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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
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Location: Chicago
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 Posted: 07/22/20 10:57 am ::: |
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It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 4701
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| Posted: 07/22/20 11:33 am ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
She’s underrated defensively, pretty Jordin Canada-like in that regard, so even if her offensive skills don’t improve further, I think she’ll still be able to carve out a back-up role. That alone sets her apart from the several other PG/CG prospects of this class imo, who are much more offense-oriented. I think if she can legitimately improve even just one of ATO and 3PT%, she deserves to be the first PG taken in the Draft (though improving both of course would be ideal). And even if she improves neither, this Draft is so weak in its American prospects that she might end up in a safe spot by being taken with a lottery pick anyway.
As for the height thing, it seems like virtually all of the “top” PG prospects in this class are small (5’8 or below, but mostly below), so I wonder what kind of effect that’ll have on Draft Day. I do think that height makes less of a difference in the guard spot than people tend to think, particularly if the player in question has better-than-average defensive aspects (on-ball defense, anticipation, long arms, etc.) to compensate.
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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 16358
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: 07/22/20 1:23 pm ::: |
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| Stormeo wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
She’s underrated defensively, pretty Jordin Canada-like in that regard, so even if her offensive skills don’t improve further, I think she’ll still be able to carve out a back-up role. That alone sets her apart from the several other PG/CG prospects of this class imo, who are much more offense-oriented. I think if she can legitimately improve even just one of ATO and 3PT%, she deserves to be the first PG taken in the Draft (though improving both of course would be ideal). And even if she improves neither, this Draft is so weak in its American prospects that she might end up in a safe spot by being taken with a lottery pick anyway.
As for the height thing, it seems like virtually all of the “top” PG prospects in this class are small (5’8 or below, but mostly below), so I wonder what kind of effect that’ll have on Draft Day. I do think that height makes less of a difference in the guard spot than people tend to think, particularly if the player in question has better-than-average defensive aspects (on-ball defense, anticipation, long arms, etc.) to compensate. |
I guess we have to agree to disagree on that one.
If she was playing this year, she would be tied with Canada as the third-shortest player in the league. Dangerfield shocked people when she fell to the second round, but it was pretty clear that her height did it for her.
If McDonald thinks making 3s is hard now, wait until she is pretty much the shortest player on the court.
It's unlikely she develops into a whole new player at this point, but I think that is what she would have to do to compensate for her height. People are talking about her as a lottery pick, and you don't spend a lottery pick on someone who might be able to hang on as a decent back-up because of defense.
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WNBA 09
Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 12537
Location: Dallas , Texas
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| Posted: 07/22/20 1:50 pm ::: |
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| I see Andrea Riley Jr when i think of McDonald.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 07/22/20 4:58 pm ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
seems like this could also describe Chennady Carter, but lots of people seem to think she's gonna be a starter for Atlanta!?
_________________
For there is always light,
if only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
- Amanda Gorman
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 4701
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| Posted: 07/22/20 5:40 pm ::: |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
| Stormeo wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
She’s underrated defensively, pretty Jordin Canada-like in that regard, so even if her offensive skills don’t improve further, I think she’ll still be able to carve out a back-up role. That alone sets her apart from the several other PG/CG prospects of this class imo, who are much more offense-oriented. I think if she can legitimately improve even just one of ATO and 3PT%, she deserves to be the first PG taken in the Draft (though improving both of course would be ideal). And even if she improves neither, this Draft is so weak in its American prospects that she might end up in a safe spot by being taken with a lottery pick anyway.
As for the height thing, it seems like virtually all of the “top” PG prospects in this class are small (5’8 or below, but mostly below), so I wonder what kind of effect that’ll have on Draft Day. I do think that height makes less of a difference in the guard spot than people tend to think, particularly if the player in question has better-than-average defensive aspects (on-ball defense, anticipation, long arms, etc.) to compensate. |
I guess we have to agree to disagree on that one.
If she was playing this year, she would be tied with Canada as the third-shortest player in the league. Dangerfield shocked people when she fell to the second round, but it was pretty clear that her height did it for her.
If McDonald thinks making 3s is hard now, wait until she is pretty much the shortest player on the court.
It's unlikely she develops into a whole new player at this point, but I think that is what she would have to do to compensate for her height. People are talking about her as a lottery pick, and you don't spend a lottery pick on someone who might be able to hang on as a decent back-up because of defense. |
I do think her current offensive abilities are also being undersold here - 20+ PPG on over 50% 2PT at a Power-5 school isn't nothing. McDonald's a very good scorer inside the arc, which I think will at least somewhat translate to the pros. She has both speed and more importantly that explosiveness that allow her to get to the rim, where the lefty is highly adept at finishing through contact with either hand or drawing a foul (or both); if she didn't have that gear-shifting turn-the-corner ability, it's a different story (see Kelsey Plum). She also has imo a pretty consistent pull-up jumper. So I'm just saying that while we're all aware of her weaknesses, I think she's being sold a bit 'short' per se with her strengths. But even if she only becomes a career bench player in the W, all the various bench-player adages fit her really well - instant offense, instant energy, a change of pace, etc.; she could thrive anyway. And again, the 2021 Draft looks to be a total crapshoot where, barring early-declarers, it seems like all of the prospects individually have a non-injury-related chance of flaming out.
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RavenDog
Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 6878
Location: Home
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/05/20 3:12 pm ::: |
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2019
WAS 26-8
CON 23-11
IND 13-21
DAL 10-24
NYL 10-24
ATL 8-26
2020
CON 8-10
DAL 6-12
WAS* 5-12
IND 5-13
ATL 5-13
NYL 2-15
2019+2020
WAS* 31-20 (Can do no better than 4th best odds at #1 pick, unless CON also ends up in the lottery)
CON 31-21
DAL 16-36
IND 18-34 (Current 3rd best odds of #1 pick)
ATL 13-39 (Current 2nd best odds of #1 pick)
NYL 12-39 (Current best odds of #1 pick)
Current lottery team
* WAS first round pick in 2021 owned by DAL in three-team Tina Charles trade.
_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/06/20 10:00 am ::: |
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2019
WAS 26-8
CON 23-11
IND 13-21
DAL 10-24
NYL 10-24
ATL 8-26
2020
CON 9-10
DAL 6-12
WAS* 5-12
IND 5-14
ATL 5-14
NYL 2-16
2019+2020
WAS* 31-20 (Can do no better than 4th best odds at #1 pick)
CON 32-21
DAL 16-36
IND 18-35 (Can do no better than 3rd best odds of #1 pick)
ATL 13-40 (Current 2nd best odds of #1 pick)
NYL 12-40 (Current best odds of #1 pick)
Current lottery team
* WAS first round pick in 2021 owned by DAL in three-team Tina Charles trade.
Remaining games
CON: PHX, PHX, ATL
DAL: WAS, SEA, CHI, NYL
WAS: DAL, MIN, LAS, NYL, ATL
IND: LVA, NYL, MIN
ATL: CHI, CON, WAS
NYL: LAS, IND, WAS, DAL
_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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PUmatty
Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 16358
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: 09/06/20 11:15 am ::: |
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|
| PUmatty wrote: |
| Stormeo wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
She’s underrated defensively, pretty Jordin Canada-like in that regard, so even if her offensive skills don’t improve further, I think she’ll still be able to carve out a back-up role. That alone sets her apart from the several other PG/CG prospects of this class imo, who are much more offense-oriented. I think if she can legitimately improve even just one of ATO and 3PT%, she deserves to be the first PG taken in the Draft (though improving both of course would be ideal). And even if she improves neither, this Draft is so weak in its American prospects that she might end up in a safe spot by being taken with a lottery pick anyway.
As for the height thing, it seems like virtually all of the “top” PG prospects in this class are small (5’8 or below, but mostly below), so I wonder what kind of effect that’ll have on Draft Day. I do think that height makes less of a difference in the guard spot than people tend to think, particularly if the player in question has better-than-average defensive aspects (on-ball defense, anticipation, long arms, etc.) to compensate. |
I guess we have to agree to disagree on that one.
If she was playing this year, she would be tied with Canada as the third-shortest player in the league. Dangerfield shocked people when she fell to the second round, but it was pretty clear that her height did it for her.
If McDonald thinks making 3s is hard now, wait until she is pretty much the shortest player on the court.
It's unlikely she develops into a whole new player at this point, but I think that is what she would have to do to compensate for her height. People are talking about her as a lottery pick, and you don't spend a lottery pick on someone who might be able to hang on as a decent back-up because of defense. |
Seeing Dangerfield play this year, I admit that I perhaps know nothing about anything.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019
Posts: 4701
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/07/20 1:20 am ::: |
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2019
WAS 26-8
CON 23-11
IND 13-21
DAL 10-24
NYL 10-24
ATL 8-26
2020
CON 9-10
DAL 7-12
WAS* 5-13
IND 5-14
ATL 5-14
NYL 2-16
2019+2020
WAS* 31-21 (Can do no better than 4th best odds at #1 pick)
CON 32-21
DAL 17-36
IND 18-35 (Can do no better than 3rd best odds of #1 pick)
ATL 13-40 (Current 2nd best odds of #1 pick)
NYL 12-40 (Current best odds of #1 pick)
Current lottery team
* WAS first round pick in 2021 owned by DAL in three-team Tina Charles trade.
Remaining games
CON: PHX, PHX, ATL
DAL: SEA, CHI, NYL
WAS: MIN, LAS, NYL, ATL
IND: LVA, NYL, MIN
ATL: CHI, CON, WAS
NYL: LAS, IND, WAS, DAL
_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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GEF34
Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 14109
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| Posted: 09/07/20 6:40 pm ::: |
Reply |
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| PUmatty wrote: |
| Stormeo wrote: |
| PUmatty wrote: |
It seems she needs to improve on three things:
1. Learn to shoot 3s
2. Have fewer turnovers than assists
3. Grow three inches
McDonald has great production in college, but it's very hard for me to imagine her transitioning very well if she doesn't improve on those first two. |
She’s underrated defensively, pretty Jordin Canada-like in that regard, so even if her offensive skills don’t improve further, I think she’ll still be able to carve out a back-up role. That alone sets her apart from the several other PG/CG prospects of this class imo, who are much more offense-oriented. I think if she can legitimately improve even just one of ATO and 3PT%, she deserves to be the first PG taken in the Draft (though improving both of course would be ideal). And even if she improves neither, this Draft is so weak in its American prospects that she might end up in a safe spot by being taken with a lottery pick anyway.
As for the height thing, it seems like virtually all of the “top” PG prospects in this class are small (5’8 or below, but mostly below), so I wonder what kind of effect that’ll have on Draft Day. I do think that height makes less of a difference in the guard spot than people tend to think, particularly if the player in question has better-than-average defensive aspects (on-ball defense, anticipation, long arms, etc.) to compensate. |
I guess we have to agree to disagree on that one.
If she was playing this year, she would be tied with Canada as the third-shortest player in the league. Dangerfield shocked people when she fell to the second round, but it was pretty clear that her height did it for her.
If McDonald thinks making 3s is hard now, wait until she is pretty much the shortest player on the court.
It's unlikely she develops into a whole new player at this point, but I think that is what she would have to do to compensate for her height. People are talking about her as a lottery pick, and you don't spend a lottery pick on someone who might be able to hang on as a decent back-up because of defense. |
You make it sound like she is not typically the shortest player on the court in college. How many games this year was she not the shortest player on court, or even in her career. She has learned to adapt and uses her athleticism and strength to make up for her lack of speed. There aren’t many players in the college game that can finish with contact like she does and in the open court she has gotten better at utilizing her speed and has improved her pull up jumper.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/07/20 7:47 pm ::: |
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2019
WAS 26-8
IND 13-21
DAL 10-24
NYL 10-24
ATL 8-26
2020
DAL 7-12
WAS* 5-13
IND 5-14
ATL 5-14
NYL 2-16
2019+2020
WAS* 31-21 (Can do no better than 4th best odds at #1 pick)
DAL 17-36
IND 18-35 (Can do no better than 3rd best odds of #1 pick)
ATL 13-40 (Current 2nd best odds of #1 pick)
NYL 12-40 (Current best odds of #1 pick)
Current lottery team
* WAS first round pick in 2021 owned by DAL in three-team Tina Charles trade.
Remaining games
DAL: SEA, CHI, NYL
WAS: MIN, LAS, NYL, ATL
IND: LVA, NYL, MIN
ATL: CHI, CON, WAS
NYL: LAS, IND, WAS, DAL
Connecticut lands a playoff spot.
Four teams left battling for that one last spot.
_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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blaase22
Joined: 28 Mar 2011
Posts: 4163
Location: Paradise
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| Posted: 09/08/20 12:54 am ::: |
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| Is this draft class going to give 2007 and 2017 a run for their money?
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
Posts: 32335
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| Posted: 09/08/20 5:35 pm ::: |
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| blaase22 wrote: |
| Is this draft class going to give 2007 and 2017 a run for their money? |
yes.
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For there is always light,
if only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
- Amanda Gorman
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011
Posts: 10911
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| Posted: 09/08/20 6:27 pm ::: |
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| You will know it is a lousy draft if the Dream win the lottery.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 66912
Location: Where the action is
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| Posted: 09/08/20 7:03 pm ::: |
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| Randy wrote: |
| You will know it is a lousy draft if the Dream win the lottery. |
The one time the Dream won the lottery it turned out to a very good draft
Besides, we all know Dallas (with Washington's pick) is going to win
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I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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WNBA 09
Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 12537
Location: Dallas , Texas
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011
Posts: 10911
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| Posted: 09/08/20 9:23 pm ::: |
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| Any possible early entries to redeem this draft?
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/08/20 9:33 pm ::: |
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| Randy wrote: |
| Any possible early entries to redeem this draft? |
There’s one that’s always talked about, Charli Collier. She’s a stretch five that would probably work well with what the Liberty do.
Evina Westbrook, but I don’t consider her a game-changer.
http://boards.rebkell.net/viewtopic.php?t=97934&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=31
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
Last edited by Shades on 09/24/20 12:55 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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PickledGinger
Joined: 04 Oct 2013
Posts: 1365
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| Posted: 09/08/20 10:51 pm ::: |
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Not a mock draft, but here's my ranking of the Top 10 prospects, assuming everyone fulfills their eligibility.
1. Michaela Onyenwere
2. Rennia Davis
3. Natasha Mack
4. Awak Kuier
5. Tiana Mangakahia
6. Arella Guirantes
7. Dana Evans
8. Iliana Rupert
9. Kiana Williams
10. Unique Thompson
If Collier or Westbrook declare early, slot them in at #3 and move everyone else down. Also, note that McDonald isn't on this list.
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awhom111
Joined: 19 Nov 2014
Posts: 4230
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| Posted: 09/08/20 11:47 pm ::: |
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| While thinking about a few other things, I learned that Juste Jocyte was born in the United States. Under current rules, that keeps her out of the WNBA until 2027 instead of being able to join in 2025 if she was born elsewhere. |
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 63772
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| Posted: 09/08/20 11:49 pm ::: |
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2019
WAS 26-8
IND 13-21
DAL 10-24
NYL 10-24
ATL 8-26
2020
DAL 7-12
WAS* 6-13
IND 5-15
ATL 5-14
NYL 2-17
2019+2020
WAS* 32-21 (Can do no better than 4th best odds at #1 pick)
IND 18-36 (Can do no better than 3rd best odds of #1 pick)
DAL 17-36
ATL 13-40 (Current 2nd best odds of #1 pick)
NYL 12-41 (Current best odds of #1 pick)
Current lottery team
* WAS first round pick in 2021 owned by DAL in three-team Tina Charles trade.
Remaining games
DAL: SEA, CHI, NYL
WAS: LAS, NYL, ATL
IND: NYL, MIN
ATL: CHI, CON, WAS
NYL: IND, WAS, DAL
Fever officially out of the playoffs.
Three teams left battling for that one last playoff spot.
_________________
Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
Last edited by Shades on 09/09/20 4:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 24352
Location: London
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| Posted: 09/09/20 12:07 am ::: |
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| PickledGinger wrote: |
Not a mock draft, but here's my ranking of the Top 10 prospects, assuming everyone fulfills their eligibility.
1. Michaela Onyenwere
2. Rennia Davis
3. Natasha Mack
4. Awak Kuier
5. Tiana Mangakahia
6. Arella Guirantes
7. Dana Evans
8. Iliana Rupert
9. Kiana Williams
10. Unique Thompson
If Collier or Westbrook declare early, slot them in at #3 and move everyone else down. Also, note that McDonald isn't on this list. |
Genuine question - have any of the people ranking Awak Kuier as some kind of lottery talent actually seen her play for more than about 30 seconds of Youtube clips?
| awhom111 wrote: |
| While thinking about a few other things, I learned that Juste Jocyte was born in the United States. Under current rules, that keeps her out of the WNBA until 2027 instead of being able to join in 2025 if she was born elsewhere. |
Which is so dumb. Really poorly written rule, that they've never bothered to rephrase through several CBAs. |
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