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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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Location: London
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 Posted: 02/15/19 5:35 pm ::: |
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| To be honest, I'm not convinced that she'll still be available at #7. |
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TotalCardinalMove
Joined: 13 Oct 2013
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| Posted: 02/15/19 5:48 pm ::: |
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| J-Spoon wrote: |
They might
But it is hard to argue a negative. Would ND be better if Ogunbowale scored less and others scored more? we don't know. What we do know is they play pretty well with Arike playing the way she plays right now. And of course others make major contributions as well, but Arike's most important contribution is her scoring. The coach probably lets her play that way because it is a big part of why ND has been successful these past four years. |
Maybe, but Arike isn’t even the best player on her team. Young is.
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willtalk
Joined: 13 Apr 2012
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Location: NorCal
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| Posted: 02/15/19 6:17 pm ::: |
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| J-Spoon wrote: |
They might
But it is hard to argue a negative. Would ND be better if Ogunbowale scored less and others scored more? we don't know. What we do know is they play pretty well with Arike playing the way she plays right now. And of course others make major contributions as well, but Arike's most important contribution is her scoring. The coach probably lets her play that way because it is a big part of why ND has been successful these past four years. |
I will give you that ( bolded part ), but the question we have to ask is if her value to a WNBA team would be the same as it is to ND?
All players have their own strengths and weaknesses that translate as assets or liabilities on the court. It is a matter of trade offs. It usually depends on the composition of the team as a whole whether the trade off makes the player an over all asset or liability on the court. If the strength the player brings to the team is needed their liabilities can be overlooked. The WNBA is a bit different than even elite programs in college. This is why recognizing her strengths and weaknesses becomes more important in respect to analyzing their impact on a team at the next level. Will the ND level +=- trade off still be worth it to a WNBA team?
Lets first look at her strength and what she brings to ND team. You rightfully mentioned scoring. But it is not just scoring, but the fact that she is the player for ND that can create her own shot. Every team needs such a player. In college she can usually get her shot off when ever she wants to take it. This is why she took and has made those game ending , time running down shots. How will that ability translate to the next level?
While it will translate, how well is still an unknown. She is short and she will be facing taller and much more athletic players at the next level. We can look at both Sims and Plums production at the next level to validate that their will be considerable drop off in numbers and efficiency.
Lets take a look at her role as the player who can create their own shot. i think we can also agree that there are far more players at the next level that fit that description. Her role in that respect would less unique and therefore diminished.
She seems to be a steak shooter who lacks consistency. She will miss a bunch in a row and still keep shooting until she begins to make them. On the ND team that is tolerated because she has value as a create her own shot player out weighs her streakyness. The asset out weights the liability. If or when what she brings to a teams value is diminished, by others who bring the same skill, than the liability takes on greater trade off value. In the WNBA there are a lot more " create your own shot" players - especially on the Sparks.
Now lets look at her major liability-- her poor defense. In college that was less noticeable because defensive schemes can help to mitigate that weakness. Most college opponents just are not loaded with multiple effective offensive threats. I have seen her play and usually she plays weak defense. She is a defensive liability even in college and in the WNBA that would be magnified.
Her resulting trade off of offensive asset vs defensive liability would be greatly magnified towards the negative end in the WNBA. The Sparks especially have little to gain from drafting a college level defensive liability in order to gain a player who MIGHT be able to create their own shot at the next level.
So the score is tied and the clock is running down at the end of a game. So who do the Sparks give the ball to for the last shot? Arike-- I seriously doubt that.
As to your statement that if she were on a less talented team she would be putting up similar numbers to what Plum and other have put up--That is total speculative BS. You are cherry picking to support an assumption. You forget that on a solid team like ND with other talented options she faces far fewer double and triple teams. Opponents do not game plane to stop her to stop ND.
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008
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| Posted: 02/16/19 12:21 am ::: |
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| Richyyy wrote: |
| To be honest, I'm not convinced that she'll still be available at #7. |
I think one of the fun things about this year is that it's hard to tell which of the players being discussed might be available at #7. I think a lot of Plan B's will be in play during this draft.
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Aladyyn
Joined: 23 Jul 2017
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Location: Czech Republic
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| Posted: 02/16/19 12:25 am ::: |
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| Is Arike a defensive liability? Yes. Like every scoring guard in the WNBA not named Hayes or Gray. I think it's blown out of proportion. The are nice flawless players in this draft, and especially not at #7.
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ClayK
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 02/16/19 8:39 am ::: |
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Presumably Ogunbowale has the athleticism to defend better should she put her mind to it ... and presumably she will. But it doesn't appear she will ever be more than an average defender, and will likely struggle her first couple years.
Also, presumably, her 31.5% three-point shooting this year is an outlier, as for her first three years she was at 41.2%. There's a lot of random fluctuation in three-point percentages (Kelsey Plum shot 33% her junior year) so judging her offensive contribution on this season is probably unfair.
Still, she will have a little more trouble shooting threes in the WNBA, with taller defenders and a deeper line, so there is reason fro some concern.
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zune69
Joined: 27 May 2010
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| Posted: 02/16/19 9:35 am ::: |
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| I can see Ogunbowale being a great 20-24 mpg instant offense player off the bench, and winning multiple 6th Woman awards. Starting backcourt player she is not.
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007
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| Posted: 02/18/19 12:02 pm ::: |
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| Did LA re-sign Gray?
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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| Posted: 02/18/19 12:16 pm ::: |
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| Haven't heard anything and my nails are down to the nub.
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Spark4Life
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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Spark4Life
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: 02/20/19 12:30 pm ::: |
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| Anyone seen the new signee play yet? Chances she makes the team?
Last edited by Spark4Life on 02/20/19 12:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Spark4Life
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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Location: NJ
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| Posted: 02/20/19 12:48 pm ::: |
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| Spark4Life wrote: |
| https://sparks.wnba.com/news/sparks-sign-alina-iagupova/ |
Who?
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Spark4Life
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
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| Posted: 02/20/19 1:02 pm ::: |
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| toad455 wrote: |
| Spark4Life wrote: |
| https://sparks.wnba.com/news/sparks-sign-alina-iagupova/ |
Who? |
She plays with Chelsea overseas.
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
Posts: 24349
Location: London
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| Posted: 02/20/19 1:03 pm ::: |
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| toad455 wrote: |
| Spark4Life wrote: |
| https://sparks.wnba.com/news/sparks-sign-alina-iagupova/ |
Who? |
Star of the Ukranian national team, bit of a gunner, was also on that Cukurova team people were paying attention to last year because DeShields was on it. You may also remember her from being illegally drafted by the Sparks back in 2013. |
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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| Posted: 02/20/19 2:21 pm ::: |
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| She seems too good to be considered a trial player (wasn’t signed to a training camp contract). Considering they already signed Ruffin-Pratt, this could be a sign they are letting Riquna Williams walk.
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 02/20/19 2:39 pm ::: |
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| And still the Sparks have yet to re-sign Gray....
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WNBA 09
Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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toad455
Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 02/20/19 4:11 pm ::: |
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Assuming Gray is re-signed and no trade happens, here's where they stand.
PG: Gray/[Sims]
SG: Sims/Ruffin-Pratt/Wiese
SF: Beard/Iagupova/Samuelson
PF: Parker/Vadeeva
C: Ogwumike/Lavender
+ #7 pick
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WfanFrJmp
Joined: 24 May 2016
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| Posted: 02/20/19 7:45 pm ::: |
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So, this reminded me that LA still has the rights to Tolo:
https://twitter.com/LA_Sparks/status/1097980881778618368
Does anyone know if she's planning to come over? If she does, do we think this changes the game regarding the desire to get Liz or does Tolo become trade bait?
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stever
Joined: 16 Nov 2004
Posts: 6916
Location: https://womensbasketballdaily.net
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| Posted: 02/20/19 8:12 pm ::: |
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| WfanFrJmp wrote: |
So, this reminded me that LA still has the rights to Tolo:
https://twitter.com/LA_Sparks/status/1097980881778618368
Does anyone know if she's planning to come over? If she does, do we think this changes the game regarding the desire to get Liz or does Tolo become trade bait? |
Somewhere in the last 30 days or so, I read a quote from Tolo in an Aussie newspaper that said she's still kinda' rehabbing and had no plans to play here this summer...wanted to get 100% healthy for Tokyo, IIRC. |
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DFWub2018
Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth
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| Posted: 02/20/19 8:32 pm ::: |
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toad445,
I keep saying it...she's coming to Dallas 😎
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DFWub2018
Joined: 24 Aug 2018
Posts: 1047
Location: Dallas/Ft. Worth
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| Posted: 02/20/19 8:33 pm ::: |
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| toad455
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011
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| Posted: 02/20/19 8:43 pm ::: |
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| DFWub2018 wrote: |
toad445,
I keep saying it...she's coming to Dallas 😎 |
toad455
toad455
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/KS6f1MKpLGM" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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