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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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 Posted: 04/11/17 10:39 am ::: |
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| ClayK wrote: |
Talk to a scholarship athlete and ask if the education is "free."
Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...
Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."
And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.
Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12. |
No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.
Quid pro quo.
And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.
Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.
BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:
"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."
Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021.
Last edited by ArtBest23 on 04/11/17 11:01 am; edited 3 times in total |
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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ArtBest23
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 04/11/17 12:13 pm ::: |
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"Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class."
"Stole"? Bitter, bitter! If they recommitted because they preferred to play for him, that's not stealing. Shaking up Cal's recruiting class? Well, yeah. Same reason. Recruits commit, at least in partiality, to a coach. The very same thing happens in WBB--all the time. Coach gets fired or leaves, some recruits (and some players) leave and go with him or her. It's a fact of life. Deal with it.
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Nixtreefan
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pilight
Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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Location: Where the action is
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| Posted: 04/11/17 12:24 pm ::: |
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| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| ClayK wrote: |
Talk to a scholarship athlete and ask if the education is "free."
Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...
Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."
And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.
Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12. |
No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.
Quid pro quo.
And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.
Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.
BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:
"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."
Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021. |
The buyouts only apply if the coach leaves before the end of his/her contract. A player's "contract" is only one year at a time. If they choose to leave at the end of the year, why should they be penalized?
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Shmermerer1
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lynxmania
Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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| Posted: 04/11/17 12:41 pm ::: |
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| Rebekah Dahlman (Vandy) will be going to DePaul
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ArtBest23
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/11/17 1:05 pm ::: |
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| pilight wrote: |
| ArtBest23 wrote: |
| ClayK wrote: |
Talk to a scholarship athlete and ask if the education is "free."
Are students who pay tuition required to lift weights three times a week at 6 a.m.? Do students who pay tuition have to avoid certain classes that they want to take because they conflict with practice? Do students who pay tuition have to attend mandatory study halls even if their grades are good? And so on ...
Being on scholarship is having a job. Maybe it's well-paid, or maybe it's not, but it's far from "free."
And to beat my favorite dead horse, does "chaos" ensue when coaches leave or athletic directors leave or school administrators leave? They have no penalty for changing jobs, but students do. Cuonzo Martin left Cal's men's basketball program to go to Missouri, and stole two recruits from Washington and shook up Cal's recruiting class. That seems a lot more like "chaos" to me than Ali Patberg being immediately eligible at Illinois.
Finally, the Power 5 schools already have an enormous advantage, and allowing transfers to be eligible immediately would, I believe, help mid-majors because then athletes would be able to spend a year and have a much better idea of where they fit, and how important it is to them, or not, to play the game rather than sit on the bench for a Final Four team. Sitting out a year and paying your own way is a major, major deterrent to many athletes who otherwise might want to try out the WCC instead of watching from the bench in the Pac-12. |
No, it's not "free" and not one person here has suggested it is. And one of the costs is that if you bail out and leave your teammates and coaches and fans in the lurch, you have to sit out a year.
Quid pro quo.
And yes, coaches bolting also causes chaos which is why they pay a penalty of hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars.
Maybe players should be able to pay a million dollar buyout to be able to play immediately. You want them treated like coaches, so there you go. That should satisfy you.
BTW, since you brought up Martin, he had to pay Tenn $1.3 million when he bolted for Cal. Then his Cal contract provided:
"If Martin himself leaves prior to April 14, 2017, he will pay $1.1 million to the University. If he leaves between April 15, 2017 and April 14, 2018, he pays the University $1 million. If he leaves between April 15, 2018 and April 14, 2019, he would owe the University $750,000."
Given his demonstrated unreliability after bolting twice, Missouri has put HUGE buyouts in his new contract. If he leaves before April 30, 2018, Martin would owe Missouri a lump sum of $10.5 million. It tapers down over time, but is still $5M in 2020, $3M in 2021. |
The buyouts only apply if the coach leaves before the end of his/her contract. A player's "contract" is only one year at a time. If they choose to leave at the end of the year, why should they be penalized? |
Actually, every major conference now provides four year scholarships. So if the school is committing to four years, doesn't seem unreasonable to get the same from the player.
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ArtBest23
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Nixtreefan
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summertime blues
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Nixtreefan
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| Posted: 04/11/17 4:42 pm ::: |
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| If you had many applicants would you take time to figure that out, me, trashcan.
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ArtBest23
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Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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| Posted: 04/11/17 5:20 pm ::: |
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Some more power 5 transfers.
A'Tyanna Gaulden is leaving Florida State.
Makenzie Ellis is leaving Colorado
At the non power 5 level you also have a few transfers.
Davion Wingate transferring from Stony Brook
Katie Armstrong transferring from St. Joseph's to Fairfield
Jodi Ramil transferring from Georgetown to Binghamton
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Nixtreefan
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Howee
Joined: 27 Nov 2009
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 04/12/17 11:51 am ::: |
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Hey people---this thread is supposed to be keeping track of what the header says...attrition, transfer, and injury. I know I've been guilty myself of joining in the side discussion, but as the initiator of the thread, could I respectfully ask that we all take THAT discussion to a new thread please?
Thank you.
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It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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Fighting Artichoke
Joined: 12 Dec 2012
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| Posted: 04/12/17 3:57 pm ::: |
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| Per Raoul, Kerstie Phills granted her release from Wagner; led her team with 13 ppg and was NEC Rookie of the Year.
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OtterlyAmused
Joined: 05 Aug 2013
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| Posted: 04/13/17 9:59 am ::: |
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I'm wondering where you got the information on Makenzie Ellis from Colorado. I haven't seen anything and the CU Buffs web page posted an article yesterday that included her competing in the national 3x3 tournament.
| Durantula wrote: |
Some more power 5 transfers.
A'Tyanna Gaulden is leaving Florida State.
Makenzie Ellis is leaving Colorado
At the non power 5 level you also have a few transfers.
Davion Wingate transferring from Stony Brook
Katie Armstrong transferring from St. Joseph's to Fairfield
Jodi Ramil transferring from Georgetown to Binghamton |
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lynxmania
Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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Location: Minnesota
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| Posted: 04/13/17 10:14 am ::: |
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| OtterlyAmused wrote: |
I'm wondering where you got the information on Makenzie Ellis from Colorado. I haven't seen anything and the CU Buffs web page posted an article yesterday that included her competing in the national 3x3 tournament.
| Durantula wrote: |
Some more power 5 transfers.
A'Tyanna Gaulden is leaving Florida State.
Makenzie Ellis is leaving Colorado
At the non power 5 level you also have a few transfers.
Davion Wingate transferring from Stony Brook
Katie Armstrong transferring from St. Joseph's to Fairfield
Jodi Ramil transferring from Georgetown to Binghamton |
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As of right now on her Twitter page, she has retweeted two people that reported she was leaving: https://twitter.com/k3nz13_3?lang=en
| Quote: |
Makenzie Rayn Ellis Retweeted
Bret McCormick @ASGR1995 · Apr 11
Makenzie Ellis 6-1 WF is transferring from Colorado. From Tulsa OK & has 2 years. Contact Chris Johnson 832-908-0121 |
| Quote: |
Makenzie Rayn Ellis Retweeted
Hoop Skills @skilledupelite · Apr 11
6'2 sophomore wing/forward Makenzie Ellis is transferring from the University of Colorado. Contact Chris Johnson 832-908-0121 @ASGR1995 |
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OtterlyAmused
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| Posted: 04/13/17 10:26 am ::: |
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Thank you. I thought their sophomore class this year was a solid core that could do really well if they got a good post with them.
As of right now on her Twitter page, she has retweeted two people that reported she was leaving: https://twitter.com/k3nz13_3?lang=en
| Quote: |
Makenzie Rayn Ellis Retweeted
Bret McCormick @ASGR1995 · Apr 11
Makenzie Ellis 6-1 WF is transferring from Colorado. From Tulsa OK & has 2 years. Contact Chris Johnson 832-908-0121 |
| Quote: |
Makenzie Rayn Ellis Retweeted
Hoop Skills @skilledupelite · Apr 11
6'2 sophomore wing/forward Makenzie Ellis is transferring from the University of Colorado. Contact Chris Johnson 832-908-0121 @ASGR1995 |
[/quote]
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
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| Posted: 04/14/17 9:52 pm ::: |
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Freshman G Arella Guirantes transferring from Texas Tech. She is a native of Bellport, NY and would like to play closer to home.
Also, Alyssa Dry and Alexandria Gulley rumored to be leaving Baylor, but no releases granted as of yet..
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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Durantula
Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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| Posted: 04/15/17 11:05 am ::: |
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| summertime blues wrote: |
Freshman G Arella Guirantes transferring from Texas Tech. She is a native of Bellport, NY and would like to play closer to home.
Also, Alyssa Dry and Alexandria Gulley rumored to be leaving Baylor, but no releases granted as of yet.. |
Guirantes was productive as a freshman, she'll get some attention. Dry and Gulley basically never played, so I don't think it affects Baylor.
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summertime blues
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| Posted: 04/15/17 5:49 pm ::: |
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| Durantula wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
Freshman G Arella Guirantes transferring from Texas Tech. She is a native of Bellport, NY and would like to play closer to home.
Also, Alyssa Dry and Alexandria Gulley rumored to be leaving Baylor, but no releases granted as of yet.. |
Guirantes was productive as a freshman, she'll get some attention. Dry and Gulley basically never played, so I don't think it affects Baylor. |
Gulley is to remain at Baylor on a medical scholarship, per an article I read but can't post from my phone to here. Dry will presumably transfer.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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NoDakSt
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summertime blues
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| Posted: 04/15/17 7:24 pm ::: |
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Any Florida team might find her attractive....including the University of Florida.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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dinkytown
Joined: 18 Sep 2011
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| Posted: 04/15/17 7:34 pm ::: |
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| NoDakSt wrote: |
| Durantula wrote: |
Boston College's leading scorer and rebounder is transferring. Mariella Fasoula from Greece. http://bcheights.com/2017/03/28/mariella-fasoula-transfer-boston-college-womens-basketball/
BC might be on the hotseat next year, its a private school so no idea on the contract length but its a tough job made even tougher when your best player leaves.
Fasoula is sort of like Shepard to me, big bodied posts, not very athletic. Shepard can shoot the three while Fasoula is crafty with her post moves. I might prefer Fasoula if I was recruiting both but it could be close. |
Fasoula reportedly visiting Vandy |
She's visiting Minnesota this weekend.
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scfastpitch
Joined: 21 Dec 2009
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| Posted: 04/16/17 8:14 am ::: |
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| Anyone heard anything about Jessica Shepard visiting South Carolina ? I was at the South Carolina softball game Saturday and the women's basketball team was there in the stands for a while . Big white girl sitting next to Alexis Jennings looked a lot like Shepard . I did a little research and found that Shepard played on the U18 team coached by Dawn Staley back in 2014 . Aja Wilson was also on that team .
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Fighting Artichoke
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| Posted: 04/16/17 12:44 pm ::: |
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Ali Patberg considering Indiana, Michigan, Michigan State and Northwestern.
About leaving Notre Dame: “I talked a lot with my family and my coaches, and they wanted me to stay,” Patberg said. “But life’s too short, and I followed my heart. It’s going to be hard, but they all want me to do what’s best for me, and so do my teammates. I’m lucky that I have a lot of support.”
http://www.therepublic.com/2017/04/16/a_really_hard_two_years/
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NoDakSt
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
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| Posted: 04/17/17 6:26 pm ::: |
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| Mass exodus from Colorado class of 2019. McKenzie Ellis, Monica Burich, and Eleanor Jones all leaving Buffs
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myrtle
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| Posted: 04/17/17 9:20 pm ::: |
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| summertime blues wrote: |
Any Florida team might find her attractive....including the University of Florida. |
really a significant loss for Duke.
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SO ...I lost a bet with Rock about how many wins Chicago would get this year. My punishment - T. Young as my avatar. Well it could be worse!
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goforit77
Joined: 09 Jan 2015
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| Posted: 04/18/17 9:43 am ::: |
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| myrtle wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
Any Florida team might find her attractive....including the University of Florida. |
really a significant loss for Duke. |
Not really...With the guards Duke will have she will be the 4th guard..Most likely she wouldn't see more playing time than this year..
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CamrnCrz1974
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/18/17 2:14 pm ::: |
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| goforit77 wrote: |
| myrtle wrote: |
| summertime blues wrote: |
Any Florida team might find her attractive....including the University of Florida. |
really a significant loss for Duke. |
Not really...With the guards Duke will have she will be the 4th guard..Most likely she wouldn't see more playing time than this year.. |
Not true at all.
Primm played backup point, backup SG, and backup wing...and was put into the lineup when there was a need for a defensive stopper outside of Lambert.
Lambert is injured and will likely miss the year. Primm was far more productive than Faith Suggs. Haley Gorecki is coming off of nearly two years of injuries. Jayda Adams is a freshman. Only Mikayla Boykin would be ahead of her (outside of Lexie Brown and Rebecca Greenwell).
Boykin could have started with Brown/Greenwell (replacing Lambert) with Primm as the primary perimeter backup. Or Primm could have started (McCallie does like the Keturah Jackson defensive stoppers).
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zvyn3
Joined: 20 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/18/17 9:33 pm ::: |
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| Beatrice Mompremier is transferring from Baylor.
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Ladyvol777
Joined: 02 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/18/17 10:00 pm ::: |
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| zvyn3 wrote: |
| Beatrice Mompremier is transferring from Baylor. |
WOW!!!!!
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Queenie
Joined: 18 Nov 2004
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| Posted: 04/18/17 10:17 pm ::: |
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| I don't know all the particulars, but Seton Hall's roster is missing a helluva lot of people who weren't seniors last year, most notably starting guard LaTecia Smith (from LA), along with promising forward Skyler Snider (from Nebraska), streaky shooter Claire Lundberg (from Minnesota), and... um, I don't actually know what Martha Kuderer's skill set is (and I've forgotten where she's from).
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lynxmania
Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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| Posted: 04/18/17 10:25 pm ::: |
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| Queenie wrote: |
| I don't know all the particulars, but Seton Hall's roster is missing a helluva lot of people who weren't seniors last year, most notably starting guard LaTecia Smith (from LA), along with promising forward Skyler Snider (from Nebraska), streaky shooter Claire Lundberg (from Minnesota), and... um, I don't actually know what Martha Kuderer's skill set is (and I've forgotten where she's from). |
Lundberg and Kuderer both transferred to Montana State
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Ladyvol777
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| Posted: 04/19/17 12:08 am ::: |
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womenshoopsworld @hoopism 1h1 hour ago More
Cascio Jensen is transferring from Nebraska:
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NoDakSt
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| Posted: 04/19/17 1:08 am ::: |
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| dinkytown wrote: |
| NoDakSt wrote: |
| Durantula wrote: |
Boston College's leading scorer and rebounder is transferring. Mariella Fasoula from Greece. http://bcheights.com/2017/03/28/mariella-fasoula-transfer-boston-college-womens-basketball/
BC might be on the hotseat next year, its a private school so no idea on the contract length but its a tough job made even tougher when your best player leaves.
Fasoula is sort of like Shepard to me, big bodied posts, not very athletic. Shepard can shoot the three while Fasoula is crafty with her post moves. I might prefer Fasoula if I was recruiting both but it could be close. |
Fasoula reportedly visiting Vandy |
She's visiting Minnesota this weekend. |
Now reportedly visiting Arizona State.
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Conway Gamecock
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| Posted: 04/19/17 4:35 am ::: |
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| Ladyvol777 wrote: |
| zvyn3 wrote: |
| Beatrice Mompremier is transferring from Baylor. |
WOW!!!!! |
Sometimes you have to wonder what goes on in a teenager's mind to make some of these choices: for months she had a list of UNC, Tennessee, Ohio State, and South Carolina. She eliminated UNC, but didn't change the other three.
So then she chooses out of them: Baylor. Four days after the #2 Post of her cycle - Kalani Brown - signed with Baylor. Both Brown and Mompremier (the #3 Post for 2014) play the same position, and are in the same class, so one of them would have to play a role of back-up to the other one. This last season, Brown started 26 of Baylor's 37 games, Mompremier started 10, and Lauren Cox started one game.
And Cox, who was the overall #1 for 2016 and the #1 Forward, can at least spend some minutes playing the 4. as she is a decent perimeter shooter, but Beatrice looks locked into the 5 spot for her career. Despite those 10 starts, she averaged under 15 minutes per game....
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WNBA 09
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summertime blues
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| Posted: 04/19/17 10:08 am ::: |
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| zvyn3 wrote: |
| Beatrice Mompremier is transferring from Baylor. |
HOLY CR@P! What has Kim done...or not done....or is it the current climate at Baylor? Inquiring minds would like to know.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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zvyn3
Joined: 20 Jul 2013
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| Posted: 04/19/17 6:54 pm ::: |
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| Duke's Lynee Belton has ended her basketball career due to injuries.
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summertime blues
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| Posted: 04/19/17 7:38 pm ::: |
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| Oregon State's Breanna Brown, a RS junior, has graduated and has elected to continue her education and play her senior year at Georgia Tech. As a graduate transfer she will be eligible immediately, and as a 6'3 forward/center she'lol be welcome on MaChelle Joseph's team.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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summertime blues
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| Posted: 04/19/17 8:18 pm ::: |
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| Ria Gulley, freshman G, leaving Indiana. She is from San Antonio and wants to play nearer home.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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summertime blues
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Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 04/19/17 8:41 pm ::: |
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| Marist is losing two players from its 8-player squad of this past season. Jordyn Jossart, RS freshman combo guard, is leaving and will transfer to her hometown D-II University of Mary. Morgan Bartner, sophomore post who was generally the seventh player in the 8-player rotation, has not stated a destination as yet. Coach Brian Giorgios does not seem perturbed as he has 3 prospects coming in as well as two transfers who will be able to play, as well as a few others returning from injury.
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Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 4825
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 04/19/17 8:49 pm ::: |
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| Montana State picks up two transfers from Seton Hall: Claire Lundberg, a 6'1 F from Andover, MN, and Martha Kuderer, a 5'11 F from Eden Prairie, MN. Both will have to sit out a year, after which Lundberg will have one year of eligibility remaining and Kuderer two. Lundberg will be pursuing a dual degree in engineering and physics.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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Oldfandepot2
Joined: 05 Jul 2013
Posts: 942
Location: Northeast
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summertime blues
Joined: 16 Apr 2013
Posts: 4825
Location: Shenandoah Valley
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| Posted: 04/19/17 9:40 pm ::: |
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| Freshman Sarah Overcash leaves Illinois for George Washington. The 6'1 F is a native of Chevy Chase, MD.
_________________
Don't take life so serious. It ain't nohows permanent.
It takes 3 years to build a team and 7 to build a program.--Conventional Wisdom
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