View previous topic :: View next topic |
Who should win Rookie of the Year? |
Ana Dabovic |
|
7% |
[ 5 ] |
Jewell Loyd |
|
25% |
[ 16 ] |
Kiah Stokes |
|
61% |
[ 39 ] |
Ramu Tokashiki |
|
0% |
[ 0 ] |
someone else |
|
4% |
[ 3 ] |
|
Total Votes : 63 |
|
Author |
Message |
pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67039 Location: Where the action is
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 7:17 am ::: ROY |
Reply |
|
Monday poll time!
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
|
|
Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 18050 Location: Queens
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 8:39 am ::: |
Reply |
|
Damn it, we need the Newcomer of the Year award back again.
_________________ Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013 Posts: 14550
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 11:37 am ::: |
Reply |
|
I would be surprised if a rookie who earned a starting job and is second on her team in both scoring and rebounding (as a guard), and has often been her team's leading scorer, would not get the award over someone who comes off the bench and is 7th on her team in scoring.
|
|
pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67039 Location: Where the action is
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 12:22 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
ArtBest23 wrote: |
I would be surprised if a rookie who earned a starting job and is second on her team in both scoring and rebounding (as a guard), and has often been her team's leading scorer, would not get the award over someone who comes off the bench and is 7th on her team in scoring. |
You're probably right. Scoring always gets the most attention in award voting. The highest scoring rookie in PPG has won ROY 82% of the time (13 of 17). Stokes has fewer ppg than any previous ROY winner.
The starting thing is a red herring. Stokes isn't starting, but she's playing about the same minutes as Loyd (26.6 vs 25.5) despite playing for a much more talented team. Earning 25 minutes/game for the league's best team is more impressive than 26 minutes/game for one of the worst. Loyd has a lower FG% than any previous ROY winner. Unless Seattle sweeps their last three games she'd be just the second ROY to play for a team with a worse record than the year before (Augustus in 2006 was the first). Stokes has three double-doubles, Loyd has none.
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
|
|
RP
Joined: 17 Jul 2010 Posts: 1299
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 12:24 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Stokes, easily. The single biggest reason NY has by far the league's top defense.
|
|
Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63863
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 12:34 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
What's more rare, 10 reb for a post player or 10 assists for a combo(?) guard?
Aren't you just making an argument that a guard should rarely win ROY?
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
|
|
UofDel_Alum
Joined: 10 Jul 2013 Posts: 3979 Location: Delaware
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 12:52 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
This was easy for me. Stokes is one of the top defensive players in the WNBA. She is the main reason for New York's rise this year in the Eastern Conference. Defense always leads to offense.
I like Loyd. She really injects excitement, optimism and scoring when she comes into the games.
These two players along with Prince and Charles tells you all you need to know why Liberty won the East this year.
|
|
UK1996
Joined: 03 Sep 2015 Posts: 403
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 12:53 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
I voted Loyd but its honestly a toss up between Loyd and Stokes.
_________________ Kentucky Wildcats, Sky, & Spurs
|
|
Michelle89
Joined: 17 Nov 2010 Posts: 16464 Location: Holland
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:02 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Scoring and reputation almost always win out for ROY. Loyd has averaged 15,8 pts in her last 6 games. My guess she will win it but Stokes deserves it aswell
_________________ "Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clichοΏ½s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." οΏ½Karen Bryant
|
|
Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63863
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:03 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
UofDel_Alum wrote: |
These two players along with Prince and Charles tells you all you need to know why Liberty won the East this year. |
You must be thinking of Boyd. Loyd plays for Seattle.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
|
|
NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007 Posts: 14097
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:09 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least.
_________________ The poster formerly known as LibWNBAFan.
|
|
UofDel_Alum
Joined: 10 Jul 2013 Posts: 3979 Location: Delaware
Back to top |
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013 Posts: 14550
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:35 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least. |
Perhaps that should read "fringe benefits of playing in the biggest media market in the Eastern time zone in NY rather than in relative obscurity in Seattle, and of being one of Geno's girls. . . ."
What is this "decisive" first half advantage of which you speak?
|
|
UofDel_Alum
Joined: 10 Jul 2013 Posts: 3979 Location: Delaware
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:37 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
UofDel_Alum wrote: |
This was easy for me. Stokes is one of the top defensive players in the WNBA. She is the main reason for New York's rise this year in the Eastern Conference. Defense always leads to offense.
I like Loyd. She really injects excitement, optimism and scoring when she comes into the games.
These two players along with Prince and Charles tells you all you need to know why Liberty won the East this year. |
Sorry, I meant Boyd
|
|
NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007 Posts: 14097
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 1:39 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
ArtBest23 wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least. |
Perhaps that should read "fringe benefits of playing in the biggest media market in the Eastern time zone in NY rather than in relative obscurity in Seattle, and of being one of Geno's girls. . . ."
What is this "decisive" first half advantage of which you speak? |
The one where Loyd started the season shooting 2 for 20, got benched for awhile and shot 50% or more in a game just 3 times while Stokes was being talked about in terms of first team defense and possible DPOY?
And she's saved her best with better scoring from 8/8 onward. Passing has improved too. She seems more comfortable and more aggressive. As a voter, if the game where she was 14-14 resonates in your mind and you combine that with her play in the later part of August and early September, then she might be your choice.
I'd vote Stokes. But it's kind of a unique year with the type of player Stokes is as well as the fact that Loyd has been up and down. If voters have the "up" Loyd in mind it could easily go the other way.
_________________ The poster formerly known as LibWNBAFan.
|
|
TotalCardinalMove
Joined: 13 Oct 2013 Posts: 1467
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 2:34 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
ArtBest23 wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least. |
Perhaps that should read "fringe benefits of playing in the biggest media market in the Eastern time zone in NY rather than in relative obscurity in Seattle, and of being one of Geno's girls. . . ."
What is this "decisive" first half advantage of which you speak? |
The one where Loyd started the season shooting 2 for 20, got benched for awhile and shot 50% or more in a game just 3 times while Stokes was being talked about in terms of first team defense and possible DPOY?
And she's saved her best with better scoring from 8/8 onward. Passing has improved too. She seems more comfortable and more aggressive. As a voter, if the game where she was 14-14 resonates in your mind and you combine that with her play in the later part of August and early September, then she might be your choice.
I'd vote Stokes. But it's kind of a unique year with the type of player Stokes is as well as the fact that Loyd has been up and down. If voters have the "up" Loyd in mind it could easily go the other way. |
But Loyd has had a more impressive second half of the season. And at the beginning of the year, Loyd had a lot of pressure on her to produce and was immediately put into the starting lineup, Stokes was coming off the bench. Once Loyd figured out the game she played way better.
|
|
pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 67039 Location: Where the action is
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 2:44 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
ArtBest23 wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least. |
Perhaps that should read "fringe benefits of playing in the biggest media market in the Eastern time zone in NY rather than in relative obscurity in Seattle, and of being one of Geno's girls. . . ."
What is this "decisive" first half advantage of which you speak? |
The one where Loyd started the season shooting 2 for 20, got benched for awhile and shot 50% or more in a game just 3 times while Stokes was being talked about in terms of first team defense and possible DPOY?
And she's saved her best with better scoring from 8/8 onward. Passing has improved too. She seems more comfortable and more aggressive. As a voter, if the game where she was 14-14 resonates in your mind and you combine that with her play in the later part of August and early September, then she might be your choice.
I'd vote Stokes. But it's kind of a unique year with the type of player Stokes is as well as the fact that Loyd has been up and down. If voters have the "up" Loyd in mind it could easily go the other way. |
But Loyd has had a more impressive second half of the season. And at the beginning of the year, Loyd had a lot of pressure on her to produce and was immediately put into the starting lineup, Stokes was coming off the bench. Once Loyd figured out the game she played way better. |
It's Rookie of the Year, not Rookie of the Last Half of the Year.
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
|
|
Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63863
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 2:50 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Remind us who votes for ROY. If it's media, they'd probably look mostly at scoring stats. If it's coaches who vote for ROY, it may be Stokes who wins because coaches are most likely to have felt the impact that Stokes has made.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
|
|
TotalCardinalMove
Joined: 13 Oct 2013 Posts: 1467
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 2:53 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
pilight wrote: |
TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
ArtBest23 wrote: |
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It also depends how much the voters are going to factor in Loyd's performance from July 31st forward, where she had 13+ points 8 times. In other words, will her recent performance outweigh her first half performance, where Stokes had a decisive advantage.
One of the fringe benefits of NY being 22-9 is that Stokes' contributions have received the publicity they deserve at least. |
Perhaps that should read "fringe benefits of playing in the biggest media market in the Eastern time zone in NY rather than in relative obscurity in Seattle, and of being one of Geno's girls. . . ."
What is this "decisive" first half advantage of which you speak? |
The one where Loyd started the season shooting 2 for 20, got benched for awhile and shot 50% or more in a game just 3 times while Stokes was being talked about in terms of first team defense and possible DPOY?
And she's saved her best with better scoring from 8/8 onward. Passing has improved too. She seems more comfortable and more aggressive. As a voter, if the game where she was 14-14 resonates in your mind and you combine that with her play in the later part of August and early September, then she might be your choice.
I'd vote Stokes. But it's kind of a unique year with the type of player Stokes is as well as the fact that Loyd has been up and down. If voters have the "up" Loyd in mind it could easily go the other way. |
But Loyd has had a more impressive second half of the season. And at the beginning of the year, Loyd had a lot of pressure on her to produce and was immediately put into the starting lineup, Stokes was coming off the bench. Once Loyd figured out the game she played way better. |
It's Rookie of the Year, not Rookie of the Last Half of the Year. |
You act as if Loyd was awful all season. She had a bad two game start to the season, but she gained confidence and started playing better. It's not like Stokes was dominant to start the season.
|
|
TotalCardinalMove
Joined: 13 Oct 2013 Posts: 1467
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 2:55 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Shades wrote: |
Remind us who votes for ROY. If it's media, they'd probably look mostly at scoring stats. If it's coaches who vote for ROY, it may be Stokes who wins because coaches are most likely to have felt the impact that Stokes has made. |
I believe award winners are selected by a panel of media members.
|
|
Michelle89
Joined: 17 Nov 2010 Posts: 16464 Location: Holland
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 3:24 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Lets get the fact straight. Loyd didnt get benched. She asked to come off the bench to gain some confidence first
_________________ "Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clichοΏ½s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." οΏ½Karen Bryant
|
|
zune69
Joined: 27 May 2010 Posts: 8192
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 3:28 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Take a look at the top performers in the 4th qt & overtime
2015 WNBA Statistics(4th Quarters & Overtimes Only)
through September 1
Highest FG Pct. (min. 30 FGA):
62.8% (27-43) Emma Meesseman, Was.
60.0% (24-40) Crystal Langhorne, Sea.
58.3% (21-36) Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
56.7% (17-30) Alysha Clark, Sea.
56.4% (22-39) Candace Parker, L.A.
56.3% (36-64) Brittney Griner, Pho.
56.3% (18-32) Jessica Breland, Chi.
54.4% (62-114) Kelsey Bone, Con.
53.3% (16-30) Jenna OHea, Sea.
53.1% (17-32) Sylvia Fowles, Min.
Highest Effective FG Pct. (min. 30 FGA):
68.3% Jenna OHea, Sea.
63.3% Alysha Clark, Sea.
62.8% Emma Meesseman, Was.
60.9% Renee Montgomery, Sea.-Min.
60.0% Crystal Langhorne, Sea.
58.6% Sydney Colson, S.A.
58.3% Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
57.7% Candace Parker, L.A.
56.4% Briann January, Ind.
56.3% Brittney Griner, Pho.
56.3% Jessica Breland, Chi.
Highest True Shooting Pct. (min. 30 FGA):
73.8% Jenna OHea, Sea.
68.1% Renee Montgomery, Sea.-Min.
67.5% Alysha Clark, Sea.
65.5% Emma Meesseman, Was.
64.9% Candace Parker, L.A.
64.1% Crystal Langhorne, Sea.
64.0% Briann January, Ind.
63.6% Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
62.1% Sydney Colson, S.A.
61.5% Matee Ajavon, Atl.
61.5% Elena Delle Donne, Chi.
Most Rebounds:
73 Tina Charles, N.Y.
63 Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
62 Courtney Paris, Tul.
58 Maya Moore, Min.
55 Elena Delle Donne, Chi.
Most Blocked Shots:
33 Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
19 Brittney Griner, Pho.
14 Elena Delle Donne, Chi.
13 LaToya Sanders, Was.
11 Courtney Paris, Tul.
Most Minutes Played:
270 Jantel Lavender, L.A.
261 DeWanna Bonner, Pho.
253 Maya Moore, Min.
248 Candice Dupree, Pho.
247 Kelsey Bone, Con.
236 Angel McCoughtry, Atl.
234 Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
231 Elena Delle Donne, Chi.
226 Tina Charles, N.Y.
224 Courtney Vandersloot, Chi.
Highest Efficiency Per 40 Minutes
(min. 125 Minutes Played):
32.03 Elena Delle Donne, Chi.
27.57 Brittney Griner, Pho.
26.25 Maya Moore, Min.
25.03 Emma Meesseman, Was.
23.72 Tina Charles, N.Y.
23.25 Kiah Stokes, N.Y.
23.22 Angel McCoughtry, Atl.
22.76 Tamika Catchings, Ind.
22.67 Kelsey Bone, Con.
21.74 Renee Montgomery, Sea.-Min.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013 Posts: 14550
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 3:57 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
Michelle89 wrote: |
Lets get the fact straight. Loyd didnt get benched. She asked to come off the bench to gain some confidence first |
Yeah, there's some really selective memories here. Some people seem to imagine that Stokes started out playing like an all star.
In reality she started the first half dozen or so games, and was scoring 2, 3, 4, 6 pts in 24-31 minutes. NY was 3-3 with her starting. Then she got taken out of the starting lineup and NY really started winning. And unlike Loyd, she never got her starting job back.
This notion that Stokes far outplayed Loyd the first half of the season is a total fairy tale.
|
|
GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008 Posts: 14120
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 4:18 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
Shades wrote: |
Remind us who votes for ROY. If it's media, they'd probably look mostly at scoring stats. If it's coaches who vote for ROY, it may be Stokes who wins because coaches are most likely to have felt the impact that Stokes has made. |
I believe award winners are selected by a panel of media members. |
Last season Rookie of the Year was voted on by a panel of 38 sportswriters and broadcasters while the All-Rookie Team was voted on by the coaches.
|
|
ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013 Posts: 14550
Back to top |
Posted: 09/07/15 4:21 pm ::: |
Reply |
|
GEF34 wrote: |
TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
Shades wrote: |
Remind us who votes for ROY. If it's media, they'd probably look mostly at scoring stats. If it's coaches who vote for ROY, it may be Stokes who wins because coaches are most likely to have felt the impact that Stokes has made. |
I believe award winners are selected by a panel of media members. |
Last season Rookie of the Year was voted on by a panel of 38 sportswriters and broadcasters while the All-Rookie Team was voted on by the coaches. |
How many of those sportswriters are based in NY and Conn?
|
|
|
|