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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 03/31/20 8:55 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

2020 WNBA Mock Draft: Windsr Volume 3

1. New York – Sabrina Ionescu
2. Dallas – Satou Sabally
3. Indiana – Lauren Cox
4. Atlanta – Chennedy Carter
5. Dallas – Ruthy Hebard
6. Minnesota – Tyasha Harris
7. Dallas – Te’a Cooper
8. Chicago – Crystal Dangerfield
9. Dallas – Bella Alarie
10. Phoenix – Mikiah Herbert-Harrigan
11. Seattle – Beatrice Mompremier
12. Washington – Megan Walker



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Last edited by Shades on 03/31/20 9:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
Shades



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Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 03/31/20 9:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Kathleen Doyle's focus shifts toward WNBA Draft
https://www.thegazette.com/subject/sports/hawkeyes/iowa-womens-basketball/kathleen-doyles-focus-shifts-toward-wnba-draft-20200331

Quote:
“I’m focused on the WNBA Draft now,” she said. “I just want to keep playing basketball, and I want to play in the WNBA.”


Quote:
“She’s tough, knows how to distribute and score. Her numbers have improved steadily every year, especially in her senior campaign. She is as solid and well-rounded point guard as any in this draft. A steal for L.A. this late in the game.”

With Carver on lockdown, Doyle focuses on ball-handling drills in her apartment.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:34 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Odds Favor Sabrina Ionescu To Go No. 1 Overall; Other 2020 WNBA Draft Props Available
https://www.sportsbookreview.com/picks/more-sports/odds-favor-sabrina-ionescu-to-go-no-1-overall-other-2020-wnba-draft-props-available/132305/

Will Sabrina Ionescu Be Selected First in the 2020 WNBA Draft?
Yes -2000
No +700

Number of Oregon Players Selected in Top 5 Odds
Two -120
Three or more -110
One +1400
Zero +5000

Second Overall Pick Odds
Satou Sabally -175
Lauren Cox +155
Field +800

Fourth Overall Pick Odds
Chennedy Carter -150
Megan Walker +175
Lauren Cox +700
Field +700

Total Forwards Drafted in First Round Odds
Over 7.5 -120
Under 7.5 -120

Total Guards Drafted in First Round Odds
Over 4.5 -120
Under 4.5 -120



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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 9:08 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://goducks.com/sports/womens-basketball/news/sabally-returns-for-senior-season-040120
Quote:
Back when I first announced my intentions to enter the WNBA draft, the coronavirus wasn’t even a thing to worry about. It was said to be no more serious than the common flu. But now it is clear it is much more serious than that, and as a result the WNBA season will be canceled. So I’ve made the easy decision to return to Oregon to play with my sister and work towards a Masters degree.



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SpaceJunkie



Joined: 10 Sep 2012
Posts: 4241
Location: Minnesota


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 9:19 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
https://goducks.com/sports/womens-basketball/news/sabally-returns-for-senior-season-040120
Quote:
Back when I first announced my intentions to enter the WNBA draft, the coronavirus wasn’t even a thing to worry about. It was said to be no more serious than the common flu. But now it is clear it is much more serious than that, and as a result the WNBA season will be canceled. So I’ve made the easy decision to return to Oregon to play with my sister and work towards a Masters degree.


I was waiting for anything on this. Smile


Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 9:38 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SpaceJunkie wrote:
Shades wrote:
https://goducks.com/sports/womens-basketball/news/sabally-returns-for-senior-season-040120
Quote:
Back when I first announced my intentions to enter the WNBA draft, the coronavirus wasn’t even a thing to worry about. It was said to be no more serious than the common flu. But now it is clear it is much more serious than that, and as a result the WNBA season will be canceled. So I’ve made the easy decision to return to Oregon to play with my sister and work towards a Masters degree.


I was waiting for anything on this. Smile


It’s disappointing, but people had to have known it was coming.



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toad455



Joined: 16 Nov 2005
Posts: 22482
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PostPosted: 04/01/20 9:39 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Louisville's Dana Evans to return to Louisville for her senior year and will NOT enter the WNBA Draft.



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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 9:43 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Louisville's Dana Evans to return to Louisville for her senior year and will NOT enter the WNBA Draft.


https://www.courier-journal.com/story/sports/college/basketball/2020/04/01/louisville-womens-basketball-dana-evans-returns-senior-season/5102668002/



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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63976



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 10:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Oregon Ducks star Sabrina Ionescu wins Senior CLASS Award
https://www.registerguard.com/sports/20200331/oregon-ducks-star-sabrina-ionescu-wins-senior-class-award

Quote:
On Tuesday the senior guard was selected as the winner of the 2019-20 Senior CLASS Award given annually to the most outstanding senior student-athlete in Division I women’s basketball.

Ionescu is the first player from Oregon to win the award, which is voted on by coaches, media and fans. Senior forward Ruthy Hebard was also a finalist this year.



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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
ClayK



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 10:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades, you were right and I was wrong.



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WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 12647
Location: Dallas , Texas


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 10:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
Shades, you were right and I was wrong.



Laughing Laughing Laughing



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PUmatty



Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 16393
Location: Chicago


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 11:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
Shades, you were right and I was wrong.


You might want to click the link ...


DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 12:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
https://goducks.com/sports/womens-basketball/news/sabally-returns-for-senior-season-040120
Quote:
Back when I first announced my intentions to enter the WNBA draft, the coronavirus wasn’t even a thing to worry about. It was said to be no more serious than the common flu. But now it is clear it is much more serious than that, and as a result the WNBA season will be canceled. So I’ve made the easy decision to return to Oregon to play with my sister and work towards a Masters degree.



I shit you not, my heart was pounding so hard, I was about to have a panic attack!!!


PUmatty



Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 16393
Location: Chicago


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 12:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
https://goducks.com/sports/womens-basketball/news/sabally-returns-for-senior-season-040120
Quote:
Back when I first announced my intentions to enter the WNBA draft, the coronavirus wasn’t even a thing to worry about. It was said to be no more serious than the common flu. But now it is clear it is much more serious than that, and as a result the WNBA season will be canceled. So I’ve made the easy decision to return to Oregon to play with my sister and work towards a Masters degree.


Well done.


Rock Hard



Joined: 02 Aug 2010
Posts: 5437
Location: Chocolate Paradise


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 2:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Dubious, indeed. April fools is amateur hour for want to be comedians.



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Hoopsmom



Joined: 05 Apr 2017
Posts: 680



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 3:00 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I have seen several mock drafts that include Ciara Duffy in the third round. Ciara has been quoted often, including in a re-tweet yesterday from Jay Elsen at Midco Sports Network, saying she is done playing basketball. She is getting married in July, and wants to look for a teaching job.


Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 24414
Location: London


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 3:14 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Hoopsmom wrote:
I have seen several mock drafts that include Ciara Duffy in the third round. Ciara has been quoted often, including in a re-tweet yesterday from Jay Elsen at Midco Sports Network, saying she is done playing basketball. She is getting married in July, and wants to look for a teaching job.

Someone who's currently walking away from basketball but whose rights could be retained in case they wanted to return in a year or two might actually be preferred by some teams over a random third-rounder they'll cut after three days of training camp.



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bluedevilaztecfan5



Joined: 16 Mar 2010
Posts: 796
Location: San Diego, CA


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 5:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Cuz it’s April, mock draft:
*not an April fools joke so don’t laugh too hard lol

1. New York- Sabrina Ionescu G 5’11
Franchise changing talent, amazing playmaker, welcome to the big apple.
2. Dallas- Satou Sabally F 6’4
Super talented forward, can beat 4s (and 3s) with her quickness, and big height advantage over 3s (and some 4s).
3. Indiana- Lauren Cox F/C 6’4
Great defensive player, good passer, inside-out game with range should pair well with McCowan.
4. Atlanta- Chennedy Carter G 5’7
Dynamic, explosive scorer who can get her own shots with the ability to create for others with the defensive attention she draws. Better shooting version of Courtney Williams, and the Dream have another great 2 guard in Hayes. But because of her ballhandling and 1on1 game I give her the slight edge over my next pick.
5. Dallas- Megan Walker F 6’1
I think I’m in the minority, but I think she is ready for the W and the Wings are fortunate to stockpile talent. She scores a lot, efficiently, from deep, cuts to the basket, takes contact and 1, curls and pull up jumpers. She can also find the open teammate, rebound well, get you some steals and occasional block. Unfortunate for her to go to Dallas (Sabally, Thornton, Gray, Samuelson, Ogunbowale).
6. Minnesota- Ruthy Hebard C/F 6’4
I realize Sims is out for a bit, but I like Ruthy over Tyasha and Crystal. Lynx get an amazingly efficient finisher in the paint, who rebounds well, is strong with a big body. While not taking them often she has a nice midrange jumper I’ve seen on rare occasions, maybe play some 4 too.
7. Dallas- Beatrice Mompremier F/C 6’4
Physically gifted, working on expanding her range. Efficient FG%, great rebounder. Wings go with potential and get a solid point guard regardless with their next pick.
8. Chicago- Tyasha Harris G 5’10
Good passing ability, nice height, plays the passing lanes, good A:TO, calming presence for your floor general. Gets to learn from Vandersloot, and maybe play alongside her in the future if she keeps working on the jumper.
9. Dallas- Crystal Dangerfield G 5’5
After picking two forwards and a post, Wings get a point. Plays the passing lane well, love her jumpshot, and she can get assists. Good backup with imo potential to be a starter.
10. Phoenix- T’ea CooperG 5’8
Mercury get a talented guard who can shoot the ball, score in a variety of ways as well as make plays for others. She also plays the passing lane well.
11. Seattle- Mikayla Pivec G 5’10
Maybe my biggest ‘reach’. I really like her physicality, she’s got a great nose for the ball. Her rebounding is amazing, she can pass and take a lot of contact and finish in the paint in traffic. If she can work on that outside shot to become more of a threat, she could have gone higher. Not sure Magbegors plans but this is a tough place to be drafted this year.
12. Washington- Bella Alarie F 6’4
Talented and versatile scorer, inside out threat. Blocks shots and rebounds well, solid athlete, fairly fluid for a big. I was higher on her when the season started and wouldn’t mind if she slipped to 13.
13. New York- Kiah Gillespie F 6’2
She’s a good scorer inside, and has expanded the range past the 3pt line (not efficient though). Good rebounder. Could challenge Gray for her spot if that shot falls in training camp.


tfan



Joined: 31 May 2010
Posts: 9816



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PostPosted: 04/01/20 6:43 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Kathleen Doyle's focus shifts toward WNBA Draft
https://www.thegazette.com/subject/sports/hawkeyes/iowa-womens-basketball/kathleen-doyles-focus-shifts-toward-wnba-draft-20200331

Quote:
“I’m focused on the WNBA Draft now,” she said. “I just want to keep playing basketball, and I want to play in the WNBA.”


Quote:
“She’s tough, knows how to distribute and score. Her numbers have improved steadily every year, especially in her senior campaign. She is as solid and well-rounded point guard as any in this draft. A steal for L.A. this late in the game.”

With Carver on lockdown, Doyle focuses on ball-handling drills in her apartment.


Nicole Kubik, Samantha Logic, Tori Jankoski.


WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 12647
Location: Dallas , Texas


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 6:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Cuz it’s April, mock draft:
*not an April fools joke so don’t laugh too hard lol

1. New York- Sabrina Ionescu G 5’11
Franchise changing talent, amazing playmaker, welcome to the big apple.
2. Dallas- Satou Sabally F 6’4
Super talented forward, can beat 4s (and 3s) with her quickness, and big height advantage over 3s (and some 4s).
3. Indiana- Lauren Cox F/C 6’4
Great defensive player, good passer, inside-out game with range should pair well with McCowan.
4. Atlanta- Chennedy Carter G 5’7
Dynamic, explosive scorer who can get her own shots with the ability to create for others with the defensive attention she draws. Better shooting version of Courtney Williams, and the Dream have another great 2 guard in Hayes. But because of her ballhandling and 1on1 game I give her the slight edge over my next pick.
5. Dallas- Megan Walker F 6’1
I think I’m in the minority, but I think she is ready for the W and the Wings are fortunate to stockpile talent. She scores a lot, efficiently, from deep, cuts to the basket, takes contact and 1, curls and pull up jumpers. She can also find the open teammate, rebound well, get you some steals and occasional block. Unfortunate for her to go to Dallas (Sabally, Thornton, Gray, Samuelson, Ogunbowale).
6. Minnesota- Ruthy Hebard C/F 6’4
I realize Sims is out for a bit, but I like Ruthy over Tyasha and Crystal. Lynx get an amazingly efficient finisher in the paint, who rebounds well, is strong with a big body. While not taking them often she has a nice midrange jumper I’ve seen on rare occasions, maybe play some 4 too.
7. Dallas- Beatrice Mompremier F/C 6’4
Physically gifted, working on expanding her range. Efficient FG%, great rebounder. Wings go with potential and get a solid point guard regardless with their next pick.
8. Chicago- Tyasha Harris G 5’10
Good passing ability, nice height, plays the passing lanes, good A:TO, calming presence for your floor general. Gets to learn from Vandersloot, and maybe play alongside her in the future if she keeps working on the jumper.
9. Dallas- Crystal Dangerfield G 5’5
After picking two forwards and a post, Wings get a point. Plays the passing lane well, love her jumpshot, and she can get assists. Good backup with imo potential to be a starter.
10. Phoenix- T’ea CooperG 5’8
Mercury get a talented guard who can shoot the ball, score in a variety of ways as well as make plays for others. She also plays the passing lane well.
11. Seattle- Mikayla Pivec G 5’10
Maybe my biggest ‘reach’. I really like her physicality, she’s got a great nose for the ball. Her rebounding is amazing, she can pass and take a lot of contact and finish in the paint in traffic. If she can work on that outside shot to become more of a threat, she could have gone higher. Not sure Magbegors plans but this is a tough place to be drafted this year.
12. Washington- Bella Alarie F 6’4
Talented and versatile scorer, inside out threat. Blocks shots and rebounds well, solid athlete, fairly fluid for a big. I was higher on her when the season started and wouldn’t mind if she slipped to 13.
13. New York- Kiah Gillespie F 6’2
She’s a good scorer inside, and has expanded the range past the 3pt line (not efficient though). Good rebounder. Could challenge Gray for her spot if that shot falls in training camp.



This actually wasn't that bad , im sure certain Minnesota fans may have something to say about the pick at 6 though . I like our picks *Dallas* , im still not 100% convinced of Sabally over Cox yet ....almost , but just not yet (DFwdub) Very Happy Very Happy Cool Cool



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adamj95



Joined: 09 May 2014
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Location: East Grand Forks, MN


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I really like Ruthy Hebard, and I know Lynx need a guard, but It'd be hard to pass her up. Lynx are going to have options next year for guards so if they have to use someone short term for a year, I'm okay with that.



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Randy



Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Seems to me that this year's draft is clearly BPA because the season probably won't be played and there will be another draft next year to fill in the roster shortcomings


DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Cuz it’s April, mock draft:
*not an April fools joke so don’t laugh too hard lol

1. New York- Sabrina Ionescu G 5’11
Franchise changing talent, amazing playmaker, welcome to the big apple.
2. Dallas- Satou Sabally F 6’4
Super talented forward, can beat 4s (and 3s) with her quickness, and big height advantage over 3s (and some 4s).
3. Indiana- Lauren Cox F/C 6’4
Great defensive player, good passer, inside-out game with range should pair well with McCowan.
4. Atlanta- Chennedy Carter G 5’7
Dynamic, explosive scorer who can get her own shots with the ability to create for others with the defensive attention she draws. Better shooting version of Courtney Williams, and the Dream have another great 2 guard in Hayes. But because of her ballhandling and 1on1 game I give her the slight edge over my next pick.
5. Dallas- Megan Walker F 6’1
I think I’m in the minority, but I think she is ready for the W and the Wings are fortunate to stockpile talent. She scores a lot, efficiently, from deep, cuts to the basket, takes contact and 1, curls and pull up jumpers. She can also find the open teammate, rebound well, get you some steals and occasional block. Unfortunate for her to go to Dallas (Sabally, Thornton, Gray, Samuelson, Ogunbowale).
6. Minnesota- Ruthy Hebard C/F 6’4
I realize Sims is out for a bit, but I like Ruthy over Tyasha and Crystal. Lynx get an amazingly efficient finisher in the paint, who rebounds well, is strong with a big body. While not taking them often she has a nice midrange jumper I’ve seen on rare occasions, maybe play some 4 too.
7. Dallas- Beatrice Mompremier F/C 6’4
Physically gifted, working on expanding her range. Efficient FG%, great rebounder. Wings go with potential and get a solid point guard regardless with their next pick.
8. Chicago- Tyasha Harris G 5’10
Good passing ability, nice height, plays the passing lanes, good A:TO, calming presence for your floor general. Gets to learn from Vandersloot, and maybe play alongside her in the future if she keeps working on the jumper.
9. Dallas- Crystal Dangerfield G 5’5
After picking two forwards and a post, Wings get a point. Plays the passing lane well, love her jumpshot, and she can get assists. Good backup with imo potential to be a starter.
10. Phoenix- T’ea CooperG 5’8
Mercury get a talented guard who can shoot the ball, score in a variety of ways as well as make plays for others. She also plays the passing lane well.
11. Seattle- Mikayla Pivec G 5’10
Maybe my biggest ‘reach’. I really like her physicality, she’s got a great nose for the ball. Her rebounding is amazing, she can pass and take a lot of contact and finish in the paint in traffic. If she can work on that outside shot to become more of a threat, she could have gone higher. Not sure Magbegors plans but this is a tough place to be drafted this year.
12. Washington- Bella Alarie F 6’4
Talented and versatile scorer, inside out threat. Blocks shots and rebounds well, solid athlete, fairly fluid for a big. I was higher on her when the season started and wouldn’t mind if she slipped to 13.
13. New York- Kiah Gillespie F 6’2
She’s a good scorer inside, and has expanded the range past the 3pt line (not efficient though). Good rebounder. Could challenge Gray for her spot if that shot falls in training camp.


No complaints here 🤓👍


DFWub2018



Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
bluedevilaztecfan5 wrote:
Cuz it’s April, mock draft:
*not an April fools joke so don’t laugh too hard lol

1. New York- Sabrina Ionescu G 5’11
Franchise changing talent, amazing playmaker, welcome to the big apple.
2. Dallas- Satou Sabally F 6’4
Super talented forward, can beat 4s (and 3s) with her quickness, and big height advantage over 3s (and some 4s).
3. Indiana- Lauren Cox F/C 6’4
Great defensive player, good passer, inside-out game with range should pair well with McCowan.
4. Atlanta- Chennedy Carter G 5’7
Dynamic, explosive scorer who can get her own shots with the ability to create for others with the defensive attention she draws. Better shooting version of
Courtney Williams, and the Dream have another great 2 guard in Hayes. But because of her ballhandling and 1on1 game I give her the slight edge over my next pick.

5. Dallas- Megan Walker F 6’1
I think I’m in the minority, but I think she is ready for the W and the Wings are fortunate to stockpile talent. She scores a lot, efficiently, from deep, cuts to the basket, takes contact and 1, curls and pull up jumpers. She can also find the open teammate, rebound well, get you some steals and occasional block. Unfortunate for her to go to Dallas (Sabally, Thornton, Gray, Samuelson, Ogunbowale).
6. Minnesota- Ruthy Hebard C/F 6’4
I realize Sims is out for a bit, but I like Ruthy over Tyasha and Crystal. Lynx get an amazingly efficient finisher in the paint, who rebounds well, is strong with a big body. While not taking them often she has a nice midrange jumper I’ve seen on rare occasions, maybe play some 4 too.
7. Dallas- Beatrice Mompremier F/C 6’4
Physically gifted, working on expanding her range. Efficient FG%, great
rebounder. Wings go with potential and get a solid point guard regardless with their next pick.

8. Chicago- Tyasha Harris G 5’10
Good passing ability, nice height, plays the passing lanes, good A:TO, calming presence for your floor general. Gets to learn from Vandersloot, and maybe play alongside her in the future if she keeps working on the jumper.
9. Dallas- Crystal Dangerfield G 5’5
After picking two forwards and a post, Wings get a point. Plays the passing lane well, love her jumpshot, and she can get assists. Good backup with imo potential to be a starter.
10. Phoenix- T’ea CooperG 5’8
Mercury get a talented guard who can shoot the ball, score in a variety of ways as well as make plays for others. She also plays the passing lane well.
11. Seattle- Mikayla Pivec G 5’10
Maybe my biggest ‘reach’. I really like her physicality, she’s got a great nose for the ball. Her rebounding is amazing, she can pass and take a lot of contact and finish in the paint in traffic. If she can work on that outside shot to become more of a threat, she could have gone higher. Not sure Magbegors plans but this is a tough place to be drafted this year.
12. Washington- Bella Alarie F 6’4
Talented and versatile scorer, inside out threat. Blocks shots and rebounds well, solid athlete, fairly fluid for a big. I was higher on her when the season started and wouldn’t mind if she slipped to 13.
13. New York- Kiah Gillespie F 6’2
She’s a good scorer inside, and has expanded the range past the 3pt line (not efficient though). Good rebounder. Could challenge Gray for her spot if that shot falls in training camp.



This actually wasn't that bad , im sure certain Minnesota fans may have something to say about the pick at 6 though . I like our picks *Dallas* , im still not 100% convinced of Sabally over Cox yet ....almost , but just not yet (DFwdub) Very Happy Very Happy Cool Cool


LMAO...we still have a little time left to covert you 🙉


Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 24414
Location: London


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PostPosted: 04/01/20 8:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
Seems to me that this year's draft is clearly BPA because the season probably won't be played and there will be another draft next year to fill in the roster shortcomings

Yeah, I was just thinking about whether any picks would change due to teams thinking there might not be a 2020 season at all. Drafting for need is generally a bad idea, but it becomes especially pointless if there's going to be another offseason and another draft before we play any more games. I doubt it changes too many choices, but it might be another factor that they at least add to the pile.



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