote:
Her entire career is constantly, relentlessly subjected to disrespect and ridicule. IMO she has every right to be annoyed by that. I'd be stunned if anyone wasn't annoyed by that. I have nothing but applause & support to send her way.


Absolutely right. Totally with you. And with Ms. Peters.


calbearman76



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PostPosted: 08/03/18 11:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
Luuuc wrote:
Her entire career is constantly, relentlessly subjected to disrespect and ridicule. IMO she has every right to be annoyed by that. I'd be stunned if anyone wasn't annoyed by that. I have nothing but applause & support to send her way.


Absolutely right. Totally with you. And with Ms. Peters.


If she truly feels that way get a new career. She is tall, I get it. But she doesn't need to engage a challenge. There are lots of jerks in the world; deal with them or ignore them. If you don't It seems like some of her issues sound like they revolve around people she might be trying to get to know but who don't respect her or her profession. Move on.

I am a big fan of the WNBA. I've traveled to 11 different cities to see games. I have driven over 50,000 miles in the past 20 years to see WBB. I probably never would have gone to Tulsa except for the Shock playing there. I have the utmost respect for WNBA players and wish the League was more successful so they could be paid more. But even if they only make 1.5% of what NBA players make they make 150% of the average salary in the US. And they do so in 4 months.

This article comes off to me as whining because even if she has to put up with some jerks she is better off than most. I am not saying she is as bad as the men that are challenging her. I am just saying she would be better off not complaining about that type of annoyance.


Silky Johnson



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PostPosted: 08/04/18 12:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

calbearman76 wrote:
If she truly feels that way get a new career. She is tall, I get it. But she doesn't need to engage a challenge. There are lots of jerks in the world; deal with them or ignore them.

You sound like somebody with three followers on Twitter asking someone with, like, 250K why they don't just ignore their trolls? Because volume (or lack thereof) makes it easier for some people than for others. It's not as if ignoring jerks makes them stop harassing you; that's not generally how jerks operate.



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Luuuc



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PostPosted: 08/04/18 12:20 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

calbearman76 wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
Luuuc wrote:
Her entire career is constantly, relentlessly subjected to disrespect and ridicule. IMO she has every right to be annoyed by that. I'd be stunned if anyone wasn't annoyed by that. I have nothing but applause & support to send her way.


Absolutely right. Totally with you. And with Ms. Peters.


If she truly feels that way get a new career. She is tall, I get it. But she doesn't need to engage a challenge. There are lots of jerks in the world; deal with them or ignore them. If you don't It seems like some of her issues sound like they revolve around people she might be trying to get to know but who don't respect her or her profession. Move on.

I am a big fan of the WNBA. I've traveled to 11 different cities to see games. I have driven over 50,000 miles in the past 20 years to see WBB. I probably never would have gone to Tulsa except for the Shock playing there. I have the utmost respect for WNBA players and wish the League was more successful so they could be paid more. But even if they only make 1.5% of what NBA players make they make 150% of the average salary in the US. And they do so in 4 months.

This article comes off to me as whining because even if she has to put up with some jerks she is better off than most. I am not saying she is as bad as the men that are challenging her. I am just saying she would be better off not complaining about that type of annoyance.

Whining?
I'm totally not on your wavelength about what you are reading into that piece of hers, so I can't really respond any further to your post.

All I will add is that within the community of WNBA players, coaches, media & fans, things are mostly fairly supportive and understanding, and we follow these players and this league wondering why it isn't more popular, and wishing it could be, so that these athletes who are the best in the world at what they do could earn more, and then have a playing calendar that allows them to be even better rather than permanently banged up.
But every time a story gets any kind of mainstream exposure, it's a deluge of insecure, immature douchebags who make up a disturbing proportion of the response. For no other reason than these are female rather than male players. That's disheartening enough for privileged male me to look at from a distance, so I can only imagine what it's like for someone who reads & hears this crap every freakin day.



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