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No expansion, it appears; relocation?
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tfan



Joined: 31 May 2010
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PostPosted: 01/27/20 3:09 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:


reposting a 6-year-old article... Come on! If Lacob really wanted a WNBA team it would have happened already. All he has to do is ask and he'd get one.


Haven’t you long been one of the “San Francisco is next, will it be expansion or relocation?” folks?

Lacob says in the article and elsewhere that he’d buy the Sparks, otherwise getting a team will be after the arena is finished. The arena just opened in September so the clock for “he’d have it by now” didn’t start ticking until then.


ClayK



Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: 01/27/20 10:52 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
toad455 wrote:


reposting a 6-year-old article... Come on! If Lacob really wanted a WNBA team it would have happened already. All he has to do is ask and he'd get one.


Haven’t you long been one of the “San Francisco is next, will it be expansion or relocation?” folks?

Lacob says in the article and elsewhere that he’d buy the Sparks, otherwise getting a team will be after the arena is finished. The arena just opened in September so the clock for “he’d have it by now” didn’t start ticking until then.


My guess, based on nothing, is that Lacob was hoping to get a relocation for free, thus getting an existing roster rather than expansion dregs. And the collapse of the Warriors, plus the nightmare of getting to Chase, haven't helped.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 01/27/20 8:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
, plus the nightmare of getting to Chase, haven't helped.


According to the ESPN attendance figures,

http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance

the Warriors are selling out every game (although they also claim some teams have attendance larger than capacity). If so, I doubt Lacob cares about any difficulty fans have getting there. He knew when he decided to leave an arena with ample parking, a dedicated freeway exit, and a BART station, for one which had none of that, that it would be much harder for fans to get to the game. But apparently a new arena and close-by restaurants trumps ease of getting there for most fans. Or alternatively, they will still show up even if you make it harder to do so.


ClayK



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PostPosted: 01/28/20 9:59 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

tfan wrote:
ClayK wrote:
, plus the nightmare of getting to Chase, haven't helped.


According to the ESPN attendance figures,

http://www.espn.com/nba/attendance

the Warriors are selling out every game (although they also claim some teams have attendance larger than capacity). If so, I doubt Lacob cares about any difficulty fans have getting there. He knew when he decided to leave an arena with ample parking, a dedicated freeway exit, and a BART station, for one which had none of that, that it would be much harder for fans to get to the game. But apparently a new arena and close-by restaurants trumps ease of getting there for most fans. Or alternatively, they will still show up even if you make it harder to do so.


As always, attendance is tickets sold, and the Warriors had something like 20,000 people on the waiting list for season tickets last year, so the place will always "sell out."

My in-laws, who live across the Bay from SF, have had season tickets for nearly 30 years and decided to keep them. Getting there is truly a nightmare, and parking is very expensive. Public transit is difficult, especially after the game.

The ticket resale market, which was very, very strong, has collapsed, so my in-laws can't fund their tickets that way any more.

The bottom line: Attendance will slowly erode, especially as the core of the team ages, and unless traffic patterns improve, it will be easier for most concert-goers to get to the Oakland Coliseum and the SAP in San Jose (or whatever it's called now). It will be very interesting to see how all this plays out, as SF itself is a relatively small city and though the arena is nice, it's still just an arena.



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Randy



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PostPosted: 01/28/20 10:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK can you explain what they were thinking in deciding to build their new arena in a location with such poor access?



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 01/28/20 5:04 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SF is where the money is, and there was no major arena there. Since they started the process, traffic has gotten much, much worse all around the Bay.

It's a nice facility, and it's always advantageous for an NBA team to own its arena, so it's probably still a good investment. And if the Warriors are really good, which they might be for a year or two, it will be a great investment.



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awhom111



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PostPosted: 01/28/20 9:52 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
ClayK can you explain what they were thinking in deciding to build their new arena in a location with such poor access?


The new Warriors owners quickly identified the benefits of having an arena that they would own. Before it opened, San Francisco was the biggest city in the country and possibly the world without an arena of any kind. Based on the non-basketball stuff they booked immediately, there was plenty of demand right away.

The first location they picked was public land and lots of people were opposed to it even though it would have been a great place for one and more accessible for pretty much everyone. Then they found private land, which also ended up being a massive political conflict between various rich people in the city.

More than half of San Francisco has no convenient access to a freeway. The fastest I could get there is still slower than it would take me to get to Stanford on a typical day even though Palo Alto is more than 40 miles away and the arena is only about 7 miles away. The original location would have been near BART, which would have made it convenient for the entire East Bay as well as the upper half of San Mateo County. The Giants stadium is also far from BART, but they have less of a fanbase in the East Bay due to the A's while the Warriors used to have about 40% of their attendance from there. Their stadium is closer to Caltrain, which is the only public transportation available from Silicon Valley all the way up to San Francisco. Either location is about equally convenient from the North Bay. The first location would have been more convenient by public transportation or driving for pretty much everyone in San Francisco. They could have created more space for parking, which might have been nice, but wanted to use the remaining space for more revenue-generating opportunities.
tfan



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PostPosted: 01/29/20 12:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
ClayK can you explain what they were thinking in deciding to build their new arena in a location with such poor access?


It is difficult to find space for a new arena and adequate parking in our major wall-to-wall developed metro areas. And not every city wants one. But at the same time, owners and fans feel that older arenas must be abandoned for newer ones - even though arenas don't wear out - so it has to take place. However, the well-heeled fans want them to be in an area where they have lots of great choices to eat/drink before/after the game/concert. That is, crowded urban areas, which makes it even more difficult to find a spot. So the rich owners will take what they can get in terms of location. It is not unprecedented to build an arena or stadium that does not have enough parking for attendees. The San Francisco 49ers stadium is like that. Businesses in the area have chosen to rent out their parking lots (no idea how that can work on Monday/Thursday night games which the 49ers originally weren't supposed to play, but have) and the amusement park next door whose former "overflow parking lot" the stadium is built on, agreed to close on game days and allow their parking lot to be used.

The Warriors arena originally had a location which may have had ample parking, but a former San Francisco mayor led a fight to keep it out of there. But the current arena has a light rail line that stops right in front of it which would connect people to BART or the train station (which Google Maps says is a 17 minute walk away).

And the truth is, in terms of auto access, any place in the Bay Area is terrible on a weeknight if you want fans from all over to come, and weekends also have traffic jams. And yet, Google, Adobe, et al continue to request and be granted permission to continue to build more facilities. People will complain about traffic, but not complain about development. For some reason they can't make the connection.


WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 01/31/20 9:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBAPA had a meeting in Toronto yesterday and not with the league officials..... hmmmm Question



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