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Shades
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 Posted: 07/22/20 9:10 am ::: |
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Howee
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FrozenLVFan
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| Posted: 07/22/20 12:05 pm ::: |
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| We're poised to hit 4M cases by tomorrow.
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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FrozenLVFan
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| Posted: 07/22/20 10:20 pm ::: |
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| I'm afraid the ignorance from the Oval Office is going to be outdone by the proliferating self-righteousness of the anti-maskers, anti-vaxers, and anti-testers. Our whole country is looking pretty pathetic right now.
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Shades
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taropatch
Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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tfan
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| Posted: 07/23/20 9:28 pm ::: |
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| Some people have a natural tendency to react with annoyance and disbelief to warnings like what we started to have decades ago with regard to environmental conservation and running out of space (recycling, public transit) and the like. Those that gave the message were denigrated as "tree huggers". Also any cautions about population growth or resource depletion of something like oil are dismissed out of hand (although in those cases - by virtually everyone). Then there is Global Warming. But with most of this, the ramifications are not immediate - it can take decades for the negatives to become readily apparent. Until that happens both sides can claim to be right. In the case of this virus, the same dismissive reaction to a warning seems to have taken place - "at worst, it is like a bad flu season". But the effects don't take decades, so in retrospect it would have been better if we had worked harder to get people to take "scientific warnings" more seriously. But working against hat is the fact that many "political conservatives" have embraced the idea that these types of warnings are misguided or made up ideas from political liberals, not from scientists.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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| Posted: 07/24/20 7:54 am ::: |
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| tfan wrote: |
| Some people have a natural tendency to react with annoyance and disbelief to warnings like what we started to have decades ago with regard to environmental conservation and running out of space (recycling, public transit) and the like. Those that gave the message were denigrated as "tree huggers". Also any cautions about population growth or resource depletion of something like oil are dismissed out of hand (although in those cases - by virtually everyone). Then there is Global Warming. But with most of this, the ramifications are not immediate - it can take decades for the negatives to become readily apparent. Until that happens both sides can claim to be right. In the case of this virus, the same dismissive reaction to a warning seems to have taken place - "at worst, it is like a bad flu season". But the effects don't take decades, so in retrospect it would have been better if we had worked harder to get people to take "scientific warnings" more seriously. But working against hat is the fact that many "political conservatives" have embraced the idea that these types of warnings are misguided or made up ideas from political liberals, not from scientists. |
Well said. I would add only that the decline of actual journalism, and the fake news and hysteria that we've come to expect from the media contribute to the disbelief and chaos as well.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 07/24/20 8:01 am ::: |
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| tfan wrote: |
| Some people have a natural tendency to react with annoyance and disbelief to warnings like what we started to have decades ago with regard to environmental conservation and running out of space (recycling, public transit) and the like. Those that gave the message were denigrated as "tree huggers". Also any cautions about population growth or resource depletion of something like oil are dismissed out of hand (although in those cases - by virtually everyone). Then there is Global Warming. But with most of this, the ramifications are not immediate - it can take decades for the negatives to become readily apparent. Until that happens both sides can claim to be right. In the case of this virus, the same dismissive reaction to a warning seems to have taken place - "at worst, it is like a bad flu season". But the effects don't take decades, so in retrospect it would have been better if we had worked harder to get people to take "scientific warnings" more seriously. But working against hat is the fact that many "political conservatives" have embraced the idea that these types of warnings are misguided or made up ideas from political liberals, not from scientists. |
It hasn't helped that environmentalists have made a large number of claims and predictions that proved false, making it easy to paint them as extremist wackos.
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Shades
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| Posted: 07/26/20 1:47 pm ::: |
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| <iframe scrolling="no" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen webkitallowfullscreen mozallowfullscreen allow="autoplay; fullscreen" src="https://w3.cdn.anvato.net/player/prod/v3/anvload.html?key=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%3D%3D" width ="640" height="360"></iframe>
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Luuuc
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| Posted: 07/28/20 2:37 am ::: |
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'Nothing more than a bad flu season' has now surpassed 150,000 fatalities in the US.
One state down here - Victoria - is struggling as well, and has had to enforce a bunch of new restrictions again.
Liz Cambage & Bec Allen probably would have been safer in the wubble than they are in Melbourne atm.
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FrozenLVFan
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| Posted: 07/28/20 10:35 am ::: |
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| That's too bad, Luuuc. I thought Australia had this problem well under control. Was the (re)surgence of the virus in Victoria related to a premature loosening of restrictions and opening up the state, like has happened in parts of the US?
Last edited by FrozenLVFan on 07/28/20 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Luuuc
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| Posted: 07/28/20 5:55 pm ::: |
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| FrozenLVFan wrote: |
| That's too bad, Luuuc. I though Australia had this problem well under control. Was the (re)surgence of the virus in Victoria related to a premature loosening of restrictions and opening up the state, like has happened in parts of the US? |
Basically, yes. I think they got loosening envy from a few other states that were doing very well. They went comparatively earlier and harder than other states with their easing back towards normality and are now paying the price. And their screwup has held back the rest of the country too.
Very frustrating to do so well and then blow it with bad decisions down the home stretch.
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 07/28/20 7:57 pm ::: |
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| Luuuc wrote: |
| FrozenLVFan wrote: |
| That's too bad, Luuuc. I though Australia had this problem well under control. Was the (re)surgence of the virus in Victoria related to a premature loosening of restrictions and opening up the state, like has happened in parts of the US? |
Basically, yes. I think they got loosening envy from a few other states that were doing very well. They went comparatively earlier and harder than other states with their easing back towards normality and are now paying the price. And their screwup has held back the rest of the country too.
Very frustrating to do so well and then blow it with bad decisions down the home stretch. |
That's pretty much exactly what California did. (And what inevitably happened to California..)
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tfan
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| Posted: 07/29/20 8:41 am ::: |
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| I saw an article talking about how there is a resurgence in Europe. Germany had their transmission rate at something like .7 and now it is above 1 again. It seems that you have to have restrictions to get it below 1 and when you loosen it goes back above one. But I saw a Medium post claiming that any country is two months away from having a small number of cases (which then can be monitored and controlled) if they maintained a strict lockdown for that period, keeping their transmission rate significantly below one. But it seems like no "free" country at the moment has the money or support - or even the concern - for another period of strict lockdowns. In the article of European countries going up in cases they showed pictures of Europeans on vacation in other European countries. I don't even want to go to the store, let alone travel to another country and site see.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 07/29/20 10:08 am ::: |
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| Howee wrote: |
| It makes sense that the Asian countries like Japan and S. Korea have better luck with that, being cultures where 'self' is less, and compliance is more valued. |
It also helps that they don't have easily accessible land neighbors. You can't walk or drive or take a train into either of those countries. You have to fly or come by boat, much more easily controlled entries.
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Shades
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| Posted: 07/29/20 11:21 am ::: |
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Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
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Location: Durham, NC
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| Posted: 07/29/20 1:06 pm ::: |
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https://www.businessinsider.com/fauci-pushes-back-against-trumps-claims-that-hes-misleading-the-public-about-coronavirus-2020-7
IT HAS BEEN PROVEN THAT HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE has ZERO effectiveness in preventing or treating COVID. The people who, like sheep, followed Cheeto down this rabbit hole (he makes $$ off chloroquine sales) have gone silent here. Thank the Lord. Anyone who promotes use of this drug has ZERO data to back up any statements they make. Discussion is good. Promoting fraud is dangerous.
The only reason anyone put together clinical trials to study this drug is because Cheeto and his buddies had stock and made $$. There was no data to support the trials. The data that came out of the trials proved it was not effective. Meanwhile, the people who had conditions the drug DOES treat either could not get the drug or had to pay a LOT more to get it.
Discussion is good. Promoting fraud causes damage. Understand the difference.
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Last edited by readyAIMfire53 on 07/29/20 1:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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| Posted: 07/29/20 3:57 pm ::: |
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Seventeen Anesthesiologist Residents, Fellow At University Hospital System Contract Virus After Private Party
| Quote: |
At least 17 anesthesiologist residents and a fellow at one of the premier university hospital systems in Florida contracted COVID-19 earlier this month after attending a private party together, according to hospital insiders and internal documents.
The outbreak at University of Florida Health occurred after a party at a private home, according to people familiar with the situation. They spoke on condition of anonymity because they said UF Health prohibits employees from speaking to reporters without authorization...
The UF Health outbreak illustrates the difficulties of stemming the spread of the pandemic, when even trained health care professionals can be sickened from a private party in Florida – one of the nation’s hot spots for the virus – after explicit warnings about the risks from social gatherings...
Details about the house party were not immediately clear. One person described it as a going-away party for a resident, but another person described it as a party organized by second-year residents for incoming first-year residents, with roughly 20 or 30 residents who attended. The conflicting statements could not be resolved.
The incident also raised questions about transparency in uncovering information about outbreaks among health care workers, even at a government-run health care system.
The hospital system declined to confirm or dispute the outbreak or a party. In a prepared statement, and over days of communications with officials there, it said unspecified state and federal privacy laws prohibit it from commenting on specific situations... |
https://www.wuft.org/news/2020/07/27/seventeen-anesthesiologist-residents-fellow-at-university-hospital-system-contract-virus-after-private-party/
Arrogance abounds.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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| Posted: 07/29/20 5:27 pm ::: |
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| readyAIMfire53 wrote: |
https://www.businessinsider.com/fauci-pushes-back-against-trumps-claims-that-hes-misleading-the-public-about-coronavirus-2020-7
IT HAS BEEN PROVEN THAT HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE has ZERO effectiveness in preventing or treating COVID. The people who, like sheep, followed Cheeto down this rabbit hole (he makes $$ off chloroquine sales) have gone silent here. Thank the Lord. Anyone who promotes use of this drug has ZERO data to back up any statements they make. Discussion is good. Promoting fraud is dangerous.
The only reason anyone put together clinical trials to study this drug is because Cheeto and his buddies had stock and made $$. There was no data to support the trials. The data that came out of the trials proved it was not effective. Meanwhile, the people who had conditions the drug DOES treat either could not get the drug or had to pay a LOT more to get it.
Discussion is good. Promoting fraud causes damage. Understand the difference. |
I have to take issue with some of this. The main reason that hydroxychloroquine became a topic for discussion was that the Chinese published both clinical and in vitro studies back in March claiming that HCQ was effective in treating COVID and multiple claims were made without reported substantiation that both China and South Korea were using it for both prophylaxis and treatment. This was immediately followed by a French study claiming HCQ was effective. Given the proliferation of cases in Europe and the US by that time, and the apparent ease with which China and SK curtailed their cases, many institutions, flailing around for ways to treat this disease, jumped on the HCQ research bandwagon. The Chinese and French data, and not Trump's stock portfolio, suggested the need for more trials.
The problem was that the original studies and most of the ones that followed were seriously flawed in their methodology and their results were dubious at best. Since none of our politicians or media personalities understand anything about research, they all cherry-picked some study to support their position regardless of its lack of validity. There's data, albeit flawed, to support any position, but POTUS did dig a pretty big rabbit hole for others to stumble into.
Even now, more lousy studies are being published. Henry Ford Hospital just published another study claiming HCQ is an effective treatment. There's a large study underway to determine if it's effective at preventing infections in health care providers. Etc, etc. The preponderance of the data show that HCQ is not effective in preventing or treating COVID, but there are still isolated studies reporting otherwise and providing more media-fodder.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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| Posted: 07/29/20 7:47 pm ::: |
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| I have no medical expertise, but years of Dungeons & Dragons have taught me that sex with demons and/or witches invariably leads to nasty diseases
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I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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| Posted: 07/29/20 10:50 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| I have no medical expertise, but years of Dungeons & Dragons have taught me that sex with demons and/or witches invariably leads to nasty diseases |
Me too. 'Cept I didn't find out via Dungeons & Dragons.
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Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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