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We are so used to this
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PUmatty



Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 10:31 am    ::: We are so used to this Reply Reply with quote

That no one even made a thread about a school shooting more deadly than Columbine.


cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 02/15/18 11:13 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

until republicans stop sucking off the NRA, nothing will change.

voting them all out will help.



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pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 11:15 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

We've had two or three school shootings per week since the first of the year. The only difference here is the higher body count.

It's nice that the cops were able to arrest the armed and dangerous white man without firing a shot...



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Stonington_QB



Joined: 05 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 1:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
until republicans stop sucking off the NRA, nothing will change.

voting them all out will help.

You got it. Electing Democrats will end random acts of violence once and for all.


ArtBest23



Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 1:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Guns don't kill people.

Fascist, racist, neo-nazi, white nationalist Trump supporters kill people.


Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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Location: Oklahoma (in my heart), whilst on my way to Oregon!


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PostPosted: 02/15/18 3:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ArtBest23 wrote:
Guns don't kill people.

Fascist, racist, neo-nazi, white nationalist Trump supporters kill people.

And crazy people. (no, wait....same thing. Never mind)

Your point is most sadly valid, Matty. In our times, I still say the only surprising thing is that this doesn't happen MORE often.



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tfan



Joined: 31 May 2010
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 4:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

"The fact that it was the 30th mass shooting so far this year has spurred activists to call on Congress again to revamp the nation's gun control policies. President Trump, a staunch defender of the National Rifle Association, said at a press conference on Thursday that the real issue lawmakers need to tackle is mental health, not guns.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5394229/Florida-high-school-shooting-plunges-city-mourning.html#ixzz57DHJXTTT


tfan



Joined: 31 May 2010
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 4:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ArtBest23 wrote:
Guns don't kill people.

Fascist, racist, neo-nazi, white nationalist Trump supporters kill people.


Which of those do you want to label the Columbine shooters as? And what label are you giving to the guy in Las Vegas?


pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 57580
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 4:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
"The fact that it was the 30th mass shooting so far this year has spurred activists to call on Congress again to revamp the nation's gun control policies. President Trump, a staunch defender of the National Rifle Association, said at a press conference on Thursday that the real issue lawmakers need to tackle is mental health, not guns.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5394229/Florida-high-school-shooting-plunges-city-mourning.html#ixzz57DHJXTTT


Trump has signed one piece of gun-related legislation, almost a year ago. It made it easier for mentally ill people to get guns.



_________________
Make lots of noise
Kiss lots of boys
Or kiss lots of girls
If that's something you're into
When the straight and narrow
Gets a little too straight
Roll up a joint, or don't
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Follow your arrow
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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 6:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
tfan wrote:
"The fact that it was the 30th mass shooting so far this year has spurred activists to call on Congress again to revamp the nation's gun control policies. President Trump, a staunch defender of the National Rifle Association, said at a press conference on Thursday that the real issue lawmakers need to tackle is mental health, not guns.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5394229/Florida-high-school-shooting-plunges-city-mourning.html#ixzz57DHJXTTT


Trump has signed one piece of gun-related legislation, almost a year ago. It made it easier for mentally ill people to get guns.



The Trump budget cuts tens of millions of funding from mental health.

Fuck him, the NRA, and its dunce supporters, including the CCDL.



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jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 02/15/18 7:14 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Some of the predictable opinions expressed in a school shooting thread here on Rebkell's make me doubly sorry that another of these threads has had to happen.

Anyone who has ever done anything. ANYTHING. Let's say just cooking a simple breakfast of scrambled eggs, toast, and coffee, knows that YOU, the human being, have to DO certain things, and do them right, in order to get to the desired end result. Crack the eggs. Put bread in the toaster. Put some water on or start your coffee maker. Apply the right amount of heat to everything for the right amount of time, etc.

This is something the jammer can solve. I've got the recipe for this. And God knows ALL that we should be talking about NOW as a society is solutions. We want to do something. We have to take the steps to get to the desired end. We're never going to eliminate every school shooting. That's impossible and except as a rhetorical device (even one is too many, etc.) that is not even something we should be talking about.

So here it is. How hot do you make the pan when cooking scrambled eggs and how long to you cook the eggs? You don't turn the heat up all the way and pre-heat a non-stick pan for an hour. lol. Then 'cook' the eggs for another hour.

This problem of mass body counts is going to continue. It is a problem that revolves around a simple one-word concept. Capacity. An assault rifle has a capacity to kill that a handgun does not. It fires incredibly destructive high velocity military rounds out of an 18 or so inch long barrel which makes missing a moving target much harder to do. And it allows a shooter to rapidly fire scores of rounds quickly and to reload very quickly. It gives one person the capacity to kill many persons very quickly and it makes it very difficult for someone on the ground, a hero, to stop a shooter who would alternatively be struggling to hit scrambling victims with a handgun and much more susceptible to being stopped by one of the many people he would not so easily be incapacitating with an assault rifle. This kind of weaponry in a crowd of school kids, church goers, from a distance, it enables a suppression of resistance in a way that a hand gun cannot.

So, as a country, we have to begin the process of taking assault weapons from out of the hands of the general public. And as impossible as that sounds? lol. Guess what? We're going to get there. I can't predict the future in some metaphysical way but I can still predict the future any fucking way. We WILL be taking these weapons away from the public at large in the not-to-distant future. It might be five years or it might be 25 years, but we will do it, because, these mass killings resulting from the unique capabilities of these weapons will continue, to the point that EVEN the most die-hard proponents of lax gun control will find themselves in an untenable and indefensible position in the face of a public outcry of a finally sufficiently enlightened, in the most terrible ways, American public.

So assault weapons are the first front in the war that will be waged to stop these massacres. The first impediment to getting there is inherent in this short thread already. Lack of focus and political blaming. Remember the scene in some movie where in a cacophony of arguing voices someone just starts yelling, shut up, SHUT UP!!, etc. Everyone who really wants to stop this has to themselves stop blaming the NRA, Republicans, Trump, stupid Americans, all of that. Put removing assault weapons in a VACUUM. All by itself. Totally removed from any hint of any other inevitably distracting and defusing area of debate or argument. Forget it all and focus only on building a public demand and outcry for the total elimination of assault weapons from public availability.

Yes the usual subjects will BE the ones pushing back on an effort such as this. We already know that. But this IS going to happen, eventually. And when it does, it will have happened because a formed consensus behind a national outcry will HAVE occurred. Past tense. We will get to the point where that consensus WILL have already happened. The harder and earlier this society starts to focus on this particular outcome the sooner that will happen and that many more children will be saved.

So the second thing we need to know and to focus on is this. There will be more of these mass shootings. Well, wait a minute. If we can look at past recent history and a calendar of the next five years and predict that x-number of Americans (let's focus on school shootings) x-number of school children will die in mass school shootings... project it just that easily and predict without fail that AR-15s will be used in those shootings... then we SHOULD proceed with the job of PREVENTING those shootings and not, as we have been, accepting and ALLOWING them to continue. That means tasks forces everywhere, even if it's just one person in one office, maybe in every school or district, scaled as needed of course, to flag potential shooters, such as this incredibly red-flag waving example of a potential shooter turning into an eventual shooter in Parkland, Florida.

Apprehend them when they exhibit the tell-tale signs. Investigate what weapons they have and remove them. Put an ankle monitor on them. Spend the money and do whatever it takes. Make the further possession of any form of weaponry punishable by a long term prison sentence. Etc. Remove them from society at all costs, if that is what it takes. Believe me, these kinds of aggressive responses will ultimately suppress behaviors. Even nutcases learn the parameters of what society will accept from them. Society accepted a LOT from this guy. Exactly everything he did up until the time he opened fire.

Put more and better security measures in place in schools. You can't walk around the halls of major hospitals without an ID card hanging on a lanyard or a sticky on your chest. Children are being killed. Put up a desk and security guards and issue IDs to students and teachers and everyone who has business on campus and clear everyone else who needs to come into the school or show themselves on school grounds, etc. Is this foolproof in every situation? No. What you're aiming for is a collection of actions that make what happened yesterday far more difficult to accomplish and thus far less likely to happen or to be as devastating when something does slip through the cracks and does happen.

So again. The public voice should be united that assault weapons must go and as soon as we become a mostly unified society demanding that (something that will eventually happen anyway) the sooner we will remove these extremely potent and destructive weapons from the hands of people like this shooter.

But schools and public officials should be laser focused on creating better protections around schools and in taking EVERY single potential shooter threat with deadly seriousness and with new and aggressive tactics for identifying and removing those people from our midst. Whatever it takes.


Genero36



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PostPosted: 02/15/18 9:25 pm    ::: Re: We are so used to this Reply Reply with quote

<embed><iframe width="854" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9QFMPVb_i3I" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe></embed>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QFMPVb_i3I



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Genero36



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PostPosted: 02/15/18 10:37 pm    ::: Re: We are so used to this Reply Reply with quote

<embed><iframe width="854" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/sopTUWWOEX4" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe></embed>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sopTUWWOEX4



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calbearman76



Joined: 02 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 02/16/18 4:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

As always in these circumstances there are several issues that combine to cause these horrible events. The problem we have is that those that want to protect their special interest to shift the blame away from their part of the problem.

There will always be violence. It happens in the US and it happens everywhere else in the world. The difference is that we don't control ownership of guns, whether it is semiautomatic weapons that can easily be turned into automatic weapons, oversized ammunition magazines, so our violence committed outside of war (or coordinated terrorist attacks) reaches higher levels than in other countries. There is an easy fix. Right now the federal government is barred from even studying the effects of gun control on the health of our country. Reasonable gun controls will not stop every event, but it will limit the worst of them.

There will always be mental health problems. Indeed mental health will likely become an even greater problem in coming generations as continued advancements in technology will create more individuals who do not have a productive role in society. This is especially difficult for young men (age 16-30) who are the most likely to commit these vile acts. And yet our society has been reducing mental health funding, and accessing of mental health services is still stigmatized within many groups.

We use to throw certain people with mental health problems into horrible institutions, but over time our societal sensibilities did not allow for that kind of treatment. We went to more outpatient models, but over time budget cuts and poor case management, including people not staying on medications, caused significant problems. More and more mental health patients went in and out of jails or short term commitments just to get back on medications but could not become productive. This is an expensive problem to solve, but the recent tax cut assures that we won't be able to implement many necessary changes.

This just comes down to what we are willing to put accept. I can accept some reasonable controls on guns in exchange for greater safety in schools and society in general. I can accept higher taxes in exchange for better treatment of mental health, understanding that neither of these steps will do away with all violence. But we need to stop taking the position that the problem is too complex so we can't do anything.


Genero36



Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 02/16/18 5:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Alleged Florida shooter member of school rifle team given NRA grant: report

Quote:
The 19-year-old accused of killing 17 people at a Florida high school Wednesday was reportedly a member of the school’s marksmanship team, which received grants from the National Rifle Association (NRA).

The Associated Press reports Nikolas Cruz, the alleged gunman in the deadly mass shooting at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, was a member of the marksmanship team, which was part of the school’s Army Junior Reserve Officer Training Corps.

Cruz was reportedly wearing a shirt with the JROTC logo when he was arrested following the shooting.

Former JROTC cadet Aaron Diener told the AP that Cruz was a member of the team and that he gave him a ride to a shooting competition where they competed together in 2016.

“He was a very good shot,” Diener said. “He had an AR-15 he talked about, and pistols.”


http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/374296-alleged-florida-shooter-member-of-school-rifle-team-given-grant?__twitter_impression=true&__twitter_impression=true



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FrozenLVFan



Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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PostPosted: 02/16/18 8:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So a bazillion people knew he had a troubled past and an assault rifle, while the family that took him in was clueless that he was disturbed, and the FBI apparently didn't take the warnings they received seriously? There are a lot of things wrong here that just banning assault weapons won't fix, although I do agree that's necessary.


Shades



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PostPosted: 02/18/18 11:04 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

<embed><iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ZxD3o-9H1lY" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe></embed>



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Last edited by Shades on 03/11/18 10:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
FrozenLVFan



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PostPosted: 02/18/18 12:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I think it would be more on point to scream at Congress to pass S.2095 than to shriek at Trump, or better yet, write, call, and Email your Congressperson. These soundbites don't accomplish much.


calbearman76



Joined: 02 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 02/18/18 3:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

FrozenLVFan wrote:
I think it would be more on point to scream at Congress to pass S.2095 than to shriek at Trump, or better yet, write, call, and Email your Congressperson. These soundbites don't accomplish much.


I'm not sure I agree. It is important for you and I to call our Congressmen, but her comment may well not have been aired if she hadn't made it personal with Trump. If she had held a sign about the bill as well perhaps that would have been more effective, but as a high school student she laid the predicate for all of us to take up the banner of getting a bill passed.

I just prefer she would have had more normal hair so she wouldn't be dismissed by some as a radical.


Shades



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PostPosted: 02/18/18 3:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It's radical to have short hair? You might want to tip-toe for the sidelines.



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Genero36



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PostPosted: 02/18/18 7:15 pm    ::: Re: We are so used to this Reply Reply with quote




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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 02/19/18 10:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Go kids!



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calbearman76



Joined: 02 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 02/19/18 8:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
It's radical to have short hair? You might want to tip-toe for the sidelines.


No tip-toeing here. I have no problem whatsoever with the look. But is it something that some people may not construe as the All American girl look. And when you are trying to win over the hearts and minds of the masses optics matter. Show me a female news anchor with a crew cut (other than one doing so specifically in support of a cancer patient.) Her look may serve to sway a few less people than might have otherwise been the case, and I have already seen some conservatives try to ridicule her message by ridiculing her. Sad but true.


stever



Joined: 16 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 02/19/18 8:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

This event was going to be held at a golf course about a mile down the road from me:


...high school football "boosters", school had nothing to do with it.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/local/oakland-county/2018/02/18/south-lyon-boosters-cancel-ar-15-raffle/349240002/



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Luuuc



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PostPosted: 02/20/18 2:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So they decided to cancel the whole thing rather than endure the horrors of holding the event without the guns? Hmmm.
On the plus side I just learned something new as a result of googling "what is a Chinese raffle"



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