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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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 Posted: 06/13/19 9:25 am ::: The Cal job |
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It's a difficult situation for Cal, I think, given two things:
1) It's very late in the year to hire a new Power 5 head coach, both from a candidate perspective and a recruiting perspective.
2) The cupboard is pretty bare at Cal right now, and it's not really a great situation. The Pac-12 is the best it's ever been, and competition for players is fierce -- and when you throw in Cal's academic requirements, it's an even tougher place to succeed. Gonzaga's Lisa Fortier-Tarpley (I think that's the right last name) has all the credentials, but like many successful mid-major coaches, would she leave an established program to struggle for several years at Cal and maybe wind up getting fired?
There's also a cost issue involved, as to get a quality coach at this point may be more expensive than makes sense, given the poor attendance and likelihood of two or three years of losing seasons.
It's an interesting issue from both sides (college and coach). The Cal administration has been trying to do better by its athletics' program, but this issue will be a tricky one to navigate. The traditional method of hiring either a successful mid-major head coach or a black female Power 5 assistant doesn't appear likely to be a path to success in the near future, given Cal's issues and the Pac-12 competition. Then again, traditional methods have become traditional because there have been successes ...
Congrats to Lindsay, though ... hope it works out for her.
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elsie
Joined: 08 Apr 2016
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| Posted: 06/13/19 8:59 pm ::: |
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all it takes for a coach to succeed is to first off, have organizational abilities and basic sports knowledge......next, you need ONE recruit....just one....to get you over the hump...so Cal if it hits the right buttons could get better in a hurry.
Oregon state was nothing until they hired a long time small college coach....but he got a couple of good recruits and its all been an upward trajectory.....
oregon was nothing until they hired away Oregon states top recruiter....
Zags have been scrimmaging Cal for several years...Fortier's family is all from California...
I would not be shocked at all if they ask her.....not shocked if she left but would be saddened........
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 06/14/19 12:01 pm ::: |
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| elsie wrote: |
all it takes for a coach to succeed is to first off, have organizational abilities and basic sports knowledge......next, you need ONE recruit....just one....to get you over the hump...so Cal if it hits the right buttons could get better in a hurry.
Oregon state was nothing until they hired a long time small college coach....but he got a couple of good recruits and its all been an upward trajectory.....
oregon was nothing until they hired away Oregon states top recruiter....
Zags have been scrimmaging Cal for several years...Fortier's family is all from California...
I would not be shocked at all if they ask her.....not shocked if she left but would be saddened........ |
Cal had the No. 8 overall pick in the WNBA draft in Kristine Anigwe. and with her in the last four years, Cal finished seventh, fifth, seventh and 10th in the Pac-12. Pac-12 record in that span? 30-42.
In this league, at least, it takes more than one player ... and if you look at Cal's roster, and lack of recruits, they're pretty much starting at ground zero.
Fortier would be a good pick, and she might be willing to roll the dice. But that's going to be a tall mountain to climb, especially considering she can stay at Gonzaga and have success -- and maybe a shot at a better job than Cal down the road. (Kelly Graves waited several years, and said no to several offers, before going to Oregon.)
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taropatch
Joined: 24 Feb 2009
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| Posted: 06/14/19 2:17 pm ::: |
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All ex-Stanford here:
Charmin Smith - did not realize she (12 years) was at Cal longer than Gottlieb. The program was hers if she didnt jump to the WNBA two months ago. Looks like both of 'em figured it was time for a change.
Molly Goodenbour - Third year HC at San Francisco but coming off of a rough season at USF. Possible candidate?
Jennifer Azzi - Three years since stepping down. Comeback time?
Katy Steding - Goodenbour's sidekick at USF. I don't think so.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 06/14/19 3:02 pm ::: |
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| taropatch wrote: |
All ex-Stanford here:
Charmin Smith - did not realize she (12 years) was at Cal longer than Gottlieb. The program was hers if she didnt jump to the WNBA two months ago. Looks like both of 'em figured it was time for a change.
Molly Goodenbour - Third year HC at San Francisco but coming off of a rough season at USF. Possible candidate?
Jennifer Azzi - Three years since stepping down. Comeback time?
Katy Steding - Goodenbour's sidekick at USF. I don't think so. |
My understanding is Charmin just got tired of recruiting, but maybe being a head coach would change her mind ...
Molly's career is a checkered one. She starts out pretty well, and then fades almost as quickly. Generally lots of transfers.
Azzi would be an interesting call, but remaking Cal would be a huge, all-in commitment, and after she left USF, it seemed that the workload was an issue.
And somehow I don't think Cal will hire a mid-major assistant ...
I'm sure the name "Gail Goestenkors" will surface at some point.
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IM in OC
Joined: 25 Mar 2009
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Location: Orange County, CA
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| Posted: 06/14/19 5:59 pm ::: |
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| taropatch wrote: |
All ex-Stanford here:
Charmin Smith - did not realize she (12 years) was at Cal longer than Gottlieb. The program was hers if she didnt jump to the WNBA two months ago. Looks like both of 'em figured it was time for a change.
Molly Goodenbour - Third year HC at San Francisco but coming off of a rough season at USF. Possible candidate?
Jennifer Azzi - Three years since stepping down. Comeback time?
Katy Steding - Goodenbour's sidekick at USF. I don't think so. |
Vanessa Nygaard, currently at Windward HS in So Cal has experience at many levels. Not sure if she is looking to move.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 06/14/19 6:36 pm ::: |
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Some jobless former Tennessee coaches:
Bridgette Gordon and Sharonna Reaves. Gordon has AC experience at a couple of other schools (escaping me at the moment), and Reaves has AC experience plus was a successful recruiter for WVU and Tennessee, helping to bag that #1 class which has now scattered somewhat with the firing of CHW.
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It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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ClayK
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| Posted: 06/20/19 9:04 am ::: |
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McKenzie Forbes will transfer, further depleting an already thin roster.
So the carrot is a P5 job ... the stick is the harsh reality that 10th place would be a great finish, and the rebuilding process will likely be a long one.
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CalwbbFan
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CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 06/21/19 1:52 pm ::: |
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A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 06/21/19 2:45 pm ::: |
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| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal. |
I beg to differ ...
I like Charmin, but she's been on the staff as associate head coach through its recent decline into irrelevance. Maybe she'll reinvigorate the program with newfound freedom as the person in charge, but right now I'm thinking this is more of the same for a program that seems destined to finished 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year.
Here's hoping I'm wrong, because she's a quality person and I'd love for Cal to get back on track, but remember there are only three reasonably good players returning (none are a threat for all-conference) and no incoming talent to speak of.
It's going to be a long road, I'm afraid.
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 06/21/19 3:20 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal. |
I beg to differ ...
I like Charmin, but she's been on the staff as associate head coach through its recent decline into irrelevance. Maybe she'll reinvigorate the program with newfound freedom as the person in charge, but right now I'm thinking this is more of the same for a program that seems destined to finished 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year.
Here's hoping I'm wrong, because she's a quality person and I'd love for Cal to get back on track, but remember there are only three reasonably good players returning (none are a threat for all-conference) and no incoming talent to speak of.
It's going to be a long road, I'm afraid. |
Here's your crape, Clay. Why not just wait and see what she can do before hanging it?
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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CalwbbFan
Joined: 26 Mar 2007
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| Posted: 06/21/19 4:14 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal. |
I beg to differ ...
I like Charmin, but she's been on the staff as associate head coach through its recent decline into irrelevance. Maybe she'll reinvigorate the program with newfound freedom as the person in charge, but right now I'm thinking this is more of the same for a program that seems destined to finished 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year.
Here's hoping I'm wrong, because she's a quality person and I'd love for Cal to get back on track, but remember there are only three reasonably good players returning (none are a threat for all-conference) and no incoming talent to speak of.
It's going to be a long road, I'm afraid. |
Given Lindsay’s bailing late and Charmin’s ties to the program I think it’s a good hire. Charmin will be able to take the team in the direction she wants to and not be beholden to LG. She offers different strengths and I think they will translate well as she takes the reins. She’s a good recruiter. We will see if she’s a good head coach. I’m hopeful. She is a product of the Stanford/TVD tree (no pun intended) and I am choosing to be optimistic.
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patsweetpat
Joined: 14 Jul 2010
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| Posted: 06/21/19 4:54 pm ::: |
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| CalwbbFan wrote: |
| She is a product of the Stanford/TVD tree (no pun intended)... |
C'mon, go ahead and intend that pun. It's a good one. It deserves your intentionality.
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CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 06/21/19 5:23 pm ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal. |
I beg to differ ...
I like Charmin, but she's been on the staff as associate head coach through its recent decline into irrelevance. Maybe she'll reinvigorate the program with newfound freedom as the person in charge, but right now I'm thinking this is more of the same for a program that seems destined to finished 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year. |
ClayK, to be fair, with Anigwe's graduation and other departures/transfers, Cal could be destined to finish 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year, irrespective of who was/is the head coach.
I think this late in the process, hiring someone who was a longtime assistant through two head coaches, played in the Bay Area (and in the same conference) at a rival, and having instant familiarity with the school, recruiting bases, facilities, etc., is a pretty great choice.
But then again, you are more knowledgeable about (and much closer to) the program than I am.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 06/21/19 5:50 pm ::: |
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| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
| ClayK wrote: |
| CamrnCrz1974 wrote: |
A great choice. An excellent choice at this juncture.
Also an obvious choice.
But still...great job, Cal. |
I beg to differ ...
I like Charmin, but she's been on the staff as associate head coach through its recent decline into irrelevance. Maybe she'll reinvigorate the program with newfound freedom as the person in charge, but right now I'm thinking this is more of the same for a program that seems destined to finished 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year. |
ClayK, to be fair, with Anigwe's graduation and other departures/transfers, Cal could be destined to finish 11th or 12th in the Pac-12 this year, irrespective of who was/is the head coach.
I think this late in the process, hiring someone who was a longtime assistant through two head coaches, played in the Bay Area (and in the same conference) at a rival, and having instant familiarity with the school, recruiting bases, facilities, etc., is a pretty great choice.
But then again, you are more knowledgeable about (and much closer to) the program than I am. |
The real question, though, is why Cal falls so far after Anigwe's departure, and whether Smith was part of the process that led to that fall.
Hopefully not and she had ideas that were never implemented in the past.
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CalwbbFan
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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| Posted: 06/25/19 9:18 pm ::: |
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| I certainly wish them well. Cal has had some outstanding seasons under different coaches, and produced some remarkable talent.
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