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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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 Posted: 12/23/15 2:12 pm ::: |
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I'm just curious what the theory is for why 12 WNBA GMs independently and consistently come to the same conclusion about not signing her.
I don't recall ever seeing an explanation for why she's not in the WNBA when it is supposedly so obvious that she should be.
It seems she gets about as much discussion here as anyone other than Moore and Delle Donne, but I'm not familiar with the full story. Can someone help out with an explanation or a little history?
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Jet Jaguar
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mb1
Joined: 09 Feb 2006
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| Posted: 12/23/15 3:18 pm ::: |
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While you may think differently, I have nothing against Samantha...I actually enjoyed watching her and spoke up for her when some friends and fans put her down.
However, I am a realist and not OBSESSED with her. My opinion is she has skills and could play in the WNBA (not start perhaps, yet play effectively).
However, even in her All Rookie Team year in Phoenix, she only averaged 35% shooting and 27% from 3PT land.
Her WNBA career averages are 35% FG and 26% 3PT FG. Assist are 144 to 99 turnovers.
Is it a reach to suggest all 12 GMs in the league are thinking:
"She could help my team, yet I won't take her because their must be a problem."
Hopefully she continues to do well overseas, a team picks her up and she proves you correct that she can benefit a WNBA team.
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Luuuc
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| Posted: 12/23/15 7:44 pm ::: |
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| mb1 wrote: |
Is it a reach to suggest all 12 GMs in the league are thinking:
"She could help my team, yet I won't take her because their must be a problem." |
Especially when 4 of those teams have first-hand experience with her, so they don't even need to speculate about whether there might be a problem or not. They would know for sure.
She's still young. There's plenty of time left for her to return to the W if she's good enough.
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Jet Jaguar
Joined: 11 Feb 2014
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| Posted: 12/23/15 8:27 pm ::: |
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| mb1 wrote: |
Is it a reach to suggest all 12 GMs in the league are thinking:
"She could help my team, yet I won't take her because their must be a problem." |
This is basically what I just said as to why teams are not taking a chance on her. They think there must be something wrong with her. They are wrong. And those percentages are not great but many first year players have low shooting percentages. Especially considering the fact she went to a bad team where she had to do more than a rookie is usually expected to do because of all the players not playing. And I will say she didn't come out of the gates blazing her second year, but it happens. She would have rebounded and had a great year I'm sure...if they played her. And a 1.49 as/to is not awful for a rookie either, again especially on a bad team.
And to Luuuc, let me remind you that one of those teams is Atlanta, who traded away Bentley, signed Sydney Carter who has no business in the WNBA, and thinks Shoni is a point guard. And another is LA, who has Penny Toler as a GM...need I say more. I wouldn't take much credence out of the actions of either one of those teams. I just hope the right team picks her up and sees the talent and can look past whatever perceived issues they think she has. If that happens, there is going to be a lot more fans of her on this board than just me, I guarantee it.
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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 12/23/15 8:59 pm ::: |
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| Jet Jaguar wrote: |
| mb1 wrote: |
Is it a reach to suggest all 12 GMs in the league are thinking:
"She could help my team, yet I won't take her because their must be a problem." |
This is basically what I just said as to why teams are not taking a chance on her. They think there must be something wrong with her. They are wrong. And those percentages are not great but many first year players have low shooting percentages. Especially considering the fact she went to a bad team where she had to do more than a rookie is usually expected to do because of all the players not playing. And I will say she didn't come out of the gates blazing her second year, but it happens. She would have rebounded and had a great year I'm sure...if they played her. And a 1.49 as/to is not awful for a rookie either, again especially on a bad team.
And to Luuuc, let me remind you that one of those teams is Atlanta, who traded away Bentley, signed Sydney Carter who has no business in the WNBA, and thinks Shoni is a point guard. And another is LA, who has Penny Toler as a GM...need I say more. I wouldn't take much credence out of the actions of either one of those teams. I just hope the right team picks her up and sees the talent and can look past whatever perceived issues they think she has. If that happens, there is going to be a lot more fans of her on this board than just me, I guarantee it. |
That's true. It is only teams with clueless front offices who bring her to camp. Interesting ...
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 12/23/15 9:31 pm ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
| That's true. It is only teams with clueless front offices who bring her to camp. Interesting ... |
Well, to be fair, they're all pretty clueless right now because they are leaving a special talent off a roster that at minimum could be a starter, but I think has the skills and talent to be an All-Star. Of course everyone will disagree with that, but that's how I feel.
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Str8_Butta
Joined: 24 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 12/24/15 10:50 am ::: |
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| Oh Lord!
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zune69
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ClayK
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| Posted: 12/24/15 4:35 pm ::: |
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| While talking to someone at the Nike TOC who was in a position to know, the feeling was that Prahalis wasn't a plus in the locker room.
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Shades
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| Posted: 12/24/15 6:32 pm ::: |
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| True or False: Sammy Prahalis is the first player selected to the All-Rookie team to involuntarily not make it through a second year of the WNBA.
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 12/24/15 9:15 pm ::: |
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| Shades wrote: |
| True or False: Sammy Prahalis is the first player selected to the All-Rookie team to involuntarily not make it through a second year of the WNBA. |
This is absolutely true. The only player to be cut from her team after being on the ART in WNBA history. SMDH...
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 12/24/15 9:24 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| While talking to someone at the Nike TOC who was in a position to know, the feeling was that Prahalis wasn't a plus in the locker room. |
You know, it's kind of funny I had never heard of this issue before she went to Phoenix. All her OSU teammates loved her. Never has had a problem on any overseas teams, USA Teams, AAU teams. No where has she had locker room problems of this sort. No where but (reportedly) Phoenix...the same team where another very good (but more established) guard ASKED to be traded from the team....hmmmm.... Just something to think about. And I'm going to assume this person who was in a position to know, just knows what he's HEARD about her or what others are saying about her. Not actual first hand experience with her. Because I know this locker room stuff is a load of BS. (BTW if you couldn't tell, t have heard all this before Clay, so this isn't news at all to me)
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ClayK
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| Posted: 12/26/15 12:51 pm ::: |
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| Jet Jaguar wrote: |
| ClayK wrote: |
| While talking to someone at the Nike TOC who was in a position to know, the feeling was that Prahalis wasn't a plus in the locker room. |
You know, it's kind of funny I had never heard of this issue before she went to Phoenix. All her OSU teammates loved her. Never has had a problem on any overseas teams, USA Teams, AAU teams. No where has she had locker room problems of this sort. No where but (reportedly) Phoenix...the same team where another very good (but more established) guard ASKED to be traded from the team....hmmmm.... Just something to think about. And I'm going to assume this person who was in a position to know, just knows what he's HEARD about her or what others are saying about her. Not actual first hand experience with her. Because I know this locker room stuff is a load of BS. (BTW if you couldn't tell, t have heard all this before Clay, so this isn't news at all to me) |
You could well be right -- I was just relaying this, though I do have to say it was a college person, and not anyone connected with Phoenix.
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 12/26/15 7:02 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| You could well be right -- I was just relaying this, though I do have to say it was a college person, and not anyone connected with Phoenix. |
I got you. Only time I've really heard it with college is when she was suspended at the beginning of her Junior year. And people were speculating it was something she did to disrupt the locker room or something. But it was because she went to Evan Turner's draft and got a free ride, which was an NCAA violation. Nothing locker room related. But people always talked sh** about her because she was different than most players and very flashy; so I've always heard crap about how "she's not a team player" because she supposedly only wants to put on a show. People would say anything about her without even knowing her. And they still do it seems. So I'm not surprised someone has HEARD that. Rumors become pseudo facts very quickly.
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 04/23/16 4:49 pm ::: |
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| <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/LxhgsNcGFXk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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zune69
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| Posted: 04/23/16 11:46 pm ::: |
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No wnba team is signing an overseas PG with these shitty stats....
Samantha Prahalis:
25.0p,3.8r,3.6a,5.9to,42% fg(171-409),31% 3ptfg(52-167),87% ft
Like really!!!
42% in a non-wnba league ????
3.6to/5.9 Turnovers in a non-wnba league ????
Sammy's team did not even make the playoffs.They finished 4-22,last place in a 14 team league.
And we already know Prahalis a poor defender.
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Shades
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| Posted: 04/24/16 12:59 am ::: |
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I'm guessing Sammy's team is so bad she has to take on the Kelsey Mitchell role and try to do too much herself. That shows up on the high point average and turnovers. That's why as I said before, this is a terrible team for Sammy to showcase herself as a PG in the WNBA. No WNBA team is going to be interested in her as a scorer.
The 42% isn't that heinous. Whitney Knight of FGCU shot 0.344 in the Atlantic Sun Conference and people seem to like her. They must like her for defensive purposes.
But no, I don't see much hope for Sammy this season. Camp starts today or tomorrow!
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 04/24/16 1:52 am ::: |
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| zune69 wrote: |
No wnba team is signing an overseas PG with these shitty stats....
Samantha Prahalis:
25.0p,3.8r,3.6a,5.9to,42% fg(171-409),31% 3ptfg(52-167),87% ft
Like really!!!
42% in a non-wnba league ????
3.6to/5.9 Turnovers in a non-wnba league ????
Sammy's team did not even make the playoffs.They finished 4-22,last place in a 14 team league.
And we already know Prahalis a poor defender. |
On the contrary, these are very impressive stats in the context of the team she was on. Her team was not a bad team, it was a HORRIBLE team. I watched every game. I'm going to assume you watched none, so you can take my word. And it was not bad because of Sammy. It got 4 wins and was actually in some close games to some decent teams BECAUSE of Sammy. This team probably goes winless with just about any other point at the helm. Basically every game the other team's coaches had to game plan against the best guard in the Italian League. She faced doubles teams, triple teams, junk defenses, every night trying to stop her. And she still put up numbers. 3.6 assists doesn't seem like a lot, but in this league it is. It was 3rd, less than a half an assist behind the leader. No player in the last 13 years in this league, has ever averaged 5 APG (no not even Penicheiro); they just don't give them out in this league. One game I counted 10 obvious assists and I think they gave her 3. But to be 3rd in the league in assists and score 25 a game is impressive. Especially with the personnel that Sammy had to assist to.
While I'll admit the turnovers were a little high, a lot of that had to do with having the ball so much and having to try and do so much plus having the defense completely geared towards stopping you (and pretty much not worrying about anyone else). Teammates not catching some of her passes also is a factor and they call a ton of travels in that league too. But the team overall did not turn it over a lot compared to the rest of the league, kind of middle of the pack. Being that Sammy was such high usage, if a turnover happened, it was probably going to be her. And if you watch the games, you're probably not going be like "Oh my god, this player turns the ball over a ton".
As far as the shooting percentage, same deal. She had to do so much on a lousy team. Look at other players on bad teams throughout Europe. Latta shot 41.4% (first number is actually just 2 pointers) and 34.3 from 3 on a pretty bad team (and she had Dolson). Zellous 43.5/30.9. Ajavon isn't on that bad of a team in Poland and is 41.8/28.9. And I'd argue that none of these team were as bad as Sammy's in comparison to the rest of the league. Sammy's team she was on on Mersin last year was probably the best team she was on in the last couple years, although not great, but there were other players where she didn't have to be the go to night after night. And she shot 47% from 2. 36% from 3. Decent efficiency. Mersin is pretty good this year and Hartley is shooting 43.9% from 2 and 33.1% from 3. Not too far off from Sammy's percentages this year in Italy and she isn't even close to the go to on that team with McCoughtry on the team.
But thank you for taking an interest and looking up her stats. But stats are exactly what you make of them. They can be made to support your argument, but shouldn't be made to make it. This was a very impressive year for Sammy. I can't think of many point guards in the WNBA who you could put on that team as it was an have a better season than that. Or lead the team to more victories. How much can you expect 1 player to be able to do? And if you asked any of the coaches in Italy who the best guard in the league this year was, I guarantee just about all of them would say Sammy Prahalis.
Last, I don't know who WE is. But don't include me in WE. Because I don't think she's a poor defender. She's not an awesome defender, but she's far from poor. There are worse defenders in the WNBA right now without a doubt.
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Last edited by Jet Jaguar on 04/24/16 2:06 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 04/24/16 2:01 am ::: |
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| Shades wrote: |
I'm guessing Sammy's team is so bad she has to take on the Kelsey Mitchell role and try to do too much herself. That shows up on the high point average and turnovers. That's why as I said before, this is a terrible team for Sammy to showcase herself as a PG in the WNBA. No WNBA team is going to be interested in her as a scorer.
The 42% isn't that heinous. Whitney Knight of FGCU shot 0.344 in the Atlantic Sun Conference and people seem to like her. They must like her for defensive purposes.
But no, I don't see much hope for Sammy this season. Camp starts today or tomorrow! |
Not a great comparison, because OSU was a pretty good team. They had solid players besides Mitchell. Mitchell just shoots the hell out of the ball and doesn't pass. Sammy had to try and score a lot because her team sucked (see previous post). And Sammy passed a lot; her teammates just didn't hit a ton of the open shots she made for them, and even when they did the stupid league gave her credit for the assist only when they felt like it. So yeah Sammy had to do too much herself out of necessity, Mitchell out of that's just how she wants to play.
And let me tell you Shades, overseas teams take American players for their scoring. WNBA GM's know this. But the point guards need to assist too, which she did, since she was 3rd in the league.
But yeah, this year isn't looking too good (stupid GM's  )
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Shades
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| Posted: 04/24/16 2:39 am ::: |
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| They both felt like they needed to do too much. Whether it was necessary to do too much is a matter of opinion, and yours is pretty biased. And maybe both just did what their coaches ask of them. I was just trying to help you out by explaining all those turnovers. Mitchell's were high, but not quite that high.
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Jet Jaguar
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| Posted: 04/24/16 10:48 am ::: |
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| Shades wrote: |
| They both felt like they needed to do too much. Whether it was necessary to do too much is a matter of opinion, and yours is pretty biased. And maybe both just did what their coaches ask of them. I was just trying to help you out by explaining all those turnovers. Mitchell's were high, but not quite that high. |
Yes, Sam was super high usage, as I pointed out. Had to do so much. And she was on a team with not very good teammates as far as ability. But like I said, the team overall did not turn the ball over a ton. It's weird to say this with almost 6 a game, but it's because of her that the team was only in the middle of the league in turnovers and not worse. If other people on the team were handling the ball, they probably would have been near the bottom in turnovers (i.e. most turnovers).
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ClayK
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| Posted: 04/24/16 11:54 am ::: |
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Sammy's agent didn't exactly help her with that contract ...
I would like to see her in the league because she's got charisma and will draw attention, but she needs to prove to people she's good enough -- and that team was not the setting for her.
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Jet Jaguar
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toad455
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| Posted: 04/24/16 5:13 pm ::: |
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| every time this thread gets brought back to life, I keep thinking some WNBA team has signed her. But I think at this point in her career, WNBA coaches & GMs have seen all they need to see of Prahalis.
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. My theory is teams just don't want to give her a legit shot now that she's been cut a few times. I don't want to go into the whole Phoenix debacle too much, but she was cut there mid-season (no trade) after basically riding the bench and not seeing any play time for most of the season after being a starter to begin the season. They basically screwed her over doing this. This sent a message to the league that there was some sort of problem, either clubhouse, or she just wasn't good (if teams forgot she was an ART player the year before). Then NY picked her up even though it was obvious Bill never intended to use her. Then the next year she had a very good Atlanta camp only to be cut because of the "big signing" of Dumerc. Now she has this stigma that she probably isn't very good because she keeps getting cut. If a team would just give her a real chance, with her flair and her unbelievable skills, I'm sure she could really make her mark in this league.
