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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009
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 Posted: 01/17/22 6:32 pm ::: |
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here is a different weird one still trying to stay slightly realistic
sign Dolson
trade Pick #5 and Onyenwere to Atl for pick #3 and draft Austin
bring back R. Allen
sign January (who I believe played with Brondello in PX) to a not too expensive two year deal to be a back up PG 3 point specialist and defense counterpart to Whitcomb and Ionescu
Ionescu/January (or start January and bring Whitcomb off bench)
Whitcomb/Richards/Jones
Laney/Willoughby
Howard/Allen
Doslon/Austin/Shook
or go really unexpected championship hunting in 22 (while stilll trying to have some sense of realism) sign steady vets who have been there and bring defense January and the very unexpected Fowles
January/Kea
Ionescu/Whitcomb/Richards
Laney/Onyenwere
Howard/Willoughby/Shook
Fowles/pick #5 (Cunane, Lee, Sabally a falling Austin)
Last edited by J-Spoon on 01/17/22 6:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 01/17/22 6:49 pm ::: |
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For me, one of the most intriguing things about sports is wondering about the future of a young player with promise. Michaela Onyenwere wasn't nearly as impressive as some previous WNBA Rookies of the Year, but she showed promise. Can she become a star? Can she become a solid WNBA player who's one step below a star but nevertheless worth having on your team? Or will she become an OK player who you can easily replace with another OK player?
I have no idea how WNBA general managers view Onyenwere's likely or possible future. Does she have trade value? I'd certainly guess that she does. Should New York try to hold onto her unless it's a deal the Liberty absolutely have to go for? I like Onyenwere, I have nothing negative to say about her, but I'd trade her if the deal is reasonable.
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007
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| Posted: 01/18/22 8:30 am ::: |
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| Liberty fans shouldn't overreact to the news about Dolson. Remember, it's a recruiting process. In most cases, players will want to visit their prospective new city. The team will then have an opportunity to entertain them and make a pitch. Dolson is from the NYC metropolitan area. It was rather easy for her to hop over to Brooklyn on Day 1. She still has to make trips to Atlanta and Las Vegas. Since Dolson already knows Chicago, she may not need to travel there, but she'll at least have a final phone conversation with James Wade. Meanwhile, I'm sure Kolb is speaking with other players or talking to other teams about trades. There's no need to start measuring Dolson for a Liberty uniform just yet.
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root_thing
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J-Spoon
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| Posted: 01/18/22 6:52 pm ::: |
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| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| New York has extended qualifying offers to Paris Kea and Nayo Raincock-Ekunwe. |
Thanks I figured out the Johannes situation and it was nicely explained by Richyyy
Last edited by J-Spoon on 01/18/22 7:01 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Richyyy
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| Posted: 01/18/22 6:59 pm ::: |
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| J-Spoon wrote: |
| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| New York has extended qualifying offers to Paris Kea and Nayo Raincock-Ekunwe. |
Did we have to offer Johannes a Qualifying Offer and if so did we? does anyone know?
I am not sure she ups either way with the Worlds so close to the season but still curious. |
All the statuses are on the HerHoopStats cap sheets in the blue boxes under the relevant year: https://herhoopstats.com/salary-cap-sheet/wnba/team/2021/new-york-liberty-11eaecc7-356f-5524-b611-2362f5011b0b/
So as that indicates, Johannes is 'suspended-contract expired' because she was suspended in the final year of her previous contract. Basically makes her the equivalent of Reserved, but doesn't require a qualifying offer to make her so. The Liberty have her exclusive rights. |
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J-Spoon
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| Posted: 01/18/22 8:05 pm ::: |
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So if this article came to fruition we would end up with
Ionescu/Kea
Whitcomb/Johannes/Richards
Laney/Onyenwere
Hines-Allen/Allen/Willoughby
Howard/pick #5
pretty good squad
my guess is a slight variation (I think Washington matches any offer for MHA and unless they sign Charles or Meesseman would not do a sign and trade for what NY would be able to offer)
Ionescu/?#1
Whitcomb/Richards/?#2
Laney/Onyenwere
Howard/Allen/Willoughby
Dolson/?#3
?#1 Kea, J. Jones, pick #5 (Henderson), unexpected cheapish vet January, Sims, L. Allen
?#2 Johannes (still don't think she show is 22 with the Worlds so close to the season) J. Jones, unexpected cheapish vet SWK, Nurse, January or Sims
?#3 Shook or pick #5 (Austin doubt she is still available, Cunane, Lee or Sabally)
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Queenie
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| Posted: 01/21/22 1:39 pm ::: |
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| So, thoughts on Breanna Stewart meeting with the Tsais? Worth getting excited over or is she just toying with everyone's emotions?
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 01/21/22 1:45 pm ::: |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| So, thoughts on Breanna Stewart meeting with the Tsais? Worth getting excited over or is she just toying with everyone's emotions? |
"Toying with everyone's emotions" is an ugly way to put that. Suppose Breanna Stewart feels it's 90% likely that she'll return to Seattle but is open to at least hearing out the Tsais and perhaps other owners/GMs/coaches. What exactly is wrong with that? Is she cruelly "toying with everyone's emotions"?
Liberty fans can choose to get excited or be skeptical. But Stewart has every right to consider her options.
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root_thing
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| Posted: 01/21/22 1:46 pm ::: |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| So, thoughts on Breanna Stewart meeting with the Tsais? Worth getting excited over or is she just toying with everyone's emotions? |
Maybe pulling a Chelsea Gray-LVA maneuver, checking out NY for next season after Bird retires.
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Shades
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| Posted: 01/21/22 2:12 pm ::: |
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It wouldn’t be the worst move for her. She would reunite with her championship teammates, Howard and Whitcomb, and start bonding with a younger, more exciting version of Bird (Ionescu).
It would make Bird’s retirement plans a bit anticlimactic. I’m thinking with her plans for that documentary, she wanted to end her career on a high note. I suppose they could still do it if they could sub in Charles and kept Russell.
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lynxmania
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| Posted: 01/21/22 6:41 pm ::: |
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https://twitter.com/womensbball247/status/1484653044394565634?s=21
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| Sources tell us that New York Liberty Head Coach Sandy Brondello will be adding Olaf Lange as an assistant to her staff. Brondello and Lange are married and have coached together in the W and overseas. Lange recently won a championship with the Sky. #wnbafreeagency #wnbatwitter |
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WNBA 09
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ChiSky54
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toad455
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 01/25/22 2:22 pm ::: |
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Thanks for posting this. I'm guessing Stewart will stay in Seattle, but it's certainly not impossible that she'll come to New York. It's a lovely thought and I intend to enjoy this possibility until it is crushed.
Here's one thing this article doesn't examine and should have. Suppose Stewart actually wants to come to the Liberty. Would it make sense for her to demand a supermax contract, get an extra $31,000 per year--and, in the process, badly hurt New York due to all it would cost to trade for Stewart? I say it wouldn't.
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Shades
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| Posted: 01/25/22 2:46 pm ::: |
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| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| Would it make sense for her to demand a supermax contract, get an extra $31,000 per year--and, in the process, badly hurt New York due to all it would cost to trade for Stewart? I say it wouldn't. |
That’s exactly the point I made when Bonner did it to Phoenix, but people didn’t seem to get what I was saying.
| Quote: |
In return, the Mercury are receiving three first-round draft picks including No. 7 and 10 overall this year. They also have the No. 5 pick in the first round of the April 17 draft. One or more of those picks could be used in a subsequent deal.
The third draft pick coming to the Mercury is a 2021 first-rounder. |
Connecticut has been sparse of first round picks lately but they’ve made good use of their late round picks and waiver wire pickup (Mompremier). So ultimately they weren’t too badly hurt.
How about Ionescu (Bird’s future replacement), #5 in 2022, and first round in 2023 (Boston/Lee/Potentially Paige Bueckers draft)?
If that’s what it took, I think I’d still pull the trigger.
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root_thing
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| Posted: 01/25/22 3:17 pm ::: |
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| Bob Lamm wrote: |
Here's one thing this article doesn't examine and should have. Suppose Stewart actually wants to come to the Liberty. Would it make sense for her to demand a supermax contract, get an extra $31,000 per year--and, in the process, badly hurt New York due to all it would cost to trade for Stewart? I say it wouldn't. |
Stewart still has friends in Seattle, so she might want to help them out. Breanna makes a lot of money in Russia. I'm guessing the $31,000 is not necessarily a huge motivation. Besides, New York might not be hurt that much by a trade. The Liberty have an excess of bodies. If they don't trade some people, they will need to cut players they like. In terms of draft picks, right now, we're looking at three quality players in the 2022 Draft. Too bad NY has the fifth pick. The 2023 Draft is supposed to be really good at the top, but adding Stewart almost guarantees a high finish in the standings for NY and a low pick in the draft. In theory, Seattle could try to hold out for Howard or Laney or Sabrina in a trade, but history shows that it doesn't happen. For example, Chicago couldn't pry Meesseman away from Washington in the Delle Donne trade. Don't forget, Seattle now recovers a supermax cap slot that they can use on Charles or Cambage or carry into next year's free agency carousel. And if things really get knotty, that's the point where Stewart can step in and accept the smaller contract. As far as the cap hit goes, NY won't be able to re-sign Allen but they can still keep one of their young players in that 12th spot. It's not really a meaningful problem.
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root_thing
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| Posted: 01/25/22 3:39 pm ::: |
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I've seen Asia Durr's name mentioned in a number of articles as if she's definitely in the mix for a roster spot. People need to realize that Durr's return is still highly questionable. She passed the WNBA heart function test, which is simply a minimum requirement. Asia still has to pass a much more rigorous team physical. When Durr last spoke to the press, she was still taking medicine on a regular basis just to function in everyday life. Asia spoke about needing to pace herself -- not because of conditioning, but because she is afraid too much physical exertion could trigger a relapse of her symptoms. That means Asia was not even at a point where she could go all out to get into shape.
Making the situation even more complicated, Durr said she was still unvaccinated at that point in time. Despite a lot of anecdotal evidence that vaccines can help long-haulers recover more quickly, Asia is under the impression that vaccines are another way a relapse can be triggered. We don't know if this is based on advice from her doctor or just a notion Durr developed on her own. What we do know is that she can't play in Brooklyn while unvaccinated. Asia is not an established star like Kyrie. If she can only play road games, Durr is not making the roster. So, this alone is a critical decision for her. Then on top of that, Asia has the actual health and skill recovery challenges. We're talking about a lot of hurdles.
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Richyyy
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| Posted: 01/25/22 3:58 pm ::: |
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I tend to agree that Stewart doesn't seem like the kind of player who'd force a sign-and-trade to get the supermax rather than the max, but in some ways it's a lot more money than you're suggesting above. You can lock in the best part of 350k more in guaranteed money via a 4yr/supermax vs a 3yr/max. For a player who's gotten hurt multiple times in recent years (leading to multiple surgeries), that might not be nothing.
ETA: That said, if you're Seattle and it seems like she wants the supermax, do you play hardball? If that's actually a priority, Seattle could technically say "We're not participating in any sign-and-trade. You want that money, you play here." Rare a team would do that, but the play is there as an option. |
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 01/25/22 4:13 pm ::: |
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| root_thing wrote: |
| I've seen Asia Durr's name mentioned in a number of articles as if she's definitely in the mix for a roster spot. People need to realize that Durr's return is still highly questionable. |
I'm glad you mentioned this. I was thinking the same thing when I read that article about Stewart that's linked above. In my view, no one can be writing right now about Asia Durr for 2022 without serious questions like the ones you've mentioned. She is anything but a lock to be on the team.
That said, of course I wish her a full and permanent recovery and a basketball career in New York or elsewhere. And if not the latter then definitely the former.
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 01/25/22 4:17 pm ::: |
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| Richyyy wrote: |
I tend to agree that Stewart doesn't seem like the kind of player who'd force a sign-and-trade to get the supermax rather than the max, but in some ways it's a lot more money than you're suggesting above. You can lock in the best part of 350k more in guaranteed money via a 4yr/supermax vs a 3yr/max. For a player who's gotten hurt multiple times in recent years (leading to multiple surgeries), that might not be nothing.
ETA: That said, if you're Seattle and it seems like she wants the supermax, do you play hardball? If that's actually a priority, Seattle could technically say "We're not participating in any sign-and-trade. You want that money, you play here." Rare a team would do that, but the play is there as an option. |
Your point is well taken, but I'd add the following: (1) possibly more money over various seasons if New York makes the playoffs and Seattle doesn't and if New York wins a championship or two; (2) much greater options for promotional $$$ in New York than in Seattle.
I'm still assuming that Stewart stays in Seattle--but I'd love to be proven wrong.
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J-Spoon
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| Posted: 01/25/22 4:23 pm ::: |
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| Stewart would be great but I am getting the when LJ was going to go to PX vibe.
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root_thing
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| Posted: 01/25/22 4:45 pm ::: |
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| Yeah, I don't get the sense that Liberty fans are all that excited. Most of us are skeptical. There's plenty of time to celebrate if it actually happens.
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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| Posted: 01/25/22 8:25 pm ::: |
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A point I saw made by WNBA Fan Nation that’s also relevant is that markets like NY can also offer business opportunities. Something else to consider.
Whether or not they get Stewie, the Liberty appear ready to be very active in their attempts to get to the next level. I’m not getting ahead of myself regarding Stewie, but I feel good about the likelihood that the Libs will emerge from the FA period significantly improved.
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