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icey23
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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pilight
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 Posted: 02/08/05 6:44 pm ::: |
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Since every team has similar expenses, that strongly implies that a team can be profitable with no more than 7500 paying customers per game.
That begs the question of how the average team loses $1M per year while averaging ~8500 in attendance...
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Keegan
Joined: 17 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 02/08/05 6:56 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
Since every team has similar expenses, that strongly implies that a team can be profitable with no more than 7500 paying customers per game.
That begs the question of how the average team loses $1M per year while averaging ~8500 in attendance... |
Depends how much of that attendance is paid...
I don't take stated financial losses at face value; I think there's also a lot of bullshitting going on. There is legit poor financial management as well. |
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sambista
Joined: 25 Sep 2004
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MNfan22
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 02/08/05 7:30 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
Since every team has similar expenses, that strongly implies that a team can be profitable with no more than 7500 paying customers per game.
That begs the question of how the average team loses $1M per year while averaging ~8500 in attendance... |
Not sure I get what your saying here plight.
How many teams averaged 8500 in full price paid attendance ?
Would seem to me that there would be major differences in the expense of running a 7500 seat arena vs. a 20,000 seat arena, from consession expenses to cleaning to security to paying the electric bill.
While 7500 is kind of small, I think it's good business to not try to super size your product to the degree you start out in the hole. Create a demand for your product & have the ticket be hard to get & hopefully you don't need to handing out freebies on the street. If this team can get near 7500 to each gm what a great atmosphere & real home court advantage for the team.
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CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 02/08/05 7:36 pm ::: |
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| That begs the question of how the average team loses $1M per year while averaging ~8500 in attendance... |
It depends upon the way in which attendance was calculated. In Phoenix, for example, overall attendance was down from 2003 to 2004. Yet paid attendance and revenue were way up. This is because Phoenix used real numbers for attendance purposes (people who pay and people who show up) rather than fake numbers (e.g., including the number of giveaways, whether used or not).
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dtsnms
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 02/08/05 9:20 pm ::: |
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A huge factor is the rent deal with the company that owns the Arena. It is very difficult to be profitable in say the Hartford Civic Center due to the fact you're negotiating with MSG for rent.
The Mohegan Sun Arena on the other hand, is owned by the tribe as well and I'm sure, while two different companies in fact own the team and the Arena, there is a favorable rent structure.
A lot of people in CT couldn't understand that factor when they kept saying play in Hartford, play in Hartford
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pilight
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| Posted: 02/09/05 11:47 pm ::: |
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| MNfan22 wrote: |
| pilight wrote: |
Since every team has similar expenses, that strongly implies that a team can be profitable with no more than 7500 paying customers per game.
That begs the question of how the average team loses $1M per year while averaging ~8500 in attendance... |
Not sure I get what your saying here plight.
How many teams averaged 8500 in full price paid attendance ?
Would seem to me that there would be major differences in the expense of running a 7500 seat arena vs. a 20,000 seat arena, from consession expenses to cleaning to security to paying the electric bill. |
8500 is the official WNBA average. You think the paid attendance is less than that? OK, tell me what you think it is.
If you're fitting 8k or 9k into a 20k building then you're not going to open all the concessions, you're not going to need as much cleaning or security, and you're not going to turn on all the lights.
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Slovydal
Joined: 17 Nov 2004
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MNfan22
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 02/10/05 1:05 am ::: |
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| MNfan22 wrote: |
Not sure I get what your saying here plight.
How many teams averaged 8500 in full price paid attendance |
| pilight wrote: |
8500 is the official WNBA average. You think the paid attendance is less than that? OK, tell me what you think it is. |
"How many" should have really been a rhetorical question because I have no idea. I really didn't expect you to 'really' know either other then what we read or may be told.
From the post of some folks during the season who are STH like myself or attend gms regularly around the league, I think many of us have been to gms were what is reported & what we see doesn't jive. As Cam mentioned, I don't know if ALL the team report attendance the same or not.
Some teams may do well with corporate sales & some do well with season ticket sales but there is an "other" category that can be hard to measure aside from walk-up sales there are discounted tkts, promotions & the freebie or give aways.
The league 'average's maybe 8500 but I wonder how many teams maybe below the 'median' of 8500 in paid ticket sales. I just have questions about how much revenue is coming in from ticket sales among other areas.
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