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jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 01/24/18 7:59 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

I have a lot of questions about what happens and when. I think by any measuring stick that exists in my head, Trump obstructed justice and he admitted doing so on camera with Lester Holt. I don't know, of course, anything about the Russia angle. Except... that finding and revealing something nefarious there could easily rise to a level of being 'more serious' than even obstructing justice and something that could absolutely force Trump's removal and even prosecution, which, I have to say, isn't something that I think will ever happen on any domestic crime charge like obstruction.

So my questions are 'what happens if?' kind of questions.

What happens if Mueller determines that Trump obstructed justice? Does he indict him? Arrest him? CAN he do that? Or does he just issue a report or a finding? Because, people, if Mueller can't actually bring Trump down himself, totally independent of the political processes of Washington, if all he can do is issue a report or something, and it's up to CONGRESS lol to vote to impeach Trump, that's never going to happen. It'll never get out of the house. Right?

Even if Trump stumbles and lies during his testimony, which, I have to say, for Trump wouldn't actually represent an actual stumble, and the crime is lying under oath, etc. Who prosecutes? What court. No criminal court has on its list of penalties the removal of a POTUS from office. lol. Again, it sounds like at some point it comes down to congress voting to impeach. Yeah. I would say the odds of that happening are very slim.

Trump has a base, the one everyone describes as hicks. He also has a big bank of secret Trump voters. Who aren't hicks. And then he has a LOT of powerful friends now. And that's business and Wall St, where they are referring to him as The Orange Swan. Laughing I ain't shittin' you. ALL of these people are becoming REALLY happy with this administration. Maybe people here aren't noticing. That's understandable. But, as I said, Trump is winning over converts. Believe it or not. HIs poll numbers are going to move up unless something happens to explode that which would be a rapid and negative resolution to the Russian probe.

But there's a lot of people who aren't going to want to let this sucker go. That's even given all the historical rarities that must fall into place to get us to that point. People STILL are not going to want to let this guy go.

Anyone know if Mueller has the ability to indict and arrest and force a trial of Donald Trump? Or family members? Because THEN we might be talking about a resignation. I think two things we can almost forget about and that is the 25th amendment or impeachment. Trump is like really very lucid, like really very sharp. And mocking aside, I'm not kidding there. Just listen to the audio of his off the cuff Q&A with reporters this afternoon. He just hands Maggie Haberman her ass is all. So the 25th is out. And I just don't see how impeachment gets through a republican congress. Anyway.

Jeez. You would think with all the time I spend watching CNN I'd know this shit by now because ... well... because they'd have experts laying the processes all out for viewers or sumthin'. Confused


calbearman76



Joined: 02 Nov 2009
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Location: Carson City


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PostPosted: 01/26/18 9:56 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The last thing I want is an impeachment without a conviction by the senate.

I believe that Trump is unfit to be president and has most likely committed several impeachable offenses. I believe his administration has been the most corrupt, by far, of any in my lifetime. If there has ever been as corrupt an administration it would be Harding, but largely because government was not as large then I do not believe he did as much harm to the country as has Trump.

I also believe that the Democrats will retake the House in November and will be able to impeach Trump in 2019. That would be a mistake unless the case for impeachment has been made so clear by then (whether by Mueller, the press or otherwise) that mainstream Republicans will vote to convict. If it is not, and I doubt that it will be, then the House must use its subpoena power to truly investigate everything, hopefully with a planned cascading set of news stories designed not only to show the corruption of Trump but the complicity of other Republicans. Even if Fox News never covers the story information will get out. If the pressure gets greater Senate Republicans may see that a President Pence may be better for them than a wounded President Trump, and then impeachment (or resignation) would be appropriate.


cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 02/20/18 10:52 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

the weekend twitter shitstorm by the TraitorInChief just another indication that Mueller is getting closer...

drip drip drip



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justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: 04/09/18 5:46 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

So Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen, was raided over the Stormy Daniels payoff. That is huge.

This means it wasn't a subpoena in which they ask for him to hand over specific information, but rather a federal judge reviewed the evidence uncovered by Mueller and given to the FBI and felt there was enough probable cause of wrongdoing to issue a warrant for an all out search and seizure of a lawyer's files. Due to privilege (not just Trump but other client's who might be in those files), this is not something a judge would be rubber-stamping.



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jammerbirdi



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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PostPosted: 04/09/18 6:01 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
So Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen, was raided over the Stormy Daniels payoff. That is huge.

This means it wasn't a subpoena in which they ask for him to hand over specific information, but rather a federal judge reviewed the evidence uncovered by Mueller and given to the FBI and felt there was enough probable cause of wrongdoing to issue a warrant for an all out search and seizure of a lawyer's files. Due to privilege (not just Trump but other client's who might be in those files), this is not something a judge would be rubber-stamping.


Could they be going after who might have threatened her in the Vegas parking lot? Like, could that have given a judge a more solid reason to approve a warrant?


justintyme



Joined: 08 Jul 2012
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PostPosted: 04/09/18 6:56 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

jammerbirdi wrote:
justintyme wrote:
So Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen, was raided over the Stormy Daniels payoff. That is huge.

This means it wasn't a subpoena in which they ask for him to hand over specific information, but rather a federal judge reviewed the evidence uncovered by Mueller and given to the FBI and felt there was enough probable cause of wrongdoing to issue a warrant for an all out search and seizure of a lawyer's files. Due to privilege (not just Trump but other client's who might be in those files), this is not something a judge would be rubber-stamping.


Could they be going after who might have threatened her in the Vegas parking lot? Like, could that have given a judge a more solid reason to approve a warrant?

I'm really not sure. The big thing seems to be that this is something that Mueller uncovered, but that was outside of his mandate, so it was handed over to the FBI/US Attorney's office.

That leads me to guess (and that is all this is) that while going over finances related to the campaign for the Russia investigation they found evidence that the Daniels' payout came from campaign funds and that Cohen lied about paying out of his own pocket. This would be a major violation of campaign finance laws.



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Genero36



Joined: 24 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: 04/09/18 7:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

justintyme wrote:
So Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen, was raided over the Stormy Daniels payoff. That is huge.

This means it wasn't a subpoena in which they ask for him to hand over specific information, but rather a federal judge reviewed the evidence uncovered by Mueller and given to the FBI and felt there was enough probable cause of wrongdoing to issue a warrant for an all out search and seizure of a lawyer's files. Due to privilege (not just Trump but other client's who might be in those files), this is not something a judge would be rubber-stamping.






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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 10944
Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 05/09/18 9:17 am    ::: e Reply Reply with quote

Interesting that Stormy Davis' lawyer can get more shit on the Russian front than the House "investigation".

-------

Trump lied every 83 seconds during his drug-laden speech re US violating the Iran nuclear deal. That may be a record low for him. Another win for Putin and the Russians.


-------

Democrats leave office during the current "me too" hysteria; Republicans stay in office/get elected.



Same shit, different day.


And Mueller marches on...Very Happy



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Howee



Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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Location: Oklahoma (in my heart), whilst on my way to Oregon!


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PostPosted: 05/10/18 12:26 am    ::: Re: e Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
Interesting that Stormy Davis' lawyer can get more shit on the Russian front than the House "investigation".


Orrr....it may be more a case of that lawyer is more free to disclose things about the "Russian front" as he discovers it, while Mueller is adhering to every proper protocol, so no 'leaking', etc., could diminish his final opus. Cool



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mercfan3



Joined: 23 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 05/10/18 7:23 am    ::: Re: e Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
Interesting that Stormy Davis' lawyer can get more shit on the Russian front than the House "investigation".


Orrr....it may be more a case of that lawyer is more free to disclose things about the "Russian front" as he discovers it, while Mueller is adhering to every proper protocol, so no 'leaking', etc., could diminish his final opus. Cool


Civil suits can be more open.

What is crazy is of this is what a civil case is finding..



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 05/10/18 8:32 am    ::: Re: e Reply Reply with quote

Howee wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
Interesting that Stormy Davis' lawyer can get more shit on the Russian front than the House "investigation".


Orrr....it may be more a case of that lawyer is more free to disclose things about the "Russian front" as he discovers it, while Mueller is adhering to every proper protocol, so no 'leaking', etc., could diminish his final opus. Cool



Orr, I did say the "HOUSE "investigation" ". Very Happy



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 05/16/18 11:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

my goodness, even the dimmest of the MAGA crowd has to begin to wonder about their hero...



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 06/04/18 7:18 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

the entire GOP should be impeached as well.

we are witnessing the biggest threat to our democratic republic since day 1.

this fucker is beyond corrupt.



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calbearman76



Joined: 02 Nov 2009
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PostPosted: 06/04/18 9:31 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

The issue now is investigation, not impeachment. The last thing we can afford is impeachment without conviction. For everything we know today there is a whole lot more we suspect. When the Democrats take the House they can have true hearings to bring out the corruption in the election and since. Only with that type of activity will there be enough to build a case for conviction. Indeed you can look at the Senate now, at individuals like Chuck Grassley and Mitch McConnell as the people that have to be won over. These are the swing votes that will get us to 67 votes and that is a high but not unsurpassable bar. With a democratic House they could be persuaded that the Republican Party would be better served by President Mike Pence than a fully disgraced Trump. And unless those stalwarts can be convinced. impeachment is an empty gesture.


cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a dbag like Trump isn't potus. If u were in my safe space, you'd have to be f'd up


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PostPosted: 06/05/18 8:05 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

thanks for the tutorial. Wink

there will be no impeachment w/ the complicit GOP in House power.

voting them out of office is the 1st step.

the investigation will continue whether or not Mueller is at the helm.

we already know of several instances of obstruction of justice.

speculation that there was conspiracy to defraud the election process and that gross corruption, bribery, etc., has occurred, is warranted.

trump's shell game distractions aim to add more suckers to the dupedplorable list.



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/18/18 7:28 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

UnsilentMajority 🌹


@The_UnSilent_
17h17 hours ago

Media: Lying

Comey: Lying

Obama: Lying

Clinton: Lying

Stormy: Lying

Strozk: Lying

Mueller: Lying

Judges: Lying

19 Sexual assault accusers: Lying

Climate change scientists: Lying

17 Intelligence agencies: Lying

Putin: “He means it, I believe him”

~ @realDonaldTrump



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/18/18 7:42 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/nra-donors-irs-maria-butina-trump-russia-spy-2016-election-a8451811.html


NRA no longer has to identify major donors to the IRS


"The decision was made public on Monday night, just as the Justice Department announced charges against Maria Butina, an alleged Russian foreign agent who embedded herself into Republican leadership circles through the NRA.

Ms Butina is accused of “infiltrating organisations having influence in American politics, for the purpose of advancing the interests of the Russian Federation”."




Just a coincidence. Wink



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mercfan3



Joined: 23 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/18/18 4:16 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/nra-donors-irs-maria-butina-trump-russia-spy-2016-election-a8451811.html


NRA no longer has to identify major donors to the IRS


"The decision was made public on Monday night, just as the Justice Department announced charges against Maria Butina, an alleged Russian foreign agent who embedded herself into Republican leadership circles through the NRA.

Ms Butina is accused of “infiltrating organisations having influence in American politics, for the purpose of advancing the interests of the Russian Federation”."




Just a coincidence. Wink


Honestly, if this investigation takes down the NRA...I won’t even care about it taking down Donald. #agirlcandream



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StevenHW



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PostPosted: 07/18/18 6:34 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
the entire GOP should be impeached as well.

we are witnessing the biggest threat to our democratic republic since day 1.

this fucker is beyond corrupt.





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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/18/18 9:08 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Trump was briefed on 1/6/17 that Putin ordered the Russian hack on the election.

Laughing



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mercfan3



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PostPosted: 07/18/18 9:57 pm    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
Trump was briefed on 1/6/17 that Putin ordered the Russian hack on the election.

Laughing


He knew way before then. Laughing



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/19/18 7:11 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

mercfan3 wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
Trump was briefed on 1/6/17 that Putin ordered the Russian hack on the election.

Laughing


He knew way before then. Laughing



Oh yeah, there's no doubt (except among Trump cultists, of course), but this is proof that he's been colluding/conspiring, on the record, at least since that date. Wink



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cthskzfn



Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: 07/19/18 9:42 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

StevenHW wrote:
cthskzfn wrote:
the entire GOP should be impeached as well.

we are witnessing the biggest threat to our democratic republic since day 1.

this fucker is beyond corrupt.






funny, sad, true.

Laughing Crying or Very sad Evil or Very Mad



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cthskzfn



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PostPosted: 07/20/18 9:22 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

Those who continue to support the traitor in the WH, and/or the GOP, should just admit they don't give a shit about democracy.

Just come out and say you're fine w/ voter suppression, Russian election hacking, and treason, so long as "your side" wins.



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tfan



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PostPosted: 07/20/18 10:31 am    ::: Reply Reply with quote

cthskzfn wrote:
Those who continue to support the traitor in the WH, and/or the GOP, should just admit they don't give a shit about democracy.

Just come out and say you're fine w/ voter suppression, Russian election hacking, and treason, so long as "your side" wins.


Don't let the hysteria on CNN and MSNBC distract you from this:

Russia sanctions: What you need to know

Quote:

US President Donald Trump approved fresh sanctions on Russia Wednesday after Congress showed overwhelming bipartisan support for the new measures.

Congress passed the bill last week in response to Russia's interference in the 2016 US election, as well as its human rights violations, annexation of Crimea and military operations in eastern Ukraine.


If there was voter suppression, why haven't Democrats sued to have judges make decisions on it?

Looks like there is a lot of wiggle room in the law with regard to treason:

Quote:
Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.


What in the heck kind of wording is that? It looks like it was made just so powerful people could hammer little guys they didn't like. If a soldier or army doctor helps a wounded captured soldier is he guilty of treason? Sure sounds like it.


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