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Mercury @ Sky - 6/11/19
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mavcarter
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010
Posts: 5029
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PostPosted: 06/12/19 8:56 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


Fowles averaged 20 & 10 in 2011 while having Dominique Canty & a rookie Vandersloot as point guards.

Charles averaged 21.5 & 9 while playing with Tanisha Wright, Brittany Boyd, and Lindsay Harding.

A’ja Wilson averaged 20 & 8 while playing with Kelsey Plum, Lindsay Allen, and Moriah Jefferson.

Who’s elite out of that group?

I just think Griner is fine without dominating on offense, and clearly the
coaching staff is as well..

Michelle89 wrote:
Wherre are the Dolson haters Laughing


She’s had two pretty good, consecutive first halves. They’ve given her the ball early and not just using her as somewhat of a decoy.

And played pretty solid defense as well.



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Iluvacc



Joined: 11 Jun 2005
Posts: 2787



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PostPosted: 06/12/19 10:32 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
Remember the days where majority posters here thought Diamond would be a bust? Even as far as calling her a cubic zirconia Laughing Laughing Where are they now i wonder ? Razz


Eating crow


Iluvacc



Joined: 11 Jun 2005
Posts: 2787



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PostPosted: 06/12/19 10:32 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


You don’t consider January an elite guard?


ClayK



Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: 06/12/19 11:27 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I thought DeShields' attitude would get in the way of her obvious talent, but I was wrong. Whatever has happened, she's now an elite player in the best league in the world.

In this particular game, though, the difference was that Chicago made 12 of 23 three-pointers -- and when any team shoots that well from distance (guarded or unguarded), they have a very good chance to win.



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shontay33



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 338



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PostPosted: 06/12/19 12:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.



BG was second on the team with shot attempts. Her play or lack thereof as others stated is not on the guards it is on BG. When she makes up her mind that she is ready to dominate and not be dominated then we can say that she at the next level. I have come to the conclusion that what you are going to get from BG is about 15pts, 4 blocks and about 3 to 6 boards a game. She is not going to be able to carry a team It is just not in her. She doesn't have the will or personalty to do that. Which is why you have to put a rebounding power forward next to her.


GlennMacGrady



Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 5710
Location: Heisenberg


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PostPosted: 06/12/19 1:54 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


That might help, but Griner should be ashamed of her general and offensive rebounding effectiveness. In addition, as you know from watching UConn, some of the best post feeders can be other post players -- such as Lobo, Moore, Dolson, Williams, Samuelson -- if the team knows how to run post-to-post pick&rolls and high-low passes.
Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
Posts: 15697
Location: Holland


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PostPosted: 06/12/19 3:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Iluvacc wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


You don’t consider January an elite guard?


An elite defender but never an elite pg



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Iluvacc



Joined: 11 Jun 2005
Posts: 2787



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PostPosted: 06/12/19 4:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Michelle89 wrote:
Iluvacc wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


You don’t consider January an elite guard?


An elite defender but never an elite pg


As a starting point guard she made it the finals twice (winning in 2012).

6th all time WNBA Playoffs Assists List

Led the league in 3pt percentage twice, and became the 2nd player to do it on different teams.

Arguably the best defensive point guard in league history.

I'm not her biggest fan, but I definitely think she qualifies as an elite pg.


CamrnCrz1974



Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 17904
Location: Phoenix


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PostPosted: 06/12/19 4:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mavcarter wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


Fowles averaged 20 & 10 in 2011 while having Dominique Canty & a rookie Vandersloot as point guards.

Charles averaged 21.5 & 9 while playing with Tanisha Wright, Brittany Boyd, and Lindsay Harding.

A’ja Wilson averaged 20 & 8 while playing with Kelsey Plum, Lindsay Allen, and Moriah Jefferson.

Who’s elite out of that group?


-- Chicago finished 14-20 in 2011 and did not make the playoffs.
-- New York lost in the first round of the playoffs in 2016.
-- Las Vegas finished 14-20 in 2018 and did not make the playoffs.

Without commenting on the elite point guard part of the equation and whether Griner has one, the above examples were not the best.


mavcarter
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Joined: 02 Sep 2010
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Location: Chicago


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PostPosted: 06/12/19 5:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

CamrnCrz1974 wrote:
mavcarter wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


Fowles averaged 20 & 10 in 2011 while having Dominique Canty & a rookie Vandersloot as point guards.

Charles averaged 21.5 & 9 while playing with Tanisha Wright, Brittany Boyd, and Lindsay Harding.

A’ja Wilson averaged 20 & 8 while playing with Kelsey Plum, Lindsay Allen, and Moriah Jefferson.

Who’s elite out of that group?


-- Chicago finished 14-20 in 2011 and did not make the playoffs.
-- New York lost in the first round of the playoffs in 2016.
-- Las Vegas finished 14-20 in 2018 and did not make the playoffs.

Without commenting on the elite point guard part of the equation and whether Griner has one, the above examples were not the best.


I honestly don’t see what team record has to do with dominant bigs still being able to dominate without having an elite PG.



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Or maybe said poster should quit being a nuisance when people don’t agree?
mercfan3



Joined: 23 Nov 2004
Posts: 18554



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PostPosted: 06/12/19 6:58 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

GlennMacGrady wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


That might help, but Griner should be ashamed of her general and offensive rebounding effectiveness. In addition, as you know from watching UConn, some of the best post feeders can be other post players -- such as Lobo, Moore, Dolson, Williams, Samuelson -- if the team knows how to run post-to-post pick&rolls and high-low passes.


I guess that’s more what I mean. Posts need a player that can pass them the ball in good spots. Usually a guard.

Griner’s rebounding is another story. At some point people will accept that she’s not an amazing rebounder and appreciate the player that she is.



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Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
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Location: Holland


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PostPosted: 06/13/19 12:55 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Iluvacc wrote:
Michelle89 wrote:
Iluvacc wrote:
mercfan3 wrote:
toad455 wrote:
Griner has really taken a step back this season. That fact that Dolson is outplaying her isn't good.


Posts need an elite guard. Griner doesn’t have one at the moment.


You don’t consider January an elite guard?


An elite defender but never an elite pg


As a starting point guard she made it the finals twice (winning in 2012).

6th all time WNBA Playoffs Assists List

Led the league in 3pt percentage twice, and became the 2nd player to do it on different teams.

Arguably the best defensive point guard in league history.

I'm not her biggest fan, but I definitely think she qualifies as an elite pg.


She averages 3,6 assist per game (2,1 TO's) for her career. There is nothing elite about that.
Lots of players went tk the finals multiple times. Doesnt make them elite..



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"Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson were and are the dynamic duo. They're the one-two punch. They're all the clich�s possible to describe people that perfectly complement each other, who make each other better and also bring out the best in the team." �Karen Bryant
Rock Hard



Joined: 02 Aug 2010
Posts: 3454
Location: Chocolate Paradise


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PostPosted: 06/13/19 9:53 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Inquiring minds want to know. What did Williams say to the ref that earned her a technical foul? Wink



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