RebKell's Junkie Boards

[pilight]

[And1]

Could the signing of Vanloo mean they could also possibly sign Meesseman?

[WNBA 09]

[HomerCecil]

This is a "well duh" comment, but I'm extremely curious to see who the Mystics get in return for the impending EDD sign and trade. Unless you are trying to move Sykes to the 1 (which seems like a bad idea, because they're really going to need her to score this year), this team has no point guard.

Edited to add: This could be catastrophic, but what if EDD decides she doesn't like any of the sign-and-trade options and retires or sits out the year? That would mean the Mystics wasted coring her, getting nothing in return, while also wasting the opportunity to core Cloud, and getting nothing in return for either of them.

Yikes. I already feel like no matter what happens, the Mystics, Sparks and Sky might be the bottom three teams in the league this year.

[readyAIMfire53]

[eyevolley4]

Atlanta - they would need to swap Elena and Cheyenne knowing they weren’t a preferred destination to begin with. A healthy Elena for 30+ games is maybe worth it but that hasn’t occurred in 4 years.

Chicago - not a contender, not a place I could see her returning

Connecticut - strange lineup things have occurred here but Breezy, DB, AT, and EDD sharing the court would be pretty out there.

Dallas - I’m not swapping Natasha or T for her and if Dallas wants change it needs to be at the lead guard position, something Washington has no help to supply.

Indiana - just doesn’t seem like swapping her with NaLyssa Smith makes sense. Smith has been great and is a great point in her career in terms of value per $ on her contract. Really underrated.

Las Vegas - legit they can give you their 2026 First Rounder and even that is worth little. I assume all of their signings and players are very intentional and there just isn’t much to make them want to move on a roster of players with the chemistry they have.

Los Angeles - she would never agree to this.

Minnesota - this roster is taking nicer shape, EDD would duplicate their MVP candidate. Not a good fit.

New York - well she’s not a defensive focused guard so no.

Phoenix - the only mobile assets they have are Sug Sutton and Sophie. Honestly, perhaps that would be a steal considering the giant lack of value Elena has brought in recent years. But boy, would Phoenix really be better for that trade?

Seattle - well this is a place that actually has some assets but they don’t really have a position for her unless she is going to be a 3 on offense and one of Ezi and Nneka are guarding the wing. This seems less offensive than trying to fit Nneka with Jj and Stewie but not dissimilar. You’d maybe be able to get Mercedes and their 2026 first rounder. They could sign Stef as a backup post to fill Russell’s slot.


Okay - after all that, I feel like the best option for Washington is if Phoenix would give them Sug and Sophie but I can’t mentally get comfortable with that for Phoenix. Next up in my mind would be Seattle would give them a player and a pick.

_________________
Some days are meant to be remembered.

[J-Spoon]

I was just about to make a similar list and pretty much agree with your conclusions

PX still seems possible but It would have to be Cuningham (hadn't really considered Sutton but if you can trade freshly signed players than great) and maybe a 2bd round pick. Also I am pretty sure EDD would have to sign for less if not much less than super max assuming Griner is still getting her rightfully due super max (or at least max) and the rest of the PX squad out side of the starters would have to be minimum players, maybe you could throw in one vet minimum but I am pretty sure clearing Jefferson, Turner, Cuningham and even Onyenwere off the books was so PX could make the money work for all. Probably won't know the remainder of the team until opening night as I assume PX will have to pick the waiver wire dry.

Cloud, DT, Allen, EDD and Griner is as good of a contending line up PX could put out but is also flawed (older, would struggle if there was a injury or injuries through out the season) might be worth it, but it is risk. The bench is going to have to be able to hold the fort.

Seattle seems like the best option I would target Horston and a future pick but would take Russell and a future pick.

besides Ch. Parker Atl could also offer a combo of H. Jones, Hillmon, Amihere and/or future first or second round picks, might be something there.

I have been thinking with absolutely no evidence that maybe Conn wants to trade Bri Jones EDD and Austin for Bri. Jones could be interesting for both teams

Since the last one seems crazy another crazy idea would be sign and trade for J. Jones again Washington would probably have to throw in Austin
also another crazy NY would be EDD for Sloot but it doesn't make sense for a Washington team trying to get younger and rebuild

And the final idea that is probably the most crazy but I will return to EDD signs the core deal and stays in Washington for one year at the super max. Maybe view it is a farewell tour and considering Washington hasn't committed any money to any new free agents it doesn't really hurt their bottom line.

[zune69]

Chicago has cap space and could use another draft pk.

3-Way trade:

To Phoe- EDD (Negotiates contract down to 100-150k)
To Wash- Mabrey, Cunningham
To Chi - Egbo or Mystics 2024 1st rd pk


Chicago gets young cheap talent or 1st rd pk

Washington gets a starter and quality bench player....Washington would still have enough money to sign Hawkins

Phoenix gets EDD.........EDD is financially well off. So I believe she would be open to negotiating her contract down(100-150k) for 1 season to play for a title contender

This trade is also adaptable....For example....Washington could dump MHA contract on Chicago to create more cap space...Chicago/Washington have the option of adding another young talent by taking Sutton.......Phoenix would have the option of taking EWill or Harrison depending on how much EDD/Griner are paid


Everyone wins with this trade.

[wnbafan]

I don't think we will see a trade until draft day. I bet Coach T has something up his sleeve.

I've always been a Mystics fan but gutting the team like this makes me look forward to a Philly team. Less than an hour away from me, I could be an sth.

_________________
Be kind, be careful, be yourself

[HomerCecil]

Very good point that it's unlikely that Coach T will end up being totally screwed. But it just seems like no matter what the Mystics get in return for EDD, it will be lopsided. I still wonder if it might have made more sense to core Cloud; she's younger, likely has a longer shelf life than EDD, and is a perfect complementary guard on a team that has lots of scoring options.

I think the Mystics are in for a rough stretch. The league is different now -- Coach T took advantage of shrewd GM moves (and having EDD's hometown being closer to DC than any other franchise) that I don't think will be as possible moving forward. Other teams are able to offer more than the Mystics can, from playing in true NBA arenas to other benefits that may or may not be totally above board. Ted Leonsis is not going to pour the money into this franchise that owners in places like Phoenix, New York, Las Vegas or Seattle are. Most of DC's pro sports teams are not competitive and I fear that's where the Mystics might be heading as other teams in the W begin investing more in their franchises.

It will also be interesting to watch the arena situation in DC. Leonsis has announced a deal to move the NBA and NHL teams to Alexandria. It's definitely not a done deal -- the NIMBYs in Alexandria don't want it -- but if it goes through, Capital One Arena in downtown DC will become a bit of an albatross. Leonsis claims they will renovate the arena, reduce capacity and put the Mystics there... I'll believe all of that when I see it. I've lived in DC since 2007 and the city is not at its strongest point right now.

[ChasingRatDogmaSalade]

[eyevolley4]

[HomerCecil]

Delle Donne has decided to sit out 2024. Given all of the developments with Phoenix and Las Vegas in the past couple days, this is not surprising.

I don't see EDD ever suiting up for the Mystics again, but I hope we haven't seen the last of her in the league. She was an absolute joy to watch in 2018 and 2019 and actually stunned several of my male friends to the point that they started paying attention to the Mystics. She was an absolute treat to watch offensively and I consider myself lucky to have watched her play in person.

That being said, her availability since 2019 has been shoddy at best, and I personally am not very surprised she's sitting out this year (which is totally her right to do, and the Mystics knew that when they cored her). So, as I worried, EDD and Cloud are gone and Coach T, for as shrewd as he's been over the years, has nothing to show for it. I suppose in theory they could get something in return for EDD for 2025, but her value is only going to go down.

Here is the current Mystics roster:

Julie Vanloo
Ariel Atkins
Brittney Sykes
Shatori Walker-Kimbrough
DiDi Richards
Karlie Samuelson
Emily Engstler
Myisha Hines-Allen
Shakira Austin
Elissa Cunane
Queen Egbo
Draft pick #6

This team has no proven point guard, its two best players arguably play the same position (Sykes and Atkins), there is... uh... not much on the wing, and there is no shooting from any reasonable distance from the post unless MHA reverts to the form she had in the Wubble.

Looking this up makes me notice that Tianna Hawkins is already off the roster. I'd seen reports she wouldn't be back but I didn't realize it was already official.

[Luuuc]

[pilight]

Eric Thibault is apparently not too popular among the players

_________________
I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home

[And1]

[eyevolley4]

I’m going to be honest, what we see as a break has likely been pure torture for her. Lyme’s is no joke. I’m hopeful she has found a routine that makes it manageable for her, but I have one good friend that felt perpetually awful for years until he found an antibiotic/herbal routine that worked for him. He also had to completely reinvent his diet and gave up many of his favorite foods and drinks while losing a lot of weight.

Even now under control, his Lyme’s is always looming and can wreak havoc on him with limited notice. With the weight loss, he’s much less strong than he used to be and is always worried about what is next.

Elena’s situation is unenviable. I’m glad she had a run of about 5 years without major complications where we got to see her rise to the top of the sport and accomplish goals of MVP, Olympic Gold, and a WNBA Championship. She’s such a special player who just never could quite reach her potential which is insane considering all she did accomplish.

_________________
Some days are meant to be remembered.

[HomerCecil]

[HomerCecil]

Sabreena Merchant at The Athletic has the best explainer of what's happening that I've seen so far. Essentially, it appears EDD would have accepted a $100,000 pay cut to play in Vegas. Most of the reporting I've seen has ignored the fact that if a cored player approves a sign-and-trade, the team they're being traded to can pay them anything less than the supermax salary as long as it's above the vet minimum.

Now that Delle Donne is sitting out, the Aces still have about $142,000 in cap space, a salary slot that seemed suitably earmarked for Delle Donne. It’s unclear what they will do with that money now, especially since the prominent unrestricted free agents are all off the board. Delle Donne was the last player available who could truly elevate a team’s ceiling. The WNBA will be worse off without her in it, and Washington has a tricky road ahead.

https://theathletic.com/5259489/2024/02/07/elena-delle-donne-mystics/

[readyAIMfire53]

As a longtime Mystics fan, this all adds up to a return of the Mistakes to DC. We watched the owners' desire to "reduce their losses" before and all but dissolve the once popular franchise before our eyes with the Trudi Lacey fiasco. The owners then made one right decision: to bring in Mike T to see if he could save the franchise. Not long after Mike T arrived, he played his trump card of obtaining Elena DelleDonne - the superstar the Mystics needed to win it all. With a few other shrewd moves based on Mike T's ability to find the right players (Natasha Cloud, Emma Meeseman and Ariel Atkins through the draft), the Mystics won the WNBA Championship.

From that peak, the Mystics trajectory has been straight down, a tale of injury, lack of commitment of foreign players and hefty contracts that limited the franchise's ability to bring in championship quality healthy players ready to play. Meanwhile, the owners chose to prioritize building a tiny stadium for the team that limited any potential growth of popularity for the franchise that could/should have arisen following the Championship.

The owners again have the choice to either let this franchise completely self destruct or find the right personnel to rebuild for another championship run, which would include a return to playing in a real professional arena and a sustainable fanbase. To some extent, the choice has already been made with the mistake of coring EDD over Cloud and thus getting absolutely nothing for losing almost all the players who won the only championship of this franchise a mere few years ago. With this coring mistake of epic proportions, Mike T is no longer the golden boy of great decisions this franchise continues to need.

Since the owners are clearly incapable of making the Mystics a destination for free agents, the only option is for them to again hit a homerun by finding new leadership to again resurrect the franchise through shrewd player choices and high draft position gained the old fashioned way of being a team incapable of winning games in the league.

The Mistakes are back. Will the owners step in now to change leadership or again wait a few years of dwindling attendance and interest before doing what needs to be done? That's really the only question to be answered. Even a tiny arena can become an echo filled chamber of a joke of a team that nobody wants to watch play.

_________________
Follow your passion and your life will be true down to your core.

~rAf

[wnbafan]

[pilight]

[wnbafan]

[HomerCecil]

On espn.com, Voepel makes a good point that while the Mystics are certainly within their rights to not trade her if they don't like what they could get in return, doing so would not look good to other players and could hurt them in free agency in the future. Agree, but I also think the days of the Mystics landing name free agents are probably over.

Thibault cored the wrong player, and I would like to know what the root issue is here that both Cloud and EDD don't want to be with the organization any longer. Nepo coach? Owner not spending money? All of the above?

The Mystakes are indeed back. I was on the STH advisory board for a brief period but then dropped out (and dropped my season tickets) when Julie Plank was let go and Sheila Johnson mouthed off about fans. I'd sort of buried that memory when they hired Mike Thibault, but it's back with a vengeance now.

[Richyyy]