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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4701
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Posted: 05/01/20 3:55 am ::: |
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Rock Hard wrote: |
The right situation for any player is to be able to start ASAP. That player will either swim or sink. The second best situation is to play at least twenty minutes per game. With that amount playing time a player can demonstrate what she can do. |
+1. That just never happened for KML. Hopefully for New York's and Walker's sakes, that'll happen for Walker. I do find Walker and Willoughby in particular to be very similar with both their body types and their games, so I wonder how that dynamic will play itself out. Oof, I can't imagine what drafting two KMLs onto the team would've been like for the Storm lmao.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11147
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Posted: 05/01/20 9:46 am ::: |
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I would disagree about starting right away, because if you start right away and fail, you're pretty much done.
For some players -- not all -- it makes more sense to play a lesser role the first year or two while you figure things out, work on your weaknesses, etc. Then when you do get the chance, you have the best chance to succeed.
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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root_thing
Joined: 28 Apr 2007 Posts: 7365 Location: Underground
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Posted: 05/01/20 10:02 am ::: |
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Stormeo wrote: |
I do find Walker and Willoughby in particular to be very similar with both their body types and their games, so I wonder how that dynamic will play itself out. |
Walker and Willoughby may have similar body types, but there are notable differences in their games. Walker shot almost twice as many 3's as Willoughby (173 vs 89). Meanwhile, Jocelyn shot more than twice as many free throws (193 vs 95) as Megan in two fewer games. Willoughby is much better off the dribble. She has more ability to create her own shot and is much more willing to take it to the hoop. Walker is the better jump shooter. Defensively, Walker is probably the better positional rebounder, but Willoughby plays with more energy. I can see her being used for trapping and pressing.
_________________ You can always do something else.
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six sense
Joined: 12 Feb 2020 Posts: 64
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Posted: 05/01/20 11:32 am ::: |
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Very good scouting report Root- thing could not have broken it down better
_________________ six sense
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Rock Hard
Joined: 02 Aug 2010 Posts: 5377 Location: Chocolate Paradise
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Posted: 05/01/20 2:21 pm ::: |
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ClayK wrote: |
I would disagree about starting right away, because if you start right away and fail, you're pretty much done.
For some players -- not all -- it makes more sense to play a lesser role the first year or two while you figure things out, work on your weaknesses, etc. Then when you do get the chance, you have the best chance to succeed. |
So if you draft a player with a great college resume' and you really need her to start because she is the best option that you have at that position. I believe that she should start.
_________________ You can win, as long as you keep your head to the SKY! Be OPTIMISTIC!
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RavenDog
Joined: 19 Feb 2007 Posts: 6878 Location: Home
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ucbart
Joined: 21 Nov 2004 Posts: 2815 Location: New York
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Posted: 05/10/20 11:14 am ::: |
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root_thing wrote: |
Stormeo wrote: |
I do find Walker and Willoughby in particular to be very similar with both their body types and their games, so I wonder how that dynamic will play itself out. |
Walker and Willoughby may have similar body types, but there are notable differences in their games. Walker shot almost twice as many 3's as Willoughby (173 vs 89). Meanwhile, Jocelyn shot more than twice as many free throws (193 vs 95) as Megan in two fewer games. Willoughby is much better off the dribble. She has more ability to create her own shot and is much more willing to take it to the hoop. Walker is the better jump shooter. Defensively, Walker is probably the better positional rebounder, but Willoughby plays with more energy. I can see her being used for trapping and pressing. |
Agree, re: Walker. This is why I think she needed another year of college. She has got to improve off the bounce and creating her own shot. She developed into a great shooter and her overall game both offensively and defensively, is good, but I think she could have improved by leaps with one more year of college.
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mavcarter #NATC
Joined: 02 Sep 2010 Posts: 5935 Location: Chicago
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Posted: 05/10/20 12:35 pm ::: |
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Regarding slashing, it doesn’t appear to be one of those skills that just come from a little work. Usually, the great players have had that ability to do it for a long time.
And it’s not like college coaches truly care to develop players when they leave their program.._________________
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Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree? |
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6796
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Posted: 05/26/20 7:24 pm ::: |
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lynxmania wrote: |
Round 1
1. New York - Sabrina Ionescu, Oregon
2. Dallas - Satou Sabally, Oregon
3. Indiana - Lauren Cox, Baylor
4. Atlanta - Chennedy Carter, Texas A&M
5. Dallas - Bella Alarie, Princeton
6. Minnesota - Mikiah Herbert Harrigan, South Carolina
7. Dallas - Tyasha Harris, South Carolina
8. Chicago - Ruthy Hebard, Oregon
9. New York - Megan Walker, UConn
10. Phoenix - Jocelyn Willoughby, Virginia [traded to New York]
11. Seattle - Kitija Laksa, TTT Riga/Lativa/USF
12. New York - Jazmine Jones, Louisville
Round 2
13. New York - Kylee Shook, Louisville
14. Indiana - Kathleen Doyle, Iowa
15. New York - Leaonna Odom, Duke
16. Minnesota - Crystal Dangerfield, UConn
17. Atlanta - Brittany Brewer, Texas Tech
18. Phoenix - Te'a Cooper, Baylor
19. Seattle - Joyner Holmes, Texas
20. Los Angeles - Beatrice Mompremier, Miami
21. Dallas - Luisa Geiselsoder, Germany
22. Los Angeles - Leonie Fiebich, Germany
23. Connecticut - Kaila Charles, Maryland
24. Washington - Jaylyn Agnew, Creighton
Round 3
25. Atlanta - Mikayla Pivec, Oregon State
26. New York - Erica Ogwumike, Rice [traded to Minnesota]
27. Atlanta - Kobi Thornton, Clemson
28. Indiana -Kamia Smalls,
29. Phoenix - Stella Johnson,, Rider
30. Chicago - Japreece Dean, UCLA
31. Seattle - Haley Gorecki, Duke
32. Chicago - Kiah Gillespie, Florida State
33. Las Vegas - Lauren Manis, Holy Cross
34. Los Angeles - Tynice Martin, Vest Virginia
35. Connecticut - Juicy Landrum, Baylor
36. Washington - Sug Sutton, Texas
*Payton Chester, Gigi Bryant, and Alyssa Altobelli selected as honorary draft picks |
[b]
2nd round did pretty well for itself
Could be one more if Laimbeer goes Mompremier or Holmes
Happy for Charles she wins the lowest draft pick to make a squad award so far, and might not have made it if she was picked earlier
who wins the most shocked they didn't make a team award
Mompremier, Holmes, Cooper, Gillespie or Martin?
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63770
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Posted: 05/26/20 8:29 pm ::: |
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You may want to use a different color coding for suspended players, because technically they aren’t cut.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 22474 Location: NJ
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Posted: 05/26/20 9:10 pm ::: |
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yeah, five players from the draft are suspended. Laksa, Geiselsoder, Fiebich, Pivec & Gillespie.
_________________ LET'S GO LIBERTY!!!!!!
Twitter: @TBRBWAY
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J-Spoon
Joined: 31 Jan 2009 Posts: 6796
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Posted: 05/26/20 9:18 pm ::: |
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I am too lazy to fix it so
nor was if a player was cut or suspended a point I was trying to make
in reference to my list above
players in bold are players who weren't cut or suspended
and therefor are active roster members as of right now
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NoDakSt
Joined: 26 Oct 2005 Posts: 4929
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Posted: 05/26/20 11:52 pm ::: |
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19 UCONNers on opening day rosters.
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4701
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Posted: 05/27/20 12:08 am ::: |
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I've said this all before, but it's even more obvious now that the W seriously needs to cut out the entire Third Round of its Drafts. I know this season is an anomaly, but the fact of the matter is, none of the third-round picks from the 2020 Draft will be playing in the 2020 Season as things stand now. The 3rd-rounders of Drafts past that have made the team they got drafted to hardly even end up developing into functional bench players, let alone borderline starters. What’s the point? Training camp contracts get wasted having to be used on raw and low-ceiling 3rd-rounders whom coaches don't have the time to focus their efforts on. These contracts are much better off going to players that have spent at least one season overseas somewhere where they have more of a capacity to immediately contribute to a team in the W given the professional basketball experience under their belt.
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24351 Location: London
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Posted: 05/27/20 6:09 am ::: |
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What's the harm in there being a third round? Players get the excitement of saying they were drafted by the WNBA (and maybe make a few extra dollars overseas as a result), local journos get to write the typical human interest stories, and teams get to pick a body for the opening week or so of camp (in a normal year). Teams also get chips to send to each other in "well by rule you have to give us something" trades.
I don't think there's a huge amount of point to it, but I don't think it really hurts anything. |
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005 Posts: 22474 Location: NJ
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Posted: 05/27/20 8:29 am ::: |
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The third round has been debated for a while now whether it should go, but there's really no harm and it does look good for a player when looking play overseas.
_________________ LET'S GO LIBERTY!!!!!!
Twitter: @TBRBWAY
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11147
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Posted: 05/27/20 10:09 am ::: |
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One advantage for players in not having a third round is that they can look at rosters and sign a training camp deal with a team that they have a chance of making rather than be forced into a training camp where their position is stacked with veterans.
That said, the PR value for the league is helpful (articles in non-WNBA cities) and players might get more money in Europe as WNBA draftees.
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24351 Location: London
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Posted: 05/27/20 10:46 am ::: |
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ClayK wrote: |
One advantage for players in not having a third round is that they can look at rosters and sign a training camp deal with a team that they have a chance of making rather than be forced into a training camp where their position is stacked with veterans. |
It's so very rare that free agents actually do that. Semi-longshot UFAs repeatedly sign places where you look at the roster and immediately go "she's got no chance to stick". I can't imagine that undrafted rookies and their agents would be any better at it. So I agree in theory, but in practice I don't think it would really happen. |
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005 Posts: 11147
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Posted: 05/27/20 11:09 am ::: |
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Richyyy wrote: |
ClayK wrote: |
One advantage for players in not having a third round is that they can look at rosters and sign a training camp deal with a team that they have a chance of making rather than be forced into a training camp where their position is stacked with veterans. |
It's so very rare that free agents actually do that. Semi-longshot UFAs repeatedly sign places where you look at the roster and immediately go "she's got no chance to stick". I can't imagine that undrafted rookies and their agents would be any better at it. So I agree in theory, but in practice I don't think it would really happen. |
True. But really, the chance of a third-rounder or free agent making an impact on the league is pretty minimal for either group.
_________________ Oṃ Tāre Tuttāre Ture Svāhā
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Stormeo
Joined: 14 Jul 2019 Posts: 4701
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32335
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Posted: 05/27/20 2:53 pm ::: |
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Pilight could tell us which third rounders in the 'modern' age have made an impact. The first that comes to my mind is Kraayeveld, because I was a fan of hers when she was with the Liberty. I think she even started for a couple of seasons. So it can happen.
_________________ For there is always light,
if only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
- Amanda Gorman
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66909 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 05/27/20 3:04 pm ::: |
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myrtle wrote: |
Pilight could tell us which third rounders in the 'modern' age have made an impact. The first that comes to my mind is Kraayeveld, because I was a fan of hers when she was with the Liberty. I think she even started for a couple of seasons. So it can happen. |
What do you consider the "modern" age?
Theresa Plaisance is probably the ceiling for third rounders these days
_________________ I'm a lonely frog
I ain't got a home
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63770
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Posted: 05/27/20 3:50 pm ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
myrtle wrote: |
Pilight could tell us which third rounders in the 'modern' age have made an impact. The first that comes to my mind is Kraayeveld, because I was a fan of hers when she was with the Liberty. I think she even started for a couple of seasons. So it can happen. |
What do you consider the "modern" age?
Theresa Plaisance is probably the ceiling for third rounders these days |
Fagbenle?
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
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Posted: 05/27/20 4:03 pm ::: |
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Shades wrote: |
pilight wrote: |
myrtle wrote: |
Pilight could tell us which third rounders in the 'modern' age have made an impact. The first that comes to my mind is Kraayeveld, because I was a fan of hers when she was with the Liberty. I think she even started for a couple of seasons. So it can happen. |
What do you consider the "modern" age?
Theresa Plaisance is probably the ceiling for third rounders these days |
Fagbenle? |
Kizar certainly had a longer and better career than most of the players drafted ahead her. Were it not for injuries she might still be playing. Played 7 seasons, and reached her peak with the Fever in 2016, 9.6/3.2/1.0 in only 17 mpg.
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ChiSky54
Joined: 19 Jun 2019 Posts: 667 Location: Chicago
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