RebKell's Junkie Boards
Board Junkies Forums
 
Log in Register FAQ Memberlist Search RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index

SARS Coronavirus 2 vaccine
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index » Area 51
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
FrozenLVFan



Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3510



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 9:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
Howee wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
What say you, Howee? Famous Chris Hedges devotee..... Howee, don’t ever type the name Chris Hedges again.

How did you know I'm famous!?? Cool
HIGHLY unlikely that I'd do that....I'm not such a 'devotee' anymore, since I learned of his history with plagiarism. I didn't know about all of that when I discovered his later work, but I DO still respect his insights on governmental corruption.


Okay, so obviously you've had me throw Chris Hedges in your face one too many times as having expressed similar sentiments as me about the establishment press and the parties, etc. so now you're just going to throw Chris Hedges himself under the bus. Hilarity does ensue here on Rebkell's.

You clearly missed my final comment above on him. No buses involved. Razz He is quite prophetic at times. But.... plagiarism, at his level, is serious shit.

jammerbirdi wrote:
Okay. I don't need him. But answer my question maybe for once. Do you believe that we should be disenfranchising alternative media voices like Krystal Ball and Matt Taibbi and the kids on The Hill's Rising show? And CHRIS HEDGES? And let’s call it what it is, silencing dissent by de-platforming dissenters. CRUSHING their voices so that we only get what the New York Times decides is fit to print. Do you support that?

No idea where you thought I was all for *crushing* dissent. And you've been quite clear here that Krystal and Matt, et. al., are your Vital Truth gurus. We all choose our 'prophets', don't we?

jammerbirdi wrote:
I'm actually done. But I just wanted to call you on the behavior of berating people for evidence while dodging questions about your own opinions.

Laughing I have NO clue as to when/where I "berated people for evidence". I asked pilight for illustration, which he provided.

Now.......on this?
Howee wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
Thank you! Fauci lied to Congress.
DID he?? What are YOUR (or Frozen's) sources on this?
This from late August is refuted by this. How reliable are Factcheck.org or Newsweek? Take your pick. Is professor Ebright's 'interpretation' valid? (I'd swear on YOUR mother's grave that Rand Paul's is NOT) I mean, this shit goes on and ON.

I think I adequately provided reasons as to why I can justifiably disagree with you on Fauci's 'lying/perjury' case. You definitely judge him. I don't see enough evidence for that. No berating involved.

Now. Let's get back to the discussion of Covid vaccine. Cool


For the record, I never said that Fauci lied. When Jammer stated that he had, I said I wasn't sure of that at all, not having read the grant proposals or Fauci's statements to Congress. And I'm pretty sure no one else on this board has either. That's a boatload of stuff to wade through, and I'll bet half of the media pundits with an opinion on it haven't read it either.


jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 11:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Fauci ADMITTED to lying about the effectiveness of masks for the general public. If you don’t know or can’t admit to knowing about this moment in COVID-19 pandemic history it is disqualifying in terms of me wanting to have a conversation with you. Yes you could have been asleep the week he was asked about it and admitted it and you can’t be blamed on that account because it is certainly not something that’s ever brought up again with the passing of that particular news cycle. But the odds are much more likely that your not stipulating to this as a known fact is something being done willfully and with full awareness of the facts on your part. And I’m just not interested in conversing with people who are that politically invested as to try to rewrite history for the benefit of public officials.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66773
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 12:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
Then there's Texas. I s'pose we'd agree that it's a *bad* concept, modeled after a *good* one. Jammer implies that this happens every other Thursday.


It does. I picked an example recent and high profile enough that even addled boomers would recognize it.



_________________
Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15691
Location: OREGON (in my heart)


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 2:03 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jammerbirdi wrote:
Fauci ADMITTED to lying about the effectiveness of masks for the general public.

*I* knew about that....are YOU not paying attention? I was addressing your assertion that he lied re: GOF research to Congress.
jammerbirdi wrote:
And now we have him lying to Congress regarding the origins of a virus that has taken probably 20 million human lives. He should be removed from his position and face the appropriate legal consequences for lying to Congress. That is the truth.


pilight wrote:
Howee wrote:
Then there's Texas. I s'pose we'd agree that it's a *bad* concept, modeled after a *good* one. Jammer implies that this happens every other Thursday.


It does. I picked an example recent and high profile enough that even addled boomers would recognize it.


Hmmm. 87 out of 87 boomers I know never heard of it. Laughing I can accept that we're all reasonably addled OR not from California OR just not plugged into the general national scene of matters that don't directly affect us. But I am quite glad to learn more. If you have a suggested site, I'd love to get familiarized with the phenomenon.



_________________
Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 2:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So, Howee, you should know by now that this motherfucker is his own GURU. Okay? What has happened, and believe me, it has been a great gift and a relief to me, is that all of these younger minds have come up in the past five years or so now recognizing and basing their perspectives on the same quite obvious truths about the political landscape as I've been doing for twenty years now in these groups.

Cathy Young, former WNBA fan and original pillar of THIS community who even back then was writing pieces for the Boston Globe and had a book out and was featured on Book Notes on CSPAN was my running partner on the old boards. She is a tremendously well respected intellectual and she too was ahead of her time pointing out the inconsistencies, hypocrisy and general failures of otherwise well-intended political efforts.

Now this field is more populated by even less ideological voices who are just telling it like it is. Like it REALLY is. Not like someone's crazy Fox News watching Uncle Bob tells it like it is at Thanksgiving until everyone want to kill him or like some Rachel Maddow/Trevor Noah parroting fan will tell you like it is.

Turns out, there actually is these things called reality and truth. It's not subjective. It's real. You can recognize bullshit and someone lying to manipulate all of us. It's not that hard but you really can't just parrot what you're hearing or reading in the NYTimes.

Speaking of all that and including the NYTimes. Somehow someone named Robby Soave, who I'd heard of AND had just seen on a recent clip from Rising that I posted here, but didn't make the connection until I saw his picture accompanying this article... SOMEHOW he got the the NYTimes to publish his dissenting observations and opinions on Biden's mandate speech.

Everything I said RIGHT HERE in this thread the night before his piece was published in the NYTimes. Probably some of you aren't subscribers so here it is. Certainly there's a difference in presentation between what can be published in the NYTimes and what the jammer can muster after a long day running around LA. But the perspective is the same. This vaccine coercion will not stand, man. You're going to get president Ron DeSantis in 2024. Or Trump again with DeSantis as VP.

Biden’s Vaccine Mandate Is a Big Mistake

By Robby Soave

Mr. Soave, a senior editor at Reason, has written extensively about law, public policy and free speech.

There’s one person that President Biden desperately needs to consult about his new federal vaccine mandate: President-elect Biden.

In December 2020, as the prospect of imminent mass vaccination against Covid-19 was finally becoming a reality, Mr. Biden leveled with the American people: He said he would not force anyone to get the jab. “No, I don’t think it should be mandatory,” he told reporters. “I wouldn’t demand it be mandatory.”

Jen Psaki, the White House press secretary, recently reiterated Mr. Biden’s position. “That’s not the role of the federal government,” she declared on July 23, referring to the idea of a government mandate. Rochelle Walensky, the director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, said the same thing a week later: “There will be no nationwide mandate.”

So much for that. On Thursday, Mr. Biden announced a far-reaching vaccine mandate that applies to most federal workers, hospitals, public schools and 80 million employees of private companies. Under the White House’s presumptuous plan, workplaces that employ more than 100 people must require their employees to either get vaccinated or submit to weekly testing — a burden so onerous that for many businesses, it will not be a choice at all.

The president’s plan is certainly well intentioned. The vaccines are the only tried-and-true strategy for defeating Covid; government officials should both encourage vaccination and make it easier to get vaccinated. Health officials must continue selling people on the vaccines by emphasizing the considerable upside: Vaccination decreases transmission of the virus and turns hospitalization and death into very unlikely outcomes. It provides such robust protection that 99 percent of coronavirus fatalities in the United States now occur in the unvaccinated population. Vaccination works, and it’s the right option for a vast majority of Americans.

But forcing vaccines on a minority contingent of unwilling people is a huge error that risks shredding the social fabric of a country already being pulled apart by political tribalism.

The president should not — and most likely does not — have the power to unilaterally compel millions of private-sector workers to get vaccinated or risk losing their jobs: Mr. Biden is presiding over a vast expansion of federal authority, one that Democrats will certainly come to regret the next time a Republican takes power. Moreover, the mechanism of enforcement — a presidential decree smuggled into law by the Department of Labor and its Occupational Safety and Health Administration — is fundamentally undemocratic. Congress is supposed to make new laws, not an unaccountable bureaucratic agency.

While more than 70 percent of American adults have received a shot, a smaller but sizable group of people, for various reasons, are unvaccinated. Some members of this group have antibodies from a previous Covid case and are reasonably protected from future illness, according to recent data. There is little benefit to forcing vaccination on such people, and Mr. Biden’s decision to not exempt them is a significant misstep.

Unvaccinated individuals who were never infected by Covid would certainly benefit from vaccination. But the coercive approach has major downsides. The most anti-vaccine Americans — those who are adamantly refusing the jab because of a misguided belief that it’s dangerous — will probably not change their minds because the government is strong-arming employers. On the contrary, the federal mandate might actually be taken as confirmation of their paranoid suspicions that the vaccines have less to do with their health and more to do with social control.

As a practical matter, it’s undeniable that the federal mandate will engender a titanic backlash and create a spate of lawsuits. Vaccine holdouts have already taken legal action against employers requiring vaccination: Todd Zywicki, a law professor at George Mason University in Virginia who had recovered from Covid and has antibodies, recently fought his institution’s mandate and prevailed. And Republican governors are certain to battle Mr. Biden over this policy. Gov. Kristi Noem of South Dakota, a Republican, tweeted at the president, “See you in court.”

It’s true that courts have upheld vaccine mandates in certain circumstances: In a 1922 case, the Supreme Court famously ruled that a city ordinance could deny admission to students who failed to get the smallpox vaccine. But the assertion that a public official can completely sidestep the legislative process and enact a much farther-reaching vaccine mandate via administrative action should elicit skepticism from even those who vigorously support vaccination.

There are other ways to nudge the populace in the right direction. Rather than punishing the unvaccinated, the government could create an incentive for vaccination by lifting restrictions for the vaccinated. This was the approach initially taken by the C.D.C., which said this year that since the vaccinated were well protected, they could almost always safely discard their masks. Unfortunately, the more transmissible Delta variant spooked federal health officials, and the C.D.C. reversed course. Some municipalities, including Washington, then reimposed mask mandates, even though the science hasn’t actually changed: The vaccinated are still well protected from Covid.

Some people would probably voluntarily get the shot if they knew for certain that a vaccination card was a ticket to living a normal life once again. Regrettably, Mr. Biden’s mandate moves in the exact opposite direction, with the White House saying his plan will ensure that “strong mask requirements remain in place.” If the government is concerned about vaccine hesitancy, it should trust the vaccines and drop other restrictions. People should know that if they get vaccinated, they will be better off. Instead, the White House is sending the message that people must get vaccinated but should hardly expect things to be different afterward.

It’s worth repeating that the federal vaccine mandate represents a broad expansion of the executive branch’s power. And Mr. Biden will not be the chief executive forever. Gov. Ron DeSantis of Florida, a plausible 2024 Republican presidential candidate, has used his current authority to prohibit private vaccine mandates in his state. Is this really the time to solidify the idea that the president is the ultimate authority on whether such things should be required or forbidden?

Robby Soave is a senior editor at Reason magazine and the author of “Tech Panic: Why We Shouldn’t Fear Facebook and the Future,” which will be published this month.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15691
Location: OREGON (in my heart)


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 4:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jammerbirdi wrote:
So, Howee, you should know by now that this motherfucker is his own GURU. Okay?

That has never been lost on me. Cool

Earlier, I said:
Howee wrote:
Okay. I'm vaccinated.

And gratefully so: as of today, my vaccinated husband is awaiting his Covid test result, as he's now got symptoms 2 weeks after close contact with our pastor, who CHOSE no vaccine for himself, and is now sick with Covid. In spite of all that, I really don't give a damn about this National Debate Shitshow.

Reminder: I do NOT disagree with the potential fallout of this mandate. I simply don't believe in denouncing EVERYBODY as liars we cannot trust. And I DO also believe that Biden's mandate could play the role of a blow torch in a Northern California park. But....what if it projects our country into an upward spiral of recovery, whilst 9 out of 10 Floridians disappear? These aren't the weirdest hypotheses out there.

Back to ideas:

I am still bothered by UNvaxxed people taking up hospital beds, when it could be avoided. Is it reasonable to say, "You're sick with covid/stroke/whatever" you must prove you've taken precautionary measures before we can admit you. Where's your vax ID?"

Or....how about the UNvaxxed folks being hit with an increase in their health insurance premiums? I mean, smokers and even child-bearing women know what that's about.



_________________
Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
Ex-Ref



Joined: 04 Oct 2009
Posts: 8835



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 6:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
jammerbirdi wrote:
So, Howee, you should know by now that this motherfucker is his own GURU. Okay?

That has never been lost on me. Cool

Earlier, I said:
Howee wrote:
Okay. I'm vaccinated.

And gratefully so: as of today, my vaccinated husband is awaiting his Covid test result, as he's now got symptoms 2 weeks after close contact with our pastor, who CHOSE no vaccine for himself, and is now sick with Covid. In spite of all that, I really don't give a damn about this National Debate Shitshow.

Reminder: I do NOT disagree with the potential fallout of this mandate. I simply don't believe in denouncing EVERYBODY as liars we cannot trust. And I DO also believe that Biden's mandate could play the role of a blow torch in a Northern California park. But....what if it projects our country into an upward spiral of recovery, whilst 9 out of 10 Floridians disappear? These aren't the weirdest hypotheses out there.

Back to ideas:

I am still bothered by UNvaxxed people taking up hospital beds, when it could be avoided. Is it reasonable to say, "You're sick with covid/stroke/whatever" you must prove you've taken precautionary measures before we can admit you. Where's your vax ID?"

Or....how about the UNvaxxed folks being hit with an increase in their health insurance premiums? I mean, smokers and even child-bearing women know what that's about.


Delta Airlines did just that. $200 per month increase to the premiums of the unvaxxed.

Quote:
“The average hospital stay for COVID-19 has cost Delta $50,000 per person. This surcharge will be necessary to address the financial risk the decision to not vaccinate is creating for our company.”

In the memo, (CEO Ed) Bastian added that every Delta employee who had been hospitalized with COVID-19, up to that point, had been unvaccinated.


https://www.wane.com/community/health/coronavirus/huge-number-of-unvaccinated-delta-workers-got-vaccine-after-200-surcharge-announcement-official-says/



_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw

“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
Ex-Ref



Joined: 04 Oct 2009
Posts: 8835



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/12/21 9:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ex-Ref wrote:
This is the one that made me go 😲. There aren't enough people to fill shifts as it is. I get emails almost daily asking for people to help out at the hospital. You get people quitting on top of this, it could be really bad!!!
Quote:
And the roughly 17 million workers at health facilities that receive federal Medicare or Medicaid also will have to be fully vaccinated.


And it begins!!!!

Quote:
Six employees at the Lewis County Health System have resigned, and seven more are unwilling to get vaccinated, meaning Lewis County General Hospital will stop delivering babies for the time being, multiple news outlets reported.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2021/09/12/lewis-county-ny-hospital-pauses-maternity-unit-amid-vaccine-mandate/8311448002/



_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw

“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
GlennMacGrady



Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 8152
Location: Heisenberg


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/15/21 7:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

More about ivermectin, a common therapeutic that frontline doctors around the world are prescribing, often in areas that have little access to vaccines, this time from the most populated country subdivision in the world, Utter Pradesh, India (>200 million inhabitants).

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

Quote:
A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66773
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 8:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
More about ivermectin, a common therapeutic that frontline doctors around the world are prescribing, often in areas that have little access to vaccines, this time from the most populated country subdivision in the world, Utter Pradesh, India (>200 million inhabitants).


If your doctor prescribes it for you, go ahead and take it. By the same token, if your doctor tells you to get vaccinated then you should do that. What you shouldn't do is self medicate with stuff bought at an animal supply store.



_________________
Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15691
Location: OREGON (in my heart)


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 9:05 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
More about ivermectin, a common therapeutic that frontline doctors around the world are prescribing, often in areas that have little access to vaccines, this time from the most populated country subdivision in the world, Utter Pradesh, India (>200 million inhabitants).

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

Quote:
A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.


Public Health expert Dr. Kavita Patel soundly refutes that, pointing to several studies (including ones from India) that have proven nothing beneficial about usage of Ivermectin for Covid. Hmmm. Whom does one believe?



_________________
Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66773
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 9:12 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
GlennMacGrady wrote:
More about ivermectin, a common therapeutic that frontline doctors around the world are prescribing, often in areas that have little access to vaccines, this time from the most populated country subdivision in the world, Utter Pradesh, India (>200 million inhabitants).

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

Quote:
A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.


Public Health expert Dr. Kavita Patel soundly refutes that, pointing to several studies (including ones from India) that have proven nothing beneficial about usage of Ivermectin for Covid. Hmmm. Whom does one believe?


Believe your doctor, who knows your medical history and has a vested interest in you continuing to make office visits. Don't believe TV or the goddamn internet.



_________________
Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 10:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Doctors are but one tool in the toolbox we have to deal with our health. We’re sold however the idea that they are the entire toolbox. MDs work within frameworks and constraints that are now as much as any time ever dictating what medicines they can prescribe, what tests they can run, what diagnosis they can make and even what details they can place into a patient’s medical record. The idea of just listening to what my doctor tells me to do has never worked for me. If it works for others that’s great. But I’ve got a life long list of experiences that run contrary to that advice.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 10:15 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

And I would add something I said here last week. In a more perfect world, when this is all over, we should be investigating and then criminally prosecuting doctors and other medical professionals for some of the things that are going on.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
FrozenLVFan



Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3510



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 11:08 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
More about ivermectin, a common therapeutic that frontline doctors around the world are prescribing, often in areas that have little access to vaccines, this time from the most populated country subdivision in the world, Utter Pradesh, India (>200 million inhabitants).

Uttar Pradesh government says early use of Ivermectin helped to keep positivity, deaths low

Quote:
A year after the country’s first Covid-19 cluster, with 5 cases, was reported in Agra district, the Uttar Pradesh government has claimed that it was the first state to have introduced a large-scale “prophylactic and therapeutic” use of Ivermectin and added that the drug helped the state to maintain a lower fatality and positivity rate as compared to other states.


There is ZERO data in that article to support their claims, although they do mention confounding factors, and no link to any report of their subjects, methods, results or anything else.


Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15691
Location: OREGON (in my heart)


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 2:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jammerbirdi wrote:
Doctors are but one tool in the toolbox we have to deal with our health. We’re sold however the idea that they are the entire toolbox. MDs work within frameworks and constraints that are now as much as any time ever dictating what medicines they can prescribe, what tests they can run, what diagnosis they can make and even what details they can place into a patient’s medical record. The idea of just listening to what my doctor tells me to do has never worked for me. If it works for others that’s great. But I’ve got a life long list of experiences that run contrary to that advice.


There was a time, in my childhood and further back, when (especially in rural communities) just HAVING a local doctor was a godsend, and they were the Final Authority on what one ought to do re: health concerns.

But in recent years, we've been encouraged to advocate for ourselves in this dynamic: "The doctor doesn't know everything!" In this hyper-availability of information, why NOT look into possible alternatives? I certainly believe in all that. My personal GP is fantastic; younger, trained in Eastern medicine, bright, not inclined to over-prescribe -- I really have had no reason to second guess his decisions for me. But not all doctors are created or trained equally. I've left other doctors for questionable decisions on their part.

But this self-advocacy is a double-edged blade, with the potential to lead the gullible to places they shouldn't go -- not all that different from the snake-oil salesmen of yesteryear.

I recently talked to a woman who told me she wasn't vaccinated out of fear; she listed at least 4 people she knew of that got very sick from vax #1 and didn't return, and one even had blood clots (??). I've probably known 80 people who've been vaccinated with nothing more than a sore arm.

Maybe we all just *see* whatever it is we're looking for.... Shocked



_________________
Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66773
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 3:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
But in recent years, we've been encouraged to advocate for ourselves in this dynamic: "The doctor doesn't know everything!" In this hyper-availability of information, why NOT look into possible alternatives? I certainly believe in all that. My personal GP is fantastic; younger, trained in Eastern medicine, bright, not inclined to over-prescribe -- I really have had no reason to second guess his decisions for me. But not all doctors are created or trained equally. I've left other doctors for questionable decisions on their part.


Get a second opinion if you like or even a third. But get it from a live doctor who examines you, not online and certainly not from social media.



_________________
Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 4:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight, who pays for second opinions? Or third opinions? What health insurance program am I not a part of that does that? How would one even secure an appointment with some other doctor when it takes MONTHS to get an appointment with your own? You’re always on me for my old timey thinking but this ‘get a second opinion’ thing hasn’t been plausible for most of us for many decades now.

Also. Jeez. I’m posting videos here that demonstrate, if nothing else, the disparity of medical opinions at the very highest levels of our pandemic response. Disagreement. Resignations. Luuuc said I think a few weeks ago essentially that doctors can also be taken in by false information. And I think the two videos I posted yesterday and today demonstrate very clearly that there’s some wheels falling off the vaccines are our way out of this claims that we are now ramming down people's throats like it or not.

There’s a flea in that honey. Many fleas, actually. There’s no question about that now. I think people here aren’t keeping up. Right now our response to the pandemic on a federal and official level has NEVER been as disconnected from the admittedly very slippery (and numerous) pieces of the coronavirus pandemic as it is at this very precarious moment. It’s a fucking mess. And that extends right down TO our own doctors. IMO.

With the exception, of course, of my own personal physician, Dr Vinnie Boombatz. Cool



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
pilight



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66773
Location: Where the action is


Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 5:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

You're as bad as the anti-vaxxers. "Don't trust your doctor, look at this deceptively edited youtube video that proves everything I've been saying!"

It almost seems like people are trying to make this thing more complicated than it is.



_________________
Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 6:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ah pilight your insult falls on my ears as warmly as an old Seals and Crofts tune in the California sunshine. Such fond memories of the way we used to be and all that.

But please don’t tell me you’re going to let some kids on YouTube best the mighty Rebkell’s gang. Refute away if y’all can.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
Ex-Ref



Joined: 04 Oct 2009
Posts: 8835



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/16/21 7:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Well, I'm pissed at everyone that has an opportunity to help themselves (get vaxxed, wear masks, or stay home) and hasn't/won't and now my day off has been cancelled tomorrow because I have to cover for people in my department that are being moved to take care of their dumbasses!!!!

I shouldn't blame it all on sick people. I'm sure that there are a fair number of employees that have tested positive and are now in quarantine.

I had plans to go to my nephew's football game tomorrow. My niece is a cheerleader. Because of the time I get off work, I can't usually get there in time. Tomorrow might be my only opportunity. Yeah, I'm pissed.



_________________
"Women are judged on their success, men on their potential. It’s time we started believing in the potential of women." —Muffet McGraw

“Thank you for showing the fellas that you've got more balls than them,” Haley said, to cheers from the crowd.
jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/18/21 2:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I sincerely hope we all come here valuing our differences of opinion, and I always do my best to provide something different in terms of an opinion.

Anyway. So what happened today provides a stunning momentary glimpse into a window on to so many things that none of us should miss the significance of this moment.

The FDA announced today that it would NOT be approving boosters for Americans under the age of 65.

Wait. Not the way you heard it? Nope. Me neither. The New York Times alert I received worded the same exact message but inverted. Something like, Today the FDA Approved Covid-19 Vaccine Booster Shots for those Aged 65 and Older.

And that's what I mean by a window on to SO MANY things.

Because that second version of the news, which is the way it was largely reported in the mainstream media, is NOT the story. The story here is that the FDA did NOT approve boosters for 83.5% of Americans. Yet even my local news in LA put it like this:

An FDA panel today unanimously approved a third shot of the Phizer vaccine but only for those 65 and older.

The report goes on to say that the FDA panel spent hours debating the need for an additional dose.

Even that is misleading. Were they actually debating the NEED for a third dose? All reports that I've heard were that they were actually debating the SAFETY of a third dose.

Hello! Where are you guys? ?

Why not? The New York Times just a few weeks ago published an article telling us all HOW to get our third shots. Even suggesting LYING if necessary. It seemed even to me like a slam dunk issue that makes perfect sense even TO ME. Whatever I mean by that. Wink

I mean, I am literally sitting here typing this and ASKING myself and the dark of night here in Area 51, WHY? Why would the the FDA not recommend boosters? Biden and his team were leaning ALL OVER in that direction. Israel has already MANDATED boosters a while ago and I believe they have already administered them to a majority of their citizens. And yet they are also experiencing higher case numbers than at any other time during the pandemic.

But then there's the media. The media doesn't deliver this stunningly negative news on the vaccines in a way that actually delivers the stun. No. They act like the FDA just approved boosters. Period.

Not hardly.

NPR actually did the best job here.

In a surprising vote, a panel of advisers to the Food and Drug Administration on Friday recommended against approval of a booster dose of the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine for people 16 years and older.

The 16-2 vote against broad use of the booster, which would be given about six months after completion of the two-dose immunization regimen, dealt a setback to Pfizer and complicates the FDA's approach to boosters.

After a brief intermission following the rejection, FDA officials returned to the meeting with a revised booster question. The panel then voted 18-0 in support of the agency authorizing a booster shot of the vaccine for people 65 and older or at high risk of severe COVID-19.


This is nothing short of a REJECTION of booster shots for Americans. Please don't come here and suggest like naïve butterflies that this was actually a vote of confidence in the original vaccines themselves. This was a WAR on the FDA board with one side, including Phizer itself, saying the boosters were needed, pushing desperately for them and the other side, the side that prevailed, was apparently more concerned about the safety of a third dose, with a J&J doctor saying that if the FDA cannot assure us of the safety of two doses how can they assure us of three?

Ratio of events for C19 vs Flu Vaccines, normalized for number of doses.

Event/Ratio

Death/91
Serious AE/28
Coagulopathy/276
Myocardial Infarction/126

Also there was the suggestion of weak evidence to support even the efficacy of the third dose. Again, see Israel and apparently there's more data from Israel that will be released in the coming days.

So again. We bash and blame our stupid stupid fellow Americans. How could they be so stupid? How about they're hearing on the ground and through the grapevine of vaccine horror stories? They're seeing through the media's manipulation of information. They're also, despite the efforts of the news media to characterize stories in the most favorable light for whomever they're fronting for, the American people are seeing the scientific disagreements and lack of consensus when it comes to vaccines, etc.

I'm just typing shit here. As I said a couple of days ago, in spite of what I consider to be a near death experience after the J&J vaccine, I would be ready to have a go with an mRNA shot. I sincerely don't want the fucking coronavirus. I'll take my chances with the jab. Don't call me an anti-vaxxer. I'm just a guy who's trying to pull the truth from what is happening around us all and go into every decision I make with my eyes wide open.

And I'm telling you all that today the FDA rejected boosters, REJECTED a third shot, for all but the oldest and most frail 16.5 percent of us. And I don't think ANYONE on that board who voted against boosters for everyone was thinking that they weren't needed. lol. Come on, my butterflies. That's not what the fuck happened here.

Booster shots that are safe and effective are DESPERATELY needed right now. And so that last window that YOUR FDA opened up for us to see through IS the window on what they know and aren't telling us about vaccine safety. And that is as big a can of worms right now as is the bullshit around the source of the pandemic itself.

We're in for a very rough time folks. There's no way out of it. See you in the Winter 21-22 thread.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
tfan



Joined: 31 May 2010
Posts: 9544



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/18/21 5:04 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I suspect that the primary reason they voted not to give a third dose to the majority of Americans is in this July 2021 quote:

Quote:
Thinking on a global scale, “to (give out boosters) prematurely would use up a lot of vaccine that much of the world needs, as well as divert our efforts in getting people their first dose of vaccine,” according to Pavia, who is also the chief of the Division of Pediatric Infectious Diseases at the University of Utah School of Medicine.


WHO Cautions Against Third Coronavirus Booster Shot


FrozenLVFan



Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3510



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/18/21 7:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
I suspect that the primary reason they voted not to give a third dose to the majority of Americans is in this July 2021 quote:

Quote:
Thinking on a global scale, “to (give out boosters) prematurely would use up a lot of vaccine that much of the world needs, as well as divert our efforts in getting people their first dose of vaccine,” according to Pavia, who is also the chief of the Division of Pediatric Infectious Diseases at the University of Utah School of Medicine.


WHO Cautions Against Third Coronavirus Booster Shot


Fixed your bold for you and would add that the data for the mRNA vaccines doesn't show a convincing drop in their efficiency as to warrant boosters for everyone.


jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 21045



Back to top
PostPosted: 09/18/21 9:34 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Sorry but that wasn’t anything close to being a deciding factor in this. The US simply would not ever and I mean EVER decide to forgo what it deemed necessary and/or safe immunizations for the American people during a deadly pandemic based on this global fairness concern. Has Israel let that stop or even slow down their efforts to give boosters?

PBS panel discussion:

Amna Nawaz:

William, what about this whole global fairness argument, the debate around this, right, the fact that Americans are going to be getting booster shots before millions of people around the world have even had their first vaccine shot? What about that?
William Brangham:

Yes, this is this incredibly thorny issue that the WHO, the Africa CDC have been arguing — in fact, one WHO official likened this to us giving life jackets to people who already have life jackets while you leave other people to drown.

And that argument has been made repeatedly. And it came up again today in this panel. The Biden administration argues, we can do both, we can give boosters to Americans, and we can help get vaccines to the world.

In fact, today, they announced 500 million new doses that were purchased by the administration to give out. But this is no doubt an issue going forward. There are something like 45, I believe it is, million Americans who might get these boosters. We have enough of those doses already here in House. So while this has been a concern that's been raised, for now, that argument didn't win the day.



_________________
Every woman who has ever been presented with a career/sex quid pro quo in the entertainment industry should come forward and simply say, “Me, too.” - jammer The New York Times 10/10/17
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    RebKell's Junkie Boards Forum Index » Area 51 All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12  Next
Page 8 of 12

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB 2.0.17 © 2001- 2004 phpBB Group
phpBB Template by Vjacheslav Trushkin