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toad455



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PostPosted: 10/14/17 9:43 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

RavenDog wrote:
Out with several of the old and in with the new. Give some of the younger players the opportunity to play Dawn. USA will still win.


USA would win with their "B" team more than likely. Games would be closer, but no one else comes close to the talent team USA has.



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5thmantheme



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PostPosted: 10/17/17 3:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

<snip> for space
WNBA 09 wrote:
tfan wrote:

Next generation' starts now for USA Basketball


Caption That Face By Sue Bird Pleasseeeeee #NextGenMyA** Laughing


Staley : "Here's what just happened ..."
Mitchell : "What just happened? Oh that's what happened."
Bird : "Rookie? Please."


ArtBest23



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PostPosted: 10/17/17 4:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
tfan wrote:
'Next generation' starts now for USA Basketball



Caption That Face By Sue Bird Pleasseeeeee #NextGenMyA** Laughing


"You're certainly no Geno, that's for sure."


pilight



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 11:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

2017-20 USA Basketball Women’s National Team Pool Unveiled

https://www.usab.com/news-events/news/2017/12/wnt-pool-announced.aspx


Quote:
The 29 members of the 2017-20 USA National Team roster announced today include: Seimone Augustus (Minnesota Lynx); Sue Bird (Seattle Storm); Tina Charles (New York Liberty); Layshia Clarendon (Atlanta Dream); Napheesa Collier (Connecticut); Elena Delle Donne (Washington Mystics); Skylar Diggins-Smith (Dallas Wings); Stefanie Dolson (Chicago Sky); Asia Durr (Louisville); Sylvia Fowles (Minnesota Lynx); Brittney Griner (Phoenix Mercury); Tiffany Hayes (Atlanta Dream); Jantel Lavender (Los Angeles Sparks); Jewell Loyd (Seattle Storm); Kayla McBride (Las Vegas Aces); Angel McCoughtry (Atlanta Dream); Kelsey Mitchell (Ohio State); Maya Moore (Minnesota Lynx); Chiney Ogwumike (Connecticut Sun); Nneka Ogwumike (Los Angeles Sparks); Kelsey Plum (Las Vegas Aces); Katie Lou Samuelson (Connecticut); Odyssey Sims (Los Angeles Sparks); Breanna Stewart (Seattle Storm); Diana Taurasi (Phoenix Mercury); Morgan Tuck (Connecticut Sun); Lindsay Whalen (Minnesota Lynx); Courtney Williams (Connecticut Sun); and A’ja Wilson (South Carolina).



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 12:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Comparing the list to the training camp roster from September, they've added McCoughtry and C.Ogwumike, and removed C.Gray, Stokes and Wiese. Surprised to see Gray gone unless there's an unknown reason for it (like she's taking up citizenship from a different country to play for them).



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#Occasionalwnbafan



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 1:30 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I find myself pulling for Uconn now in most games, but this will be a team of huskies once again, and I expect the Olden Girls Bird and DT to make it.
Shades



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 1:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'm a little surprised by the Chiney add and Gray removal, although I didn't have Gray making the final cut. I'm not surprised by the McCoughtry add, but her addition creates a complication in my projected roster from September.


Bird/Whalen
Taurasi/Augustus/Diggins
Moore/Delle Donne
Ogwumike/Stewart/Wilson
Fowles/Griner

I keep thinking Delle Donne will be the most likely of these players to have an excuse not to go to Worlds. That would work out great because McCoughtry can just slide in there behind Maya like she has in the past.

People will say it'd be easiest just to cut Wilson, but I just can't see that with a Staley-run club. Wilson is arguably a deserving player.

I don't have Charles included because I believe she didn't make it to the last training camp, so if she's still in the running that's an additional complication. Has Charles ever been that great with Team USA? The only thing that stands out to me with Charles is how she got owned by Cambage (in 2014?). I might have to check out the Team USA stats later.



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Iluvacc



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 4:14 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

No Chelsea Gray, but Kelsey Plum? I see the politics of USA basketball is as ugly as ever.


Queenie



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 5:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So we're all just assuming Parker's done with the national team?

And also, yes, miss me with this Plum bullshit, she's not even remotely close to ready.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 5:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Queenie wrote:
So we're all just assuming Parker's done with the national team?

And also, yes, miss me with this Plum bullshit, she's not even remotely close to ready.


Yes Parker is done. We still don't know why Gray is off the list. Personal choice? New member of team Andorra? Pregnant?



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bcdawg04



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 5:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Comparing the list to the training camp roster from September, they've added McCoughtry and C.Ogwumike, and removed C.Gray, Stokes and Wiese. Surprised to see Gray gone unless there's an unknown reason for it (like she's taking up citizenship from a different country to play for them).


Perhaps part of it is that she wasn't able to attend the training camp. Also, as far as I know, she has no history with the US youth teams.


Richyyy



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 5:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Gray's last game was barely a week ago in Turkey, so if it's pregnancy that'd likely be a pretty recent development. And while they could be waiting on the paperwork, if she was being naturalised you'd think the country would've wanted her for the recent round of Euro qualifiers. It's an odd one given that you'd think her recent WNBA performances would've put her on the fringe of actually making the squad.

It's pretty hard to argue that Plum and Clarendon should be ahead of her in the pecking order on merit.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.



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PUmatty



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:17 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


They need more than one.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


This X_____ Team USA seems to never show sky any love.



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SDHoops



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Gray's last game was barely a week ago in Turkey, so if it's pregnancy that'd likely be a pretty recent development. And while they could be waiting on the paperwork, if she was being naturalised you'd think the country would've wanted her for the recent round of Euro qualifiers. It's an odd one given that you'd think her recent WNBA performances would've put her on the fringe of actually making the squad.

It's pretty hard to argue that Plum and Clarendon should be ahead of her in the pecking order on merit.

Hammon was mysteriously left off the pool and Parker didn't make the team in 2016. So a hit and miss approach by the committee wouldn't be the first time it's happened.


tfan



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Plum has similar qualifications to Kara Wolters and Rebecca Lobo.


Nixtreefan



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I like Diggins too but for some reason I keep thinking they will go with Sims after this last W season as she became very unselfish in sharing the ball and knowing when to score under Agler. Plus she can be a defender they may need.


toad455



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'm really hoping at least Whalen steps down for 2018. Time to pass the torch already(to Diggins).



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 6:56 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

same OLD story.



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#Occasionalwnbafan



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 7:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

PUmatty wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


They need more than one.


A Diggins-Smith, Durr combo could be really good down the line.

Forward looks locked up for a while with Moore/EDD/Stewie/Wilson all still being pretty young.
CamrnCrz1974



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 7:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Mechelle Voepel @MechelleV

As for Sparks guard Chelsea Gray, USA Basketball's Carol Callan said she had not been to a national team training camp before, and of course she couldn't go to the one in Sept. during WNBA Finals. Sounded like there might be at least some chance for Gray someday to be added.


awhom111



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 8:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It's good to see them having a training camp during the European break, although coaching commitments obviously prevent them from say holding it in Europe and having exhibitions against Serbia and Latvia.

By the way, there are rumblings that there will be a new global calendar in effect after the 2020 Olympics, but details are still a secret at this point.
readyAIMfire53



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 10:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
Mechelle Voepel @MechelleV

As for Sparks guard Chelsea Gray, USA Basketball's Carol Callan said she had not been to a national team training camp before, and of course she couldn't go to the one in Sept. during WNBA Finals. Sounded like there might be at least some chance for Gray someday to be added.


Omitting Chelsea is BIG. She and Sky are the PG's of the future. Her height on defense is HUGE. I don't know why she didn't play on a younger US team. She was one of the best players in her class coming out of high school.



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 10:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
Mechelle Voepel @MechelleV

As for Sparks guard Chelsea Gray, USA Basketball's Carol Callan said she had not been to a national team training camp before, and of course she couldn't go to the one in Sept. during WNBA Finals. Sounded like there might be at least some chance for Gray someday to be added.


Seems like a pretty lame catch 22 excuse. So you have to have attended a national camp to be invited to a national camp. Absurd reasoning. It also reeks of punitive punishment for ever having refused to attend a national camp if ever invited.

It's not like going being at a National training camp makes players who are playing at the highest level any better. Seems like a stretch rational to defend a clickish good ole Boy system. While it might be understandable for high school and college players who might not have faced stiff enough competition to be properly evaluated. but when you are playing against the best players in the world that shouldn't matter. I mean it is just a try out and that is what those camps should be- to try out. How do you justify not inviting a player because you have never tried them out before to a try out.

More players should do what Candice did and tell them where to shove it. Play for other countries until they purge these self serving morons.


Queenie



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PostPosted: 12/14/17 11:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
Plum has similar qualifications to Kara Wolters and Rebecca Lobo.


True. They are all Huskies.



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 12:58 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:

More players should do what Candice did and tell them where to shove it. Play for other countries until they purge these self serving morons.


I kinda agree. Let Callan play her tried and true players until they are 60...Birdie could go to 10 Olympics.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 2:20 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Although Candace didn't really tell them to shove anything until they'd already dumped her in the first place. It's players like Prince and Vandersloot who've jumped the other way when there was still the prospect of USA Basketball calling them in the future.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 2:34 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
It's players like Prince and Vandersloot who've jumped the other way when there was still the prospect of USA Basketball calling them in the future.


They must not have liked their chances, and I would agree with them - the idea of them displacing Whalen, Bird, Taurasi or Augustus was very slim. And there was the threat of Diggins and others leap-frogging them.


Nixtreefan



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 12:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

#Occasionalwnbafan wrote:
PUmatty wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


They need more than one.


A Diggins-Smith, Durr combo could be really good down the line.

Forward looks locked up for a while with Moore/EDD/Stewie/Wilson all still being pretty young.


LMAO and the penny drops. You think they will want a guard who plays no defense, has to have the ball in their hand, now all your posts make sense to me.


dtsnms



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 12:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

USA Basketball’s committee isn’t going to add anyone to the pool who they have not seen at a USA National Team training camp. Chelsea was in the Finals and couldn’t participate in the Sept/Oct. training camp (emphasis added below to highlight certain aspects of her answer).

Carol Callan from yesterday:

While we know the players are excellent in either their WNBA play or their college play, our committee wants to see them in our environment and in our training camps and former competitions. So, we build this body of work with our athletes. So, the members that you see today on this list of 29 are players who were in the pool last quad, from 2013-16, who want to continue. As you know, Tamika Catchings has retired, but the other 11 Olympians are all interested in continuing on by being a part of this pool. The other thing is that if someone has never been involved with our national team program, then even if they were involved with a younger player on perhaps a U19 World Cup, or another junior program, we want to see them in our training camps and have the committee observe and evaluate what they can do with the other players who are in our pool. We pretty much want someone to attend a training camp before we move them into a pool. So, that then leads to the necessity to have as many training camps that we can within the parameters that we work. So, for instance, this past fall we had a training camp at the end of September, the first couple days of October, and it overlapped the WNBA Finals. So, clearly anybody who was involved in the WNBA Finals was not able to come to a training camp.

How important is the upcoming camp for the guard position and are there any other guards, such as Chelsea Gray, you see joining this list?

Obviously, if you look at the numbers, we’re guard-heavy in this group for the very reason that several years ago when we were talking about the roster for the Olympic team, it was noted that our guards were very veteran. So, yes. We want to have a younger mix coming in to look at. Chelsea’s (Gray) situation, she was not in the pool in the last four years, and in September she was playing with the Sparks in the WNBA Finals. So, that would be a situation I was describing earlier that our committee, before adding someone to the pool, they would like to observe them. I would anticipate that she will be involved in the future. She just was not available in September.


pilight



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 12:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

There should be “term limits” in USA Basketball National Team pool

http://womenshoopsworld.com/2017/12/14/there-should-be-term-limits-in-usa-basketball-national-team-pool/

Quote:
If Nneka Ogwumike, Diggins-Smith and Chiney Ogwumike make the cut for Tokyo, they will be first-time Olympians at ages 30, 29 and 28, respectively. Given the fact that Nneka is a former WNBA MVP, in particular, is especially shameful.



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 12:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

But the pool creates the giant swamp of players that they invite to upcoming camps. They only invite anyone else if 20+ people pull out or are unavailable. 'You can't be in the pool of players we invite to camps until you've been to a camp' just seems ridiculous.

And if they want to 'observe' someone like Gray at any point in the next three years, doesn't that basically mean that they've moved them into the pool to take a look at them? The whole thing's idiotically circular.



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 1:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
There should be “term limits” in USA Basketball National Team pool

http://womenshoopsworld.com/2017/12/14/there-should-be-term-limits-in-usa-basketball-national-team-pool/

Quote:
If Nneka Ogwumike, Diggins-Smith and Chiney Ogwumike make the cut for Tokyo, they will be first-time Olympians at ages 30, 29 and 28, respectively. Given the fact that Nneka is a former WNBA MVP, in particular, is especially shameful.


Sue is so 'right on' in this article. I don't nec. agree with her picks but It IS shameful. And today's system totally smacks of cronyism.



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#Occasionalwnbafan



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 2:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Nixtreefan wrote:
#Occasionalwnbafan wrote:
PUmatty wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


They need more than one.


A Diggins-Smith, Durr combo could be really good down the line.

Forward looks locked up for a while with Moore/EDD/Stewie/Wilson all still being pretty young.


LMAO and the penny drops. You think they will want a guard who plays no defense, has to have the ball in their hand, now all your posts make sense to me.


We can save the Insults, I think Durr is a decent size guard who can get hot from deep, who would you place in the future USA backcourt?
Randy



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 2:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It won't change until they lose a gold medal in the Olympics. They will then probably decide it's time to get the best players, not the players they like the best. Until then it's going to be more like a sorority or private club, In the case of Chelsea Grey she probably is more of a victim on circumstance because her injuries impeded her progress and until she moved to LA, wasn't really showing that much. She wasn't even a regular starter for the Sun or Sparks until this season.

Now, if I were Chelsea and ticked off about it, I would see about becoming a citizen of fortune for Spain, Australia or whatever team she thinks has the best chance to get the Gold next time around. Enough players do that and perhaps the USA BBall will get worried enough to reform.


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PostPosted: 12/15/17 2:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The question, though, is whether or when the U.S. will lose an Olympic gold medal or World Championship. And though I agree Bird and Taurasi aren't what they were, it seems likely they are good enough to win in 2018.



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 3:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
It won't change until they lose a gold medal in the Olympics. They will then probably decide it's time to get the best players, not the players they like the best. Until then it's going to be more like a sorority or private club. In the case of Chelsea Grey she probably is more of a victim on circumstance because her injuries impeded her progress and until she moved to LA, wasn't really showing that much. She wasn't even a regular starter for the Sun or Sparks until this season.

Now, if I were Chelsea and ticked off about it, I would see about becoming a citizen of fortune for Spain, Australia or whatever team she thinks has the best chance to get the Gold next time around. Enough players do that and perhaps the USA BBall will get worried enough to reform.


I have said something like this before in the past, and I'll say it again: USA Basketball and their selection committee is like a clique. If you're not part of that clique, or you didn't go to a certain select university, or if you're not a high-ranking WNBA draft pick, or if you don't kiss their butt...you might as well forget about being on the USA Team.



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StevenHW



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 3:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
The question, though, is whether or when the U.S. will lose an Olympic gold medal or World Championship. And though I agree Bird and Taurasi aren't what they were, it seems likely they are good enough to win in 2018.


The last time the U.S. Women's Team did not win a Gold Medal in the Olympics was in 1992. The last time they didn't win Gold in the FIBA World Championship was in 2006.

In the case of the '92 team, there was a big turnover of players afterwards.



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pilight



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 3:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
The question, though, is whether or when the U.S. will lose an Olympic gold medal or World Championship. And though I agree Bird and Taurasi aren't what they were, it seems likely they are good enough to win in 2018.


The last major change in selection procedure came after we lost both, in 1992 and 1994. That led to coaches having significantly reduced input into selections.



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dtsnms



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 3:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
But the pool creates the giant swamp of players that they invite to upcoming camps. They only invite anyone else if 20+ people pull out or are unavailable. 'You can't be in the pool of players we invite to camps until you've been to a camp' just seems ridiculous.

And if they want to 'observe' someone like Gray at any point in the next three years, doesn't that basically mean that they've moved them into the pool to take a look at them? The whole thing's idiotically circular.


It appears the "camps" don't have to be "pool only" players. In other words, all Gray has to do is be invited and make one of those camps to get added to the pool (and play well).


Richyyy



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 4:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Rather defeats the point of naming a pool if you're a) going to invite people to camps who aren't in the pool, and b) just going to add people to it occasionally anyway. And the one camp they have scheduled is something Gray should be able to attend, seeing as they've put it in the European qualifying window. So is the announcement for that going to say that it involves 21 players from the 2017-20 USA pool and this extra person who we've invited to fly in all the way from Turkey for the hell of it? Seems unlikely to me.

If they had any interest in Gray whatsoever it all would've made a hell of a lot more sense to just put her in the pool, and say she had a lot of work to do to force her way in if anyone asked.



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PostPosted: 12/15/17 11:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Per Queenie's request moving the Parker griping to this thread Laughing

myrtle wrote:
dtsnms wrote:
Ladyvol777 wrote:
Thanks Geno for no Candace Parker


Geno was the ventriliquist that said "no thank you" when asked to camp this summer, which she ended up not being able to go to, but she said no.


After she got shat on, what did you expect her to do?



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PostPosted: 12/16/17 11:19 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
Per Queenie's request moving the Parker griping to this thread Laughing

myrtle wrote:
dtsnms wrote:
Ladyvol777 wrote:
Thanks Geno for no Candace Parker


Geno was the ventriliquist that said "no thank you" when asked to camp this summer, which she ended up not being able to go to, but she said no.


After she got shat on, what did you expect her to do?


Say screw you Geno, you're not here any more and I'm going to get another gold medal. Best way to get revenge.


Nixtreefan



Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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PostPosted: 12/16/17 12:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

#Occasionalwnbafan wrote:
Nixtreefan wrote:
#Occasionalwnbafan wrote:
PUmatty wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Really though, Diggins should be he next PG to join team USA.


They need more than one.


A Diggins-Smith, Durr combo could be really good down the line.

Forward looks locked up for a while with Moore/EDD/Stewie/Wilson all still being pretty young.


LMAO and the penny drops. You think they will want a guard who plays no defense, has to have the ball in their hand, now all your posts make sense to me.


I love Gray but bottom line Sims is the better defender.

We can save the Insults, I think Durr is a decent size guard who can get hot from deep, who would you place in the future USA backcourt?


LMAO saving the insults coming from you LOL til the cows come home.

FYI i would put a guard who is unselfish, doesn't have to have the ball in her hands, actually does something to help her team when she doesn't have the ball in her hands like set screens and move, a guard who plays defense and not benched by her own college coach for a freshman who plays better defense than her.

Which is if you read the thread is why I thought Sims could be that guard as she can defend and has actually learned and improved over the last year in all those categories.


dtbtbtb



Joined: 24 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 12/16/17 1:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The perfect guard for team USA next generation would have been a healthy MoJeff. A real PG who can defend, sdistribute the ball and doesn't care about their own points


allenleavell



Joined: 28 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: 12/17/17 10:35 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

dtbtbtb wrote:
The perfect guard for team USA next generation would have been a healthy MoJeff. A real PG who can defend, sdistribute the ball and doesn't care about their own points

Mo would love to do it but I wouldn't because they screwed over her in the past .


UK1996



Joined: 03 Sep 2015
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PostPosted: 12/17/17 11:42 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

dtbtbtb wrote:
The perfect guard for team USA next generation would have been a healthy MoJeff. A real PG who can defend, sdistribute the ball and doesn't care about their own points

I agree that Team USA needs at least one pure point guard on the roster. There is enough firepower. That's why I wish they hadn't let Vandersloot go.


toad455



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PostPosted: 12/17/17 11:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I wonder if all those vets retire before 2020 what the team will look like and what potential college players could make the team. Noticed Jefferson wasn't invited, too.

PG: Diggins/???
SG: Loyd/Hayes/K. Mitchell
SF: Moore/Delle Donne
PF: Stewart/N. Ogwumike/Wilson
C: Fowles/Griner



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dtbtbtb



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PostPosted: 12/17/17 9:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
I wonder if all those vets retire before 2020 what the team will look like and what potential college players could make the team. Noticed Jefferson wasn't invited, too.

PG: Diggins/???
SG: Loyd/Hayes/K. Mitchell
SF: Moore/Delle Donne
PF: Stewart/N. Ogwumike/Wilson
C: Fowles/Griner


I would add MoJeff, replace Mitchell with McBride and replace Fowles with Charles and there you have a great team with all players under 30


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