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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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 Posted: 07/19/17 10:38 pm ::: Sun at Liberty 7/19 take 2 |
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I was about to post this but the old thread was locked. Regarding Brittany Boyd. A few things that rolled around in my head. First off there was an article awhile back mentioning that she's working hard at physical recovery and it's going well. In the interim she said that watching games alongside Spoon (who I think is not at the games right now?) gave her a new perspective...I guess more thought provoking.
If you look at Jasmine Thomas, here's a player who's gone from role player to solid starter to possibly the best PG in the league. If Boyd's physical recovery goes well (with an Achilles it's questionable, though her age is a positive) it will be interesting to see how other aspects of the intangible side progress. We've seen so many cases where PGs progress over time. Even good ones who up the ante another level.
Seeing Boyd walking today got me thinking all this. She looked like she was moving well. Sorta caught me by surprise.
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SDHoops
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| Posted: 07/19/17 10:43 pm ::: |
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| Okay serious questions. No jabs at anyone...but with Tina appearing to be coming on strong and the standing tight, if she sneaks into the league lead in scoring and the Libs get back in the top four again, would she get another realistic shot at MVP? That is theee question of the day. She had a stellar first month or so then kinda played so and so (enough to get by) but now she's been playing like bad Teen Chawls we all know!
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 07/19/17 10:44 pm ::: Re: Sun at Liberty 7/19 take 2 |
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| NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
I was about to post this but the old thread was locked. Regarding Brittany Boyd. A few things that rolled around in my head. First off there was an article awhile back mentioning that she's working hard at physical recovery and it's going well. In the interim she said that watching games alongside Spoon (who I think is not at the games right now?) gave her a new perspective...I guess more thought provoking.
If you look at Jasmine Thomas, here's a player who's gone from role player to solid starter to possibly the best PG in the league. If Boyd's physical recovery goes well (with an Achilles it's questionable, though her age is a positive) it will be interesting to see how other aspects of the intangible side progress. We've seen so many cases where PGs progress over time. Even good ones who up the ante another level.
Seeing Boyd walking today got me thinking all this. She looked like she was moving well. Sorta caught me by surprise. |
It's wonderful that Boyd seems so committed to watching and learning!
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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| Posted: 07/19/17 10:52 pm ::: |
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| SDHoops wrote: |
| Okay serious questions. No jabs at anyone...but with Tina appearing to be coming on strong and the standing tight, if she sneaks into the league lead in scoring and the Libs get back in the top four again, would she get another realistic shot at MVP? That is theee question of the day. She had a stellar first month or so then kinda played so and so (enough to get by) but now she's been playing like bad Teen Chawls we all know! |
I was thinking along the same lines. The Libs are a game out of a 3 seed so she certainly could be in the discussion. Last year she was more of a passer, which could knock her down a peg. The other thing is that Fowles has been an ungodly force this year and IMO Nneka is even better then she was last year in terms of creating her own offense. So if the stats basically stay as they now are, I'd say Tina would be a fairly distant third.
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Richyyy
Joined: 17 Nov 2005
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| Posted: 07/19/17 10:54 pm ::: |
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| SDHoops wrote: |
| Okay serious questions. No jabs at anyone...but with Tina appearing to be coming on strong and the standing tight, if she sneaks into the league lead in scoring and the Libs get back in the top four again, would she get another realistic shot at MVP? That is theee question of the day. She had a stellar first month or so then kinda played so and so (enough to get by) but now she's been playing like bad Teen Chawls we all know! |
I would say probably only if there's a big dropoff from Fowles or she gets hurt. She's been performing game in and game out all season to a very high level, and on the best team in the league. We could get into the 'value' argument again, but just in terms of who will win, I doubt it happens without Fowles missing a bunch of games. |
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 07/19/17 10:58 pm ::: |
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| SDHoops wrote: |
| Okay serious questions. No jabs at anyone...but with Tina appearing to be coming on strong and the standing tight, if she sneaks into the league lead in scoring and the Libs get back in the top four again, would she get another realistic shot at MVP? That is theee question of the day. She had a stellar first month or so then kinda played so and so (enough to get by) but now she's been playing like bad Teen Chawls we all know! |
I've always felt that MVP voting in every sport is a mess because voters (whoever they are in different sports) have different views of what "Most Valuable Player" actually means. Does it mean the player who's had the best season? What if you've had a great season for a team that's had a mediocre or terrible year? Or should it go to the player on the best team who's had the best season for that team?
All I'd say for sure is this. If Charles has a superb second half of the season but the Liberty don't, it hurts Charles's chances. If Charles has a superb second half and so does the team, it helps her chances. Is this the way it should be? Not in my view, but it's usually the way it is for a decent number of voters in any sport.
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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| Posted: 07/19/17 11:00 pm ::: |
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| Among other things, I think Fowles came into the season physically prepared to dominate. When I saw her on opening night I said "uh oh". As such, she's performing within the flow of the top team's offense, not an easy thing for a post player. And she's a rim protector on the league's best defensive team as well.
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 07/19/17 11:08 pm ::: Re: Sun at Liberty 7/19 take 2 |
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| NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
I was about to post this but the old thread was locked. Regarding Brittany Boyd. A few things that rolled around in my head. First off there was an article awhile back mentioning that she's working hard at physical recovery and it's going well. In the interim she said that watching games alongside Spoon (who I think is not at the games right now?) gave her a new perspective...I guess more thought provoking.
If you look at Jasmine Thomas, here's a player who's gone from role player to solid starter to possibly the best PG in the league. If Boyd's physical recovery goes well (with an Achilles it's questionable, though her age is a positive) it will be interesting to see how other aspects of the intangible side progress. We've seen so many cases where PGs progress over time. Even good ones who up the ante another level.
Seeing Boyd walking today got me thinking all this. She looked like she was moving well. Sorta caught me by surprise. |
I neglected to say: I so hope that Boyd can return next season and be 100% after a while. (I assume that can take time.) She's obviously very committed to being the best basketball player she can be. I'd really like to see what that will be.
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J-Spoon
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| Posted: 07/20/17 12:03 am ::: |
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I think Charles is a legit candidate for MVP but I do not believe she will win.
Correct me if I'm wrong but last year Charles finished first in scoring and rebounding and NY was a solid three seed with a record that is likely to be better than what they will end with this year. #1 scorer and #1 rebounder is a pretty good resume to be MVP (I wonder if there is even a historical precedent for someone being a top both categories and not winning MVP?) but she lost out to Nneka who had an amazing season. IMO The same thing will happen this year, even if she is higher in those two statistical category than Fowles, Minnesota's record and Fowles killing it from day 1 will keep her ahead of Charles. (Even if Charles has a lot less help that either N. Ogwumike had last year or Fowles has this year. It is even possible that Charles being a one woman wrecking crew might work against her now because when you are the clear alpha it is easier to rack up stats.)
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J-Spoon
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| Posted: 07/20/17 12:06 am ::: |
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| On a different note tonight was the 2nd time in a row that the Prince/Rodgers back-court was broken up so that both player only play off the ball, and it worked again. I was hoping that Prince and Rodgers could work, but having a traditional point or even a point forward (Zellous) running the offense leaving Prince/Rodgers more opportunity to score, and quickening the pace NY plays at has worked these last two games. So nice coaching move by Laimbeer.
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Bob Lamm
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| Posted: 07/20/17 12:57 am ::: |
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| J-Spoon wrote: |
| On a different note tonight was the 2nd time in a row that the Prince/Rodgers back-court was broken up so that both player only play off the ball, and it worked again. I was hoping that Prince and Rodgers could work, but having a traditional point or even a point forward (Zellous) running the offense leaving Prince/Rodgers more opportunity to score, and quickening the pace NY plays at has worked these last two games. So nice coaching move by Laimbeer. |
I was skeptical from the beginning that Prince and Rodgers would work. I say that with no criticism of Bill Laimbeer. For obvious reasons, it made sense to hope that New York could have them on the court together and get the maximum number of minutes out of each. But I'm glad that he has been trying Plan B, with Harding and Lindsay Allen splitting 40 minutes at lead guard while Prince and Rodgers split 40 minutes at #2 guard. We'll see how that goes in the five-game road trip ahead.
In my view, the games in which New York has looked best this season are those in which Zellous has been most active as our point forward.
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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| Posted: 07/20/17 10:52 am ::: Re: Sun at Liberty 7/19 take 2 |
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| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
I was about to post this but the old thread was locked. Regarding Brittany Boyd. A few things that rolled around in my head. First off there was an article awhile back mentioning that she's working hard at physical recovery and it's going well. In the interim she said that watching games alongside Spoon (who I think is not at the games right now?) gave her a new perspective...I guess more thought provoking.
If you look at Jasmine Thomas, here's a player who's gone from role player to solid starter to possibly the best PG in the league. If Boyd's physical recovery goes well (with an Achilles it's questionable, though her age is a positive) it will be interesting to see how other aspects of the intangible side progress. We've seen so many cases where PGs progress over time. Even good ones who up the ante another level.
Seeing Boyd walking today got me thinking all this. She looked like she was moving well. Sorta caught me by surprise. |
I neglected to say: I so hope that Boyd can return next season and be 100% after a while. (I assume that can take time.) She's obviously very committed to being the best basketball player she can be. I'd really like to see what that will be. |
I attempted to do some reading on Achilles injuries after Boyd's injury. I'm nowhere near an authority, however I did read some things that I feel are relevant. First off, the reason that recovery is tricky is because surgery doesn't necessarily replicate the flexibility that an undamaged Achilles would have. Logically, you can see where that might adversely affect a speed player like Boyd. Also, after Catchings tore hers, it took her about two seasons to get back over 40% shooting again. But, on the plus side, it's also atypical for a player as young as Boyd to suffer such an injury, and what I read led me to believe that being younger may help her recover faster. So we will see. I wonder if her walking is a sign that she's healing faster than the norm or if that's usual for an Achilles injury.
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NYL_WNBA_FAN
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| Posted: 07/20/17 10:59 am ::: |
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| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| J-Spoon wrote: |
| On a different note tonight was the 2nd time in a row that the Prince/Rodgers back-court was broken up so that both player only play off the ball, and it worked again. I was hoping that Prince and Rodgers could work, but having a traditional point or even a point forward (Zellous) running the offense leaving Prince/Rodgers more opportunity to score, and quickening the pace NY plays at has worked these last two games. So nice coaching move by Laimbeer. |
I was skeptical from the beginning that Prince and Rodgers would work. I say that with no criticism of Bill Laimbeer. For obvious reasons, it made sense to hope that New York could have them on the court together and get the maximum number of minutes out of each. But I'm glad that he has been trying Plan B, with Harding and Lindsay Allen splitting 40 minutes at lead guard while Prince and Rodgers split 40 minutes at #2 guard. We'll see how that goes in the five-game road trip ahead.
In my view, the games in which New York has looked best this season are those in which Zellous has been most active as our point forward. |
I definitely thought it would work better, though I did have Piph's style (walking the ball up the court) in my mind too. But I figured Boyd would be the change of pace factor, and obviously that part hasn't been able to happen.
One way the Libs did get lucky is that they were able to bring Lindsay Allen back. She'd be a solid backup for many teams in the league, and I think long-term she has tools that can make her a solid starter if she develops her scoring. What I really love about her is she has that intangible kind of quality rare in a rookie. She knows the offense, gets the team into their stuff quickly and generally plays with the poise of a vet. Turns out we got a nice young player in the second round of a draft that wasn't highly regarded. And little by little she's shown more willingness to score. Yes, she has a way to go but I'm encouraged. She's a mobile guard, which can mean being able to get mid-range scoring opportunities as a result of speed. Even if the long-range part develops in time, she should be able to get good mid-range looks.
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Bob Lamm
Joined: 11 Apr 2010
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| Posted: 07/20/17 11:12 am ::: |
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| NYL_WNBA_FAN wrote: |
| Bob Lamm wrote: |
| J-Spoon wrote: |
| On a different note tonight was the 2nd time in a row that the Prince/Rodgers back-court was broken up so that both player only play off the ball, and it worked again. I was hoping that Prince and Rodgers could work, but having a traditional point or even a point forward (Zellous) running the offense leaving Prince/Rodgers more opportunity to score, and quickening the pace NY plays at has worked these last two games. So nice coaching move by Laimbeer. |
I was skeptical from the beginning that Prince and Rodgers would work. I say that with no criticism of Bill Laimbeer. For obvious reasons, it made sense to hope that New York could have them on the court together and get the maximum number of minutes out of each. But I'm glad that he has been trying Plan B, with Harding and Lindsay Allen splitting 40 minutes at lead guard while Prince and Rodgers split 40 minutes at #2 guard. We'll see how that goes in the five-game road trip ahead.
In my view, the games in which New York has looked best this season are those in which Zellous has been most active as our point forward. |
I definitely thought it would work better, though I did have Piph's style (walking the ball up the court) in my mind too. But I figured Boyd would be the change of pace factor, and obviously that part hasn't been able to happen.
One way the Libs did get lucky is that they were able to bring Lindsay Allen back. She'd be a solid backup for many teams in the league, and I think long-term she has tools that can make her a solid starter if she develops her scoring. What I really love about her is she has that intangible kind of quality rare in a rookie. She knows the offense, gets the team into their stuff quickly and generally plays with the poise of a vet. Turns out we got a nice young player in the second round of a draft that wasn't highly regarded. And little by little she's shown more willingness to score. Yes, she has a way to go but I'm encouraged. She's a mobile guard, which can mean being able to get mid-range scoring opportunities as a result of speed. Even if the long-range part develops in time, she should be able to get good mid-range looks. |
Fully agree. New York was quite lucky that no one grabbed Lindsay Allen after she was initially cut. I really like what I've seen. Obviously, as you've said, she has a way to go. But I believe your observation about her poise is crucial. Being a WNBA rookie is challenging whatever your position, but surely being a rookie point guard is especially tough. Allen has poise that I wouldn't expect from a rookie point guard.
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