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Rock Hard



Joined: 02 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: 06/08/17 7:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
sigur3 wrote:
Sloot officially leaves.

Sky sign Shayla Cooper.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So they re-signed the player that they previously cut a week before it was necessary? That makes total sense and Amber Stocks clearly knows exactly what she's doing.


You have to appreciate the end game here. The purpose of the 2017 season is to tank for the 2018 lottery. That is how Stocks got the job. During the interview process Alter told the candidates that they had to tank this season. None of the experienced coaches wanted anything to do with a tank job. Stocks was the only that said yes she would tank. Alter hired her on the spot. Twisted Evil



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/08/17 7:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

You tank to acquire and improve your young talent for the future. If that was the case, you don't screw up the #9 pick, or ignore Copper in favour of older players, or give Cappie all the PG minutes while Epps twiddles her thumbs on the bench. If this is an intentional tank job, the only part of it they're doing well is the losing. There are meant to be other positives to seasons where winning isn't a priority.

(and yes, I'm aware you were mostly tongue-in-cheek. But this is a shambles, whatever angle you come at it from)



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sigur3



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PostPosted: 06/08/17 7:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
You tank to acquire and improve your young talent for the future. If that was the case, you don't screw up the #9 pick, or ignore Copper in favour of older players, or give Cappie all the PG minutes while Epps twiddles her thumbs on the bench. If this is an intentional tank job, the only part of it they're doing well is the losing. There are meant to be other positives to seasons where winning isn't a priority.


Yes, to all of this. They're still in win-now mode, yet have been the second-worst team in the league. That's all you need to know about the job Stocks has done so far.

And this tanking thing is fun and all, but I'm secretly preparing myself for her doing something stupid with the eventual lottery pick. Anyone want to talk me off that ledge?


lynxmania



Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: 06/08/17 8:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

sigur3 wrote:
Richyyy wrote:
You tank to acquire and improve your young talent for the future. If that was the case, you don't screw up the #9 pick, or ignore Copper in favour of older players, or give Cappie all the PG minutes while Epps twiddles her thumbs on the bench. If this is an intentional tank job, the only part of it they're doing well is the losing. There are meant to be other positives to seasons where winning isn't a priority.


Yes, to all of this. They're still in win-now mode, yet have been the second-worst team in the league. That's all you need to know about the job Stocks has done so far.

And this tanking thing is fun and all, but I'm secretly preparing myself for her doing something stupid with the eventual lottery pick. Anyone want to talk me off that ledge?


Just become a full time Fever fan instead of a part time one? Laughing


Randy



Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 06/08/17 8:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

That would push me off the ledge for sure. The Fever have totally botched in the last few years getting rid of Zealous, Clarendon, Howard and Kizer and their No. 1 draft pick. It makes little sense for them to try to maintain their win now attitude when the team is growing old and tired before their eyes. If any team should be rebuilding it is the Fever.


Rock Hard



Joined: 02 Aug 2010
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PostPosted: 06/09/17 8:07 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I know what the Sky should do. They should fire Stocks right now and hire coach S. Key.



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mavcarter
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PostPosted: 06/09/17 10:06 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Rock Hard wrote:
I know what the Sky should do. They should fire Stocks right now and hire coach S. Key.


It's a shame that Steven Key would be a more sensible option than Stocks.



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Randy



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 11:31 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job. Maybe no one else wanted it. Or maybe this hire was a cost cutting move along the lines of the Mystics and Trudy Lacy.


myrtle



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 12:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
Rock Hard wrote:
I know what the Sky should do. They should fire Stocks right now and hire coach S. Key.


It's a shame that Steven Key would be a more sensible option than Stocks.

Shocked move forward, not backward.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 1:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote




tfan



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 1:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job. Maybe no one else wanted it. Or maybe this hire was a cost cutting move along the lines of the Mystics and Trudy Lacy.


Lacy and Stocks may have worked for lower salaries, but the Mystics probably cut more costs by eliminating the GM position from that point on, while Chicago has never had a separate GM position.

I think the Golden State Warriors have glamorized hiring inexperienced coaches with their two recent hires. Mark Jackson had never been a coach, and they had a big improvement during his tenure. Then they hired Steve Kerr, who had never been a coach, and they became the best team in the league. But the GM probably deserves most of the credit.


pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 06/09/17 1:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job.


Every head coach has to be a first timer at some point. Having a long tenure as an assistant is no guarantee of success, as the Tulsa fans who lived through Gary Kloppenburg can attest. I wouldn't write off a coach after eight games. Cheryl Reeve started 2-9 in her first season in Minnesota, with plenty of Lynx fans calling for her head. Sandy Brondello's tenure as San Antonio head coach was an unmitigated disaster. They both turned out OK.



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Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 1:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Absolutely, coaches have a learning curve as well. For Chicago's sake I hope Stocks is learning on the job and improving. It's certainly possible.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 1:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job.


Every head coach has to be a first timer at some point. Having a long tenure as an assistant is no guarantee of success, as the Tulsa fans who lived through Gary Kloppenburg can attest. I wouldn't write off a coach after eight games. Cheryl Reeve started 2-9 in her first season in Minnesota, with plenty of Lynx fans calling for her head. Sandy Brondello's tenure as San Antonio head coach was an unmitigated disaster. They both turned out OK.


I think it just goes to show that it's the players that really determine most of the results. You put Stocks in at Minnesota and she'd be "Coach of the Week". Give Reeve the talent that Tulsa had during Kloppenberg's tenure and she would not still be there and lionized.


Richyyy



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 2:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
pilight wrote:
Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job.


Every head coach has to be a first timer at some point. Having a long tenure as an assistant is no guarantee of success, as the Tulsa fans who lived through Gary Kloppenburg can attest. I wouldn't write off a coach after eight games. Cheryl Reeve started 2-9 in her first season in Minnesota, with plenty of Lynx fans calling for her head. Sandy Brondello's tenure as San Antonio head coach was an unmitigated disaster. They both turned out OK.


I think it just goes to show that it's the players that really determine most of the results. You put Stocks in at Minnesota and she'd be "Coach of the Week". Give Reeve the talent that Tulsa had during Kloppenberg's tenure and she would not still be there and lionized.

I think most coaches will happily tell you that having talented players is the primary factor in winning. But that doesn't mean that one coach isn't better than another (although different coaches thrive in different situations - some maximise super-talented groups, some can get weak rosters to come together and be average, some do well in practice s but can't in-game manage to save their lives etc.)

I continue to be impressed with how Minnesota evolve their offense. The obvious element this year is the amount they're focussing on feeding Fowles and the things they've put in place to make that work. But they also run what look like sets they've run for years - then twist into something different. They haven't stood still and let other teams catch up to them. If Reeve took over San Antonio, would they still suck? Probably. But she's still doing a damn good job in Minnesota.



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pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 06/09/17 2:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
pilight wrote:
Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job.


Every head coach has to be a first timer at some point. Having a long tenure as an assistant is no guarantee of success, as the Tulsa fans who lived through Gary Kloppenburg can attest. I wouldn't write off a coach after eight games. Cheryl Reeve started 2-9 in her first season in Minnesota, with plenty of Lynx fans calling for her head. Sandy Brondello's tenure as San Antonio head coach was an unmitigated disaster. They both turned out OK.


I think it just goes to show that it's the players that really determine most of the results. You put Stocks in at Minnesota and she'd be "Coach of the Week". Give Reeve the talent that Tulsa had during Kloppenberg's tenure and she would not still be there and lionized.


A good coach can make a difference. How many years did the Sparks have Parker, Ogwumike, Lavender, Toliver, etc. without getting anywhere? All the talk was about their misaligned talent and how they couldn't get out of each other's way. Bring in Brian Agler and they are champions. OTOH, if you don't have the horses it doesn't matter how good you are with the whip. Agler couldn't win in Minnesota when he had Katie Smith and not much else.



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Rock Hard



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 2:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
mavcarter wrote:
Rock Hard wrote:
I know what the Sky should do. They should fire Stocks right now and hire coach S. Key.


It's a shame that Steven Key would be a more sensible option than Stocks.

Shocked move forward, not backward.


The Liberty fired and hired Big Bill. Wink



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tfan



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PostPosted: 06/09/17 2:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
tfan wrote:
pilight wrote:
Randy wrote:
It was a very strange hiring of a person with limited experience for a big job.


Every head coach has to be a first timer at some point. Having a long tenure as an assistant is no guarantee of success, as the Tulsa fans who lived through Gary Kloppenburg can attest. I wouldn't write off a coach after eight games. Cheryl Reeve started 2-9 in her first season in Minnesota, with plenty of Lynx fans calling for her head. Sandy Brondello's tenure as San Antonio head coach was an unmitigated disaster. They both turned out OK.


I think it just goes to show that it's the players that really determine most of the results. You put Stocks in at Minnesota and she'd be "Coach of the Week". Give Reeve the talent that Tulsa had during Kloppenberg's tenure and she would not still be there and lionized.


A good coach can make a difference. How many years did the Sparks have Parker, Ogwumike, Lavender, Toliver, etc. without getting anywhere? All the talk was about their misaligned talent and how they couldn't get out of each other's way. Bring in Brian Agler and they are champions. OTOH, if you don't have the horses it doesn't matter how good you are with the whip. Agler couldn't win in Minnesota when he had Katie Smith and not much else.


Sure, coaches can make a difference. When I say that players are most of the formula I am not removing coaches from the equation.

Agler had a similar result to Carol Ross in 2015 - lost in the Conference Semi-Finals (Ross also got to the Western Conference finals one year). In 2016 Agler got two players that Carol Ross never had - Essence Carson starting at the 3 and Chelsea Gray backing up at point guard. Gray seemed to save their butts a time or two against Minnesota. Take those two away and Agler could have had "lost in the conference semi-finals" results again (although the playoff format changed).


tfan



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PostPosted: 06/19/17 7:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

This Crazy World of Basketball



bullsky



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 10:26 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

http://www.thestate.com/sports/college/university-of-south-carolina/usc-womens-basketball/article158298004.html

So it appears that Coates won't play this season. Not a huge shocker. I know many have mentioned she could hold out and re-enter 2018. Personally, I'm not sure why on Earth one would do that, but anyways. If the Sky do stay near the bottom of the standings, would it be smart for them to sign Coates so that she can't hold out? I know it would be a useless signing but at some point, keep Coates' rights trumps keeping Harris, who will be gone next season anyways.

Thoughts?



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 10:33 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

or sign & trade her. Coates to Dallas for A. Powers?



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 10:38 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

bullsky wrote:
http://www.thestate.com/sports/college/university-of-south-carolina/usc-womens-basketball/article158298004.html

So it appears that Coates won't play this season. Not a huge shocker. I know many have mentioned she could hold out and re-enter 2018. Personally, I'm not sure why on Earth one would do that, but anyways. If the Sky do stay near the bottom of the standings, would it be smart for them to sign Coates so that she can't hold out? I know it would be a useless signing but at some point, keep Coates' rights trumps keeping Harris, who will be gone next season anyways.

Thoughts?


Does the player have to consent to the signing ?



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 10:40 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
or sign & trade her. Coates to Dallas for A. Powers?


Powers is not being traded for Coates , not happening . Kaela Davis for Coates would probably be the most you would get from us . Give up a player who has proven that she can play at this level for a player who hasnt even played one game seems kind of dumb. Contrary to the belief about the wings organization btw.



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bullsky



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 10:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It makes no sense for the Sky to trade a player who hasn't played yet after taking her at the #2.

I'm simply asking if we can sign her.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 06/28/17 11:08 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

bullsky wrote:
It makes no sense for the Sky to trade a player who hasn't played yet after taking her at the #2.

I'm simply asking if we can sign her.


Quote:
Coates’ professional career is on hold, which probably means she won’t play in the current WNBA season, but it shouldn’t be long before she’s back on the court.

Staley said Coates is probably out for this season, which matches what Chicago Sky coach Amber Stock told The State in May. The Sky knew all along the injury may be severe enough that Coates would miss the entire year, but were clearly comfortable going forward, gambling that one year would pay off in a long career.

Staley said Coates is planning to play overseas in the fall.

The 6-foot-4 center still carried a sizable strawberry on her right ankle as she limped through the basketball offices, but the limp is actually a good thing, Staley said. Coates no longer needs a boot or crutch to get around.


If she's playing overseas, she can't reenter the draft, so they can wait until February to sign her. It's a little bit of a gamble if she changes her mind about playing overseas. Any reason why she wouldn't want to go to Chicago? Looks like they could use her from the looks of Boyette's disappointing season.



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