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WfanFrJmp
Joined: 24 May 2016
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 Posted: 12/24/21 9:59 am ::: |
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Wow! I know you can never really tell but I really thought she would excel as a pro. Hopefully, she can get experience somewhere and find her groove. Is it true that this is the 2nd team that has released her?
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Luuuc
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Stormeo
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| Posted: 12/24/21 12:09 pm ::: |
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| Luuuc wrote: |
| I won't read into it too much about Dungee. Kind of ironic that Sydney - coached by Shane Heal - released a player without even giving her a real shot ... considering his whining after the Sky cut (ok, "traded" for nothing) his daughter early in the WNBA season. Last time he coached a WNBL team he literally destroyed it. |
Oof. And when Dungee says she's glad to be out of "that situation"... well, hopefully Rennia Davis knows what she's getting herself into. As for Dungee herself, maybe her mess of an overseas season just means she's better off staying Stateside and working on her game here. Players can certainly get better by having a proper offseason without having to go to an overseas League to develop, as someone like Skylar Diggins(-Smith) has shown.
| awhom111 wrote: |
| BEN Maley 38/19r |
And she did it on 14-20 FG (5-6 3PT), to go with 4 ast to 3 to's, 2 blk, & 1 stl.  I see her overall numbers are trending high – even if it's super early on. It might be time for Maley to take her talents back Stateside. She was at Oregon during the 2017-2018 season, so idk if she's eligible to be drafted this coming year or if she already was last year (and just, no one did). Whatever status she is, someone ought to give her a look, methinks.
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 12/24/21 2:38 pm ::: |
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| Thinking about Dungee's career at Arkansas, she seemed to do her best work when she could be ball dominant. Arkansas was able to carve out spots in the game where Chelsea could repeatedly go one-on-one without being a ballhog for the whole game. Somehow, Mike Neighbor's system allowed for that balance. I can see why Dungee would struggle finding her footing on a new team in a new league. You won't be able to just take over a game as the new kid unless you quickly earn the trust of coaches and teammates. Chelsea is sort of in a chicken and egg situation where she won't be allowed to do her thing until she's already done it. I don't think Dungee has ever possessed the confidence and swagger of someone like Ogunbowale. She's sort of caught in between. Meanwhile, it's not like Chelsea excels at anything else other than scoring. If Dungee doesn't put up points, there's no reason for her to be on the court.
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WfanFrJmp
Joined: 24 May 2016
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| Posted: 12/24/21 4:03 pm ::: |
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| Thank you sharing Chelsea's ig post and thoughts about her game. Y'all definitely make some great points. I'm always concerned about the players when they enter the league...and go overseas etc. It will be interesting to see how things develop for her. I do hope this ends up as a good situation for Davis. We shall see!!
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 12/24/21 6:06 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| Luuuc wrote: |
| I won't read into it too much about Dungee. Kind of ironic that Sydney - coached by Shane Heal - released a player without even giving her a real shot ... considering his whining after the Sky cut (ok, "traded" for nothing) his daughter early in the WNBA season. Last time he coached a WNBL team he literally destroyed it. |
Oof. And when Dungee says she's glad to be out of "that situation"... well, hopefully Rennia Davis knows what she's getting herself into. As for Dungee herself, maybe her mess of an overseas season just means she's better off staying Stateside and working on her game here. Players can certainly get better by having a proper offseason without having to go to an overseas League to develop, as someone like Skylar Diggins(-Smith) has shown.
| awhom111 wrote: |
| BEN Maley 38/19r |
And she did it on 14-20 FG (5-6 3PT), to go with 4 ast to 3 to's, 2 blk, & 1 stl. I see her overall numbers are trending high – even if it's super early on. It might be time for Maley to take her talents back Stateside. She was at Oregon during the 2017-2018 season, so idk if she's eligible to be drafted this coming year or if she already was last year (and just, no one did). Whatever status she is, someone ought to give her a look, methinks. |
Dungee might not have much of a guarantee of a 2022 WNBA season at this point so there is also the part where overseas may end up being her only playing option. Even if it's not your fault, a reputation for not sticking for a whole season can impact future earnings.
Maley was undrafted in 2020 so she is already a free agent. She has put up some impressive rebounding numbers, especially at the NBL1 level, but she's kind of undersized to make that a translatable skill at any other level. |
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awhom111
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awhom111
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awhom111
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awhom111
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 12/30/21 1:11 am ::: |
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| So, how did Jazmine Jones move from Antalya to Hatay? She was leading Antalya in scoring with 19.7 ppg, so I doubt they didn't want her. Short contract? Escape clause? I've never noticed overseas trades before, but maybe I've been asleep at the wheel.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 12/30/21 3:40 am ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
| Maley was undrafted in 2020 so she is already a free agent. She has put up some impressive rebounding numbers, especially at the NBL1 level, but she's kind of undersized to make that a translatable skill at any other level. |
Interesting, thank you! So it sounds like she's more of a 4 there. It's tough cuz tweener 3/4s can thrive in the WNBL, but they really struggle to find a niche in the WNBA. Perhaps Maley could become more of a full-time 3, though unless she already plays mostly on the perimeter, it's easier said than done. Still hope she gets a look if she continues to produce down under.
| root_thing wrote: |
| Thinking about Dungee's career at Arkansas, she seemed to do her best work when she could be ball dominant. Arkansas was able to carve out spots in the game where Chelsea could repeatedly go one-on-one without being a ballhog for the whole game. Somehow, Mike Neighbor's system allowed for that balance. I can see why Dungee would struggle finding her footing on a new team in a new league. You won't be able to just take over a game as the new kid unless you quickly earn the trust of coaches and teammates. Chelsea is sort of in a chicken and egg situation where she won't be allowed to do her thing until she's already done it. I don't think Dungee has ever possessed the confidence and swagger of someone like Ogunbowale. She's sort of caught in between. Meanwhile, it's not like Chelsea excels at anything else other than scoring. If Dungee doesn't put up points, there's no reason for her to be on the court. |
Spot on, and now that I'm thinking about it, it seems like she'd be a good fit for the Sparks, a team in which 1-on-1 plays are heavily utilized...
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 12/31/21 1:00 am ::: |
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Hungary:
http://www.womensbasketball247.com/2021/12/hungarian-league-round-13-december-28th-30th-2/
Poland:
http://www.womensbasketball247.com/2021/12/polish-league-round-13-december-29th-30th/
| root_thing wrote: |
| So, how did Jazmine Jones move from Antalya to Hatay? She was leading Antalya in scoring with 19.7 ppg, so I doubt they didn't want her. Short contract? Escape clause? I've never noticed overseas trades before, but maybe I've been asleep at the wheel. |
Trades are not allowed in most places. They are in Puerto Rico and South Korea, although I am not sure if that has ever covered imports, and I assume that they exist in the Philippines too.
It is unlikely to be short-term deal because those are usually made with the understanding that a player is signed to fill that spot later in the season. An example in Turkey is Kayseri signing Japreece Dean to a short-term contract that would last until Slocum was ready to play. It is possible that Antalya was not paying her and she terminated her contract.
The more likely situation is that she had a contract for the full season with Antalya. Hatay had a non-European place open up (not sure what the situation was with Kalani Brown, but that was her roster spot) and they reached out to Jones's agent to see how much they would want in salary to change teams and then they negotiated an amount to pay to Antalya to terminate their contract with her and allow her to transfer to Hatay. I am not sure that a player with relatively limited history overseas like Jones would have the juice to be able to negotiate an escape clause that was minimal. An example of such clause was the one that Sandrine Gruda had in signing with Lyon this season that allowed her to back out if they did not qualify for EuroLeague and she exercised it to return to Schio. I am not sure in general that termination clauses are that common in European women's basketball other than in places like Spain where it is a mandatory feature of employment contracts. On the men's side, a lot of them revolve around the NBA and multi-year deals are slightly more common so it makes sense to build in amounts so that teams do not have go through long negotiations to agree on transfer fees.
From Antalya's perspective, they probably think that they will be able to accomplish their season goals replacing Jones with whoever they can find now and possibly come out ahead financially. They may also be struggling financially, but not to the point of not paying salaries, and might be trying to help themselves in that regard. The teams and the player all have to agree to make the transfer. I kind of wonder if Hatay was the team trying to sign Kelsey Bone from Elitzur Holon. I was originally thinking that it might be Schio since Charli Collier has been in and out of their lineup, but I could see a player choosing Israel over Antakya, Turkey even if it pays more. |
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 12/31/21 1:24 am ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
Trades are not allowed in most places. They are in Puerto Rico and South Korea, although I am not sure if that has ever covered imports, and I assume that they exist in the Philippines too.
It is unlikely to be short-term deal because those are usually made with the understanding that a player is signed to fill that spot later in the season. An example in Turkey is Kayseri signing Japreece Dean to a short-term contract that would last until Slocum was ready to play. It is possible that Antalya was not paying her and she terminated her contract.
The more likely situation is that she had a contract for the full season with Antalya. Hatay had a non-European place open up (not sure what the situation was with Kalani Brown, but that was her roster spot) and they reached out to Jones's agent to see how much they would want in salary to change teams and then they negotiated an amount to pay to Antalya to terminate their contract with her and allow her to transfer to Hatay. I am not sure that a player with relatively limited history overseas like Jones would have the juice to be able to negotiate an escape clause that was minimal. An example of such clause was the one that Sandrine Gruda had in signing with Lyon this season that allowed her to back out if they did not qualify for EuroLeague and she exercised it to return to Schio. I am not sure in general that termination clauses are that common in European women's basketball other than in places like Spain where it is a mandatory feature of employment contracts. On the men's side, a lot of them revolve around the NBA and multi-year deals are slightly more common so it makes sense to build in amounts so that teams do not have go through long negotiations to agree on transfer fees.
From Antalya's perspective, they probably think that they will be able to accomplish their season goals replacing Jones with whoever they can find now and possibly come out ahead financially. They may also be struggling financially, but not to the point of not paying salaries, and might be trying to help themselves in that regard. The teams and the player all have to agree to make the transfer. I kind of wonder if Hatay was the team trying to sign Kelsey Bone from Elitzur Holon. I was originally thinking that it might be Schio since Charli Collier has been in and out of their lineup, but I could see a player choosing Israel over Antakya, Turkey even if it pays more. |
Thanks for the thorough explanation. Now I'm wondering what happened to Kalani Brown. She was playing well, so I doubt Hatay wanted to get rid of her.
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 12/31/21 5:47 pm ::: |
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China:
http://www.womensbasketball247.com/2021/12/chinese-league-finals-game-1-december-31st/
Israel:
http://www.womensbasketball247.com/2021/12/israeli-league-round-11-december-30th-31st/
| root_thing wrote: |
| awhom111 wrote: |
Trades are not allowed in most places. They are in Puerto Rico and South Korea, although I am not sure if that has ever covered imports, and I assume that they exist in the Philippines too.
It is unlikely to be short-term deal because those are usually made with the understanding that a player is signed to fill that spot later in the season. An example in Turkey is Kayseri signing Japreece Dean to a short-term contract that would last until Slocum was ready to play. It is possible that Antalya was not paying her and she terminated her contract.
The more likely situation is that she had a contract for the full season with Antalya. Hatay had a non-European place open up (not sure what the situation was with Kalani Brown, but that was her roster spot) and they reached out to Jones's agent to see how much they would want in salary to change teams and then they negotiated an amount to pay to Antalya to terminate their contract with her and allow her to transfer to Hatay. I am not sure that a player with relatively limited history overseas like Jones would have the juice to be able to negotiate an escape clause that was minimal. An example of such clause was the one that Sandrine Gruda had in signing with Lyon this season that allowed her to back out if they did not qualify for EuroLeague and she exercised it to return to Schio. I am not sure in general that termination clauses are that common in European women's basketball other than in places like Spain where it is a mandatory feature of employment contracts. On the men's side, a lot of them revolve around the NBA and multi-year deals are slightly more common so it makes sense to build in amounts so that teams do not have go through long negotiations to agree on transfer fees.
From Antalya's perspective, they probably think that they will be able to accomplish their season goals replacing Jones with whoever they can find now and possibly come out ahead financially. They may also be struggling financially, but not to the point of not paying salaries, and might be trying to help themselves in that regard. The teams and the player all have to agree to make the transfer. I kind of wonder if Hatay was the team trying to sign Kelsey Bone from Elitzur Holon. I was originally thinking that it might be Schio since Charli Collier has been in and out of their lineup, but I could see a player choosing Israel over Antakya, Turkey even if it pays more. |
Thanks for the thorough explanation. Now I'm wondering what happened to Kalani Brown. She was playing well, so I doubt Hatay wanted to get rid of her. |
It would be nice if teams had updated websites or posted news otherwise, but most of them are not commercial enterprises so I guess it does not matter what potential customers know. |
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Luuuc
#NATC
Joined: 10 Feb 2005
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| Posted: 01/01/22 9:01 pm ::: |
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We're at the last game of week 5 in the WNBL, and the Perth Lynx finally get to play their first game (in 2 hours). Should be fun to watch if the Whitcomb - Mabrey - Young backcourt can get rolling.
<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/3LNn-Djh3vA" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 01/02/22 1:05 am ::: |
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Australia:
http://www.womensbasketball247.com/2022/01/australian-league-round-5-december-30th-january-2nd/
Virus cases have caused five of the seven games scheduled in Italy to be postponed. We will see if the last two are actually played on Sunday. For one of the games, San Martino di Lupari had a sudden outbreak and quarantined instead of fielding the at least six players who had not tested positive in accordance with league regulations. Campobasso, known for their regard of the letter of the law, is asking for the game to be awarded to them.
Spain's next games are on Tuesday, but we have already lost three in addition to the game moved so that Gernika can make up their EuroCup game from when they were unable to play.
| Luuuc wrote: |
We're at the last game of week 5 in the WNBL, and the Perth Lynx finally get to play their first game (in 2 hours). Should be fun to watch if the Whitcomb - Mabrey - Young backcourt can get rolling.
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Do you think that Clarke will be at the very fringe of the rotation all season? Before the rest of the roster was announced, I was kind of thinking that she had an outside possibility of playing her way into the end of the draft. |
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Luuuc
#NATC
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| Posted: 01/02/22 1:19 am ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
| Do you think that Clarke will be at the very fringe of the rotation all season? Before the rest of the roster was announced, I was kind of thinking that she had an outside possibility of playing her way into the end of the draft. |
Yeah, I suspect her opportunities will be very limited unless we cop an injury. I guess the one thing in her favour might be the compressed schedule that the Lynx will be dealing with, which should at least see her stepping onto the court - albeit with a short leash - most games.
I like her WNBL potential but can't say I've seen enough to think of her as a draft prospect.
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Michelle89
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awhom111
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IM in OC
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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| Posted: 01/02/22 6:47 pm ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
Spain's next games are on Tuesday, but we have already lost three in addition to the game moved so that Gernika can make up their EuroCup game from when they were unable to play.
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Spain only has two games of 8 scheduled for Tuesday Jan 4th
Girona hosting Duran Ensino
Campus Promote hosting Casademont Zaragoza
Avenida tweeted out they had to cancel the game vs Gran Canaria as they had multiple positives(in the first tier) I guess that means players.
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Luuuc
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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| Posted: 01/02/22 11:45 pm ::: |
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| IM in OC wrote: |
| awhom111 wrote: |
Spain's next games are on Tuesday, but we have already lost three in addition to the game moved so that Gernika can make up their EuroCup game from when they were unable to play.
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Spain only has two games of 8 scheduled for Tuesday Jan 4th
Girona hosting Duran Ensino
Campus Promote hosting Casademont Zaragoza
Avenida tweeted out they had to cancel the game vs Gran Canaria as they had multiple positives(in the first tier) I guess that means players. |
Did you get my PM?
Half expecting the last two games to not make it either. Two in Italy is pretty good I guess because the entire weekend of games in Italy and Spain on the men's side were wiped out. Given that those are the two most vaccinated of the large population western European countries, there are bound to be more issues, especially with leagues that took some kind of holiday break.
Galatasaray had six positive tests among players after already dealing with what seemed like the largest outbreak publicized last season to give us the first postponement in Turkey. |
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IM in OC
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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| Posted: 01/03/22 12:23 am ::: |
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| awhom111 wrote: |
| IM in OC wrote: |
| awhom111 wrote: |
Spain's next games are on Tuesday, but we have already lost three in addition to the game moved so that Gernika can make up their EuroCup game from when they were unable to play.
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Spain only has two games of 8 scheduled for Tuesday Jan 4th
Girona hosting Duran Ensino
Campus Promote hosting Casademont Zaragoza
Avenida tweeted out they had to cancel the game vs Gran Canaria as they had multiple positives(in the first tier) I guess that means players. |
Did you get my PM?
Half expecting the last two games to not make it either. Two in Italy is pretty good I guess because the entire weekend of games in Italy and Spain on the men's side were wiped out. Given that those are the two most vaccinated of the large population western European countries, there are bound to be more issues, especially with leagues that took some kind of holiday break.
Galatasaray had six positive tests among players after already dealing with what seemed like the largest outbreak publicized last season to give us the first postponement in Turkey. |
I responded back with a PM. Never saw a Message notification.
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
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do they have a solid post aswell or online outside shooting?
Future Opals player I think, so I'm looking forward to what she can do this year.