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justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 6951
Location: Northfield, MN


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PostPosted: 05/29/18 3:19 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

toad455 wrote:
so they kept Zandalasini instead of Howard? I see that's working out real well for the Lynx!?!?!

Eh, that's way too simplistic of a view.

The Lynx were arguably in worse shape at the guard position than in the post with the loss of Montgomery and Perkins. Also, Perkins and Pierson were on team friendly contracts, which means their replacements were going to cost, unless they went with rookie contracts.

So, if you offer Howard a max contract, how do you fill your massive holes in the backcourt? You have a starting PG that you only want playing 20-25 minutes, which means you want/need a vet to timeshare with her. That means max contract in WNBA realities. Now you also need a backup post who can play center, which Howard cannot do. This means another max contract. That's 7 max contracts already. Now you need to fill the Perkins role as your starting SG cannot play 35 minutes a game, and with her bad knees injury is a major concern.

The problem with Howard is that she doesn't fit into any of these essential roles that you need. If she were built a little different she could back up the 5 and would be a no brainer. Or if the starting backcourt wasn't as old as dirt and could still play 30-35 minutes per game you wouldn't need another guard, or if Howard were a g/f and could play that role. But she can't, which means she was a potential max salary that would had to have somehow fit under the cap after adding those positions that you absolutely need. Pretty sure that math doesn't work.

If we want to blame anything, I would say it is the promise made to Augustus, Whalen, and Brunson that they would get to play as long as they want and retire as a Lynx. For instance, if the Lynx had gotten rid of Whalen and had DRob starting, they could have gotten by with Wright and Jones backing her up. Then they could have kept Howard. Ultimately though, this is a team that has committed to riding their legends until the wheels fall off. When you do this, you become very limited in options as they decline and are no longer meeting the value of their contracts.



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SpaceJunkie



Joined: 10 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: 05/29/18 3:56 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Why can't Howard or Brunson play any minutes at center when Fowles isn't playing for only a few minutes per game? Or why can't Fagbenle play any minutes at center? Why is there no cheap options for a spot that shouldn't require many minutes anyways? Why do we have to be so paranoid about Maya or Fowles getting injured that we need expensive (relative to how good the players actually are) backups at every position who won't help the Lynx win a title anyways if they have to start due to injuries instead of counting on young players? For guard, why can't Alexis Jones get any minutes? The Lynx would have enough room for at least one of D-Rob and/or Wright, and there has to be cheap options on the street or from the draft too?


Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 05/29/18 4:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I tend to agree. Howard/Wright/#12 pick (or random somebody off the street) could potentially work just as well as a bench trio as Kizer/Wright/DRob. You let Jones have more of a shot as the backup PG, with Wright as the inevitable fallback vet that Reeve would trust more. Howard's essentially the same 4/5 backup that Kizer's trying to be (a role she's looking pretty comfortable in in Seattle so far). And then you take a punt with the #12 (Gulich, Hines-Allen, Nared, Billings, Park, whoever).

I'm not saying it would necessarily be better - who knows if Howard can keep it up, maybe DRob is actually a successor for Whalen, maybe a lot of things. But that seems pretty viable to me.



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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 3:06 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Foresight is a lot more useful than hindsight.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 3:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Here is a 5/15/18 article from “The Athletic” that I saw posted at a Gophers forum. It talks about how Reeve doesn’t want to screw up as a GM. Since it’s a subscription service, I’ll just throw down everything they posted.
https://theathletic.com/355361/2018/05/15/cheryl-reeve-lynx-coach-gm-wnba-title-champions-lindsay-whalen/

Quote:
She is about to start her ninth season with the Lynx, and with the newly minted title of general manager to go with her head-coaching duties, she has never been more powerful. Despite all her success, despite helping to turn what was a woebegone franchise into the envy of the WNBA, one thought sits in the back of her mind as the Lynx prepare to pursue their fifth title in eight seasons.

Don’t screw it up.

Longtime general manager Roger Griffith stepped away from the organization after the Lynx defeated the Sparks last fall. Reeve worked closely with Griffith to help construct the juggernaut the Lynx are today, always having appreciation for the demands placed on him as he worked the salary cap, prepared for the draft and generated opportunities for trades and free agents.

Now those demands are hers....

...“I want to be different. I want the player to always win because I have to coach them,” Reeve said. “I will probably be the one that maybe leans more towards, does $5,000 really make a difference? Unless it matters on the cap, do I really want that $5,000 or whatever it is, is it really worth what we might have to go through as coach-player? From that end, I would think that communication will be huge.”

That’s where the problems can begin. A coach gets too attached to a player and makes a financial mistake. Or, on the flip side, gets too upset with a player and prematurely jettisons her.

“If we go through a four-game losing streak (prophetic?), all of a sudden I want to go, ‘I want to trade this player,’(Kizer?)” Reeve said. “Well, I wasn’t feeling that way when we weren’t losing games. One of the things I think Roger and I have done well through the years is staying the course. We’ve had opportunities to do something at a time when emotions were a little higher that we’ve always kind of steadied ourselves a little bit and said stay the course, stay the course. I hope that it’s something I’m going to be able to, as a GM, remind myself, as a coach, that when we’re in it, no, that’s not going to be something we’re going to do right now. That’s short-sighted.”



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Last edited by Shades on 06/04/18 11:07 am; edited 1 time in total
SpaceJunkie



Joined: 10 Sep 2012
Posts: 3163
Location: Minnesota


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PostPosted: 06/04/18 4:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
Foresight is a lot more useful than hindsight.


Yes. You and I disagree on a lot, but if I agreed with you that the most obvious move in the history of the universe was to re-sign Natasha Howard, at all costs (it was obvious for me, because my number one rule is don't risk end up getting trolled nonstop in the future because you were too cheap to keep a good player, like when the Thunder were too cheap too keep James Harden, a move that bewildered me at the time as well. That's why I had no idea how the Lynx "supposedly" couldn't afford Howard with Montgomery, Perkins, and Pierson off the books), and then figure out the rest from there (you would've done a better job than Reeve with that, of course), then of course that was the right move.


Michelle89



Joined: 17 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 5:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

With 2 of the best in the world in Maya and Fowles this team shouldnt be this bad. Dont care how old they are they still have more talent on this team then some other teams



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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 11:10 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

SpaceJunkie, do you subscribe to The Athletic? I’d like to see that whole article. Maybe they give some insight into the Lynx off season moves.



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SpaceJunkie



Joined: 10 Sep 2012
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 11:15 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
SpaceJunkie, do you subscribe to The Athletic? I’d like to see that whole article. Maybe they give some insight into the Lynx off season moves.


Yes. But I have to wait until I get home tonight to find it, as I'm done with my RebKell's, err, lunch break right now. Smile


Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 47817



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 1:12 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

12. Janel McCarville
13. Renee Montgomery
14. Nicole Ohlde
15. Monica Wright
16. Tonya Edwards
17. Kristen Mann Confused
18. Charde Houston
19. Nicky Anosike
20. Dev Peters

Up to date on the Lynx dartboard selection committee picks for Top 20 all time Lynx players.



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basketballologist



Joined: 05 Aug 2013
Posts: 216



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 3:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


WNBA 09



Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 6121
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 3:29 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .



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basketballologist



Joined: 05 Aug 2013
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 3:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .


Devereaux Peters is familiar with Minnesota system. She will be a good pickup


Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 4:04 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

basketballologist wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .


Devereaux Peters is familiar with Minnesota system. She will be a good pickup


She asked for a trade out of Minnesota. That’s reason enough to not want her back.



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 4:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .


Devereaux Peters is familiar with Minnesota system. She will be a good pickup


She asked for a trade out of Minnesota. That’s reason enough to not want her back.


Yeah i doubt she wants back in minnesota. Same for Howard now , crazy that players would actually RUN from playing for the defending champs !



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justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
Posts: 6951
Location: Northfield, MN


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PostPosted: 06/04/18 5:32 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

WNBA 09 wrote:
Shades wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .


Devereaux Peters is familiar with Minnesota system. She will be a good pickup


She asked for a trade out of Minnesota. That’s reason enough to not want her back.


Yeah i doubt she wants back in minnesota. Same for Howard now , crazy that players would actually RUN from playing for the defending champs !

Why is it crazy? They were players who felt they could start somewhere else, and both found a team that thought they could and offered starter money. Players tend to want to play as much as possible, and it takes a certain personality to accept a position as a role player when you know you could be a starter.



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WNBA 09



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 5:38 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
Shades wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
WNBA 09 wrote:
basketballologist wrote:
Why is Fagbenle and Zandalasini still on the team? I would waive both of them and sign some players that can give productive minutes (Larkins and Samuelson)


Larkins will require more money than either , thus the reason they are still on the team .


Devereaux Peters is familiar with Minnesota system. She will be a good pickup


She asked for a trade out of Minnesota. That’s reason enough to not want her back.


Yeah i doubt she wants back in minnesota. Same for Howard now , crazy that players would actually RUN from playing for the defending champs !

Why is it crazy? They were players who felt they could start somewhere else, and both found a team that thought they could and offered starter money. Players tend to want to play as much as possible, and it takes a certain personality to accept a position as a role player when you know you could be a starter.


Well that sucks as i felt like Coach Reeve was banking on Hot FA's to want to play with her core group and its kind of turned out the opposite.



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Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 06/06/18 10:25 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Endy Miyem re-signed by the Lynx.

http://lynx.wnba.com/news/minnesota-lynx-re-sign-forward-endy-miyem/

It’s pretty good timing. After two more games, the Lynx get like 6 days off. Plenty of practice time.



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toad455



Joined: 16 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 06/06/18 12:28 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Hopefully she gets some court time unlike Fagbenle and Zandalasini.



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Fishhappy



Joined: 15 Mar 2014
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PostPosted: 06/06/18 1:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

who did they cut to make room for her?


Shades



Joined: 10 Jul 2006
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PostPosted: 06/06/18 2:04 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Fishhappy wrote:
who did they cut to make room for her?


Nobody. They were running with only 11 because, unlike the Sparks, the Lynx are honest about what they can afford. Just like last year, the Lynx couldn’t afford 12 players for the full season.



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Fishhappy



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PostPosted: 06/10/18 11:18 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

after watching 8 games I think it is clear to nearly everyone that the Lynx are a better team with ether jones or d-rob at the point. while I remain a Whalen fan, I believe that she stayed one season to long.
Another big problem is Seimone,s lack of quickness on defense. In the last two games a rookie , Ariel Atkins, scored at will on her and the next game Courtny Williams looked like she was at shoot around in the first 5 min, of the game until Zandalasini came in for Seimone. Williams still had a hell of a game but at least she had to make shots with a hand in her face
It seems clear that Indiana, Vegas and Chicago are Lottery teams I think that the liberty, Dream and the Lynx are in a three way battle for the other spot


Shades



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PostPosted: 06/10/18 11:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

It’s too early to be calling lottery spots other than for Indiana, and even they have come close to some upset victories. It’s not like teams are destroying the Lynx even in their current form. Washington seems to be stumbling a bit. Dallas could stumble despite all the talent. Lynx could gel if Reeve can keep it together. Way too early to call. The Lynx haven’t had any red headed stepchildren on their schedule yet. No Aces, no Fever, no Sky.



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Richyyy



Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: 06/10/18 11:46 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Bit of a problem that Jones is pretty much a turnstile on D as well. She had easily her best offensive game of the season yesterday, and the fact that most of it was at the point rather than off the ball where she's been most of the year was no coincidence. But they can't have people driving by her at will just as much as they're doing to Whalen.



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Shades



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PostPosted: 06/11/18 3:36 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

11. Betty Lennox
12. Janel McCarville
13. Renee Montgomery
14. Nicole Ohlde
15. Monica Wright
16. Tonya Edwards
17. Kristen Mann Confused
18. Charde Houston
19. Nicky Anosike
20. Dev Peters

Up to date on the Lynx dartboard selection committee picks for Top 20 all time Lynx players.



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mannman



Joined: 02 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: 06/16/18 11:11 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Shades wrote:
11. Betty Lennox
12. Janel McCarville
13. Renee Montgomery
14. Nicole Ohlde
15. Monica Wright
16. Tonya Edwards
17. Kristen Mann Confused
18. Charde Houston
19. Nicky Anosike
20. Dev Peters

Up to date on the Lynx dartboard selection committee picks for Top 20 all time Lynx players.


Let's see who is left: Candice Wiggins, Tamika Raymond, Katie Smith, Taj, Maya, Rebekkah, Sylvia, Seimone, Lindsay. Still leaves two. Hmm, Teresa Edwards and, maybe Noelle Quinn?


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