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jap



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 4:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 5:42 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

signing Gray gives them a true back-up at PF. Likely pushes Gulich to the end of the bench. Sparks can still sign one more player.

PG: Gray/Wiese
SG: Williams/Augustus
SF: TRP/Sykes
PF: N. Ogwumike/Gray
C: Parker/Anigwe/Gulich



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GEF34



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 6:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


This is of course assuming the other players believe it or they don’t already know about if it is true. And also assuming they are not currently talking about.



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 9:05 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


Well this revealed Candace dynamic seems to validate what I and another poster on this site have been pushing. It might have been you and I appologize if I could not remember to acknowledge it.

I think you have a very good point about this shortend season giving Candice and opportunity to respond to those accusations. Her history suggests that she plays better when she is mad and trying to prove something. But I doubt if she can maintain that anger even through a short season.

I could see why Penny was angry and lost it with the team. Complacency is catching and anyone with a modicum os sense would realize that Candice was the source of that complacency. But since Penny could do nothing about Candice she tried to lite a fire under the team to counter that attitude.

In response to some of you who are sure that Gulish will end up at the end of the bench- why don't we wait and see before making such an early speculaton. A lot depends on what a team needs and how well a player fits in with a teams style of play. What many of you are forgettng is that in the Sparks system they require their post players to be able to shoot from outside. This is probably why they traded Brown.



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 9:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


Well this revealed Candace dynamic seems to validate what I and another poster on this site have been pushing. It might have been you and I appologize if I could not remember to acknowledge it.

I think you have a very good point about this shortend season giving Candice and opportunity to respond to those accusations. Her history suggests that she plays better when she is mad and trying to prove something. But I doubt if she can maintain that anger even through a short season.

I could see why Penny was angry and lost it with the team. Complacency is catching and anyone with a modicum os sense would realize that Candice was the source of that complacency. But since Penny could do nothing about Candice she tried to lite a fire under the team to counter that attitude.

In response to some of you who are sure that Gulish will end up at the end of the bench- why don't we wait and see before making such an early speculaton. A lot depends on what a team needs and how well a player fits in with a teams style of play. What many of you are forgettng is that in the Sparks system they require their post players to be able to shoot from outside. This is probably why they traded Brown.


I watched all of the Dream games last season and saw scant evidence that Gulich can shot from anywhere, or do anything else.



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jap



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 10:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


Well this revealed Candace dynamic seems to validate what I and another poster on this site have been pushing. It might have been you and I apologize if I could not remember to acknowledge it.

I think you have a very good point about this shortened season giving Candace and opportunity to respond to those accusations. Her history suggests that she plays better when she is mad and trying to prove something. But I doubt if she can maintain that anger even through a short season.

I could see why Penny was angry and lost it with the team. Complacency is catching and anyone with a modicum os sense would realize that Candice was the source of that complacency. But since Penny could do nothing about Candice she tried to lite a fire under the team to counter that attitude.

In response to some of you who are sure that Gulish will end up at the end of the bench- why don't we wait and see before making such an early speculation. A lot depends on what a team needs and how well a player fits in with a teams style of play. What many of you are forgetting is that in the Sparks system they require their post players to be able to shoot from outside. This is probably why they traded Brown.


I am not sure if I am the fellow poster you are referring to. All I have wanted from the very beginning was to see Candace fulfill her full potential. Early in her career, she appeared to be on that very track, even when she was dealing with injuries and aggravations of previous injuries. She was doing everything for the team - always among the leaders in the most coveted statistical categories and more-so than any other WNBA player in league history - and actually IMPROVING her overall game.

Somewhere along the line she began to gradually and increasingly take more & more plays off. The addition of extra talented teammates (Nneka, Kristi, Chelsea, etc.) only served to contribute to even more coasting rather than performing.

Penny played with the workout freak, Lisa Leslie, who was super active and talented enough to be the perennial centerpiece of the USA Olympic team. And Penny is observing Candace who is arguably even more talented than Lisa coasting when she should be continually challenging her teammates to give even more. When your very best player plays with continuous fire, the WHOLE TEAM catches on fire. Ace's Sparks could have had more championships if she was more continually focused & engaged. Penny noted the declining trend in her superstar player and sought to recoup some value for the team's good, only to be shot down by the organizational brass.

I cannot fault Penny's motive to invigorate the team during last season's playoffs, even if I question her means of accomplishing that end. She has always sought to provide her coaches and team with whatever pieces they required to be a better team. This has been her track record as a GM.

Will Candace come back swinging for the fences, or will she settle for an early retirement-esque performance?



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Last edited by jap on 06/27/20 10:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
jap



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 10:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


This is of course assuming the other players believe it or they don’t already know about if it is true. And also assuming they are not currently talking about.


The players are all aware that Candace was provided with preferential traveling privileges. How intimately aware of just how much she was being cuddled is another matter. What the players know about the behavior of the organizational brass is another issue. If they saw things they did not approve of, even that could have contributed to deflating their play.



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 10:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

does anybody seriously think that superstars in any sport are not coddled or get preferential treatment from their organizations? I would guess it is more unusual to NOT get that kind of treatment. In the W, the stars basically haven't been able to get paid substantially more than the sixth best player on the team (sometimes even the 7th or 8th best player), so it seems logical that they would get some other somethings...



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jap



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PostPosted: 06/27/20 11:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
does anybody seriously think that superstars in any sport are not coddled or get preferential treatment from their organizations? I would guess it is more unusual to NOT get that kind of treatment. In the W, the stars basically haven't been able to get paid substantially more than the sixth best player on the team (sometimes even the 7th or 8th best player), so it seems logical that they would get some other somethings...


You know, Myrtle, we really don't need you questioning my reasoning with facts! Laughing

Anyway, the point I was making earlier along that line was that Ace was getting preferential treatment above and beyond that of her "harder working teammates" - namely, Nneka and Chelsea.



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GEF34



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 1:49 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jap wrote:
GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


This is of course assuming the other players believe it or they don’t already know about if it is true. And also assuming they are not currently talking about.


The players are all aware that Candace was provided with preferential traveling privileges. How intimately aware of just how much she was being cuddled is another matter. What the players know about the behavior of the organizational brass is another issue. If they saw things they did not approve of, even that could have contributed to deflating their play.


Based on what you said here I’m not understanding your above statement in that Candace has to “prove” to her teammates. Also Candace was in Chelsea’s wedding and Nneka and Chiney have both said something about Candace being an Ogwumike sister (I bring up Chelsea and Nneka only because you mentioned them in another post). So there is a possibility everything Penny is saying or has said they already know to be true or not true, and they also may just not care.



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jap



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 2:05 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


This is of course assuming the other players believe it or they don’t already know about if it is true. And also assuming they are not currently talking about.


The players are all aware that Candace was provided with preferential traveling privileges. How intimately aware of just how much she was being cuddled is another matter. What the players know about the behavior of the organizational brass is another issue. If they saw things they did not approve of, even that could have contributed to deflating their play.


Based on what you said here I’m not understanding your above statement in that Candace has to “prove” to her teammates. Also Candace was in Chelsea’s wedding and Nneka and Chiney have both said something about Candace being an Ogwumike sister (I bring up Chelsea and Nneka only because you mentioned them in another post). So there is a possibility everything Penny is saying or has said they already know to be true or not true, and they also may just not care.


Nneka, Chelsea, and the other players are probably unaware that Penny was attempting to trade Candace. Trade attempts that fail, especially those squelched by internal superiors, are virtually never discussed with players or the media. The very idea that the GM thought Ace was inadequate to lead the team probably isn't something Candace wanted exposed.



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GEF34



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 3:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jap wrote:
GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
GEF34 wrote:
jap wrote:
I've been curious about how Candace feels about Penny's charges against the Sparks' organizational brass, Penny's desire to trade her away for the good of the team, and Penny's seeming disgust of the pampering that Candace has been receiving above & beyond that of her harder working teammates. Undoubtedly, she has probably been advised to keep a low profile. However, her teammates are seeing and hearing all this, and Ace may have a thing or two to prove to herself, her teammates, and her coaches this shortened season.


This is of course assuming the other players believe it or they don’t already know about if it is true. And also assuming they are not currently talking about.


The players are all aware that Candace was provided with preferential traveling privileges. How intimately aware of just how much she was being cuddled is another matter. What the players know about the behavior of the organizational brass is another issue. If they saw things they did not approve of, even that could have contributed to deflating their play.


Based on what you said here I’m not understanding your above statement in that Candace has to “prove” to her teammates. Also Candace was in Chelsea’s wedding and Nneka and Chiney have both said something about Candace being an Ogwumike sister (I bring up Chelsea and Nneka only because you mentioned them in another post). So there is a possibility everything Penny is saying or has said they already know to be true or not true, and they also may just not care.


Nneka, Chelsea, and the other players are probably unaware that Penny was attempting to trade Candace. Trade attempts that fail, especially those squelched by internal superiors, are virtually never discussed with players or the media. The very idea that the GM thought Ace was inadequate to lead the team probably isn't something Candace wanted exposed.


But I’m not seeing what Candace would have to prove. Whatever Penny Toler thought/said/did, that’s on Penny. Also bear in mind if the players believe Candace is the right leader or the person they want on their side when going to battle and they don’t think she should be traded or should have traded to begin with they would already be on the side of Candace.

Remember how out spoken the team was when Requana got suspended, I think you would have seen it on a higher level from the Sparks if Candace was traded.

On the other hand if the Sparks players want her traded and they find this out all that Penny has said, then I get she has to prove to the players she shouldn’t be traded, but I haven’t seen anything that even hints at the fact the players wanted her traded.



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 11:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I have been critical of Candace Parker in the past, but you know, none of us are in the locker room, or at practice, or deal with her every day. I understand that fans can be upset with her perceived lack of consistent effort, but do we really know that it's effort? I would put forth that it's possible -- not necessarily likely -- that her bad knee (which she originally hurt pushing to get back to her high school team before it was fully healed) may impact her more some days than others.

Or she's a lazy bum who we all should hate ...

For me, at least, the endorsement from the Ogwumikes outweighs all the outside, basically uninformed, opinion.

Maybe she isn't as good as she could be, but apparently her teammates are happy to have her on the team.



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 1:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Sparks have signed Te'a Cooper.



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 1:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
Sparks have signed Te'a Cooper.


Perfect fit......



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 1:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Sparks have signed Te'a Cooper.


Perfect fit......


Especially if she lasts long term.



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 4:25 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://www.latimes.com/sports/story/2020-06-28/sparks-sign-mercury-second-round-draft-pick-tea-cooper

Quote:
“I would like to thank God, my family and the Los Angeles Sparks organization for believing in me,” Cooper said in the team’s news release. “I am beyond grateful for this opportunity and I’m excited and eager to contribute on and off the court in any way possible. I am looking forward to being with my new coaches, teammates, the organization, the fans and the community.”



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 4:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

What is this now for her - 4 colleges (or was it 3? IDK), and 2 WNBA teams before her first game.....Maybe she should be a called "the well traveled Te'a Cooper."



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 4:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
What is this now for her - 4 colleges (or was it 3? IDK), and 2 WNBA teams before her first game.....Maybe she should be a called "the well traveled Te'a Cooper."


When the Sparks win the 2020 WNBA Championship, I want to blame the Phoenix Mercury, even though they already have a Lynx Reject, Wings Reject, and Liberty Reject. 😡


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PostPosted: 06/28/20 4:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SpaceJunkie wrote:
Randy wrote:
What is this now for her - 4 colleges (or was it 3? IDK), and 2 WNBA teams before her first game.....Maybe she should be a called "the well traveled Te'a Cooper."


When the Sparks win the 2020 WNBA Championship, I want to blame the Phoenix Mercury, even though they already have a Lynx Reject, Wings Reject, and Liberty Reject. 😡


What about the Dream - don't Gulich and Sykes count as rejects too? Or is your criteria they have to be waived.



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PostPosted: 06/28/20 9:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

i think we had this conversation before about Parker. I did a little digging and Candice herself admits that she always needed someone on her case or having to prove her self to get the best effort out of her. She says her father recognized this at an early age and used to take her to play at parks not close ot her home and if she didn't play all out she would have to walk home. He felt that she was so much better than the players she played with that she developed a coasting attitude at an early age.

We develop our work ethic at an early age. Candice was always so much better that she could coasta nd still dominate games. The thing is that as she got older that was not the case. She could not just turn it on when she needed to. She generally has an easy going nature which only disappears when she gets angry of feel she has something to prove.

I also beieve that non competative easy going nature makes her well liked by her teammates. This is why they support her and do not resent her. That lack of work ethic does not affect the players who always give their all like Neka and Chelsea, but it affects the others.



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PostPosted: 07/01/20 7:54 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dT2cIcja8w


Toler with another video , she's got some new edits so she must be taking this serious now . Great video though i like the smart ring idea for the WNBA players as well.



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PostPosted: 07/01/20 8:00 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Motivational Speaker. If your office needs someone to come and in give an Ass Kicking speech she's the one.... Razz



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PostPosted: 07/01/20 9:05 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
Motivational Speaker. If your office needs someone to come and in give an Ass Kicking speech she's the one.... Razz


LMAO.



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PostPosted: 07/06/20 11:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Looks like Chiney Ogwumike found herself a job after opting out.

According to Jay Williams at the New York Post, it appears she got a radio gig on ESPN radio from 4 to 7 PM.

https://nypost.com/2020/07/06/jay-williams-max-kellermans-roles-emerge-amid-espn-radio-makeover/


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