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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009
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 Posted: 04/01/23 10:24 am ::: Say What, Dawn? |
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Apparently, Staley went off on the media.
| Quote: |
| "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters," Staley said. "I do think that that's sometimes brought into the game, and it hurts." |
It DID look like a bar fight at times last night. Going into the paint and rebounding was not for the faint of heart. Bodies on the floor everywhere.
The only racist words that I've seen, that I'm aware of, to describe SC were from Dawn. (I don't like that "thug" is becoming/has become a word to exclusively mean black people. In my small part of the world I see more white thugs than anything.)
| Quote: |
| Staley implored the room of media members to not judge her team by the color of their skin, but the way they play the game. |
| Quote: |
| "You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it, that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. |
| Quote: |
| "I'm not changing. We found success in it, and maybe some days like today, we end up on the losing side of the stick. But guess what? We live to see another day. We live to see the comeback next year and try to do this again because I'm not changing." |
Dawn seems to me to be the one that is always injecting race into things.
Am I wrong?? Is she right??
I realize that words are ever-changing in meaning. Dawn needs to realize that just because a word in her world has changed, that doesn't mean that it has changed just as fast in everyone's world. It seems to me, that when words change, they do it s l o w l y. Until it comes to race. She doesn't get to waive a magic wand, change a word and then tell me that I'm wrong.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaw/2023/04/01/dawn-staley-calls-out-media-bar-fight-comments-final-four/11582968002/
_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 04/01/23 11:52 am ::: |
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| She does seem over-sensitive to me - like she sees racism in every word spoken. To some extent I understand it because there IS a lot of racism in America. But her equating anything and everything said about her team as being racism is just beyond reason. Her team does play extremely physical (and sometimes it borders on dirty play - lots of grabbing, pushing, elbowing, simply running over others) and it cracks me up when their bigs act incredulous when fouls are called on them. While it is great she stands up for her team, I also think perhaps while doing so persistently she is inculcating more racism than dispelling it. To me, it's become almost reverse racism. It would be more effective if she ranted once in awhile, rather than every time she gets behind a mic. JMO
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/01/23 12:22 pm ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| She does seem over-sensitive to me - like she sees racism in every word spoken. To some extent I understand it because there IS a lot of racism in America. But her equating anything and everything said about her team as being racism is just beyond reason. Her team does play extremely physical (and sometimes it borders on dirty play - lots of grabbing, pushing, elbowing, simply running over others) and it cracks me up when their bigs act incredulous when fouls are called on them. While it is great she stands up for her team, I also think perhaps while doing so persistently she is inculcating more racism than dispelling it. To me, it's become almost reverse racism. It would be more effective if she ranted once in awhile, rather than every time she gets behind a mic. JMO |
I respectfully disagree. Racism, replete with code words, is so main stream that people not attuned to it seem to miss it. And make no mistake, white people use code words all the time to refer to people of color. Absolutely the majority of people in this country who are committing mass murders and murders targeting people of color, LGBTQ people and Jews are white people. Those are the true thugs. But that word is commonly used as code for "Black person I feel threatened by."
Now, would I love to see Dawn's team run a more beautiful offense and - instead of jacking up tons of shots - they run more plays to get their bigs (& others) open instead of relying on offensive putbacks? Absolutely. Do I love that a skilled, in synch offensive machine outscored them? Absolutely. Do I care that the team that beat them is mostly full of white players? Well, I wish they had a better mix which included more players of color. It is hard for those midwestern schools, who have a great history of basketball teams composed almost exclusively of white players, it's hard to get a great player of color to commit to breaking that color barrier. The schools have to do a better job of showing how they enhance the experience of students of color across the board for this to happen.
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. But the term "racism" exclusively means that white people hold the power in the structures of the country and have used that majority to favor white people exclusively. Check the history of the New Deal programs and SO many others that blatantly excluded all people of color from benefitting, thus creating the disparity in generational wealth between white people and all people of color. When people of color discriminate against white people and people of other colors, it's simply discrimination. "Reverse racism" is a fabricated term that has no meaning. I say this as a person who has been discriminated against in the workplace by people of color. It is horrible to experience and I am not at all downplaying its' effect on those affected by it. I'm simply saying the term "reverse racism" does not exist and people should not use it.
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Ex-Ref
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| Posted: 04/01/23 12:35 pm ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| She does seem over-sensitive to me - like she sees racism in every word spoken. To some extent I understand it because there IS a lot of racism in America. But her equating anything and everything said about her team as being racism is just beyond reason. Her team does play extremely physical (and sometimes it borders on dirty play - lots of grabbing, pushing, elbowing, simply running over others) and it cracks me up when their bigs act incredulous when fouls are called on them. While it is great she stands up for her team, I also think perhaps while doing so persistently she is inculcating more racism than dispelling it. To me, it's become almost reverse racism. It would be more effective if she ranted once in awhile, rather than every time she gets behind a mic. JMO |
Thank you for adding some clarity to what I was thinking/feeling.
I keep going back to these two quotes:
| Quote: |
| Staley implored the room of media members to not judge her team by the color of their skin, but the way they play the game. |
What says that they are judging by color of their skin and not the style of their play? Listening to her press conference, she didn't even hear what was supposedly said about them. It was something that was passed on to her from someone else who overheard it out in public. Did they hear all of the conversation or only hear a few words and put something together that barely resembled what was said and nothing about what was meant?
ucbart, in the gameday thread, said that Dawn is always playing the victim. I agree. And it gets old. And it's why I don't like Dawn. And why I'm glad her team lost last night.
It's crazy that her players always seem to show so much poise. Boston and Johnson (what a great game she played when she finally started shooting!) were great in the presser. Poised and gracious in what had to be a very publicly painful moment for them. Good for them and good for their parents.
| Quote: |
| "You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it, that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. |
She's so unapologetic about how she coaches and her team plays. Why is she so upset about how others describe it? I'd say if she doesn't like how her coaching and team play is described, maybe SHE is the one that needs to change the way things are done.
_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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Michael
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 601
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| Posted: 04/01/23 12:49 pm ::: Re: Say What, Dawn? |
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| Ex-Ref wrote: |
Apparently, Staley went off on the media.
| Quote: |
| "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters," Staley said. "I do think that that's sometimes brought into the game, and it hurts." |
It DID look like a bar fight at times last night. Going into the paint and rebounding was not for the faint of heart. Bodies on the floor everywhere.
The only racist words that I've seen, that I'm aware of, to describe SC were from Dawn. (I don't like that "thug" is becoming/has become a word to exclusively mean black people. In my small part of the world I see more white thugs than anything.)
| Quote: |
| Staley implored the room of media members to not judge her team by the color of their skin, but the way they play the game. |
| Quote: |
| "You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it, that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. |
| Quote: |
| "I'm not changing. We found success in it, and maybe some days like today, we end up on the losing side of the stick. But guess what? We live to see another day. We live to see the comeback next year and try to do this again because I'm not changing." |
Dawn seems to me to be the one that is always injecting race into things.
Am I wrong?? Is she right??
I realize that words are ever-changing in meaning. Dawn needs to realize that just because a word in her world has changed, that doesn't mean that it has changed just as fast in everyone's world. It seems to me, that when words change, they do it s l o w l y. Until it comes to race. She doesn't get to waive a magic wand, change a word and then tell me that I'm wrong.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaw/2023/04/01/dawn-staley-calls-out-media-bar-fight-comments-final-four/11582968002/ |
Remember she is the same coach that cancelled a wbball game with BYU for something supposedly said at a Volleyball game that ended up never being substantiated..... IMO she is way oversensitive and her team does play a rough style of play often referred to as thug ball. It worked for the Bad Boys of Detroit, and it works for her team, but the difference is Detroit acknowledged they played on the edge of dirty and dared you to beat them anyway. Dawn wants to turn the game into a brawl down low but not be called out on it. Tough luck!! To equate the barroom fight comment with Racism is someone looking to make EVERYTHING racism and is not truly listening to what anyone outside of her inner cirlcle is saying.
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Michael
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 04/01/23 12:59 pm ::: |
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| i’d like to hear what our resident Black posters have to say here, if they’d like to say anything.
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Ex-Ref
Joined: 04 Oct 2009
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| Posted: 04/01/23 1:13 pm ::: |
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| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
| Racism, replete with code words, is so main stream that people not attuned to it seem to miss it. And make no mistake, white people use code words all the time to refer to people of color. Those are the true thugs. But that word is commonly used as code for "Black person I feel threatened by." |
Black people sure know a lot about what white people are thinking. It's really nice of them that they take the time to tell white people what white people are thinking. You know, because white people don't know what is going on in their own head.
| Quote: |
| Do I care that the team that beat them is mostly full of white players? Well, I wish they had a better mix which included more players of color. It is hard for those midwestern schools, who have a great history of basketball teams composed almost exclusively of white players, it's hard to get a great player of color to commit to breaking that color barrier. The schools have to do a better job of showing how they enhance the experience of students of color across the board for this to happen. |
South Carolina has two white players. I'll wait while you go look at Iowa's team and tell me how many black players they have.
_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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PRballer
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
Posts: 2544
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| Posted: 04/01/23 1:39 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| i’d like to hear what our resident Black posters have to say here, if they’d like to say anything. |
Asking Black folks to opine and discuss their feelings about racism is part of the problem. Words and tone matter. Black people don’t owe you an explanation of their feelings or a reaction.
I can sense from you and your posts on here that you don’t mean to be insensitive or uphold white supremacy at all, but just asking you to think twice before making that request.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 04/01/23 1:44 pm ::: |
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| PRballer wrote: |
| Stormeo wrote: |
| i’d like to hear what our resident Black posters have to say here, if they’d like to say anything. |
Asking Black folks to opine and discuss their feelings about racism is part of the problem. Words and tone matter. Black people don’t owe you an explanation of their feelings or a reaction.
I can sense from you and your posts on here that you don’t mean to be insensitive or uphold white supremacy at all, but just asking you to think twice before making that request. |
hence the “if they’d like to say anything”
just don’t want the opposite to happen where their voices go unheard or their thoughts get left out of a specific conversation that at least partially involves being Black
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PRballer
Joined: 18 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:04 pm ::: Re: Say What, Dawn? |
Reply |
|
| Ex-Ref wrote: |
Apparently, Staley went off on the media.
| Quote: |
| "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters," Staley said. "I do think that that's sometimes brought into the game, and it hurts." |
It DID look like a bar fight at times last night. Going into the paint and rebounding was not for the faint of heart. Bodies on the floor everywhere.
The only racist words that I've seen, that I'm aware of, to describe SC were from Dawn. (I don't like that "thug" is becoming/has become a word to exclusively mean black people. In my small part of the world I see more white thugs than anything.)
| Quote: |
| Staley implored the room of media members to not judge her team by the color of their skin, but the way they play the game. |
| Quote: |
| "You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it, that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. |
| Quote: |
| "I'm not changing. We found success in it, and maybe some days like today, we end up on the losing side of the stick. But guess what? We live to see another day. We live to see the comeback next year and try to do this again because I'm not changing." |
Dawn seems to me to be the one that is always injecting race into things.
Am I wrong?? Is she right??
I realize that words are ever-changing in meaning. Dawn needs to realize that just because a word in her world has changed, that doesn't mean that it has changed just as fast in everyone's world. It seems to me, that when words change, they do it s l o w l y. Until it comes to race. She doesn't get to waive a magic wand, change a word and then tell me that I'm wrong.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaw/2023/04/01/dawn-staley-calls-out-media-bar-fight-comments-final-four/11582968002/ |
I find a lot of this and your follow up commentary fairly asinine but a few things to point out:
-before popping off about Dawn and what she is “injecting” into things maybe watch the press conference? She calls out the national media and particular reporters who have said things about her team - . 15:45 or so https://youtu.be/gKyL4gQj3Vw
-just because you don’t see the problem in using then term “thug” to describe a group of Black athletes as problematic doesn’t mean it isn’t
-this is not a new thing that’s “becoming” - it’s an old racist term and I would suggest you stop using it.
So yes, I will answer your question directly that you posed in a public forum.
You’re wrong. Dawn is right.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:15 pm ::: |
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| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
Racism, replete with code words, is so main stream that people not attuned to it seem to miss it. And make no mistake, white people use code words all the time to refer to people of color. Absolutely the majority of people in this country who are committing mass murders and murders targeting people of color, LGBTQ people and Jews are white people. Those are the true thugs. But that word is commonly used as code for "Black person I feel threatened by."
Now, would I love to see Dawn's team run a more beautiful offense and - instead of jacking up tons of shots - they run more plays to get their bigs (& others) open instead of relying on offensive putbacks? Absolutely. Do I love that a skilled, in synch offensive machine outscored them? Absolutely. Do I care that the team that beat them is mostly full of white players? Well, I wish they had a better mix which included more players of color. It is hard for those midwestern schools, who have a great history of basketball teams composed almost exclusively of white players, it's hard to get a great player of color to commit to breaking that color barrier. The schools have to do a better job of showing how they enhance the experience of students of color across the board for this to happen.
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. But the term "racism" exclusively means that white people hold the power in the structures of the country and have used that majority to favor white people exclusively. Check the history of the New Deal programs and SO many others that blatantly excluded all people of color from benefitting, thus creating the disparity in generational wealth between white people and all people of color. When people of color discriminate against white people and people of other colors, it's simply discrimination. "Reverse racism" is a fabricated term that has no meaning. I say this as a person who has been discriminated against in the workplace by people of color. It is horrible to experience and I am not at all downplaying its' effect on those affected by it. I'm simply saying the term "reverse racism" does not exist and people should not use it. |
i love everything you had to say here – and how you said it. i totally agree & identify with this.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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Location: Where the action is
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:21 pm ::: Re: Say What, Dawn? |
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| Ex-Ref wrote: |
| (I don't like that "thug" is becoming/has become a word to exclusively mean black people. In my small part of the world I see more white thugs than anything.) |
I don't like it either, but that's the way it is
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I ain't got a home
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NoDakSt
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:39 pm ::: |
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| Some may call it whining or “playing the victim”. Some may say she’s telling HER TRUTH.
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PG4ever
Joined: 14 May 2020
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:40 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
Racism, replete with code words, is so main stream that people not attuned to it seem to miss it. And make no mistake, white people use code words all the time to refer to people of color. Absolutely the majority of people in this country who are committing mass murders and murders targeting people of color, LGBTQ people and Jews are white people. Those are the true thugs. But that word is commonly used as code for "Black person I feel threatened by."
Now, would I love to see Dawn's team run a more beautiful offense and - instead of jacking up tons of shots - they run more plays to get their bigs (& others) open instead of relying on offensive putbacks? Absolutely. Do I love that a skilled, in synch offensive machine outscored them? Absolutely. Do I care that the team that beat them is mostly full of white players? Well, I wish they had a better mix which included more players of color. It is hard for those midwestern schools, who have a great history of basketball teams composed almost exclusively of white players, it's hard to get a great player of color to commit to breaking that color barrier. The schools have to do a better job of showing how they enhance the experience of students of color across the board for this to happen.
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. But the term "racism" exclusively means that white people hold the power in the structures of the country and have used that majority to favor white people exclusively. Check the history of the New Deal programs and SO many others that blatantly excluded all people of color from benefitting, thus creating the disparity in generational wealth between white people and all people of color. When people of color discriminate against white people and people of other colors, it's simply discrimination. "Reverse racism" is a fabricated term that has no meaning. I say this as a person who has been discriminated against in the workplace by people of color. It is horrible to experience and I am not at all downplaying its' effect on those affected by it. I'm simply saying the term "reverse racism" does not exist and people should not use it. |
i love everything you had to say here – and how you said it. i totally agree & identify with this. |
This.
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undersized_post
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
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| Posted: 04/01/23 2:48 pm ::: |
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I would to kindly point out that Gabbie Marshall is Black. She is relatively light skinned and white passing at times -- which of course has its privileges (colorism is a nasty thing in itself) -- but please get your facts straight before you start assuming things about people's identities.
In fact, two of Iowa's six most important players (I would argue) are Black.
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PickledGinger
Joined: 04 Oct 2013
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| Posted: 04/01/23 3:09 pm ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| She does seem over-sensitive to me - like she sees racism in every word spoken. To some extent I understand it because there IS a lot of racism in America. But her equating anything and everything said about her team as being racism is just beyond reason. Her team does play extremely physical (and sometimes it borders on dirty play - lots of grabbing, pushing, elbowing, simply running over others) and it cracks me up when their bigs act incredulous when fouls are called on them. While it is great she stands up for her team, I also think perhaps while doing so persistently she is inculcating more racism than dispelling it. To me, it's become almost reverse racism. It would be more effective if she ranted once in awhile, rather than every time she gets behind a mic. JMO |
Hey, I learned a new word today! Thanks Myrtle.
I also completely agree with your usage of it. This reminds me of the time a woman came up to me on the street and yelled "just because you're gay doesn't mean you're not a chauvinist" right in my face. The statement itself was absolutely correct, but it seemed to be a counterpoint to a argument that was never made; at least not by me.
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Unspoken expectations are just premeditated resentments.
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barryi22
Joined: 10 Mar 2005
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| Posted: 04/01/23 3:45 pm ::: |
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I've always felt Dawn calls it how she sees it. I'm not black but can respect her perspective even if I don't always see things in the same light she does (ex. her canceling the BYU game). Not the same conversation but along political/racial lines, she started out the press conference thanking the Dallas police department for doing a good job moving the team around the city this week which reaches across the barrier of some racial/social lines in today's world.
In regards to her team, I think she has every right be stand up and be extremely defensive of her players. They're all well to do kids who are unselfish, work their butts off, play hard and they're great reps for the university. They don't have off the court issues and have helped draw in a ton of fans for women's basketball. They interview well, are respectful, and also happen to be predominantly black. I've never seen them play dirty, lose their cool or make cheap shots at opposing players. They're a great group of players on and off the court, but the general vibe with how people talk about SC or her team doesn't reflect this. There's sometimes more of a negative connotation due to style of play, and they're physical but I think people sometimes dismiss them as being dirty players which I think is very off base.
For comparison, I think a lot of Pat's teams or Vic's teams at MSU had similar qualities to South Carolina in these areas but received more positive feedback for their coaching/playing style, where South Carolina doesn't get the same credit. Both of those programs had white coaches, while Dawn is black. Is the difference in perception racially motivated? I don't think I'm in a position to make that conclusion, but I can 100% understand if Dawn believes that's the case or that it contributes to it.
Last edited by barryi22 on 04/01/23 5:37 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 04/01/23 3:51 pm ::: |
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| barryi22 wrote: |
I've always felt Dawn calls it how she sees it. I'm not black but can respect her perspective even if I don't always see things in the same light she does (ex. her canceling the BYU game). Not the same conversation but along political/racial lines, she started out the press conference thanking the Dallas police department for doing a good job moving the team around the city this week which reaches across the barrier of some racial/social lines in today's world.
In regards to her team, I think she has every right be stand up and be extremely defensive of her players. They're all well to do kids who are unselfish, work their butts off, play hard and they're great reps for the university. They don't have off the court issues and have helped draw in a ton of fans for women's basketball. They interview well, are respectful, and also happen to be predominantly black. I've never seen them play dirty, lose their cool or make cheap shots at opposing players. They're a great group of players on and off the court, but the general vibe with how people talk about SC or her team doesn't reflect this. There's sometimes more of a negative connotation due to style of play, and they're physical but I think people sometimes dismiss them as being dirty players which I think is very off base.
For comparison, I think a lot of Pat's teams or Vic's teams at MSU had similar qualities to South Carolina in these areas but received more positive feedback for their coaching/playing style, where South Carolina doesn't get the same credit. Both of those programs had white coaches, while Dawn is black. Is it difference in perception racially motivated? I don't think I'm in a position to make that conclusion, but I can 100% understand if Dawn believes that's the case or that it contributes to it. |
^^^^THIS^^^^ And I do not think "bar fight" means what some of y'all think it means.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 04/01/23 3:53 pm ::: |
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| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. |
I think you just described reverse racism while saying it doesn't exist.
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
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| Posted: 04/01/23 3:55 pm ::: |
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Considering she probably knows the exact person or people that said it or who was involved in the conversation it's probably a little easier for her to imply the meaning behind it than others when she just addresses it to a general group of people instead of calling out people by name, or there are more direct things that were said but she chose not to say them specifically because she felt she already touched on it in her words.
And if in that conversation one of the things that was said in "they are monkeys" are to something to that effect, I think assumed that "thug" is meant in more of a racial/negative term than a positive one.
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Iluvacc
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Ex-Ref
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| Posted: 04/01/23 5:26 pm ::: Re: Say What, Dawn? |
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| PRballer wrote: |
| Ex-Ref wrote: |
Apparently, Staley went off on the media.
| Quote: |
| "We're not bar fighters. We're not thugs. We're not monkeys. We're not street fighters," Staley said. "I do think that that's sometimes brought into the game, and it hurts." |
It DID look like a bar fight at times last night. Going into the paint and rebounding was not for the faint of heart. Bodies on the floor everywhere.
The only racist words that I've seen, that I'm aware of, to describe SC were from Dawn. (I don't like that "thug" is becoming/has become a word to exclusively mean black people. In my small part of the world I see more white thugs than anything.)
| Quote: |
| Staley implored the room of media members to not judge her team by the color of their skin, but the way they play the game. |
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| "You may not like how we play the game, you may not like it, that's the way we play. That's the way I coach. |
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| "I'm not changing. We found success in it, and maybe some days like today, we end up on the losing side of the stick. But guess what? We live to see another day. We live to see the comeback next year and try to do this again because I'm not changing." |
Dawn seems to me to be the one that is always injecting race into things.
Am I wrong?? Is she right??
I realize that words are ever-changing in meaning. Dawn needs to realize that just because a word in her world has changed, that doesn't mean that it has changed just as fast in everyone's world. It seems to me, that when words change, they do it s l o w l y. Until it comes to race. She doesn't get to waive a magic wand, change a word and then tell me that I'm wrong.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaw/2023/04/01/dawn-staley-calls-out-media-bar-fight-comments-final-four/11582968002/ |
I find a lot of this and your follow up commentary fairly asinine but a few things to point out:
-before popping off about Dawn and what she is “injecting” into things maybe watch the press conference? She calls out the national media and particular reporters who have said things about her team - . 15:45 or so https://youtu.be/gKyL4gQj3Vw
-just because you don’t see the problem in using then term “thug” to describe a group of Black athletes as problematic doesn’t mean it isn’t
-this is not a new thing that’s “becoming” - it’s an old racist term and I would suggest you stop using it.
So yes, I will answer your question directly that you posed in a public forum.
You’re wrong. Dawn is right. |
1) I have watched the presser. If she wants to call out people, call THEM out. She paints with the same broads strokes that she is railing against.
2) Who gets to define the words one chooses? I'll agree that there are a few exceptions, but mostly I think that it should be the person who is using the words. You know, until Dawn puts out a dictionary of words that she finds racist.
3) I say it's new, you say it's old. I gave context (s l o w l y) for my definition of "new." What is your context for "old?"
4) What is the purpose of using "directly that you posed in a public forum"? Because where I come from, that's anti-white. (See how that works?)
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"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw
“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Posts: 19752
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| Posted: 04/01/23 5:42 pm ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. |
I think you just described reverse racism while saying it doesn't exist. |
Racism is a system of oppression based on race. White people don’t experience oppression based on race - thus you can not be racist against white people (ie - reverse racism)
You can be prejudiced. But there is a difference.
I think two things can be true.
1. Dawns team is very physical. They are. And it’s completely fine.
Other teams (UConn, Maryland) are going to be rightfully angry when South Carolina doesn’t get called for the fouls they commit, and try to get the refs on their side.
But that doesn’t mean that South Carolina is doing anything wrong. It’s just a style of play. Dawn though, needs to understand that other teams are going to lobby/complain about it. They are physical. They foul a lot and it’s not called. But they definitely aren’t dirty. Dawn isn’t teaching cheap shots. But she is teaching the age old “if you foul from the start and every possession, it won’t get called.” It’s fine. The Bucks do it. But other coaches are going to say something, and as long as it doesn’t get into dog whistles - Dawn doesn’t need to be as sensitize about that.
2. The national media and/or fans have described her team in a way that they wouldn’t describe a white team that’s physical.
If those words in particular “thug” “monkeys” or anything else racially tinged was used to describe her team - she has every right to be pissed. And if national media has done this - shame on them. They understand the impact of their words better than anyone.
The fact that Dawn was so quick to cancel the game with the racial incident suggests to me that her team is likely hearing racial insults somewhere. Although I wish she’d come right out and say what happened.
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“Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
Posts: 32335
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| Posted: 04/01/23 6:11 pm ::: |
Reply |
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| mercfan3 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. |
I think you just described reverse racism while saying it doesn't exist. |
Racism is a system of oppression based on race. White people don’t experience oppression based on race - thus you can not be racist against white people (ie - reverse racism)
You can be prejudiced. But there is a difference.
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oxford definition of racism:
"prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group."
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PickledGinger
Joined: 04 Oct 2013
Posts: 1361
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| Posted: 04/01/23 6:53 pm ::: |
Reply |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| mercfan3 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
One last thing: there is no such thing as "reverse racism." People of color certainly do discriminate against white people and people of other colors than themselves. |
I think you just described reverse racism while saying it doesn't exist. |
Racism is a system of oppression based on race. White people don’t experience oppression based on race - thus you can not be racist against white people (ie - reverse racism)
You can be prejudiced. But there is a difference.
|
oxford definition of racism:
"prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group." |
Yeah, racism does not have to be systemic to exist; any derogatory comment made about someone's ethnicity is racism. While white people don't experience systemic racism, we certainly can experience racism. The term "reverse racism" might be BS and implicative of a power dynamic that doesn't exist; but to say that racism is something white people exclusively to to black people is ignoring a loooong, world-wide history of cultural bias. Black people can be racist toward white people, or Latinos or Asians; just as Asians can be racist against other Asian ethnicities.
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Unspoken expectations are just premeditated resentments.
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You are absolutely correct, colorism is very real and is a BIG thing within the black community 
