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Sun’s Williams Absent From Team Due To Altercation
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Nixtreefan



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 8:06 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Didn't mean to speculate, I thought I read suspensions but if not why keep an instigator on the tam and the victim off the team, maybe there is more to this but anywhooo it doesn't make much sense without context.


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PostPosted: 07/09/18 8:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
All else not withstanding, it's safe to assume that Collen asked Angel and others who have played with AB to weigh in before making the move.


The "others" would be Hayes and E. Williams (from her year with the Sun). Other than the owners there is no one else left from the 2013 Dream still with the team (other than maybe a ticket sales rep or someone in the office.) Nonetheless - seems to me the Dream have plenty of info to get a good read on Bentley.


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PostPosted: 07/09/18 8:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
All else not withstanding, it's safe to assume that Collen asked Angel and others who have played with AB to weigh in before making the move.


The "others" would be Hayes and E. Williams (from her year with the Sun). Other than the owners there is no one else left from the 2013 Dream still with the team (other than maybe a ticket sales rep or someone in the office.) Nonetheless - seems to me the Dream have plenty of info to get a good read on Bentley.


Renee Montgomery also played with Bentley in Connecticut



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sportsfan48



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 9:17 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Davis4632 wrote:
Shades wrote:
If it was “just a dust-up”, I would think a well-managed team would be able to smooth things out. It must have been bad enough to potentially risk the season for CON.


True. It was bad enough to the point the organization or the one or both of the players themselves felt like they couldn't play on the same team. Maybe Miller isn't a strong enough leader to control his locker room.


Maybe Williams was not with the team for personal reasons. Maybe the trade was a result of the Sun's stretch of losses and they felt they needed to change things up. Maybe the trade timing is coincidental with Williams needing personal time off. Maybe no one really knows, at least on this board. Maybe the Sun's front office and coaching staff know something of what really has taken place. Maybe the one's in the know aren't talking. Maybe if someone on this board does know what happened, they are not talking. Maybe....


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PostPosted: 07/09/18 9:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Davis4632 wrote:
Maybe Miller isn't a strong enough leader to control his locker room.

Maybe this was basement-level behaviour by members of his team and he just wasn't going to stand for that.



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Davis4632



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 10:39 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Luuuc wrote:
Davis4632 wrote:
Maybe Miller isn't a strong enough leader to control his locker room.

Maybe this was basement-level behaviour by members of his team and he just wasn't going to stand for that.


If that's the case, Sun fans better hope a altercation between Chiney, JJ, or Alyssa Thomas never occurs.


readyAIMfire53



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 10:41 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Luuuc wrote:
Davis4632 wrote:
Maybe Miller isn't a strong enough leader to control his locker room.

Maybe this was basement-level behaviour by members of his team and he just wasn't going to stand for that.


Looking forward to the rise of the Sun...with C.Williams and A.Thomas. Need to keep J.Jones playing at the same level. Maybe start J.Jones and bring AT off the bench until fully recovered. Jonquel seems to like starting and I don't think AT really cares.

One thing is clear with the Sun skid after AT went out: Alyssa is THE glue this team needs. If she comes off the bench I predict we'll see everyone fitting together better when she comes in and the Sun going on a run.

Pure speculation on my part but I think this team will be better after this trade. I think Curt Miller played this out nicely.



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Randy



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 10:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I predict that Bob and LaChina will start calling AB "At the Buzzer Bentley" again.


StevenHW



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 11:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

sportsfan48 wrote:
Davis4632 wrote:
Shades wrote:
If it was “just a dust-up”, I would think a well-managed team would be able to smooth things out. It must have been bad enough to potentially risk the season for CON.


True. It was bad enough to the point the organization or the one or both of the players themselves felt like they couldn't play on the same team. Maybe Miller isn't a strong enough leader to control his locker room.


Maybe Williams was not with the team for personal reasons. Maybe the trade was a result of the Sun's stretch of losses and they felt they needed to change things up. Maybe the trade timing is coincidental with Williams needing personal time off. Maybe no one really knows, at least on this board. Maybe the Sun's front office and coaching staff know something of what really has taken place. Maybe the one's in the know aren't talking. Maybe if someone on this board does know what happened, they are not talking. Maybe....


Maybe this reminds me of that old unwritten policy in baseball clubhouses and locker rooms, which goes like this...

“What you see here,
What you say here,
Let it stay here,
When you leave here!”

But in this day and age of tell-all books and social media, I’m not sure athletes uphold that policy.



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jap



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 11:33 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote:
All else not withstanding, it's safe to assume that Collen asked Angel and others who have played with AB to weigh in before making the move.


Collen: "Do you think there will be any problems if I bring Alex in?"

Angel: "Don't worry! If she starts any crap, I'll sic Lori Ann on her in a heartbeat!!!" Laughing



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 07/09/18 11:48 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
I predict that Bob and LaChina will start calling AB "At the Buzzer Bentley" again.


wasn't it "big buckets Bentley"?



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 12:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

myrtle wrote:
Randy wrote:
I predict that Bob and LaChina will start calling AB "At the Buzzer Bentley" again.


wasn't it "big buckets Bentley"?


Not when she was in Atlanta, it wasn't.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 3:16 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Most of the team seems to get along just fine with Bentley. Here you can see them partying just hours ago.




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HoosierHusky



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 8:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://www.theday.com/connecticut-sun/20180709/sun-trade-bentley-to-atlanta-for-guard-layshia-clarendon-draft-pick

“Layshia has a great reputation around the league as a leader on-and-off the court and a player that really has a way of getting along with her teammates,” Sun head coach and general manager Curt Miller said. “It’s continued to hit us that, ultimately, (team) culture has to be a big thing for us. If, on paper, we’re not one of the super teams, then we’re going to have to continue to overachieve because of that culture."



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pilight



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 8:34 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah, Clarendon's teams have a history of overachieving...



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 8:42 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Miller's statement comes about as close as we are going to get to pointing the finger.


readyAIMfire53



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 9:36 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Randy wrote:
Miller's statement comes about as close as we are going to get to pointing the finger.


If you read the entire article, it outs Bentley as the problem affecting team chemistry. There are no details about any altercations but he made it clear the trade was ALL about fixing team chemistry.



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toad455



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 9:45 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

And it seems clear that Williams wasn't going to play until Bentley was traded.



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zune69



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 10:02 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Yeah,lets put the blame for Connecticut going 3-8 over the last 11 gms on Bentley.

Atlanta just added a double-digit bench scorer....They just might make the playoffs.


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 10:38 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
Atlanta just added a double-digit bench scorer....

Not a remotely efficient one. Most bench players don't get to take 10 shots a night. Sykes is already better at that job.



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 10:51 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Are we discussing Alex Bentley or Betty Lennox here ? Laughing
Same song different generations .



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myrtle



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 12:04 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

readyAIMfire53 wrote:
Randy wrote:
Miller's statement comes about as close as we are going to get to pointing the finger.


If you read the entire article, it outs Bentley as the problem affecting team chemistry. There are no details about any altercations but he made it clear the trade was ALL about fixing team chemistry.


I don't see any finger pointing at Bentley. It's all vague and we'll likely never know. It could easily be that Williams gave an ultimatum and they found they could get more equal value for Bentley. "fixing team chemistry" could just mean one or the other had to go. But without knowing details, I don't think there is, or should be, any finger pointing. Why play the blame game?



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mavcarter



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 12:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

readyAIMfire53 wrote:
If you read the entire article, it outs Bentley as the problem affecting team chemistry.


Laughing Rolling Eyes


zune69



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 1:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
zune69 wrote:
Atlanta just added a double-digit bench scorer....

Not a remotely efficient one. Most bench players don't get to take 10 shots a night. Sykes is already better at that job.


1.Bentley's 39.6 fg% is better than avg for a bench player,and better than Clarendon's 32.9%......Bentley's a career 40% fg shooter..I can make a long list of pg,sg,and sf who shoot sub 40% for their careers.

2.Bentley's a 30% 3ptfg shooter....Only 2 Dream players shoot better than 28%...Clarendon shot 14.3%

3.Bentley avg 3.2 asst in 21.7 mpg...Montgomery currently leads the Dream in asst at 3.2 in 28.5 mpg...Clarendon avg 1.7 asst in 17.3mpg.

4.Bentley has a 1.97 a/t ratio(61a/31t)..Better than any player on the current Dream roster...Clarendon has a 1.29 a/t ratio(31a/24t)

People are really sleeping on Bentley.


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 1:35 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
I can make a list of pg,sg,and sf who shoot sub 40% for their careers.

Congrats. Not good ones you can't.

zune69 wrote:
2.Bentley's a 30% 3ptfg shooter....Only 2 Dream players shoot better than 28%...Clarendon shot 14.3%

Yes, she's slightly less garbage at it than the rest of their roster. Still bad. Um, yay?

zune69 wrote:
4.Bentley has a 1.97 a/t ratio(61a/31t)..Better than any player on the current Dream roster...Clarendon has a 1.29 a/t ratio(31a/24t)

Yes, her numbers are a little better than career gunner/backup Montgomery and Clarendon having an awful season. More yay.

Bentley's okay. She can get hot in the occasional game, and she's shown the ability to be a vaguely viable - albeit somewhat greedy - backup point guard. Clarendon's okay too, when you let her be (albeit she's absolutely cratered in that bench role this season, and she won't be starting in Connecticut either). It's a swap of backup point guards.



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zune69



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 1:55 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Career fg%-Current starters

Diggins-40.2
McBride-39.9
Sims-39.1
January-38.3
Gray-38.7
Cloud-35.4

Katie Smith shot less than 40% in 8 out of 15 seasons.

Bentley's career 40.2% isn't all that bad when you factor in her playmaking ability.


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
Career fg%-Current starters

Diggins-40.2
McBride-39.9
Sims-39.1
January-38.3
Gray-38.7
Cloud-35.4

Katie Smith shot less than 40% in 8 out of 15 seasons.

Bentley's career 40.2% isn't all that bad when you factor in her playmaking ability.



Goes to show guards who don't shoot particularly well in the W can be regarded as great by some.'

As was said early on in the thread, this deal should benefit both clubs.



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:02 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Richyyy wrote:
Bentley's okay. She can get hot in the occasional game, and she's shown the ability to be a vaguely viable - albeit somewhat greedy - backup point guard. Clarendon's okay too, when you let her be (albeit she's absolutely cratered in that bench role this season, and she won't be starting in Connecticut either). It's a swap of backup point guards.


I mean, to the extent that this is true, if you're going to look at it like that, then "Which one of these two is better suited to be a backup point guard?" seems like a reasonable and important question to ask. And the answer to that question appears to be Bentley. Bentley may not like playing behind Montgomery any more than Clarendon appeared to, but at least it has been proven that Bentley's game translates somewhat to a bench role, whereas Clarendon, for her career, has done a whole lot of nothing, outside of when she has been a starter.



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Aladyyn



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:07 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
Career fg%-Current starters

Diggins-40.2
McBride-39.9
Sims-39.1
January-38.3
Gray-38.7
Cloud-35.4

Katie Smith shot less than 40% in 8 out of 15 seasons.

Bentley's career 40.2% isn't all that bad when you factor in her playmaking ability.

Diggins - top 2 in free throws every healthy season since her 2nd year
McBride - shoots way more 3s at a way higher percentage, gets to the line a lot more
Sims - yeah, an inefficient gunner, still gets to the line way more than Bentley
January - scoring ability is like, the last thing she's ever been valued for
Gray - tired of repeating myself but using a player with 1.5 seasons in the league in this comparison speaks for itself
Cloud - same case as January except she's much more efficient that Bentley has ever been this season as well


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

btw Bentley has 0 seasons with >50% TS


zune69



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:20 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Aladyyn wrote:
btw Bentley has 0 seasons with >50% TS


Bentley's still a quality bench player.


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:24 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
Aladyyn wrote:
btw Bentley has 0 seasons with >50% TS


Bentley's still a quality bench player.

I don't disagree.


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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:26 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Silky Johnson wrote:
Richyyy wrote:
Bentley's okay. She can get hot in the occasional game, and she's shown the ability to be a vaguely viable - albeit somewhat greedy - backup point guard. Clarendon's okay too, when you let her be (albeit she's absolutely cratered in that bench role this season, and she won't be starting in Connecticut either). It's a swap of backup point guards.


I mean, to the extent that this is true, if you're going to look at it like that, then "Which one of these two is better suited to be a backup point guard?" seems like a reasonable and important question to ask. And the answer to that question appears to be Bentley. Bentley may not like playing behind Montgomery any more than Clarendon appeared to, but at least it has been proven that Bentley's game translates somewhat to a bench role, whereas Clarendon, for her career, has done a whole lot of nothing, outside of when she has been a starter.

That's a fair point. Bentley has shown that she can often do the same stuff off the bench that she'd be doing as a starter, while Clarendon has mostly only been any good whatsoever as a starter (she was okay for about half a season as a bench player in Indiana). That said, she may just have been a bad fit with Collen. Once she made her jump in Atlanta, the only evidence we have of her as a bench player is the 18 games this season.

Also, for what it's worth, that could be a pretty decent second-round pick that Connecticut got in this deal.



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PostPosted: 07/10/18 2:44 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

zune69 wrote:
Aladyyn wrote:
btw Bentley has 0 seasons with >50% TS


Bentley's still a quality bench player.


I dont think many disagree with you on that. She is a gunner though and i wonder if the Dream need that when they already have players like Angel, Hayes and Sykes



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PostPosted: 07/11/18 10:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Can’t this simply be a good trade for both teams? This year’s numbers may not back it up but last year Layshia averaged 6.6 apg. She’s more of a PG than Bentley, whose game I like.

Bentley OTOH is a clutch player who can create her own shot as well as catch and shoot. That fits Atlanta pretty well.

Layshia (who Miller himself says gives the team another playmaker) has more of a passer’s mentality, which is a good fit particularly if Jasmine Thomas gets hurt.



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PostPosted: 07/14/18 3:37 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Layshia Clarendon comes to the Sun and wears number 23. I might be wrong but I thought the numbers hanging on the banner in the arena were retired (12 Dydek, 42 Sales, and 23 for Douglas).


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PostPosted: 07/14/18 3:45 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

RI_Sun_Fan wrote:
Layshia Clarendon comes to the Sun and wears number 23. I might be wrong but I thought the numbers hanging on the banner in the arena were retired (12 Dydek, 42 Sales, and 23 for Douglas).


http://www.courant.com/sports/basketball/connecticut-sun/hc-katie-douglas-feature-0817-20150816-story.html

Quote:
The numbers are not retired, in the classic sense, but immortalized.



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PostPosted: 07/14/18 3:56 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

pilight wrote:
RI_Sun_Fan wrote:
Layshia Clarendon comes to the Sun and wears number 23. I might be wrong but I thought the numbers hanging on the banner in the arena were retired (12 Dydek, 42 Sales, and 23 for Douglas).


http://www.courant.com/sports/basketball/connecticut-sun/hc-katie-douglas-feature-0817-20150816-story.html

Quote:
The numbers are not retired, in the classic sense, but immortalized.


So it’s similar to the UConn retirements?

I think any real retirements should be reserved for all time greats and have a very high bar, one that the players mentioned couldn’t reach.



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PostPosted: 07/14/18 4:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Thanks, looks like the Sun do things a little differently. (That was a reply to Pilight)




Last edited by RI_Sun_Fan on 07/14/18 4:55 pm; edited 1 time in total
toad455



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PostPosted: 07/14/18 4:49 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Dydek's should be retired.



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PostPosted: 07/14/18 7:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

RI_Sun_Fan wrote:
Layshia Clarendon comes to the Sun and wears number 23. I might be wrong but I thought the numbers hanging on the banner in the arena were retired (12 Dydek, 42 Sales, and 23 for Douglas).


Their numbers were never retired. They were just honored. Meaning others can play using those numbers.


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