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Carol Anne



Joined: 09 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 08/16/19 5:54 am    ::: Mentally abusive culture within UCR's women's hoops Reply Reply with quote

Uncovering the mentally abusive culture within UCR’s women’s basketball program
https://www.highlandernews.org/36007/uncovering-the-mentally-abusive-culture-within-ucrs-womens-basketball-program/

UC Riverside suspends coach after investigation [for 20 days]
https://www.espn.com/womens-college-basketball/story/_/id/27315586/uc-riverside-suspends-coach-investigation

n.b. The Highlander piece is very long and a bit confusing at first. It starts with the news that assistant coach Giuliana Mendiola's (UW) contract was not renewed, then tackles the alleged unethical behavior of Head Coach John Margaritis. Coach? The man is a monster. Courageous article!




Last edited by Carol Anne on 08/16/19 4:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
ChasingRatDogmaSalade



Joined: 05 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: 08/16/19 11:14 am    ::: Re: Mentally abusive culture within UCR's women's hoops Reply Reply with quote

Carol Anne wrote:
Uncovering the mentally abusive culture within UCR’s women’s basketball program
https://www.highlandernews.org/36007/uncovering-the-mentally-abusive-culture-within-ucrs-womens-basketball-program/

UC Riverside suspends coach after investigation [for 20 days]
https://www.espn.com/womens-college-basketball/story/_/id/27315586/uc-riverside-suspends-coach-investigation

n.b. The Highlander piece is very long and a bit confusing at first. It starts with the news that assistant coach Giuliana Mendiola's (UW) contract was not renewed, then tackles the alleged unethical behavior of Head Coach John Margaritis. Coach? The man is a monster. Courageous article!


Best article I've ever read in the Highlander. Folks should forward this to any and all media outlets they can to shine as big a spotlight as possible on the situation.


ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/19/19 10:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Great story ... and a sad one.

One of my former players played at UCR. She was recruited by Carter Shaw, who left. She tore her ACL before her senior year, but she was invested in the team. I never talked to her about the head coach, though ...

But as the story points out, abusive coaches are the responsibility of the administration, and only thrive in department cultures that support that kind of behavior.



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Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 08/20/19 1:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

A most unfortunate, sad story; very reminiscent of Renee Portland, McCallie, et.al. WHY do coaches even begin to imagine those tactics are productive?

I'll be interested to see any updates, if anybody here finds them.



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PUmatty



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PostPosted: 08/20/19 3:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
A most unfortunate, sad story; very reminiscent of Renee Portland, McCallie, et.al. WHY do coaches even begin to imagine those tactics are productive?

I'll be interested to see any updates, if anybody here finds them.


I wouldn't put Portland and McCallie in the same bucket. Portland was explicitly homophobic in her recruiting and her treatment of players. This isn't what McCallie does.


ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/20/19 3:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I am consistently amazed that ADs and administrations stand for any of this. Of course they know what's going on -- that kind of behavior does not go unremarked.

I guess they're worried about getting sued if they fire someone for cause (otherwise they have to eat contracts, which they don't want to do), but there are internal checks and balances that can be applied.



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CamrnCrz1974



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 08/20/19 4:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

PUmatty wrote:
Howee wrote:
A most unfortunate, sad story; very reminiscent of Renee Portland, McCallie, et.al. WHY do coaches even begin to imagine those tactics are productive?

I'll be interested to see any updates, if anybody here finds them.


I wouldn't put Portland and McCallie in the same bucket. Portland was explicitly homophobic in her recruiting and her treatment of players. This isn't what McCallie does.


And there was no finding of verbal abuse. The initial complaint from former player Elizabeth Williams (in her letter to the administration) was that there was "a negative atmosphere" around the program.


Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 08/20/19 5:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
PUmatty wrote:
Howee wrote:
A most unfortunate, sad story; very reminiscent of Renee Portland, McCallie, et.al. WHY do coaches even begin to imagine those tactics are productive?

I'll be interested to see any updates, if anybody here finds them.


I wouldn't put Portland and McCallie in the same bucket. Portland was explicitly homophobic in her recruiting and her treatment of players. This isn't what McCallie does.


And there was no finding of verbal abuse. The initial complaint from former player Elizabeth Williams (in her letter to the administration) was that there was "a negative atmosphere" around the program.


Well, okay....but "a negative atmosphere" is a pretty broad blanket that certainly might include verbal abuse, however subtle. I can't imagine McCallie 'never' abused anyone verbally.

Re: Portland--to me, homophobic discrimination is similar in its singling-out of individuals for demeaning, and as a coaching tactic IS abusive. Regardless, it's all reprehensible, and none of these kids deserve any of it.



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willtalk



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 12:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
PUmatty wrote:
Howee wrote:
A most unfortunate, sad story; very reminiscent of Renee Portland, McCallie, et.al. WHY do coaches even begin to imagine those tactics are productive?

I'll be interested to see any updates, if anybody here finds them.


I wouldn't put Portland and McCallie in the same bucket. Portland was explicitly homophobic in her recruiting and her treatment of players. This isn't what McCallie does.


And there was no finding of verbal abuse. The initial complaint from former player Elizabeth Williams (in her letter to the administration) was that there was "a negative atmosphere" around the program.


Well, okay....but "a negative atmosphere" is a pretty broad blanket that certainly might include verbal abuse, however subtle. I can't imagine McCallie 'never' abused anyone verbally.

Re: Portland--to me, homophobic discrimination is similar in its singling-out of individuals for demeaning, and as a coaching tactic IS abusive. Regardless, it's all reprehensible, and none of these kids deserve any of it.
It doesn't surprise me due to the circumstances at Duke that there was a negative atmosphere. McCallie was under constant attack from the moment she took over the program. All one had to do is frequenct their forum to feel the negativity. People wonder why the program has declined and it can not all be placed on the Coach. A majority of it was from the crusade by those that had an agenda to git rid of her. You can not promote a negative on not only the Duke site but also on other sites to have an effect. Yet McCallie is still there and all that was accomplished was a diminishing of the program via bad publicity by their very own fans.

If you want a real example of coaching abuse, one has to only look at the coach that preceeded Scott Ruick at Oregon St. Ironically she was an assistant of Gail Goestenkors yet turned out to be her personality opposite. I am referring to Lavonda Wagner. When she was done there were only five players left of the roster. Scott had to enlist a bunch of walk ons to even field a team. That was an abusive coach.



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CamrnCrz1974



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 1:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
And there was no finding of verbal abuse. The initial complaint from former player Elizabeth Williams (in her letter to the administration) was that there was "a negative atmosphere" around the program.


Well, okay....but "a negative atmosphere" is a pretty broad blanket that certainly might include verbal abuse, however subtle. I can't imagine McCallie 'never' abused anyone verbally.


I said there was no finding of verbal abuse, not that Joanne P. McCallie never verbally abused anyone.

The investigation stemmed from a complaint regarding a "negative" atmosphere and looked at possible mistreatment of players and coaches. The results of the investigation did not contain a finding of verbal abuse.

willtalk wrote:
It doesn't surprise me due to the circumstances at Duke that there was a negative atmosphere. McCallie was under constant attack from the moment she took over the program. All one had to do is frequenct their forum to feel the negativity. People wonder why the program has declined and it can not all be placed on the Coach. A majority of it was from the crusade by those that had an agenda to git rid of her. You can not promote a negative on not only the Duke site but also on other sites to have an effect. Yet McCallie is still there and all that was accomplished was a diminishing of the program via bad publicity by their very own fans.


Actually, the characterization of the program's "negative" atmosphere was alleged by Elizabeth Williams, referring to McCallie's actions as head coach and how she ran the program.

The Durham Herald-Sun's Steve Wiseman reported later Sunday night that four-time All-American center Elizabeth Williams—who was on the team from 2011-2015—said she was one of the players interviewed as part of the investigation. A WNBA player, Williams reportedly wrote a letter to administrators last year [2015] expressing concerns about the program.

Wiseman reported that Williams' letter was one of many and that concerns about the program also were raised during exit interviews with administrators. Williams reportedly said no mistreatment was physical or criminal in nature but described the program's atmosphere with McCallie at the helm as negative.


LINK - The Chronicle (May 8, 2016)

In addition, there have been multiple incidents and statements made by Coach McCallie that have hurt her:
    --- Accusing a Duke student reporter of fabricating statements, only to have him release the full audio of the conversation;
    --- Making factually inaccurate statements about transfers and the state of her program;
    --- Referring to opposing players by their jersey numbers instead of their names, even though she knows them as she recruited quite a few of them -- and being called out for doing so by opposing coaches;
    --- Missing the NCAA Tournament twice in the last four years.

And this is not including comments she made to players whose parents shared them with me (and I will not reveal them here, as I promised not to do so).

I am not saying that she was received with open arms by the Duke fan base. Many were upset that Coach G left and were not as welcoming as they could have been, myself included.

But with all due, her actions and her continued behavior -- which started almost immediately -- have had MUCH more to do with the "negative" atmosphere surrounding the program than any message board possibly could.


Howee



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 1:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
In addition, there have been multiple incidents and statements made by Coach McCallie that have hurt her:
[list]--- Accusing a Duke student reporter of fabricating statements, only to have him release the full audio of the conversation;
--- Making factually inaccurate statements about transfers and the state of her program ....


Hmmm. Attacking the media, AND lying. Now I know where Trump got his m.o. Razz Laughing



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 1:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

is there a legal definition of verbal abuse?

seems too broad a term to make a determination of a situation w/o knowing specifics.



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summertime blues



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 2:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

There is also, apparently, a considerable problem at Northern Kentucky that was discussed earlier this year. It resulted in the exodus of at least 5 players. And then there was the situation at Illinois....



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 3:22 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I can't believe anyone thinks it's wrong for a coach to refer to opposing players by uniform number ...

First, it's easier for players to find a number on a jersey than connect a name to a face.

Second, your players may not know the names.

Third, it's quicker. "Guard 11" is faster than "Guard Delle Donne."

Fourth, scouting reports usually refer to players by number, and if you're following up on scouting reports, it only makes sense to continue using the number.

I'm not a McCallie fan, but that's one of the dumbest complaints I've ever heard.



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Howee



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PostPosted: 08/28/19 10:09 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
....Third, it's quicker. "Guard 11" is faster than "Guard Delle Donne."
....or than shouting, "You've got Tiana Mangakahia/Iffy Ibekwe/Marvellous Osagie-Erese/Honesty Scott-Grayson. Laughing

ClayK wrote:
I'm not a McCallie fan, but that's one of the dumbest complaints I've ever heard.

It may be a petty complaint, but frankly, *most* coaches demonstrate the classiness to honor a dominant opponent by referring to their first or last name. "Classy" and McCallie don't generally go together.



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ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/29/19 9:43 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
ClayK wrote:
....Third, it's quicker. "Guard 11" is faster than "Guard Delle Donne."
....or than shouting, "You've got Tiana Mangakahia/Iffy Ibekwe/Marvellous Osagie-Erese/Honesty Scott-Grayson. Laughing

ClayK wrote:
I'm not a McCallie fan, but that's one of the dumbest complaints I've ever heard.

It may be a petty complaint, but frankly, *most* coaches demonstrate the classiness to honor a dominant opponent by referring to their first or last name. "Classy" and McCallie don't generally go together.


It's not about "honor" -- it's about communication.



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FrozenLVFan



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PostPosted: 08/29/19 9:51 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I think that using jersey numbers during games to indicate defensive assignments, etc is fine. However, calling opposing players "Number 31" during post-game interviews is pretty rude and unprofessional.


Howee



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PostPosted: 08/29/19 9:57 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
It's not about "honor" -- it's about communication.


Maybe we're not talking about the same thing, but....if someone was referencing YOU on tv or a podcast, might you not find it more in accord with polite recognition ('honor') if they called you "reporter Clay Kallam" than to say, "that California dude reporter"? Shocked Razz



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CamrnCrz1974



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PostPosted: 08/29/19 12:27 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

ClayK wrote:
I'm not a McCallie fan, but that's one of the dumbest complaints I've ever heard.


It is how she uses it in press conferences -- and I should have made that clear in my previous post.

--- When asked about a player in a post-game press concerence -- and the player's name is mentioned in the question -- she responds by using the player's number. Clearly, she knows which players match up with which numbers.

--- She recruited many of these players. She obviously knows their names.

-- It is one thing to refer to players by their numbers during the game. But doing so in a press conference, when she demonstrates she clearly knows their names, come across as disrespectful. It has even surprised her peers, as Muffet McGraw tweeted a few years ago after Notre Dame throttled Duke in Cameron.

Muffet McGraw
‏@MuffetMcGraw
Darn, knew we forgot something on our trip this past weekend..note to self: remember to pack "Hello, my name is...stickers for #21,11 &15

https://twitter.com/MuffetMcGraw/status/430367657016053760


ClayK



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PostPosted: 08/29/19 2:30 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
ClayK wrote:
I'm not a McCallie fan, but that's one of the dumbest complaints I've ever heard.


It is how she uses it in press conferences -- and I should have made that clear in my previous post.

--- When asked about a player in a post-game press concerence -- and the player's name is mentioned in the question -- she responds by using the player's number. Clearly, she knows which players match up with which numbers.

--- She recruited many of these players. She obviously knows their names.

-- It is one thing to refer to players by their numbers during the game. But doing so in a press conference, when she demonstrates she clearly knows their names, come across as disrespectful. It has even surprised her peers, as Muffet McGraw tweeted a few years ago after Notre Dame throttled Duke in Cameron.

Muffet McGraw
‏@MuffetMcGraw
Darn, knew we forgot something on our trip this past weekend..note to self: remember to pack "Hello, my name is...stickers for #21,11 &15

https://twitter.com/MuffetMcGraw/status/430367657016053760


OK, that makes more sense ...

It is a little disrespectful in that situation, especially with the star(s).



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GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 08/30/19 12:54 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

FrozenLVFan wrote:
I think that using jersey numbers during games to indicate defensive assignments, etc is fine. However, calling opposing players "Number 31" during post-game interviews is pretty rude and unprofessional.


Off with her head!

Who?

P.

P? That's disrespectful.

Geno Auriemma frequently calls his players "guys" and sometimes refers to the other team's star player as something like "their main guy" or "their key guy". Is he being disrespectful, rude, unprofessional, sexist, homophobic? You decide. I think he's just adopting a speech affectation, that of the eternal Philly schoolyard guy.

Maybe P just likes to affect the speech of professorial analyst.
taropatch



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PostPosted: 08/30/19 3:14 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The classless Muffet McGraw refused to even acknowledge a jersey number. Pissed off that Ogunbowale didn't win 2018 ACC player of the year, she referred to the winner Durr as “the other player”.

She later heard it from Walz who shook McGraw’s hand post-game and said, “My player’s name is Asia Durr.”


Hoopsmom



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PostPosted: 08/30/19 1:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

OK, I know this is a serious topic that we started with, but you are all very entertaining! Or should I say, the coaches are very entertaining in their comebacks to (perceived or real) slights to their players... Thanks for the laughs!


CamrnCrz1974



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 08/30/19 2:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
FrozenLVFan wrote:
I think that using jersey numbers during games to indicate defensive assignments, etc is fine. However, calling opposing players "Number 31" during post-game interviews is pretty rude and unprofessional.


Off with her head!

Who?

P.

P? That's disrespectful.

Geno Auriemma frequently calls his players "guys" and sometimes refers to the other team's star player as something like "their main guy" or "their key guy". Is he being disrespectful, rude, unprofessional, sexist, homophobic? You decide. I think he's just adopting a speech affectation, that of the eternal Philly schoolyard guy.

Maybe P just likes to affect the speech of professorial analyst.


Again, as I said above, it is how she uses it in press conferences.
--- When asked about a player in a post-game press conference -- and the player's name is mentioned in the question -- she responds by using the player's number. Clearly, she knows which players match up with which numbers.

Also, as I stated above, the reference to a player's jersey is not even close to her biggest offense:

--- Complaint from a former star player regarding a "negative" atmosphere.
--- Investigation into her possible mistreatment of players and coaches
--- Accusing a Duke student reporter of fabricating statements, only to have him release the full audio of the conversation
--- Making factually inaccurate statements to the media
--- Inheriting a powerhouse program, then not just failing to continue the same level of excellence, but completely falling off the national radar
--- Missing the NCAA Tournament twice in the last four years

Referencing jersey numbers in a press conference, especially when the player's name was used in the question, just comes off as incredibly unprofessional.


GlennMacGrady



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PostPosted: 08/30/19 2:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Maybe someone should ask #31 whether she minds being called #31 in a press conference, rather than us getting all hostile on her behalf.

Oh, I forgot, the game is to bash Coach McCallie for any and all reasons possible, real or imagined.

Bashed by whom?

By karmaload16, mammaboy23 and zingerpuss69.

What kind of names are those? They sound very disrespectful, rude and unprofessional.

Those are internet screen names.

Wouldn't those people rather be called by their real names, or even jersey numbers, instead of those silly labels?

Nah, then they couldn't anonymously bash P and CP3.

Who or what is CP3?

SMH, GFU, LMAO, LOL, LOL, LOL, @#^*&$#@!!!
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