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What should happen? |
Aces forfeit |
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39% |
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Game is played during season |
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16% |
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Game is played on August 20 if there are playoff implications |
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44% |
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Total Votes : 56 |
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SportsGuru
Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 4977
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Posted: 08/04/18 9:57 am ::: |
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Silky Johnson wrote: |
SportsGuru wrote: |
There should be harsh punishment, not only forfeiture of the game but also the loss of 2019 1st rd pick. |
They should have to forfeit their pick for forfeiting one game? That's preposterous. |
Deflate-Gate resulted in Patriots quarterback Tom Brady being suspended for four games and the team being fined $1 million and losing two draft picks. The St Louis Cardinals forfeited a draft pick for spying on the Houston Astros. The Las Vegas Aces by not playing the game hurt the image of the WNBA, I believe there has to be some kind of harsh punishment so another team will think twice before they purposely don't show up for a game.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3303
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:02 am ::: |
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I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling.
_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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SportsGuru
Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 4977
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:15 am ::: |
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Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66773 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:16 am ::: |
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SportsGuru wrote: |
Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters |
So it's OK if the bench players get hurt?
_________________ Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
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Silky Johnson
Joined: 29 Sep 2014 Posts: 3303
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:32 am ::: |
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SportsGuru wrote: |
Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters |
I might find this response agreeable if it weren't for the fact that WNBA players don't make their money playing in the WNBA. These players go out and play tired and get injured, then they get dropped/don't get signed overseas, which is how they make their real bread. And then what?
_________________ Professional Hater. The Baron of #HateHard
My team no longer exists, so I'll have to settle for hating yours.
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:33 am ::: |
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Here is my Solomonesque solution assuming no rescheduling which I would prefer. Nothing happens until the end of the season. If the game outcome makes no difference in either the playoff positions or lottery odds then there is no adjustment to wins and losses. If the Mystics playoff position would be impacted by the outcome of the August 4 game the Mystics are awarded a win. If the Aces playoff position would have been impacted they would penalized with a loss. If the Aces are in the lottery, they do not get a loss so as to not enhance their lottery odds.
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SportsGuru
Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 4977
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:34 am ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
SportsGuru wrote: |
Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters |
So it's OK if the bench players get hurt? |
It's Basketball, something most of us in our youths played all day and all night long until we were call for dinner.
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vallee
Joined: 14 Jun 2006 Posts: 666
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:43 am ::: |
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I'm bracing myself for another problem here in DC for the game on the 12th. There will be demonstration and counterdemonstration downtown. The Metro system is already trying to find a way to keep the groups apart, so it's going to be tough (and potentially unsafe) to get to the game.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014 Posts: 3510
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Posted: 08/04/18 10:45 am ::: |
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SportsGuru wrote: |
Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters |
MLB is a different situation. Those players get to sleep during their chartered flight and will be fed during delays. Secondly, the physical demands of a baseball game are a lot less.
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SportsGuru
Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 4977
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Posted: 08/04/18 11:10 am ::: |
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FrozenLVFan wrote: |
SportsGuru wrote: |
Silky Johnson wrote: |
I find the thought that you hold forfeiting a game for reasons of health and safety on the same level as cheating to be troubling. |
That's a Beautiful Song excuse that someone associated with the Las Vegas Aces came up with. I seen Major League Baseball teams come in from a road game early in the morning and had to play an afternoon game, the Major League Baseball team rest the majority of their starting players and play their reserves. Bill Laimbeer could've played his 7 bench players the majority of the game and sprinkle in some of his 5 starters |
MLB is a different situation. Those players get to sleep during their chartered flight and will be fed during delays. Secondly, the physical demands of a baseball game are a lot less. |
You don't think baseball isn't a demanding sport when one is in the batter's box and there's a baseball being thrown close to 100 MPH towards a batter ?
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mercfan3
Joined: 23 Nov 2004 Posts: 19725
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Posted: 08/04/18 11:33 am ::: |
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Randy wrote: |
Here is my Solomonesque solution assuming no rescheduling which I would prefer. Nothing happens until the end of the season. If the game outcome makes no difference in either the playoff positions or lottery odds then there is no adjustment to wins and losses. If the Mystics playoff position would be impacted by the outcome of the August 4 game the Mystics are awarded a win. If the Aces playoff position would have been impacted they would penalized with a loss. If the Aces are in the lottery, they do not get a loss so as to not enhance their lottery odds. |
So the aces get punished for the WNBA being careless, and Mystics get rewarded.
I say, keep the schedule the same unless it would impact playoff positions for either team. If so, play the game at seasons end.
_________________ “Anyone point out that a Donald Trump anagram is ‘Lord Dampnut’”- Colin Mochrie
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calbearman76
Joined: 02 Nov 2009 Posts: 5152 Location: Carson City
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Posted: 08/04/18 11:42 am ::: |
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Thanks to Courtsidetix, Richyy and Randy for their information regarding League rules and the CBA. Given how difficult it is to often get information on the WNBA it is great to have this forum where people who care about the sport can find out what is going on. Also big thanks to the New York Times (Fake news) for their article. And unfortunately a BIG "what the Hay" to the WNBA website which doesn't even address the issue.
After reading all of this I believe the best alternative is to play the game on August 20 if it has playoff implications. With the Player's Association having been involved and having reasonable arguments on player safety, a forfeit ls unwarranted. The rule requiring coach travel certainly contributed to this unfortunate situation. Hopefully the WNBA will learn from this, but after 21 years I am not so sure.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66773 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 08/04/18 11:53 am ::: |
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calbearman76 wrote: |
After reading all of this I believe the best alternative is to play the game on August 20 if it has playoff implications. |
What about lottery implications?
_________________ Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
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Shades
Joined: 10 Jul 2006 Posts: 63713
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Posted: 08/04/18 11:58 am ::: |
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pilight wrote: |
calbearman76 wrote: |
After reading all of this I believe the best alternative is to play the game on August 20 if it has playoff implications. |
What about lottery implications? |
It’s unlikely the outcome of the game wouldn’t affect something, like draft position for both teams in general. Losing two games just dropped the Lynx from #3 seed to #7 seed.
_________________ Nnekalonians 1:14 - Thou shalt not accept that which is not earned
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
Joined: 28 May 2007 Posts: 14097
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Posted: 08/04/18 12:38 pm ::: |
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If they were to reschedule, 8/13 seems likely. DC hosts Dallas on the 12th and Vegas has a few days open. The building is also available. It would be inconvenient to both teams but not impossible.
It would be nice if the league spoke out on the issue.
_________________ The poster formerly known as LibWNBAFan.
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TotalCardinalMove
Joined: 13 Oct 2013 Posts: 1466
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Posted: 08/04/18 1:58 pm ::: |
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calbearman76 wrote: |
Thanks to Courtsidetix, Richyy and Randy for their information regarding League rules and the CBA. Given how difficult it is to often get information on the WNBA it is great to have this forum where people who care about the sport can find out what is going on. Also big thanks to the New York Times (Fake news) for their article. And unfortunately a BIG "what the Hay" to the WNBA website which doesn't even address the issue.
After reading all of this I believe the best alternative is to play the game on August 20 if it has playoff implications. With the Player's Association having been involved and having reasonable arguments on player safety, a forfeit ls unwarranted. The rule requiring coach travel certainly contributed to this unfortunate situation. Hopefully the WNBA will learn from this, but after 21 years I am not so sure. |
Playing the game on the 20th probably isn’t realistic with the playoffs already penciled in for the day after. What if by that point neither team is playing for a bye? They’d have to play a game the night before a single elimination playoff game. How “fair” would that be?
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 24327 Location: London
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Posted: 08/04/18 2:29 pm ::: |
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TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
calbearman76 wrote: |
Thanks to Courtsidetix, Richyy and Randy for their information regarding League rules and the CBA. Given how difficult it is to often get information on the WNBA it is great to have this forum where people who care about the sport can find out what is going on. Also big thanks to the New York Times (Fake news) for their article. And unfortunately a BIG "what the Hay" to the WNBA website which doesn't even address the issue.
After reading all of this I believe the best alternative is to play the game on August 20 if it has playoff implications. With the Player's Association having been involved and having reasonable arguments on player safety, a forfeit ls unwarranted. The rule requiring coach travel certainly contributed to this unfortunate situation. Hopefully the WNBA will learn from this, but after 21 years I am not so sure. |
Playing the game on the 20th probably isn’t realistic with the playoffs already penciled in for the day after. What if by that point neither team is playing for a bye? They’d have to play a game the night before a single elimination playoff game. How “fair” would that be? |
If either team were left in the 5th-8th spots, they'd then be playing a back-to-back-to-back, with the third one being the elimination playoff game. Maybe they'd then shift the 1st-round game to the 22nd, but then you just complicate the next round, which is supposed to be on the 23rd. Utter nonsense.
If they were going to order the game to be rescheduled, without caring about what it did to the Mystics' schedule, the most sensible day would probably have been today. Vegas are already in town, and anywhere you put it you're forcing Washington into an extra back-to-back.
Another reason that I think they're most likely to just award the win to Washington. |
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myrtle
Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 32326
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Posted: 08/04/18 2:41 pm ::: |
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With all the back to backs scheduled, I'm surprised this hasn't come up earlier. It's hard to blame Vegas. They tried to get there 24 hours before game time.
_________________ For there is always light,
if only we’re brave enough to see it.
If only we’re brave enough to be it.
- Amanda Gorman
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SportsGuru
Joined: 20 May 2005 Posts: 4977
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Posted: 08/04/18 3:09 pm ::: |
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My reading, WNBA League Office gave the Las Vegas Aces approval for a Charter Flight before the team left Las Vegas. MGM Resorts International claim they couldn't attain a Charter Flight for the Players. So, I guessing MGM Resorts International is telling everyone nobody in Las Vegas had a Jet sitting idle at the Vegas Airport or nearby air field, what about UNLV or somebody like Wayne Newton
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calbearman76
Joined: 02 Nov 2009 Posts: 5152 Location: Carson City
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Posted: 08/04/18 4:16 pm ::: |
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NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
It would be nice if the league spoke out on the issue. |
This is the biggest problem. It is likely that we won't hear anything until Monday (at the earliest). At least make a statement about what you are doing and when you will give clarification. The WNBA website still just says the game was cancelled. This is leadership at its worst.
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Randy
Joined: 08 Oct 2011 Posts: 10911
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Posted: 08/04/18 4:22 pm ::: |
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I agree they should make some kind of statement but reading all of the conclusions jumped to in this and the other threads shows why they they should take the time to find out exactly what happened and why. They also need input on all of the rules that apply and perhaps get input from all of the teams.Their decision will impact all of the teams either directly or indirectly. Because this involves the players union as well and CBA talks may be in the offing, it is a virtual minefield of possible problems. Bottom line - I wouldn't be surprised if it takes a while.
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CourtsideTix
Joined: 19 Nov 2004 Posts: 4565 Location: Washington, DC
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Posted: 08/04/18 4:25 pm ::: |
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NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
If they were to reschedule, 8/13 seems likely. DC hosts Dallas on the 12th and Vegas has a few days open. The building is also available. It would be inconvenient to both teams but not impossible.
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I think the Mystics would consider it beyond "inconvenient." It would create a back-to-back for them, and right at the end of the season when they will likely still be fighting for playoff position.
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CourtsideTix
Joined: 19 Nov 2004 Posts: 4565 Location: Washington, DC
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Posted: 08/04/18 4:35 pm ::: |
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TotalCardinalMove wrote: |
Playing the game on the 20th probably isn’t realistic with the playoffs already penciled in for the day after. What if by that point neither team is playing for a bye? They’d have to play a game the night before a single elimination playoff game. How “fair” would that be? |
Agreed. It would be totally unfair to create a potential back-to-back with the first playoff game.
Also, in terms of arena availability, I don't think anyone should assume that the Capital One Arena would even be available to the Mystics after their last scheduled regular season home game on August 17; the arena is already in the midst of a major renovation that is going to go full throttle after the regular season ends.
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004 Posts: 66773 Location: Where the action is
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Posted: 08/04/18 5:28 pm ::: |
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https://twitter.com/MechelleV/status/1025865808688414720
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As for still-pending announcement on whether Aces-Mystics is officially a forfeit for Las Vegas ... any such WNBA decisions have go through channels with the NBA. That's partly why things like this tend to take longer than perhaps WNBA fans think they should. |
_________________ Let us not deceive ourselves. Our educational institutions have proven to be no bastions of democracy.
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RI_Sun_Fan
Joined: 16 Jan 2010 Posts: 858
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Posted: 08/04/18 7:18 pm ::: |
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Pilight...
If the game isn't made up, will you count the Aces Mystics debacle as a game for the players on both rosters in your quickest to milestone lists ?
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