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ClayK



Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: 10/05/16 11:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

If Shoni Schimmel doesn't start, or at least play lots of minutes and play well, her impact on ticket sales will be negligible at best. Stephanie White was supposed to pack the place in Indiana but it didn't happen because she didn't play.

And I remain skeptical that Schimmel, even as a starter, will deliver thousands of ticketbuyers over the course of the season. There is no precedent in the 20-year history of the league -- or in the NBA -- for a player selling lots of tickets on a consistent basis due to ethnic background. Even Jeremy Lin was only briefly a boost to attendance; Michael Jordan and LeBron elevated attendance because of their ability.

The only reason I would want Schimmel on my team would be that I thought she would help me win -- as the only proven way to sell more tickets in the WNBA is to win more games.



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dtsnms



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PostPosted: 10/05/16 12:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
If Shoni Schimmel doesn't start, or at least play lots of minutes and play well, her impact on ticket sales will be negligible at best. Stephanie White was supposed to pack the place in Indiana but it didn't happen because she didn't play.

And I remain skeptical that Schimmel, even as a starter, will deliver thousands of ticketbuyers over the course of the season. There is no precedent in the 20-year history of the league -- or in the NBA -- for a player selling lots of tickets on a consistent basis due to ethnic background. Even Jeremy Lin was only briefly a boost to attendance; Michael Jordan and LeBron elevated attendance because of their ability.

The only reason I would want Schimmel on my team would be that I thought she would help me win -- as the only proven way to sell more tickets in the WNBA is to win more games.


x________________________________


Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: 10/05/16 3:14 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
Clark is a nice player but she could not stay with Angel in the one and done game at all, and her size was exposed against the bigger, more athletic Angel. I respect her D, and understand that maybe nobody can guard Angel when she's playing that way, but not sure why she would even be considered that much of an upgrade over what we have. She might not even be an upgrade. She's 5'10 just like Zellous. She's a better 3 ball shooter, but Z creates her own shot better, so...

That's not what we need. If we are going to compete for a championship, we need size and scoring on the wing. I certainly wouldn't trade Zahui for her. I'd rather roll the dice on Allen developing enough to be more of a factor next year.


With the way Angel was playing no one was going to stop her. That is not a knock on Clark

And Schimmel for O'Hea is not even trade IMO. Storm dont need another overweight player who cant guard anyone to save her life. We have KML for that



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NYL_WNBA_FAN



Joined: 28 May 2007
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PostPosted: 10/05/16 5:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I hear ya. I didn't mean it as a knock on Clark so much as the way the Libs are built I think they need a steady presence 6'1" or better to match up to the elite 6'0" or better wing players. To contend to win a title, I think that's a must.

I didn't propose the SS for O'Hea deal. But not too sure how I feel about it from either side honestly. The Libs already have Allen so O'Hea seems redundant without the upside. Shoni is an unknown as far as understanding what it takes to prepare in an offseason, so it remains to be seen if she has any value to anyone, period.



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J-Spoon



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PostPosted: 10/07/16 12:01 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

J-Spoon wrote:
The more realistic option.

Re-sign Sugar.
Start Prince and Rodgers.
Bring back Bulgak.
We currently do not have a 1st round pick.
Schimmel and 2nd round pick fight for last spot.

Prince/Boyd
Rodgers/Wright/Schimmel
Zellous/Allen
Charles/Stokes/Bulgak
Swords/Zahui B.

I really like this team. I really enjoy rooting for this team.

We could move forward on internal growth specifically Stokes, Zahui B., Boyd, Allen, Schimmel and Bulgak, can all be better than last year, and Prince can be heathy again that will keep us in the mix. I'm just not sure this is enough to be better than a top 4 team, and I'm not sure we can jump ahead of the teams above us.


So this is the basic question, can the team above compete for a championship in 2017?

If the answer is yes, with decent internal growth and a little bit of luck I'm all for it.

If the answer is no there isn't enough talent or star talent to get past the top teams what do you think we should do? (Feel free to get creative.)


NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 10/08/16 9:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The big thing I take from where we are is that I trust the organization to make the right basketball decisions. Once Stokes and Wright were injured, Laimbeer described the team as a "very different team". I think there's an acute understanding on his and the organization's part on how to get the pieces to properly fit together in order to have a championship team.

In the facebook post the team put out reflecting on 2016, Sugar was talking as if she expects to be on the team in 2017. That doesn't HAVE to mean anything, but it could mean something. I think Allen is going to be the player most closely evaluated by the organization heading into 2017 with Boyd a close second. One of those positions is going to see a drastic change, because with Piph's return that's what probably has to happen. I think the team can win with a Piph/Rodgers backcourt as long as the 3 spot gives you size, defense and some rebounding. They've done well with Wright at the point so I think we know that they really don't need a pure point guard for the offense to run. However, that would necessitate a move of Wright from the starting lineup which still makes the team different defensively. Not sure that would be a part of Bill's thinking. Regarding Allen on the plus side, 5.7 points over 13.3 minutes is actually pretty impressive. Pro rated that would be 11.4 points over 26.6 minutes, not bad productivity at all. However, that was attained largely by shooting .567 from 3, a percentage that will simply not be matched playing more minutes. She shot much worse from 2 point distance, in my opinion a by-product of having almost no counter moves for tight defense. Her 2 point shot almost always consists of one or two dribbles going left followed by a 15-18 footer. She needs more versatility in her game going to the basket. Which oddly enough she seemed to do more at first and less as the season went on. She has the skill to take the ball to the rim. She just needs the willingness. That willingness is what would make her a consistent scorer each night. So it's a waiting game.

But I guess we will know in about 8 months. *Sigh*.



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Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 10/08/16 10:57 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'd like to raise something that hasn't been mentioned much here. We don't know for sure who will be running or coaching the New York Liberty in 2017.

1. Will sexual harasser Isiah Thomas be back as president of the team? I continue to believe that if the Knicks get off to a bad start--which I view as quite possible--then Jimmy Dolan will push out Phil Jackson and install his buddy Isiah as head of the Knicks.

2. Will Kristin Bernert be back as Senior Vice President of Business and Basketball Operations? (That seems to be her title.) The answer to that could depend on the answer to #1.

3. Will Bill Laimbeer be back as coach? The answer to that could depend on the answers to #1 and #2.

4. Will Katie Smith be back as associate head coach? Will she get a head coaching job elsewhere? (Or for the Liberty?)

I have no information on any of these questions. Could be that all of them will be back, or all but Katie Smith. But I don't take it as a guarantee that things will stay as they are. Never forget that the guy at the top is Jimmy Dolan. Would anyone trust Jimmy to make a good decision about anything?



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 10/09/16 3:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I wouldn't, but the WNBA operation has largely been left alone when it has done fairly well. He loves Isiah and has never fired a coach or GM after back to back 20 win seasons. If it hasn't been a trend prior I don't think it would be likely to start now.

Of course, there is that possibility Isiah could rejoin the Knicks. Hopefully they've added enough talent where they become a 50-win team or so. I think anything between 35 and 50 wins is possible with a bunch of new players who've had injuries.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 10/12/16 12:21 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

http://www.gophersports.com/sports/w-baskbl/spec-rel/101116aac.html

Quote:
[Zahui] is playing for Nadezhda Orenburg in Russia.

Last year, the team advanced to the EuroLeague finals. Zahui B. and Nadezha Orenburg got off to a 3-0 start in Russia-PBL play this fall. Zahui B. recently scored 16 points and tallied six rebounds in 20 minutes in a victory.


Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 10/14/16 6:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Excellent radio session as Swin Cash and Tina Charles discuss sports activism on social and political issues on Brian Lehrer's show, WNYC in New York. Runs about 33 minutes. High point for me: at about the 18:45 mark, Tina Charles takes a lovely swipe at a hideous presidential candidate with a remark about "locker room talk."

http://www.wnyc.org/story/wnba-new-york-liberty-players-talk-sports-activism/



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 10/20/16 9:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'm happy to see Essence Carson win a WNBA championship. She started off so well in 2013, then had that terrible knee injury, and it's surely been a long, painful road since then.



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 10/20/16 9:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
I'm happy to see Essence Carson win a WNBA championship. She started off so well in 2013, then had that terrible knee injury, and it's surely been a long, painful road since then.


yeah, she is a quality human being!



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Queenie



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PostPosted: 10/20/16 9:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
I'm happy to see Essence Carson win a WNBA championship. She started off so well in 2013, then had that terrible knee injury, and it's surely been a long, painful road since then.


yeah, she is a quality human being!


X______

Great person, great person to have on a team. I don't think she would have replicated this in New York, and I'm happy that she was able to get back into her groove.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 10/20/16 9:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
I'm happy to see Essence Carson win a WNBA championship. She started off so well in 2013, then had that terrible knee injury, and it's surely been a long, painful road since then.


X______________



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Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 10/20/16 9:50 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Great to see others sharing my happiness for Essence Carson. I share all the tributes to her.



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
toad455



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PostPosted: 10/26/16 11:17 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.



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UofDel_Alum



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PostPosted: 10/26/16 2:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.


I wish someone in Chicago would explain to me why she was let go. POKEY?


Youth Coach



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PostPosted: 10/26/16 5:21 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.


My favorite player on the team. Former BC Eagle, saw her play a few times there and got to talk to her the year she was out of the league for the knee injury. Just an amazing woman.
toad455



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PostPosted: 10/26/16 6:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

UofDel_Alum wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.


I wish someone in Chicago would explain to me why she was let go. POKEY?


She injured her knee prior to training camps in 2014 and was cut by the Sky. Her injury forced her to miss all of 2014.



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Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 10/26/16 8:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Youth Coach wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.


My favorite player on the team. Former BC Eagle, saw her play a few times there and got to talk to her the year she was out of the league for the knee injury. Just an amazing woman.


Carolyn Swords has been a valuable player for the Liberty. In addition, I greatly admire Swords for speaking out with Tina Charles, Swin Cash, Tanisha Wright, and Kiah Stokes at the press conference after the July 10th game at the Garden where Liberty players wore black T-shirts saying "Black Lives Matter" and "Dallas 5."



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
UofDel_Alum



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PostPosted: 10/27/16 7:06 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
UofDel_Alum wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Swords' 2016 season in review:

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-carolyn-swords/

I've always liked how Swords' helps Charles' game and having her play mostly at PF.


I wish someone in Chicago would explain to me why she was let go. POKEY?


She injured her knee prior to training camps in 2014 and was cut by the Sky. Her injury forced her to miss all of 2014.


I understand those issues took place toad455 but I thought Pokey could of signed her for the 2015 season.


Shades



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PostPosted: 10/27/16 1:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Zahui vs EWill (on same team overseas) latest game results
Zahui : 18 Pts, 11 Reb, 2 Ast, 2 Blk
EWill : 10 Pts, 4 Reb, 2 Ast, 1 Stl, 1 Blk



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PostPosted: 11/03/16 12:50 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 11/13/16 10:42 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

And the Knicks remain a poor defensive team. Looking at their talent, that's not that likely to significantly improve either. Melo is a poor team defender. Rose's explosiveness is a fraction of what it once was. Porzingis is an emerging offense player but not a good defender. If your 3 best players don't defend, you aren't going to win no matter how much they do on the other end of the floor. Adding Lee and Noah, who's seemingly lost a step himself from what I've seen, isn't enough.



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NYL_WNBA_FAN



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PostPosted: 11/13/16 10:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Zahui is performing well overseas. But lots of so-so WNBA post players do the same thing. Hopefully it's the type of performance that enables her to build on her skills when she returns to the U.S. At some point I have to settle in to watch some of her games.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 11/13/16 11:19 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

We could also swap FA if we need to dump Zellous in favor of a SF. we're already overstocked with SGs.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 11/13/16 12:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
Zahui is performing well overseas. But lots of so-so WNBA post players do the same thing. Hopefully it's the type of performance that enables her to build on her skills when she returns to the U.S. At some point I have to settle in to watch some of her games.


Laimbeer has said multiple times her biggest weakness is her confidence. He knows the talent is there, she just needs more confidence on the court.



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cappa23MVP



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PostPosted: 11/16/16 5:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.


Zeke, has been there and done that...not interested in return. "I believe" Zeke will be preparing to become the next President of the U.S. Now that sexual harassment has become a prerequisite in applying for that position.

One man's harassment, is deemed locker room talk...and earns him a 4 year stay at the White House...and another, shouldn't have a job at MSG....LOL

WTF is wrong with this world. Isaiah Thomas should be the least of anyone's worries.



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PostPosted: 11/18/16 9:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.


Zeke, has been there and done that...not interested in return. "I believe" Zeke will be preparing to become the next President of the U.S. Now that sexual harassment has become a prerequisite in applying for that position.

One man's harassment, is deemed locker room talk...and earns him a 4 year stay at the White House...and another, shouldn't have a job at MSG....LOL

WTF is wrong with this world. Isaiah Thomas should be the least of anyone's worries.


Isiah Thomas is hardly at the top of my worries. But the hideous truth still remains: sexual harasser Isiah currently runs the New York Liberty.



_________________
Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.


Last edited by Bob Lamm on 11/19/16 1:30 am; edited 2 times in total
Jet Jaguar



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PostPosted: 11/19/16 12:41 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

If you guys want to comment on how you think the election went, there's an place on these boards called Area 51 for that. Otherwise let's stick to women's hoops.



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PostPosted: 11/19/16 1:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Jet Jaguar wrote:
If you guys want to comment on how you think the election went, there's an place on these boards called Area 51 for that. Otherwise let's stick to women's hoops.


I have deleted what I wrote about the election.



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
cappa23MVP



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PostPosted: 11/20/16 12:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.


Zeke, has been there and done that...not interested in return. "I believe" Zeke will be preparing to become the next President of the U.S. Now that sexual harassment has become a prerequisite in applying for that position.

One man's harassment, is deemed locker room talk...and earns him a 4 year stay at the White House...and another, shouldn't have a job at MSG....LOL

WTF is wrong with this world. Isaiah Thomas should be the least of anyone's worries.


Isiah Thomas is hardly at the top of my worries. But the hideous truth still remains: sexual harasser Isiah currently runs the New York Liberty.


Yes, Thomas is the President of the NY Liberty, and like so many other things in life, there isn't a darn thing any of us can do about it.

Quite frankly, the Liberty have done well with him at the helm. They have fallen short of the ultimate goal...but they are building something positive.

While I have no problem with calling a thing, a thing....just be consistent with it. I would expect you to label deadbeats as deadbeats....dui offenders as dui offenders...domestic violence abusers as domestic violence abusers...and you won't have to look very far, a few of those are playing in the W...So go ahead knock yourself out.

Enjoy the off season.



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Bob Lamm



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PostPosted: 11/20/16 12:37 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.


Zeke, has been there and done that...not interested in return. "I believe" Zeke will be preparing to become the next President of the U.S. Now that sexual harassment has become a prerequisite in applying for that position.

One man's harassment, is deemed locker room talk...and earns him a 4 year stay at the White House...and another, shouldn't have a job at MSG....LOL

WTF is wrong with this world. Isaiah Thomas should be the least of anyone's worries.


Isiah Thomas is hardly at the top of my worries. But the hideous truth still remains: sexual harasser Isiah currently runs the New York Liberty.


Yes, Thomas is the President of the NY Liberty, and like so many other things in life, there isn't a darn thing any of us can do about it.

Quite frankly, the Liberty have done well with him at the helm. They have fallen short of the ultimate goal...but they are building something positive.

While I have no problem with calling a thing, a thing....just be consistent with it. I would expect you to label deadbeats as deadbeats....dui offenders as dui offenders...domestic violence abusers as domestic violence abusers...and you won't have to look very far, a few of those are playing in the W...So go ahead knock yourself out.

Enjoy the off season.


I will speak out when I choose on the issues I care about most. Everyone who posts here has that right.



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Let's remember Anucha Browne, who was sexually harassed by Isiah Thomas. In recent years, she has served as a vice president of the NCAA focusing on women's basketball championships.
cappa23MVP



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PostPosted: 11/20/16 1:44 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
cappa23MVP wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
Just want to update a prediction I made a while back. The Knicks are off to a terrible start. Only four games, granted, but they are 1-3 and their opponents have thus far averaged 110 points per game. Tonight at Madison Square Garden Houston scored 68 first-half points against the Knicks.

I believe that if the Knicks have a bad first half of the season, Phil Jackson will quit, will get pushed out, or will depart by mutual consent. And that the utter fool who owns the franchise, Jimmy Dolan, will bring in his BFF, sexual harasser Isiah Thomas, to run the Knicks. Which would at least get Isiah away from the Liberty and the WNBA.


Zeke, has been there and done that...not interested in return. "I believe" Zeke will be preparing to become the next President of the U.S. Now that sexual harassment has become a prerequisite in applying for that position.

One man's harassment, is deemed locker room talk...and earns him a 4 year stay at the White House...and another, shouldn't have a job at MSG....LOL

WTF is wrong with this world. Isaiah Thomas should be the least of anyone's worries.


Isiah Thomas is hardly at the top of my worries. But the hideous truth still remains: sexual harasser Isiah currently runs the New York Liberty.


Yes, Thomas is the President of the NY Liberty, and like so many other things in life, there isn't a darn thing any of us can do about it.

Quite frankly, the Liberty have done well with him at the helm. They have fallen short of the ultimate goal...but they are building something positive.

While I have no problem with calling a thing, a thing....just be consistent with it. I would expect you to label deadbeats as deadbeats....dui offenders as dui offenders...domestic violence abusers as domestic violence abusers...and you won't have to look very far, a few of those are playing in the W...So go ahead knock yourself out.

Enjoy the off season.


I will speak out when I choose on the issues I care about most. Everyone who posts here has that right.


Oh I wasn't questioning your right to do so, like you, I was merely "calling a thing, a thing"...in my Iyanla voice.

Enjoy the off season!



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PostPosted: 11/20/16 8:30 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Whether any of us likes it or not, Isiah Thomas may well have saved the existence of the New York Liberty. Two seasons ago Laimbeer wasn't even invited back at first, and there was talk of Dolan cutting bait. Without Isiah being instrumental in the rehiring of Laimbeer, we might be looking at a far different scenario than discussing whether or not the Libs have a chance to win it all in 2017.

That's not to ignore what Isiah might or might not have done in the past. I don't know all those facts one way or the other anyway. But I think it's crystal clear that without Isiah's input, we'd be looking at a much bleaker state of affairs within the Liberty organization. If we even had an organization at all.



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PostPosted: 11/20/16 9:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
That's not to ignore what Isiah might or might not have done in the past. I don't know all those facts one way or the other anyway. But I think it's crystal clear that without Isiah's input, we'd be looking at a much bleaker state of affairs within the Liberty organization. If we even had an organization at all.


I guess a long trial and a very strong ruling from a jury doesn't mean much to you. After all, you "don't know all those facts." From where I sit, you sure as hell ARE ignoring what Isiah did to Anucha Browne. Oh, I forgot: basketball is everything. Who cares about women being sexually harassed? Even when the victim is a sports executive working for Madison Square Garden.



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PostPosted: 11/21/16 12:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bob Lamm wrote:
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
That's not to ignore what Isiah might or might not have done in the past. I don't know all those facts one way or the other anyway. But I think it's crystal clear that without Isiah's input, we'd be looking at a much bleaker state of affairs within the Liberty organization. If we even had an organization at all.


I guess a long trial and a very strong ruling from a jury doesn't mean much to you. After all, you "don't know all those facts." From where I sit, you sure as hell ARE ignoring what Isiah did to Anucha Browne. Oh, I forgot: basketball is everything. Who cares about women being sexually harassed? Even when the victim is a sports executive working for Madison Square Garden.


Pretty much all of us, including NYL_WNBA_FAN, were pretty outraged and outspoken when Isiah's involvement with the Liberty was announced. That said, it's been two seasons and letting the fox into the hen house hasn't resulted in any dead hens. The fact is, the women on the team seem to accept him. I've seen him and T-Spoon do their sales pitch together, and they look pretty happy in each other's company. We've also heard players like Boyd talk about how much Isiah has helped them with their game. Who knows, maybe he actually learned his lesson. Maybe Isiah has truly reformed.

We give serious criminals a second chance when they come out of prison. Your choices as a society are to terminate their life, segregate them through banishment or continued imprisonment or give them a second chance. Obviously, what Isiah did isn't on that level. However, since all workplaces have women, do we drop an occupational death sentence on him? Giving someone a second chance doesn't mean you condone what they did in the past. It just means that we believe/hope people can change and be rehabilitated. You compartmentalize what they did and keep a watchful eye on them. They will always carry the stigma of past actions. Give them an opportunity to prove that they've changed, but be ready to slam the door at the first sign of trouble.

We've seen through the Black Lives Matter protest that the Liberty players are a group of strong women who aren't afraid of the repercussions of taking a stand. Maybe we should just trust them to stand up for themselves in this situation. Life is complicated. I don't think most of those Trump voters elected him because they approve of his inflammatory rhetoric or his past behavior. They voted for him because they hope he can bring their jobs back, and some are probably praying he won't be as bad as his rhetoric. Maybe it's just shit he said to get the extra yahoo vote to put him over the top. Strange and ugly bedfellows, but such are the compromises of life. Let's take a negative view and assume that Isiah hasn't really changed in his heart. However, he is now smart enough to keep his hands to himself and be quiet. In return, Isiah keeps the franchise alive. If Bernert, the female coaches, and the players can live with him -- which seems to be the case -- then so can I.

Now, back to my hiatus.


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PostPosted: 11/21/16 5:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

root_thing wrote:
Bob Lamm wrote:
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
That's not to ignore what Isiah might or might not have done in the past. I don't know all those facts one way or the other anyway. But I think it's crystal clear that without Isiah's input, we'd be looking at a much bleaker state of affairs within the Liberty organization. If we even had an organization at all.


I guess a long trial and a very strong ruling from a jury doesn't mean much to you. After all, you "don't know all those facts." From where I sit, you sure as hell ARE ignoring what Isiah did to Anucha Browne. Oh, I forgot: basketball is everything. Who cares about women being sexually harassed? Even when the victim is a sports executive working for Madison Square Garden.


Pretty much all of us, including NYL_WNBA_FAN, were pretty outraged and outspoken when Isiah's involvement with the Liberty was announced. That said, it's been two seasons and letting the fox into the hen house hasn't resulted in any dead hens. The fact is, the women on the team seem to accept him. I've seen him and T-Spoon do their sales pitch together, and they look pretty happy in each other's company. We've also heard players like Boyd talk about how much Isiah has helped them with their game. Who knows, maybe he actually learned his lesson. Maybe Isiah has truly reformed.

We give serious criminals a second chance when they come out of prison. Your choices as a society are to terminate their life, segregate them through banishment or continued imprisonment or give them a second chance. Obviously, what Isiah did isn't on that level. However, since all workplaces have women, do we drop an occupational death sentence on him? Giving someone a second chance doesn't mean you condone what they did in the past. It just means that we believe/hope people can change and be rehabilitated. You compartmentalize what they did and keep a watchful eye on them. They will always carry the stigma of past actions. Give them an opportunity to prove that they've changed, but be ready to slam the door at the first sign of trouble.

We've seen through the Black Lives Matter protest that the Liberty players are a group of strong women who aren't afraid of the repercussions of taking a stand. Maybe we should just trust them to stand up for themselves in this situation. Life is complicated. I don't think most of those Trump voters elected him because they approve of his inflammatory rhetoric or his past behavior. They voted for him because they hope he can bring their jobs back, and some are probably praying he won't be as bad as his rhetoric. Maybe it's just shit he said to get the extra yahoo vote to put him over the top. Strange and ugly bedfellows, but such are the compromises of life. Let's take a negative view and assume that Isiah hasn't really changed in his heart. However, he is now smart enough to keep his hands to himself and be quiet. In return, Isiah keeps the franchise alive. If Bernert, the female coaches, and the players can live with him -- which seems to be the case -- then so can I.

Now, back to my hiatus.


I agree with many of your statements here. I'd just suggest the following:

1. Is Isiah Thomas now "smart enough to keep his hands to himself and be quiet"? He has kept quiet lately. That's true. But upon taking his current job with the Liberty, he flagrantly lied about his harassment of Anucha Browne. I hope he never again sexually harasses any woman, inside or outside Madison Square Garden.

2. Let's take at face value everything the Liberty players have said about how Isiah has helped them. I have no reason to doubt that. But let's also remember all the other women working for Madison Square Garden, some of whom surely aren't in as strong a position to challenge Isiah as Anucha Browne was, as a player for the Liberty might be.

3. I don't believe in dropping "an occupational death sentence" on Isiah Thomas (or almost anyone). I have no problem with him getting 100 basketball jobs out there. But he should not be working in a high position in the very organization and the very building where he sexually harassed Anucha Browne.



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PostPosted: 11/23/16 8:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Just to be clear, I didn't believe that Isiah Thomas should be anywhere near the New York Liberty either, based on that verdict. But the facts are both that he is and he was instrumental in keeping the franchise alive.

I am thankful, however, that the Liberty have been sustained. And I also believe in second chances for people. The fact that he has done some good for a sport played by and largely supported by women has actually done some good for both the women who play for the Liberty and those who support them. There's gray areas to everything in life, like Root Thing said above. I agree with what he wrote.



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PostPosted: 11/28/16 8:38 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The main questions about the Liberty are...
1. Can Bill Laimbeer create the same championship winning culture in NY as he did in Detroit with the Shock?
2. Does he have the roster to do so? Tina Charles is a great player and a great post to have on your team but she doesn't have the toughness of past Shock post players (Ford, Pierson, Braxton). I find Charles is a bit soft. She's a great player to have on your team but she's not going to really elevate your team. She didn't really elevate the team when she was with the Sun, she just elevated her own personal stats which sometimes I think are more important to her. Prince returns next season but will she be as good? What about her overseas commitments? They always interfere with the WNBA.
3. Does he still have that swagger that carried over to his Shock players?
4. Is he still as good a coach now as he was back then?

I don't see NY as being as strong next year as they were this year. But then again, with the sad state of the Eastern Conference, who knows. Indiana will most likely be crap without Catchings to lead the way and it's unsure how chemistry will be with Chatman coaching (a certain player from Chicago, SF, said she'd rather sit out than play for her anymore, and another certain player, EDD, may or may not have been the reason she was fired), Washington won't be much better than they were this past season under Mike the Choke Thibault and his basically non-talented roster, he'll really need to be smart in the upcoming draft, Chicago has EDD and an aging Pondexter but they have an unknown new coach which will probably make them struggle early on in the season, perhaps the entire season. Atlanta is always a tough team and now they finally have some more good players around Angel (EWill, Clarendon) but the problem there seems to be Cooper no? The Sun should be better next year now that they've had a full season under Miller and the return of healthy players next year, but Miller's coaching had me scratching my head more than he had me amazed.


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PostPosted: 11/28/16 9:39 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ay Mate wrote:
The main questions about the Liberty are...
1. Can Bill Laimbeer create the same championship winning culture in NY as he did in Detroit with the Shock?
2. Does he have the roster to do so? Tina Charles is a great player and a great post to have on your team but she doesn't have the toughness of past Shock post players (Ford, Pierson, Braxton). I find Charles is a bit soft. She's a great player to have on your team but she's not going to really elevate your team. She didn't really elevate the team when she was with the Sun, she just elevated her own personal stats which sometimes I think are more important to her. Prince returns next season but will she be as good? What about her overseas commitments? They always interfere with the WNBA.
3. Does he still have that swagger that carried over to his Shock players?
4. Is he still as good a coach now as he was back then?

I don't see NY as being as strong next year as they were this year. But then again, with the sad state of the Eastern Conference, who knows. Indiana will most likely be crap without Catchings to lead the way and it's unsure how chemistry will be with Chatman coaching (a certain player from Chicago, SF, said she'd rather sit out than play for her anymore, and another certain player, EDD, may or may not have been the reason she was fired), Washington won't be much better than they were this past season under Mike the Choke Thibault and his basically non-talented roster, he'll really need to be smart in the upcoming draft, Chicago has EDD and an aging Pondexter but they have an unknown new coach which will probably make them struggle early on in the season, perhaps the entire season. Atlanta is always a tough team and now they finally have some more good players around Angel (EWill, Clarendon) but the problem there seems to be Cooper no? The Sun should be better next year now that they've had a full season under Miller and the return of healthy players next year, but Miller's coaching had me scratching my head more than he had me amazed.


As a Liberty fan, I have great respect for Tina Charles and Bill Laimbeer. I could write at greater length about both and every word would be positive. Is Tina Charles "a bit soft"? No way. Can she "elevate" our team? She already has.



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PostPosted: 11/28/16 8:55 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ay Mate wrote:

I don't see NY as being as strong next year as they were this year.


That's what I thought after 2015, and they proved me wrong. I don't see why they can't carry over their regular-season success with another 18+win season.

They're still not getting past any of the Western powerhouses in a series that goes beyond 1 game, though...but who is?



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PostPosted: 11/29/16 9:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

They won 21 games last year without Piph for two-thirds of the season and semi-effective for the final third. Not to mention having as few as seven healthy players down the stretch.

Any team is as good as its supporting cast. In my estimation, if you took Charles off of the Liberty, the only two players who you could sub for her and have them win 21 games would have been Maya or Parker. Obviously if you had Maya, part of the construct would have been different...probably no Zellous in free agency and possibly the addition of a post. But in terms of effect on a team, Maya and Parker are it.

Will their supporting cast be good enough? That's in flux. But one thing you have to figure they will have in 2017 for the first time is 3 big scorers. Whether that's with Piph and Rodgers (you aren't keeping Rodgers as a likely max free agent if she isn't starting) or a sign-and-trade involving whoever you get for Rodgers, we'll see.



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PostPosted: 11/29/16 11:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote


WNBA speak at Wapato HS for Native American Heritage Month


http://www.kapptv.com/article/2016/nov/29/wnba-stars-shoni-and-jude-schimmel-speak-wapato-hi/

Quote:

"Go out there and follow your dreams don't let anybody tell you that you can't do anything," said Shoni Schimmel.

Adding that even when you’ve reached your goal, continue to challenge yourself.

"you know for all of our lives we did nothing but pursue our dreams and I was a young kid saying to myself I want to do something and here I am doing it so you know you have to go out there," said Shoni Schimmel.

But most importantly never forget to give back to the people who gave to you and helped you get to where you wanted to be, once you’ve reached your goal.



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PostPosted: 11/30/16 8:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Piph ain't doing so well overseas. Only averaging 8 ppg, 2 rpg & 2.3 apg in 25 mpg. Hopefully Bill is looking for a SF this offseason.



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PostPosted: 12/01/16 8:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Are those well below her typical numbers overseas or just slightly below? Figure in May she will be about 17 months removed from her injury. I'm honestly not too concerned. She retained her hops and showed flashes of her change of pace ability in the playoff game. 17 months removed, and showing a strong maintenance of her ability in September, I feel good about where she will be by May.

On another note, I like the schedule a lot better from a personal standpoint. I'll be able to get to DC and to Connecticut. There's two weekday day games as opposed to 3 last year. The season starts early but ends in September rather than in mid-August as it did with an early start in 2014. The Liberty have no back-to-backs, so I am leaning toward the possibility that no team has any, but I'm not sure.

And we play Connecticut 4 times, which is a potential advantage. No disrespect to them, they have young and talented players. But they've lost Chiney to an injury that has potentially long-term ramifications and their mix of players wasn't so great either, though it did appear to improve when Bone was dealt. But still, that's better than having the extra game against an Indy team that dominated us for much of the last two seasons. Also 2 games at home vs. the two WNBA finalists. Definitely beats last year's schedule.



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PostPosted: 12/02/16 12:09 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

2016 Season in Review – Amanda Zahui B

http://liberty.wnba.com/news/2016-season-review-amanda-zahui-b/

Quote:
The No. 2 overall pick in 2015, Zahui B averaged 3.4 points and 2.4 rebounds per game as a rookie for Tulsa. New York saw a versatile post player with a rare skill set, as Zahui B consistently was able to show off her range, defensive timing, and ability to finish at the basket as she grew more and more comfortable in Bill Laimbeer’s system. New York parted with its 2017 1st Round Draft pick in the trade, a move that appears to have already paid dividends as Zahui B wasted no time becoming a difference maker.


Quote:
As she enters her 3rd year in the league, all eyes will be on her to see how those flashes throughout the 2016 season will be harbingers of what she will accomplish entering a familiar setting this time around.



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PostPosted: 12/02/16 8:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The three things I'm most worried about heading into the offseason is.

1.) Securing a capable starting SF.
2.) Developing Boyd into our starting PG.
3.) The health of Prince.



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PostPosted: 12/03/16 1:29 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
The three things I'm most worried about heading into the offseason is.

1.) Securing a capable starting SF.
2.) Developing Boyd into our starting PG.
3.) The health of Prince.

You should be VERY worried if this is the plan



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PostPosted: 12/03/16 1:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
The three things I'm most worried about heading into the offseason is.

1.) Securing a capable starting SF.
2.) Developing Boyd into our starting PG.
3.) The health of Prince.


Yes...Yes (tho I think we can get by with her splitting time with wright) Prince's health is paramount to 1 and 2...especially if we trade Rodgers to satisify 1...which likely would be the chip we have. Said it before If Bill couldn't trust Allen with a second of PT in the playoffs I don't think she's gonna fill the starting role for the level we want next year tho she could be the future there so if they want to bring in an aging veteran and platoon with Allen that is an option,...but don't think starting Z with Allen as the true 3 on the bench is...the days of 2s as starting 3s are over IMHO



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