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awhom111



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PostPosted: 05/16/17 8:56 pm    ::: 2017 TV Ratings Reply Reply with quote

The ESPN opener averaged 346,000 viewers. As posted in the other thread, the comparable Twitter number was 62,459.

That number was beaten by at least 3 college softball conference championship games that day.

The lower numbers will not be as accessible this season because sportstvratings.com is no longer doing daily ratings. If I see numbers from any other sources, I will post them. We might be able to get local FSSW ratings for the Wings.
awhom111



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PostPosted: 05/19/17 7:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Lynx-Liberty averaged 215,000 viewers on ESPN2.
awhom111



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PostPosted: 06/01/17 11:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Sparks-Liberty averaged 170,000 on ESPN2.
awhom111



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PostPosted: 06/08/17 11:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I guess I forgot to post this due to post-Warriors euphoria.

Mystics-Wings averaged 158,000 on ESPN2 on Tuesday. The deciding game of the Women's College World Series at the same time on ESPN averaged 1,739,000 viewers.
snlMINAJ



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 4:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

yikes


awhom111



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PostPosted: 06/26/17 8:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Mystics-Lynx on Friday averaged 195,000 viewers.

For those of you who wonder why they don't get put on main ESPN, the College World Series game at that time averaged 1,049,000 viewers.
MuneravenMN
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PostPosted: 06/27/17 9:04 pm    ::: I have a Bad Feeling Reply Reply with quote

I am seeing far less interest in the league. There are less people talking online. There are less people watching on TV. When my knee was too banged up to manage the stairs at the game we couldn't give our seats away. Seriously. Nobody wanted good seats to a winning WNBA team. And Flash seats aren't selling.

It's very strange. I mean people still go to Lynx games but...I just have a bad feeling about the league.

We were talking about it the other day and we added up the cost to see the Lynx here in MN. Parking is $15. Tickets are $90 a game. Two bottles of water cost $12. If you want a burger and fries downtown add in another $30. Call it $150 with gas. That is a lot of money, at least to me. How many people are willing to pay that to see a WNBA game? Our seats are average, not great, btw.

I don't know. I just feel like the league is really not doing well right now. Am I wrong?



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josephkramer44



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 12:55 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I am watching several indicators VERY closely right now. TV ratings are hard to come by this year but they seem down and by a significant margin (this is from a very small pool of data however so it may not be accurate). Attendance is not what the teams wanted (even with the usual inflation of numbers). Looking at craigslist ads it doesn't seem there is much interest in the tickets put up for sale there. I'm watching a few other things as well.
The real concern is the fact that just about all indicators of success are going in the wrong direction this year, and this after the vaunted 2016 "Watch Me Work" campaign that saturated the NBA playoffs with advertising and other marketing events. Despite Lisa Border's claims of unprecedented success I was personally skeptical of her claims (I think she felt she needed to show something big during her first year). What with the first half of this season failing to really show any growth I stand by my skepticism.
Nevertheless it is not yet time to panic. Lets see what the All Star game can draw and the 2nd half of the season. There is simply not enough data yet to draw any real accurate conclusions. However I am thinking that Ms. Wiggins opinion piece may have done some damage.


ClayK



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 11:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I do sense a shift in interest in the league, but such things happen and it isn't necessarily about the sport as a whole but rather the specific circumstances of the specific year.

That said, my biggest concern is the hollowing out of the talent pool at the lower levels due to rising participation in volleyball, water polo and to a lesser extent, lacrosse. What makes the games attractive are the players, and if elite athletes are choosing other sports instead of basketball, then there will be fewer stars that catch fans' eyes.

As for Wiggins, I don't know that what she said is any different than what's been said for years about the league being heavily lesbian -- which is true -- and the counter to that is that there is a growing societal acceptance of LGBT activities.

But assuming the talent keeps flowing, my guess would be this is a normal dip that most businesses go through at one point or another, not a symptom of a fatal disease.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 11:30 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I think it always depends on the draft. That's what starts the off the league every year. This 2017 draft was terrible. The top three picks haven't done anything. There's no excitement for this season. The most exciting thing to happen was Delle Donne going to Washington. Half the teams in the league are terrible. Attendance is notably way down. I think with next year's stacked draft class we'll see an increase in visibility. The playoffs this year should be exciting. Minnesota's the favorite, but reigning champs the Sparks plus New York & Washington could make the semifinals & finals very exciting.



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josephkramer44



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 3:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Eastern Europe is the next biggest basketball playing area to the US. Having spent a lot of time in Eastern Europe I notice that volleyball is a LOT more popular than basketball among women. I don't know why, its just how it works out there.



ClayK wrote:
I do sense a shift in interest in the league, but such things happen and it isn't necessarily about the sport as a whole but rather the specific circumstances of the specific year.

That said, my biggest concern is the hollowing out of the talent pool at the lower levels due to rising participation in volleyball, water polo and to a lesser extent, lacrosse. What makes the games attractive are the players, and if elite athletes are choosing other sports instead of basketball, then there will be fewer stars that catch fans' eyes.

As for Wiggins, I don't know that what she said is any different than what's been said for years about the league being heavily lesbian -- which is true -- and the counter to that is that there is a growing societal acceptance of LGBT activities.

But assuming the talent keeps flowing, my guess would be this is a normal dip that most businesses go through at one point or another, not a symptom of a fatal disease.


tfan



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 3:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I don't know if this was posted by I was just doing a search for Lisa Borders and found this article that I haven't seen:

Borders promises expansion, but wants league stability first

Quote:
“What I’ve always said is, when we have full arenas in all 12 markets, or attendance is increasing, then we will look at expansion,” she said.


That only makes sense to me if you look at the TV contract having to get divided up amongst the teams - more teams mean existing teams get less. But otherwise, attendance in Atlanta won't affect attendance in San Francisco. ESPN would probably like expansion as I would expect more teams to increase TV ratings.

40% of the twitter views of the games are from outside the US: The idea for twitter broadcasts came from Jewell Loyd.

Quote:
Of that audience — which has averaged around 950,000 for the first four games this season — approximately 40 percent of viewers were outside the United States
.




Last edited by tfan on 06/28/17 4:10 pm; edited 1 time in total
josephkramer44



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 3:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

More hot air from Borders. Unless things change there just doesn't seem to be a profit in organizing and owning a WNBA team. Even for an NBA team that is extra work and man hours for what is not a lot of extra profit (even in the best of years). Now is profit the ONLY reason to operate a sports team? No, but it HAS TO BE A CONSIDERATION.
I am not sure if it would make any difference in ratings (which are basically a rounding error) but that would require TV money to be split up more than it is now, which could be harmful to the less well positioned teams. And with ESPN's current troubles mounting (and fast) you can be assured they won't give another penny for WNBA games. Once again I think the WNBA's main troubles stem from extremely faulty marketing and an insane glut on the sports entertainment market (there are only so many hours one can watch sports during the day).


MuneravenMN
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PostPosted: 06/28/17 4:37 pm    ::: Bad League Management and Bad Team Management Reply Reply with quote

Caveat: Soccer is a different beast. BUT...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/soccer-insider/wp/2017/06/24/portland-thorns-fan-support-is-unlike-anything-else-in-womens-soccer/?utm_term=.252b13044f33

So why is women's soccer in Portland attracting big crowds of rabid fans while the WNBA can't even sustain the interest of people who want to be rabid fans?

I think this league has taken a whole series of wrong turns. I think they get almost everything wrong, from how they promote the league ("Hey look we work out!") to the amateur hour draft coverage. I think they often play in too-large venues and too often have lousy play-by-play and color on TV. I think the uniforms are dull. I think most teams have really clever in-arena promos but nobody ever sees them unless they go to the game! Use them to PROMOTE the players and the team!

I think the WNBA looks drab and boring to most people. Where is the creativity in promoting this sport? And why isn't the league trying to promote FAN solidarity and activities? They don't even try. Sigh.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 4:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The Thorns are in a league of their own. The NWSL is basically being held up by the three MLS-owned teams(Portland, Orlando & Houston). The non-MLS owned teams in the NWSL are averaging between 4,200-2,200 only. With that being said, it was once rumored that the Timbers/Thorns were interested in the WNBA and bringing back the Portland Fire. I would love it if this were to be true.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 4:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

In regards to expansion, I think Borders is closely watching Dallas & Atlanta and their ownership. If those two can get stable, we'll see expansion. Otherwise, I think Joe Lacob is on hold in case either the Wings or Dream owners pull the plug.



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Admiral_Needa



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 5:13 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Quote:
“That global footprint is being amplified by what we’re doing on all the platforms, but specifically Twitter.”

That suggestion, she said, came from a conversation with Storm guard Jewell Loyd.

I didn’t even know that was an option on Twitter,” she said. “She’s young, I don’t know everything about these things. I listen to our players. So, I brought that back to the attorneys at the league, and 56 days later, we had a Twitter deal.”




Quote:
Idea Arrow
NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE AND TWITTER ANNOUNCE STREAMING PARTNERSHIP FOR THURSDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL

Twitter to stream 10 Thursday Night Football games globally
Posted Apr 5, 2016


Twitter’s global head of sports partnerships Laura Froelich said that the live streaming deal with the NFL went “incredibly well,” noting increases in viewership each week and positive comments from fans.

Average viewership for the eight remaining games ranged from 2.6 million to 3.1 million

https://nflcommunications.com/Pages/National-Football-League-and-Twitter-Announce-Streaming-Partnership-for-Thursday-Night-Football.aspx
https://www.geekwire.com/2017/twitter-says-live-streaming-nfl-games-went-incredibly-well-no-word-deal-next-season/



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Admiral_Needa



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 5:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
In regards to expansion, I think Borders is closely watching Dallas & Atlanta and their ownership. If those two can get stable, we'll see expansion. Otherwise, I think Joe Lacob is on hold in case either the Wings or Dream owners pull the plug.




Or, to put it another way, Lacob is holding out until the Wings or Dream owners pull the plug.. I'm not a fan of an expansion draft either... Idea



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Shades



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 5:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I haven't seen any indication of the Wings going under. Where is that coming from? I'm surprised ATL hasn't gone under for a while now, but they're still around. Must be dedicated owners.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 5:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
I haven't seen any indication of the Wings going under. Where is that coming from?


Team was moved by one of the Tulsa majority owners. Attendance is poor after the move and the team President got the boot in less than a year on the job. They moved partly for more corporate sponsors and that may be the case, but one thing for sure is that they had a jersey sponsor in Tulsa, but don't have one in Dallas.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 6:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
I haven't seen any indication of the Wings going under. Where is that coming from? I'm surprised ATL hasn't gone under for a while now, but they're still around. Must be dedicated owners.


A Few delusional posters on here using attendance in only there 2nd season as the benchmark for failed franchise already Rolling Eyes



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 06/29/17 2:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Quote:
the WNBA's main troubles stem from extremely faulty marketing


Quote:
I think they get almost everything wrong, from how they promote the league


So what should the league be doing?

My sense is that the vast majority of potential fans of the WNBA have been exposed to the product on TV, so it's not as if marketing will reach an untapped source of supporters.

And in the end, it's the product itself that attracts customers/viewers, not a clever advertising campaign. If the previous marketing has exposed the potential customer base to the product, then what else can be done except to improve the product?

And the best way to improve this particular product, in my view, is to raise the quality of play. That will not happen if expansion dilutes the existing talent, and in fact contraction would probably be the best path to an improved product. (That same argument has been used in MLB and NFL and the NBA when there are complaints about the quality of play.)

On the other hand, the WNBA is strongest in markets where it has a franchise. Without a franchise in the Bay Area, for example, the league is all but invisible. When one arrives in 2019 or 2020, most likely an Atlanta relocation if attendance is any guide, all of a sudden folks will know about.

From that perspective, expansion would help the league, but at what point would diluting the talent base make the product on the floor less attractive?



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/29/17 3:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
Quote:
the WNBA's main troubles stem from extremely faulty marketing


Quote:
I think they get almost everything wrong, from how they promote the league


So what should the league be doing?

My sense is that the vast majority of potential fans of the WNBA have been exposed to the product on TV, so it's not as if marketing will reach an untapped source of supporters.

And in the end, it's the product itself that attracts customers/viewers, not a clever advertising campaign. If the previous marketing has exposed the potential customer base to the product, then what else can be done except to improve the product?

And the best way to improve this particular product, in my view, is to raise the quality of play. That will not happen if expansion dilutes the existing talent, and in fact contraction would probably be the best path to an improved product. (That same argument has been used in MLB and NFL and the NBA when there are complaints about the quality of play.)

On the other hand, the WNBA is strongest in markets where it has a franchise. Without a franchise in the Bay Area, for example, the league is all but invisible. When one arrives in 2019 or 2020, most likely an Atlanta relocation if attendance is any guide, all of a sudden folks will know about.

From that perspective, expansion would help the league, but at what point would diluting the talent base make the product on the floor less attractive?


Do you have an opinion on why attendance and ratings are lower than they were a decade or more ago?


ClayK



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PostPosted: 06/29/17 5:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

First, I question the attendance numbers. I think the league has cleaned up a lot of that in the last few years. And there were also a lot more freebies given out at different times in the league's history, or $1 tickets given to supermarket chains.

As for the ratings, what are the numbers exactly? I don't think I've seen a year-by-year tracking of ESPN and NBA-TV ratings. I would say this year is down just because it's one of those years, but if ratings are 10% down, game to game, from 10 years ago, that's a different story. (If they're 5% down, that's within the margin of error ...)



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/29/17 5:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
First, I question the attendance numbers. I think the league has cleaned up a lot of that in the last few years. And there were also a lot more freebies given out at different times in the league's history, or $1 tickets given to supermarket chains.

As for the ratings, what are the numbers exactly? I don't think I've seen a year-by-year tracking of ESPN and NBA-TV ratings. I would say this year is down just because it's one of those years, but if ratings are 10% down, game to game, from 10 years ago, that's a different story. (If they're 5% down, that's within the margin of error ...)





2014 was an average of 240,000 for 19 games. 2015 was an average of 202,000 for 10 ESPN2 and 1 ESPN games. I don't see any articles giving the regular season ratings for 2016. I think there was a thread here last year where someone published the 2016 ratings.


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