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J-Spoon



Joined: 31 Jan 2009
Posts: 5811



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PostPosted: 12/24/20 9:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richards at 11 Heal at 18 or vice versa
I don't think Westbrook lasts until 11 (I could se PX at 6 or Dallas at 7 taking a chance on Westbrook, and I don't think LA passes on her at 10) swap her in if she does for either player above, if Seattle could get Westbrook at 11 and Richards at 18 would be pretty cool.

How much money is left over for Whitcomb?

if you pay 215K for Howard Bird gives slight discount 190K and Clark gets on board for say 165K

(maybe a little insulting to Clark but as has been pointed out an unlike Howard who will have other suitors at super max are there other teams out there that are going to pay Clark more than 165K as everyone seems to have shrinking cap space, and would she even want to go somewhere else for maybe 10k more?)

Bird/Canada/Heal
Loyd/Whitcomb
Clark/Richards
Howard/Magbegor
Stewart/Russell

is that enough coverage in the post?
can you sometimes go Small with some Bird at the 2 and Loyd at the 3?
Does this work otherwise and keep in championship contention?


Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 1948
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 12/25/20 3:06 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

J-Spoon wrote:
Bird/Canada/Heal
Loyd/Whitcomb
Clark/Richards
Howard/Magbegor
Stewart/Russell

To be clear, Heal likely wouldn't show up until 2022 (we forced Laksa to be a deferral pick even though she wanted to show up this past season, so I don't see why we wouldn't do the same with a younger Heal).

J-Spoon wrote:
is that enough coverage in the post?
can you sometimes go Small with some Bird at the 2 and Loyd at the 3?
Does this work otherwise and keep in championship contention?

With an 11-player roster, only one position can really have 'depth' to it. Either PG or one of the post positions makes sense. And yes, we have actually already played Canada, Bird, and Loyd altogether several instances before. A third PG on the roster would make sense even if Bird has a completely healthy season.

J-Spoon wrote:
How much money is left over for Whitcomb?

No more than 80k-85k, it seems. She might accept that if she really wants to stay with the Storm, but if a GM out there really does offer her upwards of $150k, she'd be foolish to refuse it – she now has a baby to take care of, after all. Smile


Anyways, it's all so tricky. Say we bring back Bird, Clark, and Howard this season. We're probably still the #1 team in the League in 2021 by doing that alone; any move that follows would be gravy. But after 2021, Loyd, Canada, and Russell will all need new contracts. If you sign players for too much this season, there may not be enough to allocate funds to those players the season afterward. Will Bird retire after 2021? Nobody knows, but it obviously becomes harder on our payroll situation if she stays beyond 2021 – especially knowing that she won't be better than she is now. I hope we've been doing some long-term planning and not just short-term. That's why I wouldn't be too devastated to see Howard get traded. It's like, do we go all in on repeating in 2021 and perhaps damage our window of contention beyond that? Or do we try to risk getting crafty now with move-making in the hopes that it sets us up for continued success down the line? While it's a fortunate fork in the road to come across, it still isn't an easy decision for any front office to make. Obtaining success and sustaining success can be two very different art forms...



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Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
Posts: 15966
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PostPosted: 12/25/20 7:15 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Winning championships is not easy. You never know when you will have another opportunity. So with Bird in her final years and Loyd and Stewie in their prime years you go 100% for next season.



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"Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clich�s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." �Karen Bryant
Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 22676
Location: London


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PostPosted: 12/25/20 8:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I agree, especially with the strong chance that 2021 could be Bird's last season (assuming she even plays that). You go hard, and that includes keeping Howard even if it's a one-year rental. She's still the best defender on the best defensive team. I also still think they core her, which does raise the possibility that she just signs the core qualifying offer (1-year supermax).

Also, just to note, Laksa agreed not to show up. If someone drafts Heal and she wants to come, the team can't actually stop her. Discussions and agreements are obviously made, though.



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Force10rulz



Joined: 11 Apr 2009
Posts: 1944
Location: Puget Sound


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PostPosted: 12/25/20 12:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stewie tested positive for covid just a week after going to Russia. So far no symptoms but she’s in quarantine.



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Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 1948
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 12/26/20 2:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah, while we still have Bird, I agree that we may as well go for it all and figure the rest out later. It's up to the front office to make sure we retain our status as a contender long after Bird hangs it up. I hope they're savvy about the future, but I'm not the most optimistic (as we all know!).

Richyyy wrote:
Also, just to note, Laksa agreed not to show up. If someone drafts Heal and she wants to come, the team can't actually stop her. Discussions and agreements are obviously made, though.

I know you've said this repeatedly, and I do accept that she clearly agreed to it, but I still find the whole process of it all dubious. As it's also been said before, she's no 19 year-old; she's older than most/all? of the 2020 draftees. Player agreement aside, the concept of Laksa being a deferral pick is just stupid. The international class was weak in 2020, but even drafting one of the low-ceiling German draftees with our 1st-rounder would've made more sense – especially since we can find SGs who shoot (missing much of the time) and really do nothing else à la Laksa in large swaths here in the States. Rolling Eyes But anyways, that's just me being frustrated at the reality of the situation. No doubt I and others have said some iteration of this before though, so I'll curb it for now – at least until it inevitably comes up again in the spring. Laughing

Force10rulz wrote:
Stewie tested positive for covid just a week after going to Russia. So far no symptoms but she’s in quarantine.

Ugh. Get well soon, Stewie. Crying or Very sad Tough to not only be away from family during the holidays, but also be sick throughout the time.



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IM in OC



Joined: 25 Mar 2009
Posts: 772
Location: Orange County, CA


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PostPosted: 12/26/20 4:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:


Force10rulz wrote:
Stewie tested positive for covid just a week after going to Russia. So far no symptoms but she’s in quarantine.

Ugh. Get well soon, Stewie. Crying or Very sad Tough to not only be away from family during the holidays, but also be sick throughout the time.


I just watched Stewie play in a game this past week. I dont think she is in quarantine, anymore.


Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
Posts: 15966
Location: Holland


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PostPosted: 12/26/20 5:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Force10rulz wrote:
Stewie tested positive for covid just a week after going to Russia. So far no symptoms but she’s in quarantine.


She tested positive in november with no symthoms. She is celebrating the holidays with her gf Martha Xargay and their good friend Sonja Vasic (former Petrovic) & her husband. So no quarantine



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"Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clich�s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." �Karen Bryant
Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 1948
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 12/26/20 6:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Thanks for the Stewie clarification, y’all. Glad to know she recovered smoothly and had a good Christmas. (If you celebrated, I hope all of y’all did too!) Very Happy I’m not always browsing through twitter & the like, so I’m prone to missing news from there. Much appreciated!



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"It's not a game of 'how to', it's a game of 'when to.'" –Sue Bird, on basketball but probably also life
ucbart



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 1816
Location: New York


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PostPosted: 12/29/20 12:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Anyone know what Jewel Loyd is up to? Her Instagram story clearly has her in Gampel Pavillion on the UCONN campus with video of her saying "hi friends" to Sue and Stewie's cardboard cutouts that are in the seats. Anyone know why she is there? She on the DePaul staff?


mavcarter
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: 12/29/20 12:51 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Loyd is enrolled at DePaul.



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Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree?
WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 10105
Location: Dallas , Texas


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PostPosted: 12/29/20 2:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
Loyd is enrolled at DePaul.


Also a AC on the Depaul women's bbal squad !



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ucbart



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 1816
Location: New York


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PostPosted: 12/29/20 2:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
mavcarter wrote:
Loyd is enrolled at DePaul.


Also a AC on the Depaul women's bbal squad !


Cool! I hope SNY interviews her tonight about being back at Gampel.


Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 1948
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 01/16/21 5:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

As WNBA free agency begins, questions loom for defending champion Storm

Quote:
WNBA free agency began Thursday night with the defending champion Storm designating Natasha Howard as a core player, which gives Seattle exclusive negotiating rights with the seven-year veteran.

The move nearly assures Howard will return for her fourth year with the Storm where she won the 2019 WNBA Defensive Player of the Year award, the 2018 WNBA Most Improved Player award and helped Seattle to a pair of titles.

However, the decision to retain Howard is also costly. She’s scheduled to earn $221,000 next season, which is nearly twice as much as her $117,000 salary in 2020.

Unless Howard has already accepted the core-player QO (hasn't been reported that she has, afaik), I guess I wouldn't say she's 'scheduled' for it. If she already has accepted it, someone let me know. At this point, I can only hope that she re-signs for a longer-term, less-money deal. If we re-sign Howard at the supermax, I'm guessing we can pretty much kiss Clark good-bye. Maybe we can count Whitcomb back in, which wouldn't be a terrible silver lining, but we'd miss Clark more than Whitcomb.

Still, would we miss Howard more or Clark more? Most of y'all would without hesitation say Howard, and I certainly understand why. That could be right. I myself... just don't know. But we'll cross that bridge if we ever come to it. As it is, now that Clark is officially able to freely negotiate elsewhere, teams will absolutely go after her hard, if for no other reason than to make us weaker. We'll see how this all goes, but I'm not feeling optimistic about it these days...



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"It's not a game of 'how to', it's a game of 'when to.'" –Sue Bird, on basketball but probably also life
mavcarter
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: 01/16/21 5:47 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I wonder with them using the word scheduled, they’re just assuming the player plans on accepting the deal due to that being minimum offer to start with?

$221K is a lot to walk away from, regardless of the circumstances..



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Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 1948
Location: Seattle, WA


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PostPosted: 01/16/21 6:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
I wonder with them using the word scheduled, they’re just assuming the player plans on accepting the deal due to that being minimum offer to start with?

$221K is a lot to walk away from, regardless of the circumstances..


Once again, I'm considering the source aka the author. Laughing Percy Allen is well-respected as a reporter on the Seattle Times Sports staff, but he hasn't been covering the Storm for all that long. (I preferred Jayda Evans' Storm coverage, but that was a few years back now.) It certainly wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for him to misunderstand how some of these more specific free agency rules work in this League, especially since a few of them are still pretty new. On the other hand, he may know exactly how they work & it could just be unconventional usage of the word "scheduled". Honestly I think if Howard did in fact sign the QO, Richyyy would've let us know by now. Very Happy



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"It's not a game of 'how to', it's a game of 'when to.'" –Sue Bird, on basketball but probably also life
mavcarter
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: 01/16/21 6:10 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Welp, let me mind my business then. Laughing



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Stormeo



Joined: 14 Jul 2019
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PostPosted: 01/16/21 6:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
Welp, let me mind my business then. Laughing


Lololol no big deal!! If there's anything the past 4 years (& 3 months, but who's counting) have taught me, it's to consider the author of any piece of writing I encounter, especially when anything comes across as... sus. Laughing

Ugh anyways, I wonder who's most likely to go after Clark. I think she still has a home in suburban Nashville, so she's somewhat close to Indiana & Atlanta. She's also close with Crystal Dangerfield since they knew each other being from the same area, and if Maya Moore officially retires, Clark is definitely a player Cheryl Reeve would like. And if either LA or Phoenix have the money for her, they could use her stability at the 3 position; Ditto the Sun, if Alyssa Thomas can't play/participate in this season.



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"It's not a game of 'how to', it's a game of 'when to.'" –Sue Bird, on basketball but probably also life
Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 01/16/21 7:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah, the most likely answer is that it's just someone who doesn't fully understand the rule.



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Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: 01/17/21 6:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Clark is very close with the team especially Loyd and Russell. To me she seems like a player that would stay around for less money because of her teammates and a big chance for another ring. Lets hope we sign Howard for multiple years and less then the max so that Clark gets a bigger check because she deserved it



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"Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clich�s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." �Karen Bryant
Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 01/17/21 7:52 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

My guess is that Clark will stay but will want to be paid what she's worth, which is likely something approaching the max, even if it's not all the way there. Howard might want out, and if that's the case the teams usually accommodate the player's wishes. The question would then become whether they try to replace her with some combination of what they already have - Russell, Magbegor, even Langhorne and/or Tuck if cutting them is no longer necessary - or if they look for a replacement. They'd obviously also be getting something back for Howard, which could be part of the replacement.



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bcdawg04



Joined: 12 Apr 2016
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PostPosted: 01/17/21 2:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:
mavcarter wrote:
I wonder with them using the word scheduled, they’re just assuming the player plans on accepting the deal due to that being minimum offer to start with?

$221K is a lot to walk away from, regardless of the circumstances..


Once again, I'm considering the source aka the author. Laughing Percy Allen is well-respected as a reporter on the Seattle Times Sports staff, but he hasn't been covering the Storm for all that long. (I preferred Jayda Evans' Storm coverage, but that was a few years back now.) It certainly wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for him to misunderstand how some of these more specific free agency rules work in this League, especially since a few of them are still pretty new. On the other hand, he may know exactly how they work & it could just be unconventional usage of the word "scheduled". Honestly I think if Howard did in fact sign the QO, Richyyy would've let us know by now. Very Happy


The good thing about Percy Allen coverage is that he writes news articles. Jayda Evans primarily writes commentary, particularly in her non-Storm coverage.


myrtle



Joined: 02 May 2008
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PostPosted: 01/19/21 9:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Stormeo wrote:


J-Spoon wrote:
How much money is left over for Whitcomb?

No more than 80k-85k, it seems. She might accept that if she really wants to stay with the Storm, but if a GM out there really does offer her upwards of $150k, she'd be foolish to refuse it – she now has a baby to take care of, after all. Smile


Yeah, loyalty can only take you so far. It would be a sad loss for this team but I could see Sami getting paid more elsewhere.



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mavcarter
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PostPosted: 01/19/21 10:09 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I still wonder what WNBA executive even made the assumption that Whitcomb could possibly get a $150K contract..

$150K for bench player, nowhere near being in contention for 6WOY, who’s also 32 and will turn 33 in July?



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 01/19/21 10:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
I still wonder what WNBA executive even made the assumption that Whitcomb could possibly get a $150K contract..

$150K for bench player, nowhere near being in contention for 6WOY, who’s also 32 and will turn 33 in July?


I was thinking 110-120. It's a new world in contracts. And I think she could be in contention for 6WOY on some teams. She's been a very important piece for Seattle - what I would call a steady eddie dependable player.



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