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| Who will win this game? |
| Texas |
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62% |
[ 5 ] |
| Tennessee |
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37% |
[ 3 ] |
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| Total Votes : 8 |
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15729
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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 Posted: 12/12/17 12:27 am ::: |
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| bballjunkie wrote: |
So now it makes sense why you trash what everyone else thinks is good basketball. 
A bunch of athletes with low Game IQs, selfish basketball, poor shot selection, poor decision making, poor game management, a player who can’t make it over half court - what’s not to like   |
Hmm. I'd challenge you directly to find a place here where I "trash what everyone else thinks is good basketball." That's just bullshit.
More likely, I'll work to derail the Bandwagon Effect, where a bunch o' whineys like to Harp 'n Hate on something in a group way, like junior high kids. Your opinion of TN/TX is just that: your opinion. I saw a TN team that played much better without Diamond. You (apparently) saw Holly Hate, and can't move past that. Glitches, errors in the game? Yes, but improvement? DOUBLE "Yes".
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bballjunkie
Joined: 12 Aug 2014
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bballjunkie
Joined: 12 Aug 2014
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readyAIMfire53
Joined: 20 Nov 2004
Posts: 7370
Location: Durham, NC
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18028
Location: Queens
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| Posted: 12/12/17 2:20 pm ::: |
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| bballjunkie wrote: |
| Queenie wrote: |
| bballjunkie wrote: |
So now it makes sense why you trash what everyone else thinks is good basketball.
A bunch of athletes with low Game IQs, selfish basketball, poor shot selection, poor decision making, poor game management, a player who can’t make it over half court - what’s not to like |
Other people are allowed to enjoy things that you don't enjoy.
Other people are allowed to not enjoy things that you enjoy.
Other people are allowed to have favorite teams that are not yours.
Other people are allowed to be frustrated that the majority of mainstream WBB coverage revolves around one team, with most of the remainder revolving around maybe five or six others. |
Thanks for qualifying my post.
No comment about sticking to basketball however hmm |
I... uh... oh, how do I say this delicately without derailing the thread too much further... the point. It may have been missed.
You're a UConn fan. Your team is not my team, or Howee's team, and that's okay.
Howee's an Oklahoma fan (and used to be a Texas fan too, IIRC). His team is not my team, or your team, and that's okay.
I'm a St. John's fan (and a LIU fan, and a Michigan fan, and a Seton Hall fan, and an Iona fan, and a Fordham fan {except for tonight}). My teams are not your teams, or Howee's teams, and that's okay.
Telling someone that the reason they don't like "good basketball" (or are maybe just sick and tired of hearing about your team) is that the things they like are bad? Step back and reconsider telling them that. Let them find the positives in the things they enjoy, while you enjoy the things that you enjoy.
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FrozenLVFan
Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 3510
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| Posted: 12/12/17 3:07 pm ::: |
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| GlennMacGrady wrote: |
I watched this game after the fact and enjoyed it.
The game commentary in this thread is, however, the most inept since 2007, according to an anonymous consensus of basketball experts. Absolutely no one has considered the possibility that the offensive difficulties in the game could have resulted from the fact that the the starters for UT and UTK are the 10 best defensive players in the country. Admit it, no one thought about that!!!
Anyway, I was honestly impressed by the talent on Tennessee, playing with a coherence or attempted coherence that has been lacking on many previous LV teams. |
In the spirit of Queenie's post, I acknowledge that I am a Tennessee fan (and Dartmouth, and Colgate, and UVM). These are my teams, and besides conferring some bias upon me, that also means that I have seen every Tennessee game, except two, in the past ten years (thank you, ESPN3). Therefore, having an informed basis for comparison, I would say that this year's Tenn team is hands-down the best since the Parker-led team of 2008. Talent, desire, and addition by subtraction have elevated this team to the best in a decade at Tenn.
However, I did not enjoy watching the Texas game. Tenn's defense was very good, but they did not play anywhere near as well as I know they can play on offense, based on what I've seen in nine previous games this season. I'm sure there will be more inexperience-caused bumps in the road this season, but I'm very excited to see what this team can accomplish.
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 5423
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| Posted: 12/12/17 4:25 pm ::: |
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| FrozenLVFan wrote: |
In the spirit of Queenie's post, I acknowledge that I am a Tennessee fan (and Dartmouth, and Colgate, and UVM). These are my teams, and besides conferring some bias upon me, than also means that I have seen every Tennessee game, except two, in the past ten years (thank you, ESPN3). Therefore having an informed basis for comparison, I would say that this year's Tenn team is hands-down the best since the Parker-led team of 2008. Talent, desire, and addition by subtraction have elevated this team to the best in a decade at Tenn.
However, I did not enjoy watching the Texas game. Tenn's defense was very good, but they did not play anywhere near as well as I know they can play on offense, based on what I've seen in nine previous games this season. I'm sure there will be more inexperience-caused bumps in the road this season, but I'm very excited to see what this team can accomplish. |
In my opinion both teams spent more time working on their hair styles for this nationally-televised game than whatever plan their coaches designed. These were the not ready for prime time players.
Perhaps the reason why both teams have looked good on offense prior to the game on Sunday has a lot to do with the quality of the opposition they had been facing. When your team has a talent and size advantage over an opponent an offense that relies on individual players beating over-matched opponents with the skills they brought from high school and AAU ball produces lopsided scores. The closest to a "cohesive" offense shown by either team on Sunday was 2 man pick and rolls. Creating an open shot for a team mate was virtually non-existent and as the players became tired the 4th period turned into a boring and poorly executed foul-fest as 4 players on offense stood around around while their teammate dribbled until a foul was called. The only thing that made the game at all watchable was the close score and that was due more to the mutual ineptitude of the players than any display of skill. The most exciting part of the last 10 minutes for anyone but a fan of either team was arguing about which player caused the ball to go out of bounds.
While I was impressed with the energy Tenn played with for 40 minutes, something that was sorely lacking last season, any suggestion of cohesiveness is due either to overdosing on meds or simply being provocative. This was the same Tennessee offense that we have been watching for over 30 years. When they have a talent/strength/experience advantage they look pretty good. But it's always based on a player with the ball beating an opponent and/or out-muscling the opposition under the glass.
I admit that I had several harsh comments on the thread but I was simply holding the two teams to the same standard as UConn is held to on their game threads where the focus seems to be on the water missing from the glass.
Tennesse's freshmen are showing promise. The game against Texas showed me that they have a long way to go. The freshmen are using the skills they had when they arrived in Knoxville which are considerable. If Russell and Nared stay healthy and don't wear down by the load they are carrying Tenn will be a good team. But I'll wait to see how the freshmen play at Maples, at Purcell and at Colonial Life before giving out grades and projecting their chances in March..
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 5423
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| Posted: 12/12/17 5:49 pm ::: |
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Here's a link to a good analysis of the game from Graham Hayes
http://www.espn.com/womens-college-basketball/story/_/id/21728374/fearless-freshmen-help-tennessee-lady-vols-topple-no-2-texas-longhorns
| Quote: |
| the current Lady Vols won a game that lacked precision for long stretches but offered ample passion and intensity. And a team with four players on the court who had never before played a college game of this magnitude looked far more comfortable playing through mistakes than the team that started juniors and seniors. |
| Quote: |
| They only get one season with Nared and Russell, which means next season could be a step backward or at least a tricky recalibration. And Sunday was not a blueprint for how this team can win in March. It might not even be a blueprint for how to win at Stanford next week. |
| Quote: |
| For all of that, the most surprising thing about the afternoon might not have been how well Tennessee's young players dealt with their surroundings but how poorly Texas did. .... McCarty's frustrating day, which saw her foul out after hitting just 2 of 15 shots, summed up so much. |
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Nixtreefan
Joined: 14 Nov 2012
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bballjunkie
Joined: 12 Aug 2014
Posts: 785
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| Posted: 12/13/17 10:15 am ::: |
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[quote="Queenie"][quote="bballjunkie"][quote="Queenie"][quote="bballjunkie"]So now it makes sense why you trash what everyone else thinks is good basketball.
A bunch of athletes with low Game IQs, selfish basketball, poor shot selection, poor decision making, poor game management, a player who can’t make it over half court - what’s not to like [/quote]
Other people are allowed to enjoy things that you don't enjoy.
Other people are allowed to not enjoy things that you enjoy.
Other people are allowed to have favorite teams that are not yours.
Other people are allowed to be frustrated that the majority of mainstream WBB coverage revolves around one team, with most of the remainder revolving around maybe five or six others.[/quote]
Thanks for qualifying my post.
No comment about sticking to basketball however hmm[/quote]
I... uh... oh, how do I say this delicately without derailing the thread too much further... the point. It may have been missed.
You're a UConn fan. Your team is not my team, or Howee's team, and that's okay.
Howee's an Oklahoma fan (and used to be a Texas fan too, IIRC). His team is not my team, or your team, and that's okay.
I'm a St. John's fan (and a LIU fan, and a Michigan fan, and a Seton Hall fan, and an Iona fan, and a Fordham fan {except for tonight}). My teams are not your teams, or Howee's teams, [i]and that's okay[/i].
Telling someone that the reason they don't like "good basketball" (or are maybe just sick and tired of hearing about your team) is that the things they like are bad? Step back and reconsider telling them that. Let them find the positives in the things they enjoy, while you enjoy the things that you enjoy.[/quote]
Oh believe me I Knew exactly what you were saying. My point still stands, the difference is I didn’t have to stoop to name calling which seems to be ok by you if that poster likes what you like.
I am very aware of Howees likes and dislikes, makes it very clear. Which is why I was pointing out that it was funny that there was a difference in how she viewed a game that had a lot of negatives basketball wise but says negative things about other teams and players that play better basketball in my opinion.
Again the name calling is what was wrong with Howees post we are both allowed to have opinions but it seems only one poster is allowed to call other names that have nothing to do with basketball.
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bballjunkie
Joined: 12 Aug 2014
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
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Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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GlennMacGrady
Joined: 03 Jan 2005
Posts: 8225
Location: Heisenberg
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| Posted: 12/13/17 2:31 pm ::: |
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| cthskzfn wrote: |
Hey Glenn I seem to remember you weren't impressed, last summer, with idea of "addition by subtraction" (I'm not going to find the thread) re: the LVs' prospects this year sans DD.
But, I think what we've seen what many of us expected- get rid of the cancer and the team improves. |
I don't recall what I said, but I don't think I've ever supported the idea of "addition by subtraction", either generally or with specific respect to DD, if what that means is the exact same team would be better without star player X than with her. If that were true regarding DD, then any pro team that drafts or hires her would immediately be hurting their team. That's silly.
Nor have I ever considered DD to be a "cancer", though it seems obvious that she's somewhat hard to coach and often becomes a chucker, or plays somewhat selfishly, when she thinks she has to carry a team. But she's not alone in those traits. I consider her to have many high talent and athletic gifts, but that she's not as good as her most rabid admirers think she is.
Is Tennessee better this year than last? I don't have an opinion yet, having only seen them twice. In this thread above I was only commenting on this one game, in which it seemed to me, as I said, that the team showed a "coherence or attempted coherence that has been lacking on many previous LV teams." What I meant is that I sensed that they were trying to ball share and play cohesively as unit -- except for Nared, who was a little too chucky -- and succeeded nicely a few more times than LV teams of the past, which I've never considered to be technically sophisticated under Summitt or Warlick.
If the LV team is better this year than last, I would attribute it less to the absence of DD, more to some improvements by Russell and Nared, and maybe mostly to three really good freshmen. |
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 7816
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 12/13/17 2:45 pm ::: |
Reply |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| bballjunkie wrote: |
| Queenie wrote: |
| bballjunkie wrote: |
So now it makes sense why you trash what everyone else thinks is good basketball.
A bunch of athletes with low Game IQs, selfish basketball, poor shot selection, poor decision making, poor game management, a player who can’t make it over half court - what’s not to like |
Other people are allowed to enjoy things that you don't enjoy.
Other people are allowed to not enjoy things that you enjoy.
Other people are allowed to have favorite teams that are not yours.
Other people are allowed to be frustrated that the majority of mainstream WBB coverage revolves around one team, with most of the remainder revolving around maybe five or six others. |
Thanks for qualifying my post.
No comment about sticking to basketball however hmm |
I... uh... oh, how do I say this delicately without derailing the thread too much further... the point. It may have been missed.
You're a UConn fan. Your team is not my team, or Howee's team, and that's okay.
Howee's an Oklahoma fan (and used to be a Texas fan too, IIRC). His team is not my team, or your team, and that's okay.
I'm a St. John's fan (and a LIU fan, and a Michigan fan, and a Seton Hall fan, and an Iona fan, and a Fordham fan {except for tonight}). My teams are not your teams, or Howee's teams, and that's okay.
Telling someone that the reason they don't like "good basketball" (or are maybe just sick and tired of hearing about your team) is that the things they like are bad? Step back and reconsider telling them that. Let them find the positives in the things they enjoy, while you enjoy the things that you enjoy. |
Couldn't agree with this post more, and thank you, Queenie, for saying what you've said. I get pretty frustrated with some fans who trash all teams not their own for "not playing good basketball" and who are, or seem to be, virulently anti certain teams.
I am a fan of JMU, Tennessee, and to some lesser degree, of Syracuse, Missouri State, DePaul, Texas, and Wisconsin (oh, pity me there!). I recognize that being a fan of a mid-major is quite a different thing from being a fan of a P5 team and that mid-major basketball is kind of a different animal. That doesn't mean it's bad, any more than saying MBB is a different animal from WBB makes WBB a bad thing.
/getting off my soapbox now
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It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
Last edited by summertime blues on 12/14/17 10:55 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15729
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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linkster
Joined: 27 Jul 2012
Posts: 5423
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| Posted: 12/13/17 6:45 pm ::: |
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| Howee wrote: |
More likely, I'll work to derail the Bandwagon Effect, where a bunch o' whineys like to Harp 'n Hate on something in a group way, like junior high kids. Your opinion of TN/TX is just that: your opinion. I saw a TN team that played much better without Diamond. You (apparently) saw Holly Hate, and can't move past that. Glitches, errors in the game? Yes, but improvement? DOUBLE "Yes". |
I did NOT call names, and I DON'T trash what everyone else thinks
Really? So you're OK if you are referred to as a whiney junior high kid who's both a harpy and a hater (or a similar equivalent)?
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15729
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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| Posted: 12/13/17 8:35 pm ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
| Howee wrote: |
More likely, I'll work to derail the Bandwagon Effect, where a bunch o' whineys like to Harp 'n Hate on something in a group way, like junior high kids. Your opinion of TN/TX is just that: your opinion. I saw a TN team that played much better without Diamond. You (apparently) saw Holly Hate, and can't move past that. Glitches, errors in the game? Yes, but improvement? DOUBLE "Yes". |
I did NOT call names, and I DON'T trash what everyone else thinks
Really? So you're OK if you are referred to as a whiney junior high kid who's both a harpy and a hater (or a similar equivalent)? |
Yep. That's not calling anyone a name, but describing behavior(s). There's a difference. One may not like it (especially if one sees themselves there), but it's not name calling.
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"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
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Skyfan22
Joined: 12 Aug 2013
Posts: 520
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| Posted: 12/14/17 12:50 am ::: |
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| linkster wrote: |
| Howee wrote: |
More likely, I'll work to derail the Bandwagon Effect, where a bunch o' whineys like to Harp 'n Hate on something in a group way, like junior high kids. Your opinion of TN/TX is just that: your opinion. I saw a TN team that played much better without Diamond. You (apparently) saw Holly Hate, and can't move past that. Glitches, errors in the game? Yes, but improvement? DOUBLE "Yes". |
I did NOT call names, and I DON'T trash what everyone else thinks
Really? So you're OK if you are referred to as a whiney junior high kid who's both a harpy and a hater (or a similar equivalent)? |
Oh Jesus Fuck. It’s simple semantics. Nowhere did Howee call whoever the whiner is that he was responding to a whiner. His/her post states she/he works to dethrone whiners in general. Get some fucking context and stop ruining the forum.
When I first read this forum in 2013 there were tons of rich posts with information I found intriguing. Now when I do click open, I am generally done in 2 minutes and sorry I wasted those minutes. It’s certainly a sad state of affairs when you see a post from Shades and you’re excited as to the increased chance of actual content vs. reading vitriol of a bunch of whiners.
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Carol Anne
Joined: 09 Apr 2005
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Location: Seattle
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 12851
Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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| Posted: 12/14/17 10:13 am ::: |
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More likely, I'll work to derail the Bandwagon Effect, where a bunch o' pom-pommers like to cheer 'n root on something blindly, in a group way, like junior high kids. Your opinion of TN/TX is just that: your opinion. I saw a TN team that played much like they have for decades- poor offensive execution. You (apparently) saw Holly as Wooden, and can't move past that. Glitches, errors in the game? Yes! DOUBLE "Yes".
I have no dog in the fight, and the above is just an illustration. To say Howee isn't busting balls because he hasn't explicitly called anyone an asshole, for example, is silly.
But, that's the formula here- you can denigrate to any degree, as long as you don't "call them names". At least, that's how it appears to me.
I may be wrong. 
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cthskzfn
Joined: 21 Nov 2004
Posts: 12851
Location: In a world where a PSYCHOpath like Trump isn't potus.
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| Posted: 12/14/17 10:16 am ::: |
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Good to know she was less than 100%. Hopefully that explains her performance.
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Silly, stupid white people might be waking up.
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
Posts: 15729
Location: OREGON (in my heart)
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| Posted: 12/14/17 1:53 pm ::: |
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| cthskzfn wrote: |
| To say Howee isn't busting balls because he hasn't explicitly called anyone an asshole, for example, is silly. |
Maybe you wanna re-read my ORIGINAL post:
| Howee wrote: |
Oh, MYYY. "PERSPECTIVES"!! LOL!
I had to watch the entire game on mute (don't ask....) but I was actually impressed with TN. I saw some Really Good Stuff, especially from Freshmen, and Nared was awesome. Mercedes was great, too, imo....still never has made the #1 recruit level, but she's solidly good. I thought I saw some inspired play that should have made the Holly Haterz stfu!
TX? Aston is primo. NOT a good game, and when Joyner is back, there'll be improvement, I'd hope. Atkins is a stud-lette. McCarty wasn't her best, but she'll get it back. Yes, Baylor has the better frontcourt, but TX has a stronger backcourt.
Good stuff, to me....sorry y'all were so disappointed.  |
| cthskzfn wrote: |
But, that's the formula here- you can denigrate to any degree, as long as you don't "call them names". At least, that's how it appears to me.
I may be wrong. |
Clearly, you ARE. But we're usta that. (Now, THAT'S 'ball-busting'!~  )
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Oregon: Go Ducks!
"Inévitablement, les canards voleront"
Last edited by Howee on 12/14/17 1:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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sigur3
Joined: 18 Jun 2013
Posts: 6191
Location: Chicago-ish
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| Posted: 12/14/17 1:56 pm ::: |
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| Skyfan22 wrote: |
| It’s certainly a sad state of affairs when you see a post from Shades and you’re excited as to the increased chance of actual content vs. reading vitriol of a bunch of whiners. |
/dead
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 18028
Location: Queens
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| Posted: 12/14/17 11:20 pm ::: |
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| That seems like a good note to end this thread on, unless someone would like to contribute actual game-related commentary.
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Ardent believer in the separation of church and stadium.
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tfan
Joined: 31 May 2010
Posts: 9602
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| Posted: 12/18/17 12:54 pm ::: |
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| <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/26YzDuuh-r4" frameborder="0" gesture="media" allow="encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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