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dtsnms
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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 Posted: 07/28/05 9:06 am ::: Shameka Christon |
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I thought this deserved it's own thread, since there seems to be some good debate going on, lost in the hugeness of the other threads.
She's a talented young player, but 4-13 (not counting that last shot)? That's more shots than Wauters and Baranova combined in half the minutes. You just can't do that and win IMO.
Where were the veterans to slow her down? Never mind the coaches, it's up to Hammon as PG and VJ/Crystal to tell her to not rush things when they're on the court (assuming at least one of the three was).
You take away her shooting, and the Libs shoot 65% from the floor. I think that translates into a Win personally.
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Lior
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herrade
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| Posted: 07/28/05 9:23 am ::: Re: Shameka Christon |
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| dtsnms wrote: |
| Where were the veterans to slow her down? Never mind the coaches, it's up to Hammon as PG and VJ/Crystal to tell her to not rush things when they're on the court (assuming at least one of the three was). |
I'm guessing that the number shots Shameka takes is not indicative of the number of plays that are run for her. Judging by Patty's reaction to these situations -- including some overheard profanities -- Shameka mangles plays here and there. Sometimes she gets the ball and goes into this zone where you know she decides she's going to be the one to take the shot. Either she makes a jaw-dropping move and scores or she does something incredibly dangerous and stupid. Unfortunately, the last few games is seems like she's been doing more of the latter.
I agree with BCBG -- she has tremendous potential, and anyone who doesn't see that is blind or a fool. But she needs to be reigned in right now. Her decision making is just not where it should be.
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BCBG25
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| Posted: 07/28/05 9:25 am ::: |
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Ok, let's break down the misses I can remember:
1 wide open jumper in the 1st half;
3 ill-advised 3-pointers in the 2nd half;
1 jumper that hit the front rim, totally off balance;
2 consecutive misses under the basket before the putback;
1 in the alley-oop play.
I have 2 other misses I can't remember. Other than the 3-pointers and the off balance jumper, I have no complaints. She hustled on defense, she grabbed 2 out of our 3 offensive rebounds, she made Swoopes work hard for her shots, she was ALL OVER THE PLACE. Is there any reason why our vets didn't shoot more? Can you tell me why the heck they were running that slow-mo Princeton offense in the 2nd half?
As I said in the other thread and DTS repeated, after the 1st crazy trey, someone should have pulled her aside and told her to hold her horses. Isn't that why you have 3 captains? Or is it a bad case of too many chiefs and not enough indians?
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herrade
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| Posted: 07/28/05 9:34 am ::: |
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| BCBG25 wrote: |
| Ok, let's break down the misses I can remember: |
in the situations i was talking about, sometimes she never even gets a shot off, so you can't just count misses. for example, when she lost her dribble in the corner during the first half. she managed to get the ball back with some truly impressive acrobatics, but she ran so much time off the clock that by the time she got the ball to becky the shot clock was down to zero.
there's not a person on that team who doesn't make bad decisions. but considering her role and her experience, she's taking too many shots, and she's holding the ball for too long.
i'm not saying she's a bad player -- i'm not even saying she's not a good player. i think there's just been so much praise that she's been blown up into a goddess, and she isn't quite there yet.
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KeiraNY
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| Posted: 07/28/05 9:55 am ::: Re: Shameka Christon |
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You know what? I agree with you that my girl took some down right nasty ass shots yesterday! No questions, but I wouldn't "reign her in" as you say. Here's my logic (bear w/ me here <g>): If you reign her in, you take away her confidence in shooting the ball. Every time she touches it she'll think, can I shoot it? If I do, will they bench me? I want her to take shots, good shots. Whether it's 20 or 5, I want those shots. However, what the coaching staff & the vets have to "teach" her is to make smarter decisions. Don't shoot for the heck of shooting. If you're open: shoot. If you have a clean shot: shoot it.
You just can't tell a shooter NOT to shoot. She just has to be smarter about it. As BCBG said, these are growing pains. I think she's doing remarkably well but she needs to be smarter.
| herrade wrote: |
| dtsnms wrote: |
| Where were the veterans to slow her down? Never mind the coaches, it's up to Hammon as PG and VJ/Crystal to tell her to not rush things when they're on the court (assuming at least one of the three was). |
I'm guessing that the number shots Shameka takes is not indicative of the number of plays that are run for her. Judging by Patty's reaction to these situations -- including some overheard profanities -- Shameka mangles plays here and there. Sometimes she gets the ball and goes into this zone where you know she decides she's going to be the one to take the shot. Either she makes a jaw-dropping move and scores or she does something incredibly dangerous and stupid. Unfortunately, the last few games is seems like she's been doing more of the latter.
I agree with BCBG -- she has tremendous potential, and anyone who doesn't see that is blind or a fool. But she needs to be reigned in right now. Her decision making is just not where it should be. |
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accommodatingly
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| Posted: 07/28/05 10:02 am ::: misses |
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| BCBG25 wrote: |
3 ill-advised 3-pointers in the 2nd half;
1 jumper that hit the front rim, totally off balance;
2 consecutive misses under the basket before the putback;
1 in the alley-oop play.
I have 2 other misses I can't remember. Other than the 3-pointers and the off balance jumper, I have no complaints. She hustled on defense, she grabbed 2 out of our 3 offensive rebounds, she made Swoopes work hard for her shots, she was ALL OVER THE PLACE. |
Christon works hard and does amazing things, but in a game decided by 2 points at the buzzer, those misses count. Some of those three-point attempts came quite early in the shot clock, late in the game, while the Lib held a slender lead.
I agree with DTS: Christon needs to improve her judgment. Whether or not the Lib staff can help her do it, others (like herrade) can judge, not I.
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BCBG25
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| Posted: 07/28/05 10:08 am ::: Re: misses |
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| accommodatingly wrote: |
| BCBG25 wrote: |
3 ill-advised 3-pointers in the 2nd half;
1 jumper that hit the front rim, totally off balance;
2 consecutive misses under the basket before the putback;
1 in the alley-oop play.
I have 2 other misses I can't remember. Other than the 3-pointers and the off balance jumper, I have no complaints. She hustled on defense, she grabbed 2 out of our 3 offensive rebounds, she made Swoopes work hard for her shots, she was ALL OVER THE PLACE. |
Christon works hard and does amazing things, but in a game decided by 2 points at the buzzer, those misses count. Some of those three-point attempts came quite early in the shot clock, late in the game, while the Lib held a slender lead.
I agree with DTS: Christon needs to improve her judgment. Whether or not the Lib staff can help her do it, others (like herrade) can judge, not I. |
Quite easy to place the blame on her. I didn't like the 3-pointers myself, but the offense sucked and nobody wanted to freaking shoot. Look at everybody's stats and you'll see that Nova and C-Rob were scared to death to shoot. I think she was doing what she could, and if anyone else is to blame, is Patty or the veterans for not, again, slapping her upside the head after the 1st 3. And for not having the patience to close out that game. It was the Liberty's loss, more than anything.
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VandyWhit
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| Posted: 07/28/05 10:09 am ::: |
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| Quote: |
| i think there's just been so much praise that she's been blown up into a goddess, and she isn't quite there yet. |
I think you hit the nail on the head with that one!
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BCBG25
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KeiraNY
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jersey_stupka
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| Posted: 07/28/05 10:20 am ::: |
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The Baby done good. She made some badazz decisions and its a game. i want her to learn for this. ye gods, it is NOT the end of the world! if you can learn from this and all evidence points to that happening then sometimes you learn more from the tough times.
my question, where was everyone else in last night's offense??
and where or where is the freaking coaching on this team???
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dtsnms
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| Posted: 07/28/05 10:23 am ::: |
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| jersey_stupka wrote: |
my question, where was everyone else in last night's offense??
and where or where is the freaking coaching on this team??? |
Exactly! She's got to get them involved. Becky's got to get them involved. VJ's got to get them involved. Coyle has to get them involved. It's no good to have posts that can score like Elena and Wauters and not get them the ball.
Nykesha may lead the Sun in scoring, but it's Taj they always try to get to first.
Listen, Christon is talented, no denying, but she's a second year player, with limited minutes from last year. She'll learn and she'll grow. The trick is to not let the growing pains kick away games.
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jersey_stupka
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Admiral_Needa
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:01 pm ::: |
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I think Meka is just being told to take those 3-pt shots...  For one, as a player, she needs to develop the 3-pt shot, especially for a SF. Secondly, Nova and C-Rob aren't shooting 3's as much or with as accurate as last year, so the team needs to compensate.
Moreover, Meka subbing in as the 4 always has mixed results. After she and Frett replaced VJ and Nova, in the first few minutes of the 1st half, Meka flew in from nowhere to grab 3 rebounds. In the second half, the rebounds stopped coming, probably because she often found herself under the basket in a ~tip drill.
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sambista
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:30 pm ::: |
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| keira is soooo right that meka would lose her confidence (which is just beginning to show) if you rein her in. a shooter's gotta shoot. don't stifle that talent just because her court sense hasn't caught up yet. has anyone besides me detected that now loree moore is gunshy? okay, she made some mistakes, but now she's full of doubt. even if you believe meka lost the game for us - which i DON'T, because the other shooters went missing, as b says - big freakin deal. it's not as if a loss for this team is rare. so what?! far as i'm concerned, the liberty are paying the price for not bringing in new blood sooner (or maybe i should say, playing the new blood that was brought in). this is the sacrifice, and next year christon, and i hope some other new blood, will be the bomb. i thought meka played so well in some aspects that the downside barely merits a mention. such promise! sorry, kids, blame this loss on patty coyle, who has no capacity to anticipate and only knows how to be reactive instead of proactive.
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dtsnms
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:34 pm ::: |
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I think you're not giving the kid enough credit. She didn't get to this level by being over-sensitive I'm sure.
Look, against Charlotte, Mike T was furious with Lindsay. She sat for a long while, he put her in and she made a really dumb play immediately. Mike yanked her right out. It was like a 20 second time on the court.
She came back and played a kick ass second half, and led the team to a blowout victory.
I don't see anything wrong with the captains saying to Meeka, "listen our first options are to get it to Nova and Wauters. It will open up better shots for you. Look inside before just shooting."
I don't think that would diminish her confidence. Give her a chance to show her makeup!
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herrade
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:43 pm ::: |
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| sebibb wrote: |
| a shooter's gotta shoot. |
i don't remember people saying that about becky when her shot was off, or anna deforge. what about crystal? if all our shooters kept shooting on their bad days, we'd have some miserable results. instead, people step back when they aren't feeling it and try to get the ball to the person who is (that is, of course, unless patty hasn't benched them yet).
| sebibb wrote: |
| has anyone besides me detected that now loree moore is gunshy? |
she always has been. she wasn't brough in to be a shooter.
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sambista
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:44 pm ::: |
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oh, i'm sorry. i wasn't suggesting she couldn't be counseled. i was shuddering at the idea of pulling her. it sounded as if some folks thought she lost the game and patty should've sat her down. i may have been reading too fast. (just popped in briefly after oral surgery. time for more meds and beddie-bye.)
no, you can even slap her around a bit - just don't take her outta the game!
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dtsnms
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:45 pm ::: |
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| sebibb wrote: |
oh, i'm sorry. i wasn't suggesting she couldn't be counseled. i was shuddering at the idea of pulling her. it sounded as if some folks thought she lost the game and patty should've sat her down. i may have been reading too fast. (just popped in briefly after oral surgery. time for more meds and beddie-bye.)
no, you can even slap her around a bit - just don't take her outta the game! |
Oh no, she ain't gonna learn if she ain't on the court!
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sambista
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:48 pm ::: |
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| herrade wrote: |
| sebibb wrote: |
| a shooter's gotta shoot. |
i don't remember people saying that about becky when her shot was off, or anna deforge. what about crystal? if all our shooters kept shooting on their bad days, we'd have some miserable results. instead, people step back when they aren't feeling it and try to get the ball to the person who is (that is, of course, unless patty hasn't benched them yet).
| sebibb wrote: |
| has anyone besides me detected that now loree moore is gunshy? |
she always has been. she wasn't brough in to be a shooter. |
herrade, it sure wasn't me who said to sit becky down. not for that reason, anyway. as for loree, i was talking more about her confidence working the floor. she looked totally flummoxed out there last night, after a couple of mistakes. vera jones remarked on it, too, how she looked unsure of herself.
in any event, i've always been for allowing players to work through this stuff. my biggest complaint about the liberty is that the new players never get enough pt to figure out what they're supposed to figure out. for all we know, good players have come and gone before we knew what they could do.
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Str8_Butta
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| Posted: 07/28/05 1:52 pm ::: |
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| dtsnms wrote: |
I think you're not giving the kid enough credit. She didn't get to this level by being over-sensitive I'm sure.
Look, against Charlotte, Mike T was furious with Lindsay. She sat for a long while, he put her in and she made a really dumb play immediately. Mike yanked her right out. It was like a 20 second time on the court.
She came back and played a kick ass second half, and led the team to a blowout victory.
I don't see anything wrong with the captains saying to Meeka, "listen our first options are to get it to Nova and Wauters. It will open up better shots for you. Look inside before just shooting."
I don't think that would diminish her confidence. Give her a chance to show her makeup! |
Her teammates and coaches tell her to shoot the ball, her job is to score and play D. Meka does look inside or pass to others, it's not like everytime she touches it she shoots. If Meka was making these shots then no one would be complaining about how many shots she attempts. I do wish she could get her shooting touch back, she's struggling now but she still makes things happen at key times.
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Admiral_Needa
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KeiraNY
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bigsportzbabe
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| Posted: 07/28/05 2:38 pm ::: |
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| Admiral_Needa wrote: |
| Str8_Butta33 wrote: |
| Her teammates and coaches tell her to shoot the ball, her job is to score and play D. Meka does look inside or pass to others, it's not like everytime she touches it she shoots. If Meka was making these shots then no one would be complaining about how many shots she attempts. I do wish she could get her shooting touch back, she's struggling now but she still makes things happen at key times. |
Exactly...  |
IMO...not exactly.....even if she made one or two, not staying in the offensive scheme destroys the flow of the game
the only flaw in SC`s game, is that sometimes she lapses into poor shot selection....she seems to go into panic mode, and shot selection and clock management fly out the window...this is all about experience and BB savvy which she is acquiring daily...that being said, every time she jacks up a dumb shot, with 15 seconds on the shot clock, and a sea of opponents jerseys waiting for the rebound, she can cause a 4 or 5 point shift in the game..which she did at least 3 times yesterday.
I think that the Comets saw this, and tried to deny everyone else the ball
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