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Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships???
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Ex-Ref



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PostPosted: 06/24/19 7:24 am    ::: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

NCAA says yes.

Quote:
The NCAA is ratcheting up its opposition to a California bill that would allow college athletes in the state to earn compensation for the use of their own name, image or likeness, beginning in 2023.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/2019/06/24/ncaa-california-schools-could-banned-championships-over-bill/1542632001/



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PostPosted: 06/24/19 9:22 am    ::: Re: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

Ex-Ref wrote:
NCAA says yes.

Quote:
The NCAA is ratcheting up its opposition to a California bill that would allow college athletes in the state to earn compensation for the use of their own name, image or likeness, beginning in 2023.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/2019/06/24/ncaa-california-schools-could-banned-championships-over-bill/1542632001/


Well why, after all, should athletes be allowed to earn any money? That would make a sham of the amateur athletic system that produces six-figure salaries for NCAA and college administrators and seven-figure salaries for some coaches.

What do these young people want? Let them sleep in the dorm and eat cafeteria food, get hurt now and again, and be happy. Yes sir, no sir, three bags full ...



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Ex-Ref



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 5:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Quote:
Ohio State athletics director Gene Smith, who is co-chairing the working group, told USA TODAY Sports this week that if Newsom signs the bill, the uncertainty surrounding a potential difference between California law and NCAA rules would prompt him – for now -- not to schedule games against California schools for dates after Jan. 1, 2023, because he does not see how they could remain NCAA members unless differences between the law and the NCAA’s rules can be resolved.



Quote:
“If the California law goes into effect in ’23,” Smith said Tuesday, “and let’s say the NCAA legislation, how ever it emerges, doesn’t quite meet what California wants it to be and they continue to hold that law, who’s going to play (California schools)? We’re certainly not. They won’t be members of the NCAA. I think that’s going to be the problem."



Quote:
Smith said that if Newsom signs the bill, schools in California are "going to have a model where they can almost pay for play – not quite – but I think they’re going to be challenged to maintain their membership in the association because, as an association, we have the authority as a group to make our own rules and regulations, and they will be outside those rules and regulations. So, I’m not quite sure how they will stay in the association."


Quote:
“I’m a single vote in that,” he said. “My guess is our membership would say yes because one of our principles is fair play, and even in the working group that I’m on, we’re focused on trying to make sure we deal with this in a fair-play way – as best as we can have a level playing field. We know it’s unlevel in a lot of ways, but this could make it unbelievably unlevel.


Quote:
In the wake of the California legislature sending its bill to Newsom by margins of 72-0 in the Assembly and 39-0 in the Senate, lawmakers in South Carolina and New York have either introduced, or announced their intention to introduce, bills similar to California’s. That was with legislative efforts already having occurred or been announced in Congress and in the states of Washington and Colorado.



https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/2019/09/26/ohio-state-athletic-director-ncaa-drop-california-if-bill-passes/3778683002/



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 9:23 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So the NCAA would ban California schools to prevent its employees from being paid?

That'll work ...



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 9:45 am    ::: Re: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:

What do these young people want? Let them sleep in the dorm and eat cafeteria food, get hurt now and again, and be happy. Yes sir, no sir, three bags full ...


Good Lord Clay! You always talk like the schools are exploiting student athletes. Except for Major college football and some basketball programs, most athletic programs do not even break even finacially. Especially womens college basketball. You can count on one hand the programs that make a profit. The market value of most women college athetes is negligable. They always have the option of going over seas to play if the feel they can do better elsewhere.

If you want to see what the actual market value of most student athetes is - just see how many professional leagues exist out side of the major ones. The market value of college sports is dictated purely by association with the universities. Sure the Leagues use college as a farm system. Except for baseball few professional sport have farm systems. Just ask what the players on those farm teams make. When put in pure value the college athletes are getting paid more than those players in the minors. And generally few college athetes are even as good as those players in the minors.

The only reason minor leagues can finacially exist is because they are subsidized by the majors. In Europe those womens basketball teams exist only because they are subsidized by cities or corporate sponsors. Hey! the WNBA is bearly hanging on and you expose paying student athletes.

So where do you stop paying students. What about the band? Or all the drama students involved in student productions? Concerts and recitals Or many of the other things that students do without pay. Come to think of it just being a student is hard work. Perhaps students should be paid for their effort?



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 9:45 am    ::: Re: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:

What do these young people want? Let them sleep in the dorm and eat cafeteria food, get hurt now and again, and be happy. Yes sir, no sir, three bags full ...


Good Lord Clay! You always talk like the schools are exploiting student athletes. Except for Major college football and some basketball programs, most athletic programs do not even break even finacially. Especially womens college basketball. You can count on one hand the programs that make a profit. The market value of most women college athetes is negligable. They always have the option of going over seas to play if the feel they can do better elsewhere.

If you want to see what the actual market value of most student athetes is - just see how many professional leagues exist out side of the major ones. The market value of college sports is dictated purely by association with the universities. Sure the Leagues use college as a farm system. Except for baseball few professional sport have farm systems. Just ask what the players on those farm teams make. When put in pure value the college athletes are getting paid more than those players in the minors. And generally few college athetes are even as good as those players in the minors.

The only reason minor leagues can finacially exist is because they are subsidized by the majors. In Europe those womens basketball teams exist only because they are subsidized by cities or corporate sponsors. Hey! the WNBA is bearly hanging on and you expose paying student athletes.

So where do you stop paying students. What about the band? Or all the drama students involved in student productions? Concerts and recitals Or many of the other things that students do without pay. Come to think of it just being a student is hard work. Perhaps students should be paid for their effort?



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 9:49 am    ::: Re: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
ClayK wrote:

What do these young people want? Let them sleep in the dorm and eat cafeteria food, get hurt now and again, and be happy. Yes sir, no sir, three bags full ...


Good Lord Clay! You always talk like the schools are exploiting student athletes. Except for Major college football and some basketball programs, most athletic programs do not even break even finacially. Especially womens college basketball. You can count on one hand the programs that make a profit. The market value of most women college athetes is negligable. They always have the option of going over seas to play if the feel they can do better elsewhere.

If you want to see what the actual market value of most student athetes is - just see how many professional leagues exist out side of the major ones. The market value of college sports is dictated purely by association with the universities. Sure the Leagues use college as a farm system. Except for baseball few professional sport have farm systems. Just ask what the players on those farm teams make. When put in pure value the college athletes are getting paid more than those players in the minors. And generally few college athetes are even as good as those players in the minors.

The only reason minor leagues can finacially exist is because they are subsidized by the majors. In Europe those womens basketball teams exist only because they are subsidized by cities or corporate sponsors. Hey! the WNBA is bearly hanging on and you expose paying student athletes.

So where do you stop paying students. What about the band? Or all the drama students involved in student productions? Concerts and recitals Or many of the other things that students do without pay. Come to think of it just being a student is hard work. Perhaps students should be paid for their effort?


California isn't talking about paying athletes. It's talking about allowing them to control their own name, image, and likeness rights.



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PostPosted: 09/27/19 3:15 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I have always felt that the only way for collegiate amateur athletics to truly remain amateur athletics, is not to go the "pay to play" route, but to go entirely in the opposite direction. But this will always be dismissed over hand by the national collegiate institutional community, because there's just too much of a power hold on it by the Almighty Dollar.

I say do away with the money - remove the networks from college football & basketball. No more ESPN, CBS, ABC, etc. No more multi-million dollar television deals and contracts. Let the networks broadcast professional sports.

The only broadcasts of college sports, should be done by the universities. Let them use the internet now that its evolved into a more mature entity: each university gets online streaming rights for its home games: charge a nominal fee to access, to pay for the service costs.

Otherwise, if you want to see a college game, buy a damn ticket and go in person. Beyond that, there's always radio broadcasts & online audio streams for games that can be free.

For bowl games, set a deal that allows for both universities to have streaming rights, or set a deal between conferences at a minimum fee, but again, no major television. The universities don't get huge checks for bowls: the right to play in them should suffice.

Essentially turn the major collegiate sports back to what intramural sports are like these days. The universities won't make millions, the conferences won't make millions, the NCAA won't make millions.

And then the players won't be able to claim they should get a piece of the pie, because there won't be any pie. If all its going to be is some huge money-generating machine, then ALL role players should have a right to get a share. But if the institutions are going to forever claim that it's not supposed to be about the money, then prove it by taking the money out of the equation.

But of course, they will never do that, because it's all based upon a lie.....


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PostPosted: 09/27/19 3:32 pm    ::: Re: Could CA Schools Be Banned From NCAA Championships??? Reply Reply with quote

willtalk wrote:
ClayK wrote:

What do these young people want? Let them sleep in the dorm and eat cafeteria food, get hurt now and again, and be happy. Yes sir, no sir, three bags full ...


Good Lord Clay! You always talk like the schools are exploiting student athletes. Except for Major college football and some basketball programs, most athletic programs do not even break even finacially. Especially womens college basketball. You can count on one hand the programs that make a profit. The market value of most women college athetes is negligable. They always have the option of going over seas to play if the feel they can do better elsewhere.

If you want to see what the actual market value of most student athetes is - just see how many professional leagues exist out side of the major ones. The market value of college sports is dictated purely by association with the universities. Sure the Leagues use college as a farm system. Except for baseball few professional sport have farm systems. Just ask what the players on those farm teams make. When put in pure value the college athletes are getting paid more than those players in the minors. And generally few college athetes are even as good as those players in the minors.

The only reason minor leagues can finacially exist is because they are subsidized by the majors. In Europe those womens basketball teams exist only because they are subsidized by cities or corporate sponsors. Hey! the WNBA is bearly hanging on and you expose paying student athletes.

So where do you stop paying students. What about the band? Or all the drama students involved in student productions? Concerts and recitals Or many of the other things that students do without pay. Come to think of it just being a student is hard work. Perhaps students should be paid for their effort?


So it's OK for the coach to go first-class, and the AD to have a suite. But the actual people who generate the income? Take what we give you ...

Professional sports -- and collegiate sports are professional -- watched its pay scale change dramatically when free agency arrived, and the market determined the athletes worth a whole lot more than the coaches or GMs.

And why shouldn't the best actor in the school get money? They charge admission for shows. And if not, that's fine too. Women's golf? Why are there scholarships in women's golf?

Collegiate sports are a business. They are adjunct to universities that generates income through revenue, donations and enrollment, and they supply marketing that would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars in the open market. Coaches and administrators are paid large sums of money to do their jobs, but those jobs are not nearly as important in the functioning of the industry as the jobs of the athletes.

Pay the athletes first, then the coaches and ADs. Or pay the coaches and ADs the same as professors, but let students transfer wherever they want and make as much money from outside sources as they want. (If a marketing student makes money on the side as a marketer, she isn't banned from the business department.)

Or don't pay anybody.

Everyone involved is an adult, and all should have equal access to the resources the college allocates to the athletic department. There is no way a coach should have a seven-figure salary and the starting quarterback gets a scholarship that costs the school less than $20,000.



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PostPosted: 09/30/19 9:50 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Governor signed the bill: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/30/sports/college-athletes-paid-california.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage


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PostPosted: 09/30/19 8:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

On a news story tonight, I heard an argument that hadn't occurred to me, but now it's obvious: if this plays out as might be expected, it gives a big recruiting advantage to CA schools. I can see how this becomes a sticky wicket for the NCAA.... Shocked



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PostPosted: 09/30/19 8:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I remembered hearing it on PTI when it was proposed. Kornheiser said that if the players in California are paid, they could get all the top athletes, especially the basketball players who want to play for one season. So California is excluded from the nationals but they do their own championships. If they have the best players, then the true national championships become, say San Diego State vs. UCLA in basketball and USC vs. Cal in football. There's no way out of it.


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PostPosted: 09/30/19 11:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Its almost like California is already "banned" (tongue-in-cheek) from NCAA football and men's basketball postseason. They don't sport teams that rank that high, not lately anyway. As far as being in the mix for championships, the nation of California makes some noise in women's basketball (Stanford), volleyball (Stanford), softball and maybe baseball; also soccer, swimming, etc.


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PostPosted: 10/01/19 8:47 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

My guess is that the NCAA will say something like "If any players on any of your teams accept endorsement money, your school will be suspended from the NCAA and ineligible for any championships."



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PostPosted: 10/01/19 8:53 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
My guess is that the NCAA will say something like "If any players on any of your teams accept endorsement money, your school will be suspended from the NCAA and ineligible for any championships."


The NCAA is not going to win this fight. They'll find some sort of accommodation that mostly benefits the schools.



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PostPosted: 10/01/19 1:30 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I'm hearing a little (just a little) buzz about it in Virginia. Methinks this movement could be spreading.



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PostPosted: 10/01/19 1:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

summertime blues wrote:
I'm hearing a little (just a little) buzz about it in Virginia. Methinks this movement could be spreading.


Florida's got a similar bill that could go into effect next summer



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PostPosted: 10/01/19 11:23 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

exactly.....athletes do not HAVE TO go to college.....let them take their talents elsewhere.....

if this stands, it will certainly destroy college athletics.....I can see many many football/basketball being dropped completely because how can small or midsize teams ever have the money to compete with the advertising money of an LA, or a Seattle or a Portland or a Durham etc......a kid could get a million in LA what do you think he would get in Omaha or Wichita or Springfield.....???

what the hell is free room and board and free tuition plus a monthly stipend mean except a gift to a student athlete?

and if this insanity is allowed, and NO female athletes are given the keys to the city, I can only imagine the uproar....


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PostPosted: 10/02/19 10:01 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

elsie wrote:
exactly.....athletes do not HAVE TO go to college.....let them take their talents elsewhere.....



And if they do, college athletics and all the money it generates (don't believe the accounting that says athletics loses money) disappears.

The athletes do the work that produces the revenue, so why should a coach get seven figures and the quarterback zero? And why should the AD sit in his office and get seven figures and the defensive back who just ripped up his knee so badly he can never play a sport like basketball again get zero?

The whole premise of athletics and colleges makes zero sense. If it didn't make schools tons of money, the connection wouldn't be there. How exactly would colleges be worse off if they focused on intramurals and club sports? Well, aside from the money ...



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PostPosted: 10/02/19 1:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

U.S. Rep. Anthony Gonzalez, a former Ohio State football standout, is planning to propose a new national law to give college athletes the opportunity to make endorsement money.

Quote:
Gonzalez believes a federal law is the correct way to move forward.

"I actually think that we need to do something quickly, within the next year," Gonzalez told ESPN. "I don't think you have three years to figure this out. I think decisions will start happening immediately."

He said he wants to create legislation that gives athletes the chance to make money while also setting up some way to protect athletes from what Gonzalez described as "bad actors."


https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/27751454/congressman-propose-federal-legislation-paying-college-athletes


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PostPosted: 10/02/19 1:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ohio State AD Gene Smith against Fair Pay to Play Act
https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/27743871/ohio-state-ad-gene-smith-fair-pay-play-act

Big Ten commissioner Jim Delany opposes California's Fair Pay to Play Act
https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/27750921/big-ten-commissioner-jim-delany-opposes-california-fair-pay-play-act


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PostPosted: 10/04/19 5:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Ex-Ref wrote:
Quote:
In the wake of the California legislature sending its bill to Newsom by margins of 72-0 in the Assembly and 39-0 in the Senate, lawmakers in South Carolina and New York have either introduced, or announced their intention to introduce, bills similar to California’s. That was with legislative efforts already having occurred or been announced in Congress and in the states of Washington and Colorado.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/2019/09/26/ohio-state-athletic-director-ncaa-drop-california-if-bill-passes/3778683002/


What is good for California's college athletes may prove to be good for those in other states, too.

The new CA law that allows collegiate athletes to profit from the use of their name or image is inspiring similar activity in Washington, Maryland, New York, South Carolina and Tennessee.

It is a full-court press against the NCAA model, which has left athletes sidelined from netting any of the enormous profits generated by college sports.

The student-athlete regulator predicts a legal showdown because the laws will damage the current system, which provides scholarships to thousands of students.

California inspires other states to push to pay college athletes
Reid Wilson (The Hill)
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/464268-california-inspires-other-states-to-push-to-pay-college-athletes


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PostPosted: 10/05/19 2:53 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Some, but not most, of the players will be singing Tone Loc's I get paid to do the wild thing.


Sooner or later Zeppelin's when the levee breaks NCAAs'll have no place to stay.


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PostPosted: 10/14/19 1:40 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

A lawyers delight...


pilight



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PostPosted: 10/29/19 1:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NCAA to let college athletes monetize their likeness

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ncaa-to-allow-college-athletes-to-monetize-their-likeness/

Quote:
"As a national governing body, the NCAA is uniquely positioned to modify its rules to ensure fairness and a level playing field for student-athletes," the association's president Mark Emmert said in a statement. "The board's action today creates a path to enhance opportunities for student-athletes while ensuring they compete against students and not professionals."



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