RebKell's Junkie Boards

[turkeytrot]

Four years ago the UVA athletic administration couldn’t push Hall of Fame Coach Debbie Ryan out the door fast enough.

In her last four years Ryan went 88-46 (65.7%) overall and 32-24 (57.1%) in the ACC – the teams earned 3 NCAA berths with 4 and 5 seeds as well as one NIT quarterfinal appearance. Ryan’s team always played tough schedules which were consistently in the top twenty SOS rankings.

With the coach fully (and miraculously) recovered from a bout with pancreatic cancer, top ten prospects were once again visiting (3 in 2011) with one signing a letter of intent.

Nevertheless, the last of the 8 original women’s basketball coaches in the ACC was unceremoniously shoved out the door in abrupt fashion without a proper farewell from fans, former players and colleagues.

After a sputtering search that totally ignored all time Cav great Dawn Staley (need we say more) current coach Joanne Boyle came on board. Judging by posts on this and the Cal board from that period, many would say that hire came as a great relief in parts of California.

What may have been a relief in Berkeley is developing into a serious issue in Charlottesville.

After four years Boyle’s record comes in at only 72-56 (56.2%) overall with a 30-36 (45.4%) mark in the ACC.

Aside from the first year when she had 100% Ryan players she is 47-45 (51.1%) overall and 21-29 (42%) in the conference.

Making matters worse, Boyle has, for the most part, significantly eased the schedule. This past year the Cavs played 4 of the weakest teams in the game at home, padding the win column but ending the season at an embarrassing all time UVA RPI low of 110 and SOS in the 75 range.

In the 28 years since 1983 under Ryan UVA advanced to post-season play 27 times including 24 NCAA appearances.

Under Boyle the Cavs have made two WNIT appearances in four seasons.

Why has this come about?

One major issue was the failure to hold the Ryan recruits in 2011. Although one did matriculate, she has since transferred. Others de-committed and the best of the lot sought and received a release from her letter and went on to a strong career at a national champion.

Another serious problem has been a raft of transfers over the years including one in early 2014 and another at the conclusion of this past season.

Based on the continuing personnel losses and past trends it would not be surprising if more eased their way out before the school year ends.

A major player defection at this point could be the final straw as Boyle is in the last year of a 5 year deal and no doubt recruits are aware of that fact.

In 2011 UVA made a number of bad decisions, fans and player have suffered, a great program is now in tatters and it does not look at this point that it is all going to end well.

If the UVA athletic administration applies the same standards to the incumbent coach as it did to Ryan, well…………….

[22]

I don't really know anything about the history of UVA basketball or when Boyle would be considered to have a team of her own recruits....

But a few things seem like possible reasons/factors:

Does the W/L record partly reflect tougher competition of the new schools in the ACC?

The roster looks extremely young and I thought includes 3 top 100 freshmen recruits. I don't know how the seniors they may lose are balanced out by new recruits and growth of the youth they already have... but seems like they should get better just by getting older as a team.

Just throwing these out for consideration, as I don't have any answers on these.

[Howee]

[summertime blues]

As others have pointed out elsewhere, several transfers in the first year or so after the advent of a new coach are not unusual. Two transfers in a season are barely unusual any more, if you read the transfer thread. The restructuring of the ACC and the addition of some very strong programs has certainly shaken things up more than a bit. And there is the dictum that it takes three years to build a team and seven to build a program. I'm not arguing that what the AD did to Ryan was right....actually, it sounds pretty crappy....but I also think turkeytrot is a little precipitous in the weeping and wailing and wanting to throw Boyle to the wolves.

_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

[turkeytrot]

ACC has changed considerably and is a bit stronger after last year's additions of ND and Louisville.

However, the loss of Maryland pretty much offsets the ND gain.

The others that have come in the power conference restructurings have not necessarily made the conference much better.

Syracuse appears to be a bit of an improvement thus far.

Pittsburgh under McConnell is an example of what UVA could have been - voted to be last this year they made a run to the NCAA based upon good leadership and coaching.

On the other hand, the additions of Boston College and VPI have been god awful. "Rebuilding" poor programs with bargain basement coaches has meant plenty of easy wins for almost everyone else.

Admittedly, comparisons are very difficult due to the unabalanced schedules in a 15 member conference in which the 2 home & home partners can vary widely in quality.

[summertime blues]

[linkster]

[pwhite66]

No issues here with turkeytrot's overall point - everyone expected more from Boyle after four years. But to be fair, Virginia DID approach Dawn Staley about the position; Staley released a statement essentially saying that while flattered she felt she was on the verge of a breakthrough at South Carolina (pretty good call there). Now Staley is extremely loyal to Debbie Ryan so, given the perception that Ryan was pressured to leave before she was ready, I doubt there was any way Staley would have taken the job. But all indications are Virginia gave it a shot anyway.

Also, I'm not sure about your information about the Ryan recruits of 2011. The class included just two players. One, Bria Smith, did de-commit and went on to have a nice career at Louisville. The other, Sarah Imovbioh, is still at Virginia and will play her final season in 2015-16.

Finally, I'm only aware of three transfers from Virginia since Boyle came aboard:

Raeshaun Gaffney - to Xavier
Amanda Fioravanti - to St. Joseph's
Tiffany Suarez - announced transfer last month, destination unknown

I may be missing someone. Even so, it's a stretch to characterize this as a "raft of transfers."

To me, the biggest on-court reason Virginia has under-performed in recent years has been Boyle's inability to recruit/develop a single upper-level ACC-caliber post player to work alongside Imovbioh. Virginia's guards are fine, but especially these past two years the Cavaliers have had very little inside beyond Imovbioh, who is very good but undersized at 6-2 (or so her bio says). And again, Boyle didn't recruit Imovbioh. All three of Virginia's incoming recruits are listed at 6-3 or taller and one of them, Mone' Jones, is ranked 61st on ESPN's Top 100 list. It's not really fair to expect freshmen, especially freshmen posts, to step right in and contribute significantly in a league like the ACC. But I think at least one of these players will need to be a factor in 2015-16 if the Cavaliers are to become an NCAA-caliber team. And since this is year five of a five-year deal and there's been no talk of an extension - as far as I know - the NCAAs would appear to be the in-house expectation.

Still, my biggest question about Boyle is one I'll probably never get an answer to - and frankly is difficult to even bring up. But here goes - did her personal adoption saga impact her ability to develop an NCAA-caliber team at Virginia? As several stories have detailed, the adoption process was incredibly time-consuming and emotional. Was Boyle able to navigate through all those twists and turns and still be at her absolute best for the Cavaliers? I'm sure Boyle will say yes, but I'll always wonder. Because she didn't inherit a train wreck program, and she'd recruited spectacularly at Cal. I'm puzzled as to why progress at Virginia has been so slow.

[summertime blues]

[pwhite66]

Actually, I was being generous in saying "slow." There's been no progress; in fact, I'd say the 2014-15 Cavaliers were, competitively at least, a slightly lesser version of the team that took the court the year prior to Boyle's arrival.

Maybe things take a step forward in Year 5, or 6 or 7. I hope so. I just thought Virginia was closer than five years away from ACC relevancy when Boyle took over, that there was something to build on rather than the need for a complete rebuild.

[summertime blues]

[Durantula]

I take it that when Virginia was good UNC was also good but what were Duke and Maryland doing back then? I know both schools had periods of down years and I was not sure if they coincided with Virginia's rise. Now that Duke and Maryland are very good it makes it challenging for Virginia recruiting wise I would think. To a lesser extent Virginia Tech is now a power 5 school but that was not the case a while ago. Not a big deal but competing against a BCS team in state in recruiting is harder than being the only BCS in your state.

[summertime blues]

VA Tech might be Power 5 in football but they are AWFUL in WBB. Bottom of the ACC.

_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom

[mzonefan]

[summertime blues]

[Howee]

[mzonefan]

I enjoy researching this kind of stuff and found this nugget in the UVA WBB site.


NCAA Tournament

Virginia's Record by Round:
First Round 9-7
Second Round 12-5
Regional Semifinal 7-5
Regional Final 3-4
Final Four/Semifinal 1-2
Final Four/Final 0-1
Total: 57 games (.579) 33-24

National Championship 0-1
1991

National Semifinal 1-2
1990, 1991, 1992

Final Eight 3-4
1988, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1995, 1996

Final Sixteen 7-5
1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 
1995, 1996, 1997, 2000

Second Round 12-5
1987, 1988, 1989, 1990, 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 
1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2003, 2005, 2008, 2009

First Round 9-7
1984, 1985, 1986, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 
1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2008, 2009, 2010

Virginia's Record by Region
East (12 times) 20-13
Mideast (6 times) 6-6
Midwest (twice) 4-2
West (3 times) 3-3

Virginia's Seed
#1 (3 times) 1986, 1991, 1992
#2 (3 times) 1988, 1990, 1993
#3 (4 times) 1987, 1994, 1995, 1996
#4 (4 times) 1989, 1997, 2000, 2008
#5 (3 times) 1984, 2009, 2010
#6 (3 times) 1985, 1998, 2005
#7 (never)
#8 (twice) 2002, 2003
#9 (twice) 1999, 2001
#10-#16 (never)

[mzonefan]

So, if you look at it in the context of NCAA tourney.... Ryan's teams made 24 NCAA appearances (and even more if you count AIAW) and Boyle's teams have none.

[Durantula]

[pilight]

[summertime blues]

[Durantula]

[22]

[RP]

[summertime blues]